Proof that fundies DON'T walk the walk

[Boogalou]

Aw shucks, my very own thread, internet and cake :oops: :D

[Funky Chicken]

If these specifically Christian people were to say anything when handing out food to the homeless, shouldn't it be more like, "*I*love you"..." Because, didn't Jesus specifically exhort us to "love others"? Otherwise, aren't they really saying, "here, have this sandwich, Jesus loves you but I don't. I'm just doing this because I've been told it's a good idea."...?

[Mama Mia]

Now THAT would be creepy ... to have a random stranger say "I love you" as they gave me a sandwich... I might think it had a roofie in it.

[valsa]

Now THAT would be creepy ... to have a random stranger say "I love you" as they gave me a sandwich... I might think it had a roofie in it.

So much better to say, "My invisible friend who died 2000 years ago because you're a wicked sinner loves you".

[JesusFightClub]

On the rare occasions I give people money, I say "Best of luck to you, mate" or words to that effect. Fairly rubbish, but I am at a bit of a loss as to what else you could say.

"I love you" is a bit creepy (and saying it to strangers will get you the wrong sort of attention). "Jesus loves you" sounds like "and I have ticked you off my Heavenly Chores List for the day". The practical alternative is "Here is a sandwich" which is going to get you the response "Duh."

[Mama Mia]

Well, technically, if they were around 2,000 years ago they would be dead regardless, and not visible -- so "my invisible friend who died 2000 years ago because you're a wicked sinner loves you" would be very confusing, and also doesn't sound grammatically correct.

[Funky Chicken]

I s'pose what I mean is that that's what they should say if they say anything at all, but yes it is a bit creepy! Personally I reckon that people will find their own way to their beliefs, and if you push it on them, they're more likely to turn away; especially a lot of homeless people who might already have had problems with "authority". I wonder what the "conversion rate" (if they get any) is when you compare the proselytizer donors with the non-proselytizer donors? I bet that study won't ever be done...

JFC I reckon yours is the best thing to say...

[valsa]

Well, technically, if they were around 2,000 years ago they would be dead regardless, and not visible -- so "my invisible friend who died 2000 years ago because you're a wicked sinner loves you" would be very confusing, and also doesn't sound grammatically correct.

That's 'cause I suck at grammar.

"My invisible friend, who died 2000 years ago because you're a wicked sinner, loves you."

Any better?

[SpeakNow]

Usually I say something like "Have a great day!" or "I hope you enjoy." If the person responds by saying "G-d bless you" (which happens fairly frequently), I usually respond by saying "G-d bless you as well." For someone reason, to me personally, G-d bless you seems more appropriate (if you want to make a religious statement). To me, G-d bless you is essentially the same as saying "I wish you well." To me, saying "Jesus loves you" doesn't really have the same meaning. It just seems like you're throwing your religion in someone's face (whether or not that is your intention, I don't know), rather than telling the person that you hope things get better for them or something like that.

Sorry for my total lack of grammar/correct punctuation. I'm running on very little sleep right now.

[Mama Mia]

I imagine that many homeless people, if they were following this thread, would be thinking "or you could, possibly, stop spending your time debating the merits of various greetings and actually get off your asses and make some sandwiches to give to actual people who are actually hungry"

When I've given food to homeless people ( which I will do if I'm coming out of a store or something .. I'm too lazy to go make sandwiches) I don't say anything but "here would you like this ?" often though the person will say "god bless you" back to me, which I think is interesting.

And Valsa, yes, the comma makes it much more clear.

[Patsy]

Do you really think someone would find it upsetting or offensive if you DID say (not yell) Social Justice is Awesome ? Probably not.

No. I'm saying that it's weird and unnecessary to announce your motivations for every action.

What's rude is the underlying assumption that a person shares some level of your beliefs. It would be rude for me to announce to people "God isn't real!" if I didn't know their beliefs, because what the hell are they supposed to say to that if they don't agree with me?

[Mama Mia]

I don't know, I just find it weird that people are sooooo worried about saying anything that might possible be construed as offensive/rude to someone, it just seems really overly anxious to me. It isn't putting a negative spin on anyone else's beliefs ( at least the way the sandwich maker describes it ), it isn't even asking the other person to give a response.

It is a sandwich and three words.. it sounds like a champagne and caviar problem to me, in a situation where people have actual, real, problems.

[valsa]

I imagine that many homeless people, if they were following this thread, would be thinking "or you could, possibly, stop spending your time debating the merits of various greetings and actually get off your asses and make some sandwiches to give to actual people who are actually hungry".

You keep saying stuff like this, all the while ignoring the fact that people who've been homeless have weighed in on this matter and some have said that they had negative feelings when people say things like "Jesus loves you".

You can't pretend that the people in that position wouldn't find this a relevant issue when people who have been in that position are telling you it's a relevant issue.

[valsa]

It is a sandwich and three words.

Exactly. It's a sandwich and three words. How difficult is it to NOT say those three words when you've been repeatedly told it can make people feel uncomfortable?

[emmiedahl]

I don't understand why some people must include proselytizing in every halfway nice thing they do. Are Christians really such terrible people that they would not give someone a sandwich even without the threat of Jesus?

