Do you think older, unmarried SAHD's see a gynocologist?

[tehgoobster]

Chaotic Life,

I'll have to say when that doctor said he sometimes knocks patients out to do a pap-smear--I was taken aback, very shocked. I told him that having that exam hurt as much as when I gave birth to my son. He didn't seems fazed, he just said "Well, at least this pain was shorter than that." Weird that he didn't think the painful pap-smear was wrong. There was a female nurses' aid in the room. But, at that clinic, nurses aids come and go. They also have a lot of interns. So, I didn't know her. And she just stood by quietly the whole time, never said anything. She didn't even say anything when he yelled at me to "stop moving!!" (Cuz it hurt so much I started moving backwards, away from him.) And the minute the exam was over, she left. Then after that another odd thing happened. I sat up on the table and the doctor was sitting on a stool at the edge of the table (by my feet). When the exam was over I was very dizzy, so I set my feet down on (what I thought) was a ledge beneath the table I was sitting on. My feet were there for a few minutes before I realized they felt funny. So, I looked down and my feet were actually resting on my doctor's legs. I felt that was really weird that he never said anything about my feet resting on his legs. Like bea said, the whole thing kinda creepy. Another thing was that I look much younger than my age and when I told him how old I am, he seemed almost disappointed and said "Oh really? You look much younger..." I thought that was weird too, but I brushed it off. I guess the whole appointment was weird, now that I think about it.

Tons of red flags went up for me reading about your doctor. Something seriously doesn't seem right AT ALL. I wouldn't go to him again if I were you.

[OnceModestTwiceShy]

I would also recommend going to female GYNs only if at all possible. I'm not at all a puritanical type, but I won't let a male doctor do a pap or pelvic exam. I think you're much more likely to be gentle and understanding if you have the same parts.

[Cran]

Personally, I have made very BAD experiences with female doctors (of several professions: gyn, neuroligist, dentist) that outnumber my negative experience with male doctors by far. It is my personal feeling that women might think "Doesn't bother me, why should it bother her?" and that might end up desastrous, while a male doesn't have this parts and can never relate in the same way and might therefore be more accepting of a woman's feelings.

So, to make it short, I prefer male doctors. But all in all, it comes not down to sex, but to empathy, which can be lacking in both sexes.

[Jinger_Cat]

Crystal,

File a complaint with the the state medical board. This is something that should get attention from authorities.

[daharyn]

Folks, if you're scared of going, I have one recommendation--develop a good working relationship with a female GP who is under the age of 50. I find the gynecology stuff much easier to handle if it is interspersed with all the other medical stuff--like, "oh, I need a tetanus booster and a pap smear, OK." And so I see the same (youngish, female) doctor for everything. It's far less intimidating that way.

I went to a women's college: before you had a pelvic exam with health services you had to sit through a required "this is what to expect & how it should feel" talk from the student wellness group. It was kind of embarrassing to be sitting in a room with a bunch of other women hearing this but hey, it made it a lot easier to do the first time. I got annual paps as soon as I got health insurance (age 25). I just turned thirty and my GP surprised me with the news that after 30, if everything's normal, you only need 'em every 3 years! It was one of the best parts of getting another year older. :)

As far as the SAHDs go, I don't think there's any way any of them are getting regular gynecological care. I doubt they got vaccinated against HPV either. This frustrates me, because their sexual safety is out of their hands--it's based on the idea that "my future husband is a virgin and will NEVER sleep with someone other than me after we are married." And that just seems like a really stupid thing to assume. I think that lack of access to care (and more importantly, information about sexual health) also makes it more likely that if, God forbid, a SAHD experiences any sort of sexual assault, she may not know how best to handle it, medically speaking.

Not getting your business taken care of leaves you at greater risk, ladies. It shouldn't hurt (I personally bleed a tiny bit, and cramp just a little, but some people do and some don't. That's normal), and it's pretty darn quick. So please, please, please get your bits looked at on a regular basis. Whether or not you're sexually active, and with whom, doesn't matter so much, as does keeping everything in good working order!

ETA: Also, getting your pap smear done is a great time to get annual STD testing! Which all sexually active people, monogamous or otherwise, should do, in order to protect themselves and their partners. You spend one doctor's visit getting that done, then go have, um, a REALLY great time the rest of the year. :dance:

[bananacat]

I would also recommend going to female GYNs only if at all possible. I'm not at all a puritanical type, but I won't let a male doctor do a pap or pelvic exam. I think you're much more likely to be gentle and understanding if you have the same parts.

