The Pilgrim/Hales/Buckinghams

[terranova]

http://www.religionnewsblog.com/21528/r ... -and-alone

http://www.religionnewsblog.com/19977/t ... pa-pilgrim

_lilith found this article on the Hale family discussed in the Maxwell thread. I thought it deserved it's own thread as there is soo much wrong with this situation, words can not describe.

The Buckingham family took in the Hales (aka Pilgrims) after their Papa (Robert) raped and kidnapped the oldest of his 15 children. They now (as of 2007 anyway) live all together in a tiny cabin in the Alaskan wilderness.

[lilith]

Thank you terranova. I thought about starting a thread, but I've never done it (not sure ifi have enough posts).

I'm reading more about this on Rick Ross. It's just horrible.

But even though the kids are undoubtably in a better situation now, and the press keeps referring to the Buckinghams as a "kind, large, christian homesteading family", I've got to wonder how off the wall these folks are too, in their little cabin in Alaska. They befriended Papa Pilgrim, had him and his family stay in their home, they obviously found him likable and had some beliefs in common. They did the right thing about the sexual abuse and took it to the authorities and supported the Hale family through it, which is laudable, but they are continuing the patriarchy and religious abuse. I would think the kids need professional help and a chance to reevaluate those beliefs.

[gustava]

I remember this story. Dreadful, evil man.

[bananacat]

Thank you terranova. I thought about starting a thread, but I've never done it (not sure ifi have enough posts).

I'm reading more about this on Rick Ross. It's just horrible.

But even though the kids are undoubtably in a better situation now, and the press keeps referring to the Buckinghams as a "kind, large, christian homesteading family", I've got to wonder how off the wall these folks are too, in their little cabin in Alaska. They befriended Papa Pilgrim, had him and his family stay in their home, they obviously found him likable and had some beliefs in common. They did the right thing about the sexual abuse and took it to the authorities and supported the Hale family through it, which is laudable, but they are continuing the patriarchy and religious abuse. I would think the kids need professional help and a chance to reevaluate those beliefs.

I'm so glad you brought this up. Yes, their situation is better than it used to be, but it still doesn't seem so great to me. I mean, I'm glad that they're no longer being sexually abused and that all the siblings can stay together, but they're still living in an oppressive, isolated, Patriarchal household. It's not even the poverty that bothers me so much, but the strict gender roles and strict religious doctrine along with the continued isolation. And like you said, lack of professional therapy if needed.

[treemom]

But the buckinghams did more than people like the maxwells ever would. Yea they are oppressive and patriarchal. But they also did the right thing.

[lexiloumarie]

One article talked about how the two oldest Buckngham girls married the two oldest Hale boys, and that both were pregnant & living on the family property in their own cabins. So it sounds like the fundie homesteading continues. :/ I worry for the daughter (they said it was an older daughter, but not which one at least in what I read), because I bet they'll be marrying her off soon enough and she's got to have scars.

[Witsec1]

I found this blog post, with recent pictures of the two families.

blog.bryantfamilyfarm.com/2012/05/special-visit.html

There are additional posts if you click through to newer posts.

They appear very fundy indeed.

ETA: I wonder if their trip is a vacation or a "ministry" a la Maxwells.

[Daenerys]

What was the father's sentence? The original article didn't say... I hope he went down for a long, long time.

[Witsec1]

14 years, I think, but he died soon after the sentencing.

[emmiedahl]

I have a hard time snarking on people who are willing to put their money where their mouth is. Taking on the support of another household is a difficult and yet very right thing to do.

[kpmom]

14 years, I think, but he died soon after the sentencing.

14 years for violently raping your daughter sure doesn't seem like much.

[Guest Anonymous]

ETA: I wonder if their trip is a vacation or a "ministry" a la Maxwells.

I think it's what some might call a vacation.... they are getting free food and board wherever they go, and making trips to parks and zoos. The Maxwells 'encouraged' them to go out for the day when they visited Kansas, presumably because they didn't have enough chore packs to go round the busload of visitors when work time came around.... :lol:

[fluttershies]

14 years for violently raping your daughter sure doesn't seem like much.

