Colorado boy joins Girl Scouts

[emmiedahl]

But the issue is not clear cut and so the challenge to GS is: could you cut some slack to a child who is still processing issues of gender identity? He is seven and not yet fully articulate. But he says he likes to wear 'girl' clothes and 'do girl stuff'. He wants to be a GS please. Do human rights extend to children before they are able to use pronouns in a way that gives them legitimate group membership?

I think human rights absolutely do extend to questioning children, and that GS is a great place for s/he to explore his female identity. I was under the impression that this was a boy who liked girl stuff. I saw a news report about it on TV and they presented the boy as a firm boy. I am leery of allowing boys into a feminist space considering that little girls have so few of them. A trans or questioning child, on the other hand, needs that space as much as my daughter. It is hard to learn to be a woman if you are physiologically female; a trans child will encounter many more obstacles in learning to be a woman. S/he deserves special treatment and a whole lot of understanding from the community. It is not just about the trans child; my daughter could grow to be a better feminist and more tolerant person by having contact with a child in this situation.

I believe that gender is a huge spectrum and that we should teach our children to accept a variety of gender identities.

[Guest Anonymous]

Oh, sorry, I only read one report where it seemed clearer he was questioning. GS sounds like an awesome organisation where you are. :) I was a girl guide and most notably did badges in hostess-skills and flower arranging....

[QAF_Rocks]

In other articles that Bobby's mother and grandmother referred to him consistently with male pronouns - "he" and "his". If Bobby identifies as a girl, then his own family needs to treat him as such too, and that includes using "she" and "her". Maybe they could switch her name to Bobbie or Bobbi as a more feminine spelling.

It might be that Bobby isn't quite sure yet. It could take him a while to figure things out. His family could also not be ready to transition him full-time. It's hard to say, since Bobby's only seven, but even if he does turn out not to be transgender, I still think it's fine for him to be in Girl Scouts. Society doesn't make it easy for gender-variant children, and if he's more comfortable being with girls, the experience will be positive for him.

[emmiedahl]

I think a questioning child is also a special circumstance.

The parents also may be reluctant to assign a different gender pronoun (or make any steps in the trans direction) until the child asks for it.

It must be a very difficult situation. If my son thought he was transgendered, I would probably take his lead in making changes like that. When he wanted to dress in female clothing, then we would do that. When he wanted a female name and/or to be referred to as she/her, we would do that. But I would not suggest those things until the child asked about it. I would not want to push him either way.

Of course, it seems silly to say even that, because honestly I would probably ask for expert help and do whatever they told me.

[ems]

http://www.9news.com/news/article/226301/339/Boy-wanting-to-join-Girl-Scouts-told-no

Thoughts?

A conservative Catholic fb friend posted an article about this on facebook. I don't really like to snark on her, because she's someone I actually knew back in high school and is generally a good person. She's also not what I would call fundie. However, some of her opinions and posts just really make me want to :roll:. And she has a friend who frequently comments who I really do want to snark at, and have done so...

Anyway, as I said, sometimes people say things that I really do just go "WTF" :roll: . Said friend's commentary was this, along with talk about planned parenthood (no capital letters) and masturbation is just another reason any female children she has will be doing American Heritage Girls instead.

Now I was never a Girl Scout, just did a brief stint as a campfire girl. So I need to do an informal survey. Any of you here who were Girl Scouts, did your leaders ever discuss masturbation or planned parenthood (either the org. or birth control)? Because I didn't know that Girl Scouts was a sex ed program...

[emmiedahl]

I was not a GS, but I have seen GS materials for older girls (tweens/young teens) that discuss birth control from a health perspective, as something that the girls need to be aware of. Hell, even my 9yo daughter knows that there are special pills you can take to not get pregnant. PP has been allowed to have a booth at certain GS events and they hand out similar materials. I don't know about masturbation being taught, but really, it is an organization designed to help girls grow up strong and educated. Masturbation is part of that.

Every troop is different. The leader can opt to offer different things. You can start your own troop and decide not to do the health badges. It is not forced on anyone.

[ems]

http://www.9news.com/news/article/226301/339/Boy-wanting-to-join-Girl-Scouts-told-no

Thoughts?

