Michael Bates Brandon Keilen wedding

[ladyaudley]

I'm only having my sister and best friend, too. Husband to be just has his best friend as a best man. I'm paying for the dresses, too.

[martian]

I've seen so many gorgeous, drool worthy, modest dresses following links from here. I think there was even a whole thread where Ralar posted a picture of a cousin's stunning, much more than merely Bates modest gown, and then people posted links to other beautiful, extremely conservative wedding dresses. So what is the Bates' deal with kinda crappy, tacked on alterations? Is it to demonstrate how set apart from the world they are that they simply must do alterations, because all the gowns ever are too worldly? I don't think it's lack of time to order, probably takes a fair amount of time to alter a dress you had to order in the first place. Shouldn't be money, some of the really beautiful dresses I looked at were also ridiculously inexpensive. Can't see why it would be from wanting trendiness or style, since Duchess Kate made modest the hottest. So, what is the Bates deal?

I don't know why I'm caught on this question. I just keep coming back to the weirdness of it.

[Justme]

I would imagine the fact that they plan their weddings in 3-4 months accounts for many of the "crappy" dresses. They have to buy off the rack since they don't have time to order. Generally, there is a small selection of "off the rack" wedding dresses.

[martian]

I'm not sure why some fundies at least wouldn't have dresses waiting in their hope chests along with their Victorian marriage manuals and anti-suffragette posters but, even so, how long does it take to order a wedding dress? I should go check but, at the online places, it looked like you just placed the order and boom, dress in the mail. And is it bad form to get your dress ready when the courtship gets serious? Michael's courtship was waaayyy longer than a few months, after all.

Edit: Okay, looking around online, it seems like the online shops can get you a dress in weeks, and with the bricks and mortar stores, it very much depends on the manufacturer, the design, and whether they already have your size in stock. Still, getting a dress in 2.5 to 3 months that is made to size seems not to be that out of the ordinary going by a brief glance at the bridal forums. The online prices can be fantastic, seriously, wonder if the quality stands up?

[ViolaSebastian]

I'm not sure why some fundies at least wouldn't have dresses waiting in their hope chests along with their Victorian marriage manuals and anti-suffragette posters but, even so, how long does it take to order a wedding dress? I should go check but, at the online places, it looked like you just placed the order and boom, dress in the mail. And is it bad form to get your dress ready when the courtship gets serious? Michael's courtship was waaayyy longer than a few months, after all.

Back when I worked at a dress shop, we would tell brides six months to be on the safe side. They came in a lot sooner, but we needed to have a lot of wiggle room to make the alterations they almost certainly needed.

[martian]

Yeah, the bridal forums I looked at were talking 6 or even 9 months, but it just seems like things can also move along much, much faster depending on designer and manufacturer.

I don't know why this bugs me so. Maybe it just seems like an artificial problem, kind of like the War on Christmas or how kids are forbidden to pray over their lunchables in school? I don't know.

[Snarkle]

It is probably a matter of money as well. I finally watched the BUB episode where she went wedding dress shopping and the dress she liked was (if I recall correctly) $1,500 even with a discount, and with the more modest alterations she wanted it would hit around $2,000 which is insane for a dress she only wore for mere hours considering how short her reception was. Since they still needed to [sort of] feed 800 guests and the rest, she might have tried on new dresses for the show, but bought a discounted (possibly discontinued) dress and invested in alterations more than the dress itself.

[sisterwives]

Yeah, the bridal forums I looked at were talking 6 or even 9 months, but it just seems like things can also move along much, much faster depending on designer and manufacturer.

Honestly, I always suspected that the Bates women want their cake and to eat it too wrt dresses. They want beautiful modern dresses however they are, gasp! Immodest, so they take them go cheap seamstresses to get them altered, which may end horribly or lovely. I've seen some HIDEOUS alterations on dresses but because the brides were on a time crunch, they were just forced to be wear the fug dress on their wedding days.

I also think that the style of dress they go after don't look good after alterations. They really should go the route Jessa Seewald did and get an already modest dress.

[actuallyjessica]

i feel sorry for these fundie brides who end up wearing dresses that don't seem to do their figures justice, in order to meet the time crunch of a short engagement and modesty standards. seeing the dresses that michael tried on and appeared to love and then admitted she'd have to keep looking because it would cost too much made me sad. wedding gowns cost a lot of money, but if you're going to look at those pictures for the next 50+ years you don't want to look back and shudder at the dress. my wedding day was wonderful and i got to marry my love, but i don't really enjoy looking at my wedding photos for a couple of cosmetic reasons. :/

i thought this dress looked absolutely amazing on michael, but could see why it wouldn't be her style. it isn't modest enough, but man! gorgeous!

[19 cats and counting]

i feel sorry for these fundie brides who end up wearing dresses that don't seem to do their figures justice, in order to meet the time crunch of a short engagement and modesty standards. seeing the dresses that michael tried on and appeared to love and then admitted she'd have to keep looking because it would cost too much made me sad. wedding gowns cost a lot of money, but if you're going to look at those pictures for the next 50+ years you don't want to look back and shudder at the dress. my wedding day was wonderful and i got to marry my love, but i don't really enjoy looking at my wedding photos for a couple of cosmetic reasons. :/

i thought this dress looked absolutely amazing on michael, but could see why it wouldn't be her style. it isn't modest enough, but man! gorgeous!