It seems odd to me, as odd as handing someone a sandwich and saying, "God does not exist."

[valsa]

To me, G-d bless you is essentially the same as saying "I wish you well." To me, saying "Jesus loves you" doesn't really have the same meaning.

I personally view it as basically being the same thing. While using "God" instead of "Jesus" makes it slightly more inclusive (for the religions that incorporate a God but not Jesus), it still doesn't take into consideration-

1) People who don't believe in God

2) People who feel may believe but feel uncomfortable discussing a highly private matter like religion

3) People who believe but may also feel anger or sadness when discussing God. I don't believe in God but I imagine that if I did and was living on the street, I'd be pretty pissed at him.

[Patsy]

I also find open prosletysing with a "Jesus loves you" far less offensive. If someone handed me a bag of lollies with a card for their church and said "Jesus loves you", I'd feel pretty neutral about it. Whatever. They're trying to give me a message, and they're open about their motives.

editing to add extra explanation: when it's said this way, it's "here is something I'm trying to tell you/convince you of", when it's said as an afterthought, it's "here is a fact", which makes me feel awkward, like when a friend announces "evolution's not true". What am I supposed to say to that?

But an expectation of gratitude (e.g. the guy who openly mocked me for accepting his tract and saying "okay, cool" instead of "thank you"), or the expectation to be able to set the tone for any future interaction ("hello, here's a sandwhich, I'm here to give you food P.S. GOD") grates on me. If somebody approached me to ask the time, and then went into their alterior motives re: Jesus, I'd find that far more annoying than someone just openly handing out church cards.

I'll also add that I give no credence to that line of thought, "Oh, bless their little hearts, these Christians, they're so naive they don't realise how arrogant they look!" No. Grow up. Think. You don't get to say whatever the fuck you want to strangers just because you did something nice. The fact that we have Christians on this thread saying "Well, I didn't think about it, but now that I've been explicitly told it could be offensive, I still don't care" just seems pretty entitled to me.

[JesusFightClub]

You keep saying stuff like this, all the while ignoring the fact that people who've been homeless have weighed in on this matter and some have said that they had negative feelings when people say things like "Jesus loves you".

You can't pretend that the people in that position wouldn't find this a relevant issue when people who have been in that position are telling you it's a relevant issue.

I am a homeless person following this thread ;) Not a rough sleeper, but a person whose landlord has given them notice to quit, who wants to stay living with another person (who has no job) and who can't afford a flat and would struggle to pay rent anywhere else. I foresee much couch surfing in my future.

There are many different types of homelessness. So I think as Valsa says here, you just can't presume and there are other people on this thread who have experienced homelessness.

[Mama Mia]

I don't see a problem with someone handing out a sandwich and saying "god does not exist" , if that is what they feel like saying, why not? Or "social justice is awesome" or "I had extra bread so I made sandwiches", or "hey here's a sandwich, have a great day"... some people are going to be offended whatever you say. It is an awkward situation. Many people driving by an overpass are going to be yelling out extremely vile things to people. It just seems like a little bit of a friendly gesture, with good intentions, doesn't need to be picked to pieces looking for evil intent. In this context it isn't even to open a conversation - because they are at a stop sign and then driving on. And I have been the couch surfing type of homeless, and have taken food from charity. People who are that easily offended by other people are too fucking spechul snowflake for me.

[valsa]

I don't see a problem with someone handing out a sandwich and saying "god does not exist" , if that is what they feel like saying, why not? Or "social justice is awesome" or "I had extra bread so I made sandwiches", or "hey here's a sandwich, have a great day"... some people are going to be offended whatever you say. It is an awkward situation. Many people driving by an overpass are going to be yelling out extremely vile things to people. It just seems like a little bit of a friendly gesture, with good intentions, doesn't need to be picked to pieces looking for evil intent. In this context it isn't even to open a conversation - because they are at a stop sign and then driving on. And I have been the couch surfing type of homeless, and have taken food from charity. People who are that easily offended by other people are too fucking spechul snowflake for me.

So... second verse, same as the first?

You obviously don't give a damn about saying rude and offensive things to people. Whatever, that's your issue. But don't act like the people you're saying rude and offensive things to are wrong for being offended.

[Patsy]

People who are that easily offended by other people are too fucking spechul snowflake for me.

[Mama Mia]

People are free to be offended by whatever the hell they want. Since I'm not even bothering to make the freaking sandwich, I'm not taking the risk of offending anyone. :roll:

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

I was at Lowe's today and a man came up to my car and asked for money. I don't carry cash so I offered him a donut which he accepted and then he said "God bless". I think I'm punch-drunk tired because it is so cracking me up right now.

[debrand]

I was at Lowe's today and a man came up to my car and asked for money. I don't carry cash so I offered him a donut which he accepted and then he said "God bless". I think I'm punch-drunk tired because it is so cracking me up right now.

Why did that crack you up?

[formergothardite]

I used to not see how making sure everyone knew that the only reason you did nice things for others was because of your religion could be offensive. But now, if I was homeless and someone drove up and handed me food and said "Jesus loves you." my first reaction would be to think that if there was a Jesus he couldn't love me that much because, you know, I'm hungry and living on the streets. And here you are with your car and extra food, so Jesus obviously loves you more than me.