Duggars by the Dozen 46: Living with the Fallout

[xenobia]

This is a screenshot from Jessas latest vlog. Is this Jackson, Tyler and Jason? If so, it seems like Tyler is still with the Duggar kids now and then even if they don't have custody anymore. 

[Giraffe]

1 hour ago, xenobia said:

This is a screenshot from Jessas latest vlog. Is this Jackson, Tyler and Jason? If so, it seems like Tyler is still with the Duggar kids now and then even if they don't have custody anymore. 

It's not necessarily a current picture 

[xenobia]

16 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

It's not necessarily a current picture 

As far as I can tell from the vlog, this is late summer. Some of the siblings (Jana, Jed, Hannie and these ones) were helping the Seewalds to build a porch. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

I wouldn’t mind if Tyler still visited all of his Duggar cousins. I’m sure they are close. He shouldn’t have to cut them off just because he moved in with his grandparents. 

[xenobia]

25 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I wouldn’t mind if Tyler still visited all of his Duggar cousins. I’m sure they are close. He shouldn’t have to cut them off just because he moved in with his grandparents. 

Totally agree. And we didn't see M&JB in the vlog, just some Duggar siblings heping the Seewalds on their house. If Tyler joins in on that, good for him. 

[Four is Enough]

On 11/11/2023 at 2:20 AM, Father Son Holy Goat said:

I think she knows deep down that he’s guilty but won’t allow herself to access the information because she feels she has too much to lose.

Please God just don't let her think that touching children is a man's right.

[Mama Mia]

I go back and forth on the extent of Anna’s knowledge and belief in Josh and why she stays.

My current overall feeling is that with the initial molestations she believed whatever very minimized version of events she was given, along with everyone’s apparent agreement that he had changed following some combination of punishment/counseling/prayer/growing-up. OK. He was a very young teen. She was probably told about 20% of actuality. He acted decently to her. She’s young and ridiculously sheltered. Plausible. Time goes on, she has a nice life with nice things.  A husband she seems to love, kids she dotes on, big support network. $$$

The scandal breaks, she learns more (but not all) detail, is likely much more uncomfortable, has the icks,  but she’s 3 or 4 kids in, Josh tells her how much he’s changed, it’s exaggerated, his sisters forgave him, God fixed him, God wants her to stay, etc etc. She digs in deeper.

Ashley Madison scandal breaks. She’s humiliated but she wants to make it work, and probably on some level is  really, really, really relieved that he’s cheating with grown women as it proves he’s not actually a pedophile. They’ll get through this. Plus now they are super dependent on his family as he is basically unemployable. She knows he has sexual impulse issues, but thinks of it like any other addiction/sin/affliction - with enough love and prayer and external  controls he can manage it. Things will get better. It’s them against the world.

Life goes on. Not as much $$$, pariahs to the screen and a PR nightmare, but still have the basics, the kids get along with their cousins,  maybe some resentment and doubts, but she directs those towards the outside world not her husband.  She gets a pass from the public and still some of the goodies, even if she has to put porn blockers on devices, live 2 feet from the watchful eyes of her in-laws,  and shove Josh out of site whenever a camera is nearby. 

The CSAM bust happens. Josh tells her some very, very squirrelly versions of events.  “I thought it was ‘barely legal’ teens!” “ I thought it was role play!” “ I thought it was just some rough consenting BDSM!” “ I had no idea what kind of porn it was!” “ I was horrified when I discovered what it was but didn’t know what to do!”  — then when finding out more, or she knew in her gut that was wrong she switches to “ As a matter of fact, it wasn’t his at all! It’s a plant! A conspiracy! “ because she 100% doesn’t want to go down the mental  path of that’s really what he likes and actively sought out and went to great lengths to hide. So she’s actively choosing to believe her husband isn’t a danger. It’s safe for her to keep thinking that for the next 10 years. 
 

 

 

 

 

 

[clueliss]

I've stumbled across a podcast from Hidden True Crime where not long ago they dove into Shiney Happy People.  Specifically they have done a lot of digging into the Vallow/Daybell weird/horrors and she found similarities (despite fundie vs LDS/Visions of Glory based stuff). She was an investigative reporter.  He's a forensic psychologist.  

https://pca.st/episode/2c640534-4ebc-47c4-9e80-5924090b932e

 

[Coconut Flan]

I can't be the only person who thinks it's time for the media to move on from the overly excited/clickbaity articles about some Duggar offspring or grandchild violating Jim Bob's modesty "rules."  They married, moved out, gone on with their lives, and left JB and Michelle's opinion about at least some things far behind them.  JB and Michelle have even given up a lot of the performative stuff they used to do for the show.

[Cam]

47 minutes ago, Coconut Flan said:

I can't be the only person who thinks it's time for the media to move on from the overly excited/clickbaity articles about some Duggar offspring or grandchild violating Jim Bob's modesty "rules."  They married, moved out, gone on with their lives, and left JB and Michelle's opinion about at least some things far behind them.  JB and Michelle have even given up a lot of the performative stuff they used to do for the show.

Oh yes, I grew weary of it long ago and have made similar comments like you. It must still be effective click bait for the media so they continue to use it. Among other things, I hate that they infantilize grown, married women by claiming they’re “rebelling against their daddy.” The media reinforces this narrative over and over by continually running these stories. Give these women space and agency to do as they please without insisting they’re being “bad little girls”. 

