Mormon Marriage Crisis

[Kaylee]

Oh--can anyone remember the book that came out in the '80s written by an LDS wife who married a guy despite the fact that he confessed "same-sex attraction"--which he claimed to have overcome despite having exchanged "friendship rings" with another guy? After their divorce, the husband came out of the closet and contracted AIDS. His ex-wife took him in and cared for him as he grew sicker and died.

Yes, it was called "Goodbye, I Love You" by Carol Pearson. She has a website at http://clpearson.com/ and has written a few more books. I haven't looked over things enough yet to know if she is fulling accepting of gay people now (as in not saying they have to be celibate to be right with God), but she seems to still be a member of and support the LDS church, so if she is it's in spite of that.

Her daughter, Emily also wrote a book, called "Dancing With Crazy". She is now an ex-mormon - her testimony on why she left and links to her blog are at http://www.iamanexmormon.com/2011/01/my-name-is-emily-pearson-and-i-am-an-ex-mormon/

[keeks21]

These are just brain dumps from reading his blog and the gawker post.

Their relationship is a needy fag hags dream. (I'm a terrible person, I just had to put it out there.)

I don't understand how he has an awesome sex life? Does he think about men when they have sex? I wonder if she's asexual? And the sex stuff didn't really bother her? This is from my social observations of the world but isn't intimacy in a relationship important? Although I guess the Mormons do believe that their life on earth is only a fraction of their true life.

I also don't like the constant use of homosexual and "this issue" in his post. It's like being homosexual is a problem that he has managed to outsmart. My gay friends don't think of themselves as "issues" and they haven't sacrificed having a family for their sexuality.

[Patsy]

I thought the Mormon church officially changed its policy from 'You're gay? Marry anyway!' to 'You're gay? Don't get married, but don't tell anyone except your priest. Have fun at singles nights!' after they realised how many lives were ruined by gay people going into straight marriages. Anyone know if that's the case?

[mirele]

Here's a blog post by a Mormon woman named Ashley. She wrote it as a response to the article discussed in this thread.

http://cedarpocket.wordpress.com/2012/0 ... a-unicorn/

Without getting into any detail about my intimate personal life, I'd say this is closer to my experience than that of the "happy Mormon married couple where the husband happens to be gay."

[QAF_Rocks]

In tems of his counseling work, he mentions in his article that he has shared his personal situation with clients who suffer from SSA. It seems to me that he may be holding his relationship up as an example of how to deal with this sort of situation...

If he's not, he's not doing his job correctly. He works for a Mormon counseling center. You can bet he's not telling any of his patients that it's okay to be in a gay or lesbian relationship. What's most troubling is that he works with teenagers. So you have all these impressionable, scared kids from Mormon families who have been brought to therapy by their parents, and Josh is expected to tell them that they must be celibate or marry someone of the opposite sex..

I wonder if Josh himself was subject to this type of therapy. There's nothing about it in his essay, but you have to wonder:

I knew I was gay when I was 11 or 12. That’s the onset of puberty, when humans begin to feel sexual attractions. For a little while I was waiting for the attraction to girls to set in because that’s what everyone said would happen, but then there was a sinking moment of realization—a thought like “oh, this thing for guys is its replacement.†I told my parents shortly thereafter, when it seemed pretty clear that my sexuality wasn’t playing a trick on me, and the girl thing wasn’t going to happen, but the guy thing was totally happening. I was 13 when I told my dad (a member of the Stake Presidency—which is a lay leader in the Mormon church—at the time). My parents were incredibly loving and supportive, which is part of why I believe I’m so well adjusted today. They deserve serious props for being so loving and accepting—I never felt judged or unwanted or that they wished to change anything about me. That’s part of why I have never been ashamed about this part of myself. (I feel plenty of shame about other irrational things, like the fact that I can’t catch a ball or change a tire (as you may have noticed on the blog)—and I’m working on that stuff because toxic shame isn’t a good thing. But I’ve never been shameful about who I am, or about this feature of me as a critical part of my person, which it is in the same way that sexuality is a critical part of any person.)

He makes it sound like his devout parents were fine with their 13-year-old coming out to them, but how then did Josh end up following the Mormon party line? If they were so accepting, why does he still believe that it's a sin for him to be in a relationship with another man? I would be surprised if they hadn't sent him to this type of therapy, in a "loving and supportive" frame of mind, of course. :roll:

[QAF_Rocks]

I don't know because we don't have children yet. I don't think we necessarily tell specifically anything. We have a lot of LGBTQ friends and naturally children see how they live so I don't think that would be much of a problem. I don't assume now that someone's love interest is of opposite gender and I think I would assume even less when I have (possible) teenagers.

