Captain Bret Alan Smith Pt. 3: Fundie Cat Fights, Ahoy

[Letgo]

On ‎10‎/‎29‎/‎2016 at 1:53 PM, fundiefan said:

Every Smith child has been a prop since birth - or adoption. They are used to promote their insane father's even more insane ideas of life. 

I still get teary thinking of the lives the adopted kids could have had if only someone else had adopted them first. Whatever tragedy of life led them to be adopted in the first place was no doubt enough tragedy for one person's life. But, to land in the Smith house - the suckage makes my heart hurt for every one of them. More so than those born into it; theirs was an accident of birth; the adopted kids were intentionally adopted into that hell life. 

So how on earth were the Smiths able to adopt? Wouldn't they need a home study? How would they pass a home inspection or the interviews?

"These are the rods we will use to beat the children. Here is the prayer closet-hope the kiddos aren't claustrophobic! *chuckle* We homeschool, and here are the only four books our children will ever be allowed to read. College preparation? Please don't use the "C" word in our home! We shelter our children from evil influences of the world, such as education, thinking, independence, choices, employment, and the like."

[uber frau]

There are plenty of adoption agencies that seem entirely motivated by the white Saviour complex:  they seem to believe that a poor, brown child will ALWAYS be better off with a Murican, Christian family and are quite prepared to overlook things that many people would consider to be pretty damn fundamental.

And then there are plenty of fundies who are quite to tell a white lie or two when a heathen child's immortal soul is at stake.

[fundiefan]

13 hours ago, Letgo said:

So how on earth were the Smiths able to adopt? Wouldn't they need a home study? How would they pass a home inspection or the interviews?

"These are the rods we will use to beat the children. Here is the prayer closet-hope the kiddos aren't claustrophobic! *chuckle* We homeschool, and here are the only four books our children will ever be allowed to read. College preparation? Please don't use the "C" word in our home! We shelter our children from evil influences of the world, such as education, thinking, independence, choices, employment, and the like."

I always just assumed it was one of the fundie agencies that apparently get a pass on reality. Actually, they often circumvent reality, so I don't  have any qualms about saying those children were all adopted under shady circumstances. All but Sitara were international. And those so-called "Christian" agencies managed to get a lot of children for the right kind of American Christian, without too much trouble.

[lilwriter85]

My employer hired a temporary consultant a couple of months back for a project that I worked on.   We got to know a bit about each other. His stepdaughter and her husband are fundies. Both are involved with ATI and ILBP. I kind of freaked when he told me that. The stepdaughter and husband only have three kids and she had fertility issues and miscarriages. The stepdaughter's husband doesn't have a steady work history. He has had several sales jobs and for awhile worked as a DSL installer.  Anyway, the fundie couple decided to try adoption. They were working an adoption agency at one point, but the agency closed their file because they couldn't come up with certain agency fees. They tried gofundme to raise money, but it didn't work out. The temp consultant said that other agencies have rejected them mostly because of the husband's shaky work history. Now, the couple is taking classes to foster kids. I don't know if they are hoping to do foster to adopt. While I don't think couples need to be rich to adopt, I was relieved that fundie couple  like that wasn't able to to adopt. 

As for the Smiths, I'm guessing they put up a good front to pass the home study and other requirements. With the couple that I recently learned about, I hope that adoption agencies will continue to reject them.

[Palimpsest]

The Smiths also adopted the sibling group from (was it Latvia?) about 10 years ago.   International adoption agencies have since  been clamped down upon somewhat (not enough, IMO) since then.  Also many countries, including Latvia, are now closing or limiting international adoptions even of sibling groups with special needs.  Too many rehomings of children to say nothing of abuse and deaths.

I don't think the Smiths would necessarily pass the adoption home checks and screens today. Well, I hope definitely not today.

[ophelia]

9 hours ago, uber frau said:

There are plenty of adoption agencies that seem entirely motivated by the white Saviour complex:  they seem to believe that a poor, brown child will ALWAYS be better off with a Murican, Christian family and are quite prepared to overlook things that many people would consider to be pretty damn fundamental.

And then there are plenty of fundies who are quite to tell a white lie or two when a heathen child's immortal soul is at stake.

White supremacy at it's best. That is so utterly disgusting. And the thought of Jackie and Bret feeling extra holy for "saving these poor non-white children (and some of them are special needs)" makes me want to puke. They feel holier than most people in their own fundie circles.

 

[Bethella]

1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

The Smiths also adopted the sibling group from (was it Latvia?) about 10 years ago.   International adoption agencies have since  been clamped down upon somewhat (not enough, IMO) since then.  Also many countries, including Latvia, are now closing or limiting international adoptions even of sibling groups with special needs.  Too many rehomings of children to say nothing of abuse and deaths.