I think that dress is pretty modest, but I see why it would not meet her standards. She said she wanted a dress to make her look skinny (she's built like Alyssa so naturally skinny) and the fabric that dress is made of looks (from photos, no clue in person) like it is very unforgiving of body flaws (aka emphasizes any fat bulge, etc) and one would need industrial strength Spanx to wear it.

I really don't get why many fundies just don't make a trip to Utah and go to Mormon bridal shops.

[Diana]

i feel sorry for these fundie brides who end up wearing dresses that don't seem to do their figures justice, in order to meet the time crunch of a short engagement and modesty standards. seeing the dresses that michael tried on and appeared to love and then admitted she'd have to keep looking because it would cost too much made me sad. wedding gowns cost a lot of money, but if you're going to look at those pictures for the next 50+ years you don't want to look back and shudder at the dress. my wedding day was wonderful and i got to marry my love, but i don't really enjoy looking at my wedding photos for a couple of cosmetic reasons. :/

i thought this dress looked absolutely amazing on michael, but could see why it wouldn't be her style. it isn't modest enough, but man! gorgeous!

Personally i dont like that dress either. The one she finally choose but couldn buy because it was too expensive was gorgeous to me. But who knows how it would have looked after the alterations they wanted to make to it anyway.

[19 cats and counting]

Just took a look at Jessa's no modesty alterations needed dress again. While it's very modest by wedding dress standards, it's not modest by many fundie standards.

It's a pretty deep scoop neck and I can see it being too low for someone like Michael, who is always wearing the layered look in everyday life. Also it doesn't strike me as her sense of style. Of the Bates girls, I can only seeing Alyssa (who's dress I liked) wearing it.

[martian]

I think that dress is pretty modest, but I see why it would not meet her standards. She said she wanted a dress to make her look skinny (she's built like Alyssa so naturally skinny) and the fabric that dress is made of looks (from photos, no clue in person) like it is very unforgiving of body flaws (aka emphasizes any fat bulge, etc) and one would need industrial strength Spanx to wear it.

I really don't get why many fundies just don't make a trip to Utah and go to Mormon bridal shops.

It is probably a matter of money as well. I finally watched the BUB episode where she went wedding dress shopping and the dress she liked was (if I recall correctly) $1,500 even with a discount, and with the more modest alterations she wanted it would hit around $2,000 which is insane for a dress she only wore for mere hours considering how short her reception was. Since they still needed to [sort of] feed 800 guests and the rest, she might have tried on new dresses for the show, but bought a discounted (possibly discontinued) dress and invested in alterations more than the dress itself.

I've seen modest stuff online that looked gorgeous for under a couple of hundred dollars. Does anyone know, do those dresses just not hold up in person? I think even some of the Allure gowns were super cheap, and those aren't actually sold online, you go to a bricks and mortar store to get them. Also, yeah, all the Mormon bridal dresses - is there some unspoken prohibition with the fundies about getting a modest dress from the Mormons? Any Temple appropriate dress should be modest enough for the average fundie, and the Mormons have economies of scale on their side to bring the prices down.

I guess something about this problem seems so artificial to me that the solutions the Bates arrive at look ostentatiously modest. I confess that the Bates in general get under my skin for being such cuddly fundies. I think they are amazingly good at managing their public image and flying under the radar as fanatics, so a lot of things they do come off as phony to me including supposedly not having the money to buy their most loyal servant-daughter the wedding dress of her dreams all while they're filming a damn television show. Fuck you, Gil, you unrepentant, deadbeat grifter! I see you hiding behind your pretty children!

[Georgiana]

Jessa's wedding happened really at the height of Duggar prestige. Jill's wedding drew an unprecedented amount of viewers. Everyone assumed (correctly) that Jessa's would as well. Like a smaller scale of the Royal Wedding, whatever modest dress line got their dress on Jessa was going to get a windfall off advertising. I think Allure made something work for Jessa.

Michael Bates, whose family/wedding doesn't yet have the prestige the Duggars did, especially while she was planning, didn't have those options. She had to buy/alter a dress like a normal person.

[salex]

I don't understand why more of them don't make their wedding dresses. They are supposed to be getting all of their helpmeet training and home making skills. By the time they are old enough to get married, they should be able to make a wedding dress that looks good. (Note, I made mine, it was basic late 70s style, but simple style as I am not a froufrou kind of girl-- lace sleeves and overlay of lace over a scooped neckline. and I hand beaded the lace around the veil-- but I'd been sewing from the time I was 8 years old and entering garments in competition over 10 years for 4-H. I'd say half the girls I knew back then sewed well enough to make a nice looking, well made wedding dress, if they wanted to do so. Even more of our moms, aunts and grandmothers had that skill. Sewing was so common that it was not uncommon to buy the patterns, fabric and notions to give the bridesmaids and they or someone in their family would sew their dresses. :shock: :lol:

My sister-in-law's 80s wedding dress was made by her mother, and looked completely professional. Not to say no one bought a wedding dress, but since they are altering them any way, find a patter and sew.