True, I guess I was thinking of how bisexual parents in hetero relationships have to come out to their kids, since it's not immediately obvious like it is in a family with two moms or two dads. It seems like it would make the most sense to mention it casually, when the children are young, rather than wait until they are teenagers. I think it could be as simple as talking about past girlfriends/boyfriends, or displaying pride symbols and explaining what they mean on a personal level.

[CrazyCatLady]

Oh look, our dear friend Lori has weighed in on this matter: http://lorialexander.blogspotDOTcom/201 ... loset.html

[Soldevi]

He has a great sex life with his wife because he knows sex is about love and intimacy over lust and feelings.

Love is not a feeling?

[Kira]

Today Josh Weed was exposed as an reparative therapist :( . I'm not suprised by this, but I am angered that some people bought into the idea that this was the Mormon church "evolving" on gay issues and that he was just a nice guy doing what was best for him. Now it turns on he practiced ex-gay therapy which is dangerous.

http://www.joemygod.blogspot.com/2012/0 ... on-is.html

[CrazyCatLady]

Today Josh Weed was exposed as an reparative therapist :( . I'm not suprised by this, but I am angered that some people bought into the idea that this was the Mormon church "evolving" on gay issues and that he was just a nice guy doing what was best for him. Now it turns on he practiced ex-gay therapy which is dangerous.

http://www.joemygod.blogspot.com/2012/0 ... on-is.html

Yikes! that is dangerous territory. wonder how much his malpractice insurance costs...

[Kira]

Here is a great response to the Josh Weed post: http://cedarpocket.wordpress.com/2012/0 ... a-unicorn/

Some of the comments are sad and depressing. Religion can be awful sometimes :( .

[synchroswimr]

Here is a great response to the Josh Weed post: http://cedarpocket.wordpress.com/2012/0 ... a-unicorn/

Some of the comments are sad and depressing. Religion can be awful sometimes :( .

That was a great post. Thanks for sharing it

[mirele]

Yikes! that is dangerous territory. wonder how much his malpractice insurance costs...

Link doesn't seem to work, here's another one.

http://www.joemygod.blogspot.com/2012/0 ... on-is.html

(not broken, joe.my.god would be amused to see FJites on his site)

Oh, and by the way, this guy is a WEASEL. weasel, Weasel, WEASEL. No offense to the mustelid family, but wow....I can't even express my anger. I'd like to take this guy, put him up against the wall, and explain to him BLUNTLY why trying to make GLBT people straight is evil, wrong and doomed to failure.

[Witsec7]

Apparently Mormons, who historically wed earlier than the general population in the US are now waiting longer. Single congregations in the SLC area are growing and some of the 30+ age group are wondering if they will ever find the right one.

 

My prediction is that at some point the prophet is going to get a revelation about god wanting arranged marriages.

 

 

Quote

"It's a meat market," Rinehart, 36, said with a sigh before giving it a shot. He approached a slim woman in her early 30s who was seated alone. They shook hands. She said she was a librarian. He said he was a lawyer. She gave a lukewarm smile and looked at her phone. "Typical," Rinehart muttered to himself as he walked away before running into an ex-girlfriend who had saved him a chair.

 

Around him, men and women alike shot wanting glances and often looks of dejection as they exchanged names and pleasantries ahead of the main event.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/1 ... 75524.html

[Sprocket]

What they need is some very, um, enterprising young ladies who know how to put together a power point presentation!!!

efr

[YPestis]

So the Mormons are like the rest of the country. They are delaying marriage and staying single. How is that weird? :lol: The rising cost of raising children, need for more education to attain jobs, and the increased opportunities for women affect Mormons like every other group in this country. I remember reading one social analysis that noted fewer children and delayed marriage is strongly correlated with increase in education and job opportunities for women. It turns out, if given the choices beyond cooking, cleaning and child care, many women also like to sample jobs beyond the home, just like men.

[RachelB]

So the Mormons are like the rest of the country to delay marriage or stay single. How is that weird ? The rising cost of raising children, need for more education to attain jobs, and the increased opportunities for women affect Mormons like every other group in this country. I remember reading one socialogy analysis that noted fewer children and delayed marriage is strongly caused by the increase in education and job opportunities for women. It turns out, if given the choices beyond cooking, cleaning and child care, many women like to sample jobs beyond the home, just like men.