I don't think the Smiths would necessarily pass the adoption home checks and screens today. Well, I hope definitely not today.

The Smiths adopted Armando and Yerik from Kazakhstan before September 2005 (I think that was when the blog started?); they adopted Madara from Latvia in Spring 2007, followed by the four boys (Wallace, Joshua, Ronald and Daniel), also from Latvia, later that year; their last adoption was Sitara from the US in Spring 2010.

[Palimpsest]

3 minutes ago, Bethella said:

The Smiths adopted Armando and Yerik from Kazakhstan before September 2005 (I think that was when the blog started?); they adopted Madara from Latvia in Spring 2007, followed by the four boys (Wallace, Joshua, Ronald and Daniel), also from Latvia, later that year; their last adoption was Sitara in Spring 2010.

Many thanks.  I'm hazy on the Smith adoptions - obviously! Is Madara the same sibling group as the 4 boys?   Sitara was a domestic adoption I think.

I still think they might have a lot more problems adopting today both internationally and domestically.

[lilwriter85]

1 hour ago, Palimpsest said:

The Smiths also adopted the sibling group from (was it Latvia?) about 10 years ago.   International adoption agencies have since  been clamped down upon somewhat (not enough, IMO) since then.  Also many countries, including Latvia, are now closing or limiting international adoptions even of sibling groups with special needs.  Too many rehomings of children to say nothing of abuse and deaths.

I don't think the Smiths would necessarily pass the adoption home checks and screens today. Well, I hope definitely not today.

I also don't think they would pass through screenings or checks today. I'm glad that some countries are getting with stricter the requirements. Overseas adoption requirements have come up in a lot of adoption related threads here.

[Bethella]

10 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Many thanks.  I'm hazy on the Smith adoptions - obviously! Is Madara the same sibling group as the 4 boys?   Sitara was a domestic adoption I think.

I still think they might have a lot more problems adopting today both internationally and domestically.

I think Madara and the 4 boys are a sibling group, but I'm not sure, I wasn't following them that closely. Yes, Sitara was a domestic adoption- I edited my post to reflect that just as you were posting.

[Palimpsest]

2 minutes ago, lilwriter85 said:

I also don't think they would pass through screenings or checks today. I'm glad that some countries are getting with stricter the requirements. Overseas adoption requirements have come up in a lot of adoption related threads here.

Yes, indeed.  I actually carefully avoid the adoption threads here because I do some (quite minor) volunteer work around macro issues in international adoption and don't want my blood pressure raised even higher!

[JMO]

So I went searching on the original Smith blog and found this from July 2007:

http://smithfamilia.blogspot.com/2007/07/return-from-latvia.html

Did they rename the boys?  It looks like they adopted all 5 at once. 

ETA:

I found the entry from when they picked up the boys 3 months later:

http://smithfamilia.blogspot.com/2007/10/were-off-to-latvia.html

[Bethella]

7 hours ago, JMO said:

So I went searching on the original Smith blog and found this from July 2007:

http://smithfamilia.blogspot.com/2007/07/return-from-latvia.html

Did they rename the boys?  It looks like they adopted all 5 at once. 

ETA:

I found the entry from when they picked up the boys 3 months later:

http://smithfamilia.blogspot.com/2007/10/were-off-to-latvia.html

It looks like they gave the boys new first names, turning their original names in to middle names. Wallace Yivoh, Joshua Madeks, Ronald Madisen, and Daniel Gavido.

[fundiefan]

16 minutes ago, Bethella said:

It looks like they gave the boys new first names, turning their original names in to middle names. Wallace Yivoh, Joshua Madeks, Ronald Madisen, and Daniel Gavido.

They're the Smiths. Everyone gets multiple names and they're used interchangeably. Alan was known as Alan and Charlie. The Mortons do it too, although they do typically stick with the middle names when referring to them on the blog. Although the younger ones are mixing it up with their personal social media profiles. 

It's because of that that it took me a really damn long time to figure them all out when I first 'discovered' them. At one time I thought the Smiths had two adult sons, Charlie and Alan. 

It may be intentional, cultural, fundie, who knows. It's just weird. Not that they do it at all, but they do it so consistently with all the males in Smorton land.

[JMO]

I noticed that too @Bethella. I guess they did that to give them more American sounding names?   I still can't believe that someone let them adopt a whole family.  Those poor kids. New language ,  new names, crazy new religious rules. 

[JMO]

I know I mentioned this last night but it really bugs me.  How old was Madara when they adopted her?  And the two older boys were of an age to remember a lot of their previous life too.  Now, I have no idea of their life with their birth family and it's quite possible that it was neglectful and even abusive.  But, I can't imagine one day the "Cap'n" showing up and telling me that I've been living life wrong.  I need to be subservient to him and all men.  I must obey without question my parents.  I must immerse myself in religion and follow the bible as a handbook to life.  It's quite possible that they were in a Christian orphanage and were being immersed in religion already.  But I can't imagine being brought to a new country, new culture, new language, and being told that there are all new rules for how to live.  And the chief among them is complete obediance to my new "father".  What a lot of upheaval.  