Though, sewing is not always cheaper than buying, but being an excellent seamstress seems like it should be part of the fundie girl/woman repertoire.

[CaptainFunderpants]

I think that dress is pretty modest, but I see why it would not meet her standards. She said she wanted a dress to make her look skinny (she's built like Alyssa so naturally skinny) and the fabric that dress is made of looks (from photos, no clue in person) like it is very unforgiving of body flaws (aka emphasizes any fat bulge, etc) and one would need industrial strength Spanx to wear it.

I really don't get why many fundies just don't make a trip to Utah and go to Mormon bridal shops.

Michael isn't tiny like Alyssa at all. Michael is naturally broad and so I could see wanting a wedding dress to make her seem tiny, because she does have a broad jaw line, broad shoulders, and full hips. Alyssa has none of those things.

[Georgiana]

I don't understand why more of them don't make their wedding dresses. They are supposed to be getting all of their helpmeet training and home making skills. By the time they are old enough to get married, they should be able to make a wedding dress that looks good. (Note, I made mine, it was basic late 70s style, but simple style as I am not a froufrou kind of girl-- lace sleeves and overlay of lace over a scooped neckline. and I hand beaded the lace around the veil-- but I'd been sewing from the time I was 8 years old and entering garments in competition over 10 years for 4-H. I'd say half the girls I knew back then sewed well enough to make a nice looking, well made wedding dress, if they wanted to do so. Even more of our moms, aunts and grandmothers had that skill. Sewing was so common that it was not uncommon to buy the patterns, fabric and notions to give the bridesmaids and they or someone in their family would sew their dresses. :shock: :lol:

My sister-in-law's 80s wedding dress was made by her mother, and looked completely professional. Not to say no one bought a wedding dress, but since they are altering them any way, find a patter and sew.

Though, sewing is not always cheaper than buying, but being an excellent seamstress seems like it should be part of the fundie girl/woman repertoire.

Well, Anna did.

But I think nowadays the Bates/Duggar girls are FAR more media savvy than Anna was and don't want to be on national TV in a homemade gown. Which isn't to say homemade dresses can't be nice, but they have so much to do over such a short amount of time, they don't have the time to spend making a nice dress. If fundie engagements were longer, I think we would see more. But if you have the money, it's a huge chunk of time you can get back by buying the dress instead of making it.

[Kiracee]

Well, Anna did.

But I think nowadays the Bates/Duggar girls are FAR more media savvy than Anna was and don't want to be on national TV in a homemade gown. Which isn't to say homemade dresses can't be nice, but they have so much to do over such a short amount of time, they don't have the time to spend making a nice dress. If fundie engagements were longer, I think we would see more. But if you have the money, it's a huge chunk of time you can get back by buying the dress instead of making it.

I thought anna borrowed her sister's dress.

[Brienna]

I thought so too Kiracee.

The bridesmaid dresses they made themselves, I believe.

[NewSeasonOfLife]

Since Michael made Erin's bridesmaid dresses from scratch and used to make all the girls' dresses when they were still in the frumper stage, I have nothing against her not making her own wedding/bridesmaid dresses. She should least let that bit of the wedding taken care of and not hanging over her. Plus she was nannying pretty close to full time, probably up until the wedding. Her time was way more limited than the Duggar girls.

[SassyPants]

Well, Anna did.

But I think nowadays the Bates/Duggar girls are FAR more media savvy than Anna was and don't want to be on national TV in a homemade gown. Which isn't to say homemade dresses can't be nice, but they have so much to do over such a short amount of time, they don't have the time to spend making a nice dress. If fundie engagements were longer, I think we would see more. But if you have the money, it's a huge chunk of time you can get back by buying the dress instead of making it.

So much to do? LOL, not really.

[singsingsing]

Hey, did you guys see their latest blog post? brandonlovesmichaela.com/2015/09/24/5394/

It's got some wedding pictures and she also says, "We know that many challenges will come our way in the days ahead, and we’ve already been seeking the Lord about some major changes that will be coming our direction." I'm guessing this means they're going to be moving with Gothard Headquarters to Big Sandy.

[actuallyjessica]

Hey, did you guys see their latest blog post? brandonlovesmichaela.com/2015/09/24/5394/

It's got some wedding pictures and she also says, "We know that many challenges will come our way in the days ahead, and we’ve already been seeking the Lord about some major changes that will be coming our direction." I'm guessing this means they're going to be moving with Gothard Headquarters to Big Sandy.

or she's pregnant.

have they said if michael has what erin has?

[luv2laugh]

It's definitely about them having to move to Big Sandy, TX.... They just got married and moved in and now they have to move.

[singsingsing]

I feel bad for them, but something tells me Michael might be happier in Big Sandy than she would've been in Chicago, anyway. I realize Gothard HQ is/was located in a suburb, but she doesn't strike me as a big city person.