The Organic Movement

[fundiefan]

I don't buy organic but I do try and buy from a local farmer's stand. The farmer grows most of the produce that his family sells and he is honest if he got it elsewhere. Does he spray for insects? Maybe, but I'm helping a local businessman so I keep money in my community. It also helps the enviroment because he doesn't ship food from elsewhere. I pass his fields when I take my evening walk with my dog so I know what he plants.

That's what I do when I consider my food purchases/consumption beyond feeding myself within my budget - local. For me, local is far more important than some per-determined measures of organic. The farmers markets I go to are not huge organized events. They're one day a week-usually Wednesdays- that local farmers gather in a parking lot or ball field and sell their product. My money goes into my community, because I believe every individual is a valuable part of the community. If a farmer fails, the community fails and loses out. My favorites are actually the stands farmers set up on their own property for daily sale. There is nothing better than fresh, picked hours ago, tomatoes - since I can't grow them on my own. I will often make a special trip for the tomatoes so I can have them fresh from the vine. I help the farmer, I get the next best thing to instantly fresh.

Maybe I am 'hurting' my health by not buying labeled organic food. I'm ok with that. I do a lot of other things in life that are in opposition to someone else's ideals, even the USDA.

We all make choices in our lives and with our money. Attempting to live up to someone else's standards is a recipe for failure.

Do what you can with what you've got; do your best to help your community and be a productive member of society; live your life without fear or any consuming obsession.

If you honestly believe organic is the only way to go, have at it. If, however, it is not a priority - live your life anyway and don't let yourself get caught up in someone else's choices, values or beliefs.

The number one priority is to eat; to nourish your body and survive. How you do that is up to you.

[fundiefan]

My daughter is an organic farmer. We live in a small, rural community. She sells at local farmers markets and to restaurants in a nearby major metropolitan area, as well as on the Internet. Her business is thriving and growing faster than she can almost keep up with. We, or course, eat only organic vegetables and as much organic fruit as possible (not all growers here farm fruit organically). I ask the local fruit growers what chemicals they use on their crops and there are certain poisonous ones I won't touch.

My daughter usually charges the going price at supermarkets for her produce at the local markets unless it is a very rare and unusual crop. She gives her restaurants and other bulk buyers a break in price. Everyone knows her, knows her operation and trusts that she is totally and completely organic and local. We feel it is the responsible thing to do in terms of saving the environment to produce organic and eat local. Think of all the fuel spared when you buy local rather than buying something from Chile, for example. Also, she buys only organic seeds and in fact uses her own seeds as much as possible. We also grow our own poultry and buy from local organic pork and beef producers. Not only do we like the idea that they are not fed the wrong foods or antibiotics, we find it hard to support mass animal producers (such as chicken factories and beef feed lots) because of the extremely cruel ways the animals are raised. Our animals are raised for human consumption but are totally free-range and cared for in humane ways.

If you want to read about why you should eat organic, I recommend 2 books - "Botany of Desire", by Michael Pollan and "Animal, Vegetable, Miracle", by Barbara Kingsolver. You may never buy another potato at the grocery store when you read Pollan's account of the deadly chemical used by at least 90% of potato growers in the USA. This chemical is also used by many farmers in California, for example, on strawberries and other fruit.

Not everyone has those resources or connections. An apartment dweller in NYC can't grow or raise their own food. I'm an apartment dweller in a suburb in the midwest and I still don't have those options. What is available is what your choice is. And if an apple is .15 or .45 - if you have a limited, unquestionable budget, ten apples is a chunk of your food budget. Ten organic apples because they're 'better' for you, or ten average apples you wash AND a pound of chicken breast? My budget restrictions mean there is no question as to the choice. I don't doubt for a second I am not the only one.

I also don't go for scare tactics. Reading a book that makes me fearful of buying potatoes really wouldn't be beneficial to me. Becoming scared into choices is not actually making choices.

I absolutely refuse to read books on food and nutrition with ANY slant; organic, whole, raw....if there is a restriction or cause, I won't touch it.

I won't be scared into acting.

