Jinjer 59: Cooking with Prepared Spice Mix

[nst]

18 hours ago, Cam said:

I just watched the Netflix documentary about Pamela Anderson and found it insightful: “Pamela: A Love Story”. It’s not like I’m big fan of hers, but I like her. 
 

I have a hold on her book at the library.
 

it just reinforced that it was a love letter to her boys - all three of them, tommy and her kids. 

i would hate to be tommy's third wife right now....it was so obvious. 

[Cam]

11 minutes ago, nst said:

it just reinforced that it was a love letter to her boys - all three of them, tommy and her kids. 

i would hate to be tommy's third wife right now....it was so obvious. 

I certainly didn’t see it as a love letter to Tommy. Nothing discussed about him in the doc is surprising.

Not sure if Pamela grasps how she plays into the patriarchy.

The one part of the doc that sticks with me is after their