[DaisyD]

Upheaval is one word for it....

 

[fundiefan]

48 minutes ago, JMO said:

I know I mentioned this last night but it really bugs me.  How old was Madara when they adopted her?  And the two older boys were of an age to remember a lot of their previous life too.  Now, I have no idea of their life with their birth family and it's quite possible that it was neglectful and even abusive.  But, I can't imagine one day the "Cap'n" showing up and telling me that I've been living life wrong.  I need to be subservient to him and all men.  I must obey without question my parents.  I must immerse myself in religion and follow the bible as a handbook to life.  It's quite possible that they were in a Christian orphanage and were being immersed in religion already.  But I can't imagine being brought to a new country, new culture, new language, and being told that there are all new rules for how to live.  And the chief among them is complete obediance to my new "father".  What a lot of upheaval.  

That's been one of my largest personal objections to all the so called Christian international adoptions no matter where they're from or how old they are or what language they spoke or even what their living conditions were like.

How the hell can be any kind of healthy to go from one world to another like that? Even if you were in a neglectful orphanage or dire situations - the solution is not to remove you from your country, language, culture, values, food, beliefs and plop you into the middle of a white, American fundie family who will homeschool you, fill you with bible verses and rules, tell you you're worthless in some god's eyes -but he loves you anyway... really, I hope no one pulls that shit with adopted kids who no doubt already have self worth issues .

The extremes are...well, extreme. How can a kid adjust in a healthy way? How can they ever truly reconcile themselves, their past, their present and their future when they land in fundieland and are repressed, told what their value is-or isn't-forced to learn bible verses and sing praises to some god they may never have heard of....it all makes my head spin and I am now repeating myself.

 

[Carm_88]

1 hour ago, fundiefan said:

The extremes are...well, extreme. How can a kid adjust in a healthy way? How can they ever truly reconcile themselves, their past, their present and their future when they land in fundieland and are repressed, told what their value is-or isn't-forced to learn bible verses and sing praises to some god they may never have heard of....it all makes my head spin and I am now repeating myself.

 

I don't think the kid will ever adjust in a healthy way. An average family would learn about the child's culture and maybe integrate it. Or you'd hope they would. The Smiths wouldn't. It's their way or the highway. These poor kids. It's sad that they went from one horrible situation to another. To be adopted into a cult? Heartbreaking

[JMO]

Not to mention that if their birth mother was unmarried or had children out of wedlock with more than one father she would be branded a SINNER and unworthy of God's love.  I can't imagine what sort of nasty head trip that has to be. 

[fundiefan]

Bret shared Vision Forums post. Many comments later, he's just as much of a dick as ever. I would never, ever allow a female in his presence. He is a horrible, nasty, vile, ignorant excuse for a man. 

[picklepizzas]

ugh. i feel like he's trying to draw parallels between what he sees as someone lying about accusations against doug phillips and alan's case...implying AGAIN that alan's accusers are straight up lying. yikes.

[Mudgie]

It's one thing to extend mercy to a grown man who commits adultery. It's another thing entirely to extend mercy and forgiveness to a CHILD RAPIST. There is no comparing the two. 

I consider it quite merciful that whoever discovered their child had been assaulted and raped did not in fact take justice into their own hands and castrate the vile excuse for a human being. 

That's about as much mercy as he should receive. 

 

[fundiefan]

Jacque Smith is in drama queen mode. Illness, those poor incarcerated relatives of hers who made her day by calling, babies she can't see...

It does kind of have to suck to be her. To have so much of her life dictated and controlled by her husband and religion that even her emotions are expressed in a convoluted way.

Apparently Bret's mom had a heart attack and the Smith daughter Mady is 'honoring her parents' by staying with her.

Every single fucking thing they do is wrapped in their warped view of religion, themselves and reality. One day, they'll self combust and it won't be pretty.

It's all quite a contrast to the Mortons who are, despite the circumstances of their oldest daughters life, living good lives that seems to make them happy.

I have to admit, I keep waiting with an almost hopeful feeling for the Smith's world to combust. I'm not proud, but those people are disturbed and they disgust me.

[JMO]

Did you also see Brett's post blaming Georgia's loss in the "War Between the States " due to God's anger over the history of aggression against Native Americans? Now, I'm impressed he hasn't just taken the white savior vs savage mind frame but the fact that he frames it in terms of his supposed Native American ancestry and he doesn't call it the Civil War makes my eyes roll .