Mormon Marriage Crisis

[CrazyCatLady]

Josh is supposedly a therapist. I wonder if he advocates for marrying away the gay?

i noticed his website says he is an "an Associate Marriage and Family Therapist" i wonder what the word "associate" means exactly? right now i'm studying to get my license as a psychologist so i was just wondering if associate in this sense is a lower-order license or if he hasn't passed his licensing exam or what.

[QAF_Rocks]

As far as telling them about my homosexuality, my gut as well as my training as a therapist tells me that eight years old is probably the developmental age to talk to them about sexuality and sex. So I would imagine that letting them know about this might be part of that conversation. We're going to have to see. I do know, for certain, that our oldest will want to know as early as possible. She is incredibly curious about interpersonal information (as you can see here), and I am positive that finding out as a late teen (which is probably impossible now--let's face it, Google will still exist then) would be really traumatizing for her, and she would probably feel very betrayed that we hadn't been more open with her. The other girls aren't old enough to get a read on.

I knew my parents were gay from the time I was a baby, but of course it's different having two moms who are obviously in a relationship than having a gay dad who's married to a woman. I don't know if the kids are going to be terribly confused about all this or not, but I see no reason to turn it into a big secret or wait until they are older to have a conversation. Is it not possible to casually let them know?

Incidentally, what do bisexual parents in hetero relationships tell their children? I would think most would be nonchalant, ie: "Some people fall in love with men, some with women, some with both." But of course Mormons are heavily invested in the whole "straight is best" philosophy. I wonder what Josh would do if one of his girls came out?

[Witsec7]

..

Incidentally, what do bisexual parents in hetero relationships tell their children? I would think most would be nonchalant, ie: "Some people fall in love with men, some with women, some with both." But of course Mormons are heavily invested in the whole "straight is best" philosophy. I wonder what Josh would do if one of his girls came out?

I don't recall it being a distinct conversation.

[CrazyCatLady]

I hope that he would be as supportive as his parents were of him. In his coming out post he talks about their support and how important that was to him.

[QAF_Rocks]

I don't recall it being a distinct conversation.

That seems like the most logical way to handle any topic, quite frankly. I would think a "Surprise! I'm LGBT!" conversation would be unnecessary and counter-productive for children, turning it into a bigger deal than it really is.

After all, parents generally don't do the whole "Surprise! You're Adopted!" or "Gee Whiz, You're Biracial!" thing these days.

[QAF_Rocks]

I hope that he would be as supportive as his parents were of him. In his coming out post he talks about their support and how important that was to him.

I hope he would, and I also hope he wouldn't expect them to go down the same road that he did.

[Witsec7]

That seems like the most logical way to handle any topic, quite frankly. I would think a "Surprise! I'm LGBT!" conversation would be unnecessary and counter-productive for children, turning it into a bigger deal than it really is.

After all, parents generally don't do the whole "Surprise! You're Adopted!" or "Gee Whiz, You're Biracial!" thing these days.

My DD grew up in an extended family that pretty much contained a spectrum of sexuality. There just wasn't any reason to give anyone's particular sexual practices airtime.

[QAF_Rocks]

My DD grew up in an extended family that pretty much contained a spectrum of sexuality. There just wasn't any reason to give anyone's particular sexual practices airtime.

So bisexuality was mentioned? I thought it sounded like you didn't have a distinct conversation, but it was common knowledge/not a secret.

[Witsec7]

So bisexuality was mentioned? I thought it sounded like you didn't have a distinct conversation, but it was common knowledge/not a secret.

No it was not a secret, I'm sure we had convo's about it when she was present. It was never an ooh WoW Mom's Bi or Aunt Jane is Bi or Uncle Jack is Bi. It just was. In later years after I had separated from her father and dated both women and men it was never an issue.

[QAF_Rocks]

No it was not a secret, I'm sure we had convo's about it when she was present. It was never an ooh WoW Mom's Bi or Aunt Jane is Bi or Uncle Jack is Bi. It just was. In later years after I had separated from her father and dated both women and men it was never an issue.

Ah, thanks, that's what I thought. It seems like the most sensible approach to me.

[QAF_Rocks]

Well, well. well. I did a little digging into Josh Weed's background, and this little "coming out party" isn't as innocent as it appears.