Oh how I wish that were true. I've never had any horrible pap experiences, but I've female doctors who wouldn't let me get a word in edgewise, or dismiss my legitimate concerns, or try to shame me just as much as male doctors. I've also had fantastic female doctors, but not all of them are gentle or understanding.

[nutella addict]

Chaotic Life, definitely change doctors, all of that just sounds so not ok.

I've been having them every year since I was 18. Mom didn't care that I wasn't sexually active, I was 18 so it was time to start. Another friend's mom also dragged her in when we were 18 so at least we could talk about it. The doctors in my area said either 18 or 21 or sexually active, whichever comes first. I've seen both a male and a female doctor, and honestly the male doctor was more gentle, although the female doctor was fine too. My mom also made me get the HPV vaccine when it came out even though I said I was only ever going to sleep with my future husband. I think it was probably good of her, really, and I'm glad that I know my exams are normal. It's uncomfortable, yes, but it really doesn't last very long and a good doctor will do his/her best to make it efficient, painless, and not awkward.

And I agree, I don't think the SAHDs will ever see a gynecologist until they're married and having babies.

[debrand]

You should really start doing regular breast exams at about 18. It's not a big deal, do it in the shower. More and more younger women are being dx'ed with breast cancer and it's treatable. Even women with no family history are getting it. To me it's better safe than sorry.

I'm 58, post menopausal and had a baseline pap last year. I'm good for 3 years. I have terrible times with them anyway, my uterus is tipped and even using the smallest speculum I am screaming. But I need to be vigilant so I'll go and get it done.

Mine is tilted also but I've only had discomfort not pain.

One of the reasons that I will only go to a female ob-gyn is because they have to get a yearly pap also. I assume that makes them more understanding.

[Kishiria]

Wow, it sounds like a lot of people on this board have had unusually bad experiences (or doctors with really terrible technique). Let me just assure everyone who HASN'T had a pelvic exam, yet, that unless you have some sort of unusual issue or or a really terrible doctor, it's not NEARLY as bad as you might think. Seriously.

I dreaded going for YEARS AND YEARS and was completely freaked out for weeks before I went for the first time, and then I went and it was totally anticlimatic. I was actually angry at myself afterwards for having spent so much time and energy worrying about something that was not that big of a deal. Is it awkward and a bit embarrassing? Sure. Is it the worst medical procedure you've ever gone through? Absolutely not. It's over really, really quick and though it's a bit uncomfortable, I've never had it outright hurt. So, yeah, it's not something to spend a lot of mental energy on.

THIS.

My mom is a crazy Puerto Rican Catholic, and she built up gyno checks as something horrible and to be feared. I suffered with a terrible yeast infection for at least a year until I finally went to a Nurse-Practioner who did it and it was no biggie. I was 20.

I'm 46 now, and I only get annual pap smears (which don't hurt) because the Army makes me. Otherwise I'd get one every 3 years. Doctors are now pushing mammograms on me, but I'm refusing because I don't believe they're safe and many doctors, especially Canadian ones, are the ones saying annual mammograms are a really bad idea due to the crushing and radiation exposure. I had one pre-deployment because it was mandatory.

However, I have no history of either cervical or breast cancer in either side of my family. I'm longtime monogamous and have never been pregnant. I don't have a gynecologist, I just have my GP do a pap when I'm in for my annual checkup and as I said, I never do mammograms.

[OnceModestTwiceShy]

Oh how I wish that were true. I've never had any horrible pap experiences, but I've female doctors who wouldn't let me get a word in edgewise, or dismiss my legitimate concerns, or try to shame me just as much as male doctors. I've also had fantastic female doctors, but not all of them are gentle or understanding.

Fair enough...I have had the absolute opposite experience, so I guess it depends. To be fair, I've also been sexually abused, so I'm very weird about strange men touching me in ANY context!

[galaxygirl]

I'm lucky that my regular family doctor is also a gyn and I'm completely comfortable with her. My paps didn't hurt at all, to me it felt no worse than putting in a tampon tbh. I was disappointed that she's not an OB, but I found one that I'm just as at ease with, so it's all good.

Chrystal J, while reading your story, there were so many red flags going off. Find yourself a new doctor and put in complaints about this one, what he's doing is not right at all.

[dramallama]

Wow, it sounds like a lot of people on this board have had unusually bad experiences (or doctors with really terrible technique). Let me just assure everyone who HASN'T had a pelvic exam, yet, that unless you have some sort of unusual issue or or a really terrible doctor, it's not NEARLY as bad as you might think. Seriously.