This might explain the desperate attempts in some quarters to avoid giving women the opportunity to try occupations beyond cooking, cleaning, and child care. Heaven forbid men learn how to do that stuff.

[shrillharpy]

So the Mormons are like the rest of the country to delay marriage or stay single. How is that weird ? The rising cost of raising children, need for more education to attain jobs, and the increased opportunities for women affect Mormons like every other group in this country. I remember reading one socialogy analysis that noted fewer children and delayed marriage is strongly caused by the increase in education and job opportunities for women. It turns out, if given the choices beyond cooking, cleaning and child care, many women like to sample jobs beyond the home, just like men.

I think the issue with delaying marriage or staying single is that it runs counter to the Mormon ideal of large families (ie lots of little future tithe payers). Not that I'm cynical or anything.

[Witsec7]

I think the issue with delaying marriage or staying single is that it runs counter to the Mormon ideal of large families (ie lots of little future tithe payers). Not that I'm cynical or anything.

I appreciate the fact that these women have other options with regards to careers. I also wonder about the pressure from the church. The financial side is another part of it Harpy. Does the church stand to gain more if the woman have living wage jobs and higher incomes than the SAHM?

[CynicMom]

They single out the people who aren't married or engaged, then are surprised when those people tend to leave the faith. [headdesk]

[Jessica]

I was in the singles ward for a while. Meat market is the perfect word for it. Every move you make it scrutinized to hell and back. You can't simply smile and say hello to someone of the opposite sex without everyone thinking you're flirting and want to marry that person. It can't be that you're naturally a happy, smiley, friendly person. No, it's a carefully planned method of roping in that cute guy and getting him to marry you!

Considering the church's high divorce rate, I hardly consider marraige after 30 to be a "crisis". Yes, how horrible that people want more than just the LDS Checklist Of Spouse Requirements in their future mate. How dare people want to be true SOUL MATES and find someone that really suits them, and be content to wait till their mid-30s to find them instead of just settling for someone else just to check marriage off their list of to-dos as soon as possible... How is this a crisis?

[shrillharpy]

I appreciate the fact that these women have other options with regards to careers. I also wonder about the pressure from the church. The financial side is another part of it Harpy. Does the church stand to gain more if the woman have living wage jobs and higher incomes than the SAHM?

I think they have an eye to the future. A woman who makes a living wage and gets married in her 30's will probably have 1-3 kids, especially if she wants to continue her career. A SAHM who got married at 21 could have many more kids than her later-marrying friend. I think the powers that be want to trade the working woman's current tithe for more future tithe payers, if that makes sense.

[Rachel333]

Apparently Mormons, who historically wed earlier than the general population in the US are now waiting longer. Single congregations in the SLC area are growing and some of the 30+ age group are wondering if they will ever find the right one.

My prediction is that at some point the prophet is going to get a revelation about god wanting arranged marriages.

I really doubt that. The LDS church is just getting blander and blander in efforts to become more mainstream (I think this is actually a good thing, but it makes the church less interesting to me. :lol: ) I would be shocked if there was any significant revelation like that. Big revelations just don't happen anymore. You'd think a church with a prophet who receives modern-day revelation straight from God would be more exciting...

I think there will just be more talks telling people to hurry up and get married and blaming the men for not getting married fast enough.

[Maul the Koala]

I think the issue with delaying marriage or staying single is that it runs counter to the Mormon ideal of large families (ie lots of little future tithe payers). Not that I'm cynical or anything.

I think they are worried about those members leaving the fold. Marriage is central in LDS doctrine and people are pushed to marry very young (relatively). How do you reconcile with the prospect of potentially not finding a spouse while your faith tells you it's the way to get higher up in the Celestial Kingdom? I'd be having a pretty big faith crisis personally and seriously considering leaving the organization completely.

[gustava]

I think they are worried about those members leaving the fold. Marriage is central in LDS doctrine and people are pushed to marry very young (relatively). How do you reconcile with the prospect of potentially not finding a spouse while your faith tells you it's the way to get higher up in the Celestial Kingdom? I'd be having a pretty big faith crisis personally and seriously considering leaving the organization completely.

Similar to Judiasm in the US, with men marrying outside the faith, so the children (at least in Conservative and Orthodox) not being considered Jewish.

However, there's always Mittens as a role model; he married a gentile after she converted to LDS.

Unfortunately, the 34 year old man in this article is the basic "Peter Pan" and outside of the LDS church, he would be considered rather normal....except he's a virgin, or so he says.