[Margarita]

On 11/17/2023 at 6:18 AM, clueliss said:

I've stumbled across a podcast from Hidden True Crime where not long ago they dove into Shiney Happy People.  Specifically they have done a lot of digging into the Vallow/Daybell weird/horrors and she found similarities (despite fundie vs LDS/Visions of Glory based stuff). She was an investigative reporter.  He's a forensic psychologist.  

https://pca.st/episode/2c640534-4ebc-47c4-9e80-5924090b932e

 

Apologies if it's been mentioned, but for those interested in the Vallow/Daybell shitshow, I fully recommend the book (print and audio) When the Moon Turns to Blood: Lori Vallow, Chad Daybell, and a Story of Murder, Wild Faith, and End Times. Even wilder than I had imagined. It's written by Leah Sottile, a seriously talented investigative journalist. I think the book is best suited to the FJ-type audience, not true crime junkies. She really delves into the wild faith bit. 

[SisterCupcake]

On 11/20/2023 at 12:28 PM, Margarita said:

Apologies if it's been mentioned, but for those interested in the Vallow/Daybell shitshow, I fully recommend the book (print and audio) When the Moon Turns to Blood: Lori Vallow, Chad Daybell, and a Story of Murder, Wild Faith, and End Times. Even wilder than I had imagined. It's written by Leah Sottile, a seriously talented investigative journalist. I think the book is best suited to the FJ-type audience, not true crime junkies. She really delves into the wild faith bit. 

I downloaded it and started reading, so fascinating! It also has the most concise version of LDS history I’ve ever read! Thanks for the recommendation. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

I’m wondering who had to come with Hannie. Even though Hannie is 18 and has probably had her drivers license for years. 

[indianabones]

On 11/20/2023 at 8:38 AM, Coconut Flan said:

I can't be the only person who thinks it's time for the media to move on from the overly excited/clickbaity articles about some Duggar offspring or grandchild violating Jim Bob's modesty "rules." 

My parents visited me for Thanksgiving, and we went out to a brewery one night and my mom and I started talking about celebrity gossip. My dad asked us, "Did you guys hear about how one of the Dooger daughters has been seen wearing some risqué clothing?"

[JermajestyDuggar]

I guess Jenny went with her. 

[Coconut Flan]

They don't think it's possible for those two to conspire?  I'm sure some of the sons have.

[JermajestyDuggar]

26 minutes ago, Coconut Flan said:

They don't think it's possible for those two to conspire?  I'm sure some of the sons have.

I wonder if JB trusts Marlin and maybe that’s why he would allow it. Marlin seems just as narcissistic and controlling. Two peas in a pod.

[Cam]

21 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

 

I’ve seen a few kids wear this kind of clothing at Halloween when they’re dressing up as an old lady, just add a gray curly wig and use a walker for a prop. 

[Father Son Holy Goat]

21 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

They don't think it's possible for those two to conspire?  I'm sure some of the sons have.

I’m pretty sure Jessa and Jinger conspired a few times too.

Looking back, the grossest chaperone had to be Jinger watching Josh and Anna. Who thought it was a good idea to send a younger sister that Josh molested to chaperone his date? 

[JermajestyDuggar]

Hannie is the exact same age as Hudson Bontrager so they probably do think she needs a chaperone. And Jenny probably wanted to go. I would do anything to get out of the Duggar house for a few days. 

[Father Son Holy Goat]

6 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Hannie is the exact same age as Hudson Bontrager so they probably do think she needs a chaperone. And Jenny probably wanted to go. I would do anything to get out of the Duggar house for a few days. 

And away from Jim Bob.

[AprilQuilt]

On 12/3/2023 at 10:45 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

I guess Jenny went with her. 

I always think Jennifer looks so different from her sisters but I can see Jill and Jana in her here, and a whole heap of Jim Bob. The Duggar boys all look kind of like they came from the same mold, more or less, but the girls each have their own thing going on. So interesting to see what infinite variation there can be within a gene pool!

Hannie looks really grown up. I wonder who's dressing her, or whether she's allowed to use Pinterest or the social media appropriate to GYMs. For the longest time she was in the awkward adolescent 'baggy religious slogan t-shirt' phase, now she's all modern modest dress-and-cardigan.

Ashamed for myself that I immediately recognised Praise Helferich Bontrager. I've been here too long.

[JermajestyDuggar]

21 minutes ago, AprilQuilt said:

I always think Jennifer looks so different from her sisters but I can see Jill and Jana in her here, and a whole heap of Jim Bob. The Duggar boys all look kind of like they came from the same mold, more or less, but the girls each have their own thing going on. So interesting to see what infinite variation there can be within a gene pool!

Hannie looks really grown up. I wonder who's dressing her, or whether she's allowed to use Pinterest or the social media appropriate to GYMs. For the longest time she was in the awkward adolescent 'baggy religious slogan t-shirt' phase, now she's all modern modest dress-and-cardigan.

Ashamed for myself that I immediately recognised Praise Helferich Bontrager. I've been here too long.

I actually think it might be Susannah Helferich Bontrager. Only because Praise has the tooth that is forward. And I’m not seeing that tooth in the pic. 

[AprilQuilt]

57 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I actually think it might be Susannah Helferich Bontrager. Only because Praise has the tooth that is forward. And I’m not seeing that tooth in the pic. 

I forgot there were two of them!

OK, that makes me feel much better. I shouldn't be able to identify a Helferich or a Bontrager but at least I can't tell the sisters apart. Maybe I'm not too deep in this after all. Maybe it is a healthy interest.

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, AprilQuilt said:

I forgot there were two of them!

OK, that makes me feel much better. I shouldn't be able to identify a Helferich or a Bontrager but at least I can't tell the sisters apart. Maybe I'm not too deep in this after all. Maybe it is a healthy interest.

Susanna and Praise look way too much alike. I have a feeling the Pecan Children (Wallers) will grow up to look a lot alike similar to the Helferiches. Since Cil and Pecan look like brother and sister.