[Wolfie]

If you want to read about why you should eat organic, I recommend 2 books - "Botany of Desire", by Michael Pollan and "Animal, Vegetable, Miracle", by Barbara Kingsolver. You may never buy another potato at the grocery store when you read Pollan's account of the deadly chemical used by at least 90% of potato growers in the USA. This chemical is also used by many farmers in California, for example, on strawberries and other fruit.

In Animal, Vegetable, Miracle, Kingsolver does stress that buying something local, that might not be 100% organic IS better than buying something organic that has been trucked in. That book is more about buying local.

I'm lucky to have an acre that is zoned residential AG, I can have some meat chickens that I know the background on. However, I can't afford the organic feed for them, so I do what I can. Not everybody has this luxury, and I haven't always had this choice. For a long time I was in little rentals with teeny yards that only supported three tomato plants, or even smaller apartments without even a balcony.

[Boogalou]

I honestly think that with the fundies eating all organic is just another way to say "nah nah nah, I am sooooooo much better than you". I also think it plays into their fantasy that everything modern (women in pants, non-KJ bibles, socialism, pesticides, factory farming, medicine, etc.) is completely evil and of the devil (computers, of course, are the exception) and that life was so much better in the past without pesticides and herbicides. It is also, yet another, way for them to go against the mainstream and create some sort of counter-culture and seperation between them and the masses.

However, like so many things in life, there is no black and white when it comes to eating organic and the fundies fail to recognize this. Previous posters have covered many of the major points here but there is something that has not been mentioned. Organic farming produces less food per acre than non-organic farming. So, every farm that starts growing organic food is now producing less food which, obviously, means less food. If lots and lots of farms grow organic food there will be serious food shortages (more so than there are now) and with more and more farm land being paved over we kind of need all the land we have now being as productive as possible. I have read a few things on the matter, and a lot of studies disagree. Some have said if every farm were organic the world would not have enough to eat but then I have read the exact opposite. I am far more inclined to believe the latter but YMMV. I apologize for this being repetitive and convoluted but I am finding it kind of difficult to get my point across.

[Witsec1]

Boogalou, I think the productivity per acre of conventional vs. organic depends a lot on the particular crop and lots of other factors, including whether you are measuring the number of bushels, or the amount of nutrition per acre. I read some where that in terms of the most nutrition per acre, the traditional Chinese peasant farm is the most productive.

Where conventional and organic differ the most is on productivity measured against human labor. Organic is more labor intensive by a lot.

For me, it's weird to see the fundies taking up the organic banner. I live in one of the epicenters of organic farming in the US (Santa Cruz). I wonder what the fundies would make of my local farmers market, with most of the vendors sporting tats and piercings, and often a whiff of whacky tobaccy in the air...

[Boogalou]

Boogalou, I think the productivity per acre of conventional vs. organic depends a lot on the particular crop and lots of other factors, including whether you are measuring the number of bushels, or the amount of nutrition per acre. I read some where that in terms of the most nutrition per acre, the traditional Chinese peasant farm is the most productive.

Where conventional and organic differ the most is on productivity measured against human labor. Organic is more labor intensive by a lot.

For me, it's weird to see the fundies taking up the organic banner. I live in one of the epicenters of organic farming in the US (Santa Cruz). I wonder what the fundies would make of my local farmers market, with most of the vendors sporting tats and piercings, and often a whiff of whacky tobaccy in the air...

Yes, definately. I have also heard that "modern" farming uses more energy, especially in fossil fuel, than it actually produces. I was just pointing it out that organic food is waaaaaaaaaaay more complicated and far more in a gray area than the fundies seem to think. Sometimes I feel there are so many problems that THERE IS NO RIGHT ANSWER and then other times I am more optimistic.

I also think it is pretty weird that fundies have taken up the cause when it is one I generally associate far more with people who are liberal and kind of on the left of the political spectrum. Fundies are an enigma and apparently not black and white either. Sigh.

[BlackHawk]

The fundie organic movement is quite interesting, in my opinion. I think it's just another way they want to show you how their god has provided for them.

We prefer local over organic any day. We shop farmers market for 90% of what we eat. Almost all fruits and veggies come locally... a place I can honestly go see and touch and feel. If we could afford a CSA, we would, but that's a chunk of money we don't have up front.