I dreaded going for YEARS AND YEARS and was completely freaked out for weeks before I went for the first time, and then I went and it was totally anticlimactic. I was actually angry at myself afterwards for having spent so much time and energy worrying about something that was not that big of a deal. Is it awkward and a bit embarrassing? Sure. Is it the worst medical procedure you've ever gone through? Absolutely not. It's over really, really quick and though it's a bit uncomfortable, I've never had it outright hurt. So, yeah, it's not something to spend a lot of mental energy on.

Yes, this. I was SO TERRIFIED. I waited until I was 24 and the night before my appointment, I was unable to sleep and started Google image searching "speculum" - DON'T DO THAT. But when it happened...it was nothing. Extremely mild discomfort, of course it was awkward, but it felt more like a bit of pressure and the feeling of needing to pee, no pain whatsoever, and it was over inside of 2-3 minutes. Probably less. If it hurts, go to a different doctor. I have a great female GP who warms the gel and the speculum before the exam and is super-fast, and a doctor who knows what s/he's doing is key.

And as my sister-in-law was diagnosed with stage IIb breast cancer earlier this year, with no family history, and under the recommended age for beginning mammograms, I, too, would like to stress the need for checking your breasts as well.

[synchroswimr]

To the person who had one painful pap, I agree with the others-find a different doc and tell him/her about your first experience.

I've been having them yearly for 15 years, even though I've only been active for 10 years, and all if that with the same man. Mine are extremely painful because I have vulvodynia. Sex is also painful for me - ranging from mild pain to excruciating, I can't do this pain.

So, if you continually have painful paps, it is worth asking the question. I'd been having sex for 5 years before a doc listened to me and helped me find the problem.

[AmandaP]

Just going to chime in with my experiences.

I didn't have a Pap until a few weeks after I got married. I was a virgin until my wedding night. I've had one every year since and they've never been painful - just a bit uncomfortable. I've also gone to the doctor with my sister and with my cousin for their first visits and held their hands through the experience. Both times their doctors were quite understanding of their desire to have me with them. My sister found out at her first appointment (mere months before she got married) that she had a horrifically thick and tightly closed hymen. The doctor couldn't even insert a q-tip! This had been causing her to have horribly painful periods for years (slow but heavy flow, and awful cramps along with enough pain to make her throw up and pass out) and it could have been FIXED for her years before if we hadn't grown up in a family terrified of teh secks and anything genitally related.

My doctor has always moved slowly, asked me if I was OK, and been very gentle. I can't imagine being dismissed when I was in pain. ((hugs)) to you ChrystalJ.

[Daisy4]

I have a great female GP who warms the gel and the speculum before the exam and is super-fast, and a doctor who knows what s/he's doing is key.

THIS!

I've been to a few Gynos that weren't great. It wasn't painful but it was very uncomfortable. I looked up reviews and choose a new practice. I LOVE the nurse practitioner that I see now, I even followed her to a different practice. What sets her apart is that she is super FAST, the first time I saw her I couldn't believe that it was over so quickly. She gets everything ready before starting so that once the speculum is in, she just has to do the swabbing and be done. I remember another doc would put it in and then start looking for the stuff he needed. A warm speculum helps too!

She is also great to talk to and takes time to answer questions.

Seriously, if your exams are painful, please switch practitioners!

[dawbs]

the PP who mentioned not letting the BF/DH/whomever back w/ you, they gave me grief about allowing the Mr. back w/ me once and I asked...the doc explained that she gets a feel for some things and that's her ONLY time to ask questions like 'is anyone hurting you at home"--something that doesnt' work well when the abuser happens to be there. It's not a great answer but it is one.

And I'll say I had one INCREDIBLY bad pap (my first or second ever) and it was because the doctor (who I didn't like and who I promptly fired) didn't notice that a few stray and very delicately placed hairs caught in the dang speculum. That doesn't sound like a big deal but OMG, I cried. It was just the most painful experience of my life, to that point.

[masagoroll]

If Steve Maxwell won't even let his kids get on airplanes because the security measures are too immodest, he's definitely not letting Sarah and Anna visit the gyno.

I've had a full pap and pelvic every year since I was 18. It's just good sense, considering it's sometimes the only way to know if you have a problem. And you can get problems even if you're not sexually active. It doesn't take long, and you can mostly just look at the ceiling and pretend you're somewhere else until it's over.

If you go and it hurts unbearably, then you should talk to your doctor. My friend had that problem until her doctor realized that my friend's vagina is basically in backwards. Ever since then, her doctor has been able to adjust pap technique and my friend hasn't had a problem.

How can a vagina be in backwards??