Considering how much harsher US prison sentences seem to be than UK ones (this is not always a good thing but still), I was really shocked at such a low sentence. Iirc he got it in exchange for not contesting the charges?

I can't snark the Buckinghams much either when they've made such sacrifices for the Hales, and even Mrs Buckingham's mother is helping by teaching the younger Hale children. The Buckinghams might be fundie but at least they care about children's happiness and put some emphasis on them forming their own opinions (as all the kids each have their own Bible and are encouraged to study it for themselves, not just dad's opinion of it).

[Witsec7]

Some of the daughters victim impacts statements are on you tube. They are painful to listen to. Its unfortunate that they had to trade on cult for another just to be free from sexual assault.

[Guest Anonymous]

If the Buckinghams hadn't 'taken on' the Hales, would they have been eligible for financial aid/medical/counselling help?

I kind of admire the B family for being prepared to help, but I'm not sure that it is necessarily the best kind of help for a family to whom Godknowswhat happened.

Not sure also whether it is healthy for their own not insignificantly sized family to be swamped by a clan of abused others?

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Wow. I had read of the "Pilgrim" family before but had no idea of the connection when I first read the travelogue posts yesterday. Odder and odder the more one digs.

Still, this explains the "two families, or one?" question and why there were THAT many kids.

They went to visit Fort Leavenworth while in Kansas, presumably they lived there at one time? Enough to go to the Maxwells' old church? So I guess one of them was in the military at some point? Jacob apparently lived there too, he went to public school in 7th grade.

[Witsec7]

http://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-ad ... l?page=all

This is an incredibly well written story and covers the introductions of both families.

[Witsec7]

The Hale/Buckinghams sing :?

bOY7lggriRo

[gustava]

http://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/The-Darkest-Place.html?page=all

This is an incredibly well written story and covers the introductions of both families.

Thanks for the link.

[Witsec7]

There is a wealth of information out there on these families. Be mindful too the Buckinghams live in Palmer not far from Wassilla. I'm a long time reader of the Mudflats and these are the nonmainstream xtians that have been populating the area for the past few decades.

http://www.mccarthy-kennicott.com/SO2006/page8.html

[AmyP]

One article talked about how the two oldest Buckngham girls married the two oldest Hale boys, and that both were pregnant & living on the family property in their own cabins. So it sounds like the fundie homesteading continues. :/ I worry for the daughter (they said it was an older daughter, but not which one at least in what I read), because I bet they'll be marrying her off soon enough and she's got to have scars.

I think it was Elishiba, wasn't it? I thought she married already.

[Witsec7]

Buckingham seems to be marrying off sons and daughters (a Jacob Berlin is courting Jerusalem Hale). Jim seems like he's a leave and cleave kinda guy.

Another note, Papa Pilgrim was first married to John Connally's daughter, who died in an accident :roll: when he was trying to grab a shotgun she was holding...

riffle

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Buckingham seems to be marrying off sons and daughters (a Jacob Berlin is courting Jerusalem Hale). Jim seems like he's a leave and cleave kinda guy.

Another note, Papa Pilgrim was first married to John Connally's daughter, who died in an accident :roll: when he was trying to grab a shotgun she was holding...

riffle

Jacob got engaged to Jerusalem this past April 28th while the BuckHale (as they put it) group was on vacation. He then is with them on subsequent days, so it seems he's going to Alaska? Or just travelling for a while? Or?

Thanks for all the links - lots of fascinating reading here. I remember reading a bit about the Hale family years ago but hadn't really thought of them in a while...

One of their other neighbors has a blog "Pleasant in the Valley," they go to the same church, are big into natural food in the style of Weston A Price, including all the raw milk stuff. (Just following some links in the comments of the vacation blog.)

[Witsec7]

GVC this is fascinating to me as well since I was aware of Pa Pilgrims charges and crimes. One thing that is really obvious from reading the blog is that Mrs. Hale is never referred to.

[BiblebeltCath]

GVC this is fascinating to me as well since I was aware of Pa Pilgrims charges and crimes. One thing that is really obvious from reading the blog is that Mrs. Hale is never referred to.

sneaking out of lurkdom to share this link

shiningstarsmagazine.com/2011/04/stay-at-home-wife-interview-with-sharia-hale/