I'm confused, though...are they letting him join the Girl Scouts or not?

This was the article my friend (actually her sister, she just commented about the masturbation and planned parenthood) posted:

cnsnews.com/news/article/girl-scouts-allow-7-year-old-boy-join-because-he-living-life-girl

[Kate]

Anyway, as I said, sometimes people say things that I really do just go "WTF" :roll: . Said friend's commentary was this, along with talk about planned parenthood (no capital letters) and masturbation is just another reason any female children she has will be doing American Heritage Girls instead.

Now I was never a Girl Scout, just did a brief stint as a campfire girl. So I need to do an informal survey. Any of you here who were Girl Scouts, did your leaders ever discuss masturbation or planned parenthood (either the org. or birth control)? Because I didn't know that Girl Scouts was a sex ed program...

I think what your friend's friend was referring to is this:

http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/g/ ... uts-UN.htm

In short, some brochures were in the room at a UN conference after a GS program (same room as other sessions on that day) that were from PP and advocated masturbation and other things. GS says they had nothing to do with them, but with fundies, you have to know any story that trashes the UN and feminism and pulls in HIV and the Girl Scouts is gonna have legs.

I believe I first heard about it in something Stacy McDonald wrote, but it's out there lots of places.

(and fwiw, I sure as hell wouldn't want any adult stranger talking to my minor child about sex, so I can see how this could get people's attention, but really, people, can you at least check your facts?)

[emmiedahl]

One of the girl scout health books does talk about bc. Honestly, for young teenaged girls, that is a part of health. They will need to know that prayer and douching with coke are not good methods.

[ems]

One of the girl scout health books does talk about bc. Honestly, for young teenaged girls, that is a part of health. They will need to know that prayer and douching with coke are not good methods.

To me, that's understandable. I think if I were a parent I would be more comfortable with sex ed being handled by the schools along with myself, but I can see how an organization guiding girls as they grow into women would include it, as it is part of health education, which the Girl Scouts promote. Honestly as someone who was never a Girl Scout but did go to a few meetings and go Christmas caroling with a friend, I associate them more with cookies and crafts than with a holistic education that includes basic sex ed, but again it's understandable that it would be discussed - as long as it's with teens, not Brownies or whatever!

The link that the above poster provided claims that Girl Scouts provided some explicit HIV-related sex-ed/birth control brochure promoting casual sex. The original article, from some Catholic organization, claims that it did things like "encourage children as young as 5 to have sex" and say it's a violation of people's rights to be made to reveal their HIV status to partners. Just ...... WTF. Even without seeing it debunked it didn't seem credible in the least. And the fb friend I mentioned is generally an intelligent person, so I just can't understand how she believes and accepts some of the things she does. I guess that's what happens when you think the mainstream media is biased so you rely on alternate sources...

[emmiedahl]

The link that the above poster provided claims that Girl Scouts provided some explicit HIV-related sex-ed/birth control brochure promoting casual sex. The original article, from some Catholic organization, claims that it did things like "encourage children as young as 5 to have sex" and say it's a violation of people's rights to be made to reveal their HIV status to partners. Just ...... WTF. Even without seeing it debunked it didn't seem credible in the least. And the fb friend I mentioned is generally an intelligent person, so I just can't understand how she believes and accepts some of the things she does. I guess that's what happens when you think the mainstream media is biased so you rely on alternate sources...

Daisy Girl Scouts (5 and 6 yrs) have a standardized curriculum in which they earn "petal" patches for doing certain projects. They are mainly about morality, friendship, basic stuff.

My daughter just finished Brownies. They are for 7 and 8 year olds. There was never a mention of sex, masturbation, anything controversial. There was a book that had a section on what to do if you think a friend is being abused--talk to the friend and tell her that you cannot keep that kind of secret, then tell a parent or a teacher and ask them to intervene. There was a big "girl power" thing that was basically introductory feminism. These are the most controversial (from a fundie perspective).

She is in Juniors now, and this is the age to begin talking about drugs and sex imo. Before they encounter a situation and don't know how to deal with it, before the hormones kick in, etc.