People should not be afraid of going! I went to the gyno as a virgin who had never even used a tampon and it hurt a little, but not bad. There was no yelling or crying or being upset!

[Childless]

Huh. I must be weird because I was never freaked out about getting a pap smear or a pelvic exam. Not even the first one. My mom talked to me about it before I went and said that it was no big deal and didn't hurt at all, so I didn't worry about it. And, she was right. It was a little odd because I had my first one at 18 years old and I was still a virgin, but it didn't hurt. Just a tad bit embarassing.

Now that I've had a kid though, it's nothing. There is no modesty in childbirth.

[dramallama]

Part of the reason I was so terrified was because I'd listened to my older sister's stories of how terrible and excruciating it was, when I was younger. She was kind of a drama queen with a tendency for wild exaggeration at that age, and I've always been easy to freak out with little effort.

[VodouDoll]

How can a vagina be in backwards?

I don't know. That's just how her body is formed, I guess. They normally tilt one way and hers tilts the other way.

[bea]

I'm going to guess that she's got a tilted cervix, not a backwards vagina. I've got a tilted cervix myself, and it can make the very first pap smear uncomfortable until the doctor realizes and adjusts.

Can I just say that this is why I come to this forum? We're ostensibly talking about the SAHDs health care, but then we encourage other women here to care for themselves and their health and help them feel less scared and/or threatened by sharing our experiences with something really personal.

[synchroswimr]

Can I just say that this is why I come to this forum? We're ostensibly talking about the SAHDs health care, but then we encourage other women here to care for themselves and their health and help them feel less scared and/or threatened by sharing our experiences with something really personal.

All while carrying on a separate discussion about various members' love of dictionaries. ahhh, FJ, how do I love thee? Let me count the ways...

[thoughtful]

I just wanted to be another voice encouraging (hey, in this case, it's the right word) young women here to get done what needs to be done, and doctor-shop assertively.

I've had wonderful experiences with most of the gynecologists to whom I've gone, including yakking and joking away as they examined me. Of course, I am the grandchild of a woman who loved to ask, as the gynecologist was examining her "So Doc, is my hat on straight?" :D

As long as I am getting the care I should, I like to be especially nice to them, and to dentists, since they see so many reluctant people all day. I've really bonded (what? No pun intended! ;) ) with some of my dentists.

I've had three truly crappy doctor experiences -- one was a gynecologist, but he didn't cause me physical pain, he was just one of those "you should have a hysterectomy because I say so" guys. The other two were a GP and an ophthalmologist.

If I come away feeling like they only saw the parts, and not a person, like a car that has been up on the lube rack (which has nothing to do with the parts being examined -- in fact, the ophthalmologist was the worst when it came to this feeling, and he made my father feel the same way), that's the end of that doctor for me.

[LIzzieB]

I'm with everyone else - it shouldn't hurt. Uncomfortable, maybe. Embarrassing, sure. But not painful.

I have been going to my female GP for 10 years or so, and I think she's brilliant. I had a positive result on my smear a few years ago, and had to have them every 6 months for the next two years. :( Not fun, but they all came back normal after that. I've also had problems with ovarian cysts over the last couple of years, so have had vaginal ultrasounds every 3-6 months for a couple of years. I have to say, it all gets easier with practice.

It really bugs me that women in patriarchal groups are unable or feel unable to seek the medical care they need. Cervical cancer is one of the most swiftly moving cancers if not detected early through regular smears.

[Feberin]

I had my first pap smear with my family doctor at 22 shortly before I would be dropped from my dad's insurance. I wasn't sexually active yet and it hurt during the procedure. They were very nice and a female nurse held my hand during it. I bled quite a bit afterwards too. I went again to the same practice after I'd had sex and it wasn't nearly as bad but still extremely uncomfortable. Since then I've always gone to my midwife's office. They do the BEST pap smears like I barely realize what they are doing. The first time they did one I kept asking if they were really finished.

I would assume that 99.9% of SAHD don't go to get pap smears. Perhaps ones who have a really bad problem but I would think it would have to get really bad first. Some might go before they get married but not many. Since most of these families don't have insurance since they are so big in family run buisnesses I would think very few of the children are even going to their well child visits and getting vacinations (not trying to start that debate). I would think after marriage some might go while they are pregnant at least to their midwife or whatever but once again due the lack of insurance I think many use lay midwives (mine were nurse midwives) who might not do any pap smears anyways. I remember one fundie blog I used to read before she made it private a couple years ago said that since they didn't have insurance she'd had to find a midwife who would charge on a payment plan that they could afford and such for the home birth she was planning. I doubt pap smears were in her budget.