Turns out that he's on the ex-gay bandwagon:

I am an Associate Marriage and Family Therapist located in the greater Seattle area. I work with individuals, couples and families. My specialties include working with adult or youth clients who experience:

Anxiety

Depression

PTSD as the result of childhood sexual abuse

ADHD/Adult ADHD

Unwanted same-sex attraction

Sexual addiction/pornography addiction

Anger management issues

Issues with motivation

Difficulties in social-skills development

As a therapist, Josh works with many people struggling with difficult life issues, but focuses his efforts mainly on adolescent and adult sexual addiction issues, with an emphasis on youth treatment. His work is dedicated to helping people combat patterns and beliefs that cause feelings of shame, hopelessness and despair. Josh also works helping those with sexual identity issues and unwanted sexual attractions and/or behaviors. Before transitioning to private practice, his clinical work revolved around his role at Kent Youth and Family Services, where he still performs Drug and Alcohol assessments. Josh particularly enjoys working with youth; helping them feel hope as they face many life challenges.

http://joshuaweedcounseling.blogspot.com

http://www.lifestarwashington.com/staff.php

Any bets on what he's telling those clients? I thought this story sounded fishy. :?

[Witsec7]

Unwanted same-sex attraction

:shock:

Well I guess his SSA is unwanted as well huh?

riffle

[QAF_Rocks]

And of course LifeSTAR is LDS-affiliated.

So he must be telling these distraught people with "unwanted same-sex attractions" that acting on homosexuality is a sin, and they are called to be celibate.

From his original essay:

If you are gay and Mormon (or Christian), I want you to know how much love I feel for you, and how much I admire you. I know how hard it is to be where you are. I want you to do me a favor. I want you, right now, to take a deep breath, look in the mirror, and accept yourself as you are in this very instant. You are you. And your attractions are part of you. And you are totally okay! I promise. I want you to stop battling with this part of you that you may have understood as being sinful. Being gay does not mean you are a sinner or that you are evil. Sin is in action, not in temptation or attraction. I feel this is a very important distinction. This is true for every single person. You don’t get to choose your circumstances, but you do get to choose what you do with them.

I also found a comment mentioning that Josh Weed contributed an essay to an ex-gay book, but I haven't managed to track down the source yet.

[Katiebug]

That was kind of weird to read. On the plus side, I'm glad that his parents were supportive when he came out to them. Particularly for an LDS bishop and his wife in a devout family that must have been a challenging experience for all parties. If both he and his wife are happy with their relationship and their life together then I certainly won't criticize their decision to marry and have children. On the other hand he certainly seems to approach it from a heteronormative perspective; a "real" family is a man and a woman with biological children; a gay couple with adopted children or a child who is only biologically related to one partner is "counterfeit". I understand that his religious beliefs dictate that he feel that way, but despite his statement that it didn't apply to every gay person I still got the feeling that he felt it should.

If their sex life is as amazing as they claim, then I wonder if he's actually bi. And I'm not sure how his wife reconciles said sex life with the fact that he's probably fantasizing about the guy on the cover of the Abercrombie & Fitch catalog; personally I'd have a hard time getting in the mood knowing that my partner wasn't really into it in the same way. Meh, not my sex life, not my problem. If they're happy with it then who am I to judge?

My husband and I had a teacher in high school who came out a few years after I graduated. He was Catholic and by all appearances happily married for 30 years and a father of grown children by the time he came out. It was a situation of him just not wanting to pretend anymore. He loved his wife very much and she's the mother of their kids, but he couldn't change who he's attracted to. He was not out to his wife when they got married, so she felt like her entire adult life and family was built on a lie.

[QAF_Rocks]

I also found a comment mentioning that Josh Weed contributed an essay to an ex-gay book, but I haven't managed to track down the source yet.

Think I found it: http://www.amazon.com/Voices-Hope-Perspectives-Same-Gender-ebook/product-reviews/B005QQ0AF8

He actually did link to it in the original article. From one of the negative reviews:

There is one clear agenda here, and one only: insistence that gay Mormons must accept the currently incomplete LDS theology of homosexuality and resist, for the duration of their lives, any indulgence of homosexual attractions. No other alternative or information source is even mentioned.

[Juliakitty]

I admire him for his bravery in being so forthright with this, even though I don't agree with his take on it.

[QAF_Rocks]

I admire him for his bravery in being so forthright with this, even though I don't agree with his take on it.

I kind of did at first, but the ex-gay therapy is a dealbreaker for me. He's not exactly a sexual rebel with a cool, modern take on the traditional family. How is this guy any different from Ted Haggard? Sure, he wasn't caught in a scandal, but otherwise they're both on the "same-sex attraction is okay as long as you don't act on it" train.

The only difference I can see is that Josh admits he's gay, while Ted refuses to say he's gay or bisexual. Other than the terminology, the outcome is the same. Men with same-sex attractions have to lead celibate lives or marry women. The ex-gay movement has gotten a lot more cagey in recent years, due to all those scandals. I think most people understand that you can't "pray away the gay." So now their message seems to be more like Josh's, ie: "It's fine to identify as gay, but you can't ever be in a same-sex relationship."

[SisiL78]

I'm a bit angry that Slate would even publish this garbage though... so many Gay and Lesbian children will be pushed into heterosexual marriages thereby magnifying the misery of being Gay and Mormon (or other fundamentalist religion) to include your spouse who is now joined to you eternally even though you can never be attracted to him/her and they can never find someone who will be. Lovely!

 

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/fait ... ingle.html

[Maul the Koala]

It's being discussed here

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=10806

[SisiL78]

oh, sorry. the article only showed up today on slate....

[lilwriter85]

This. She must be living in perpetual denial. That's what it sounded like when she was talking about how they weren't infatuated with each other so they weren't distracted. :doh: (It sounded like she WAS/is? attracted to him, though.)

I have always wondered if one woman in my parents' church is lesbian but chose to remain single so she could still be Catholic and it always made me feel bad for her because I didn't think I'd be happy in her situation. I feel bad for this couple too, as I don't know how they can be truly happy in that relationship. However, I do think he has a political bent/motivation and agree with whoever said it's going to encourage other fundies to wonder why other gay people can't just choose to live in a straight marriage.

I also agree she is living in denial.

[HtblckDesiato]

Here is an interesting ex-Mormon response: goodreasonblog.blogspot.fr/2012/06/mixed-orientation-marriage-that-works.html

A quick preview:

I can see why they'd think that because his story is tremendously affirming for the beliefs of Mormon women, two core beliefs in particular:

Gay people ought to abstain from gay sex for the entirety of their lives, and this is proof that it can work!

Sex isn't very important to a relationship. Why should men get to have the kind of sex they want, and why won't my husband quit bugging me about it?!

So you can imagine the Facebook fury when I tell them that this is a terrible idea, and I give the whole thing ten years.

I second CrazyCatLady in that I personally cannot imagine marrying someone who I knew was not attracted to me!

In tems of his counseling work, he mentions in his article that he has shared his personal situation with clients who suffer from SSA. It seems to me that he may be holding his relationship up as an example of how to deal with this sort of situation...

[Hane]

He reminds me of a character in an episode of "Big Love." In it, Sarah, the teenaged daughter, has gotten pregnant and thinks she has no alternative but to give her baby up for adoption. She meets with a couple who are hoping to adopt. The husband, like this guy, is SO open about his struggles with what he calls "same-sex attraction"--he fits every gay male stereotype in the book--while his wife sits there awkwardly.

Like Josh, it was all about "I can be as gay as I want and still be a devout LDS, as long as I don't actually DO anything about it!!!" I picture these guys eventually flying out of their glass-doored closets and being true to their sexual identities.

The organist at my old Catholic church fell into this category: married for a good 20 years, kids--and counseling gay men and youths. Then he got divorced. I'm willing to bet he's come out since.

Oh--can anyone remember the book that came out in the '80s written by an LDS wife who married a guy despite the fact that he confessed "same-sex attraction"--which he claimed to have overcome despite having exchanged "friendship rings" with another guy? After their divorce, the husband came out of the closet and contracted AIDS. His ex-wife took him in and cared for him as he grew sicker and died.

[Soldevi]

Incidentally, what do bisexual parents in hetero relationships tell their children? I would think most would be nonchalant, ie: "Some people fall in love with men, some with women, some with both."

I don't know because we don't have children yet. I don't think we necessarily tell specifically anything. We have a lot of LGBTQ friends and naturally children see how they live so I don't think that would be much of a problem. I don't assume now that someone's love interest is of opposite gender and I think I would assume even less when I have (possible) teenagers.

Funnily enough, I sort of came out as straight :D My family thought I was a lesbian and then I met my ex and they couldn't believe I dated a man, lol. Idk, for me gender has always been not-so-important part of a relationship. I like both as much and I just happened to fall in love with a man. He was there, then, and available.

[julie paradox]

My bi friend (in a hetero relationship) took his young son to the Pride march. I don't know whether it led to any particular conversations or whether child simply thought "cool day out with rainbows" but I imagine it would be a pretty big hint if he ever starts to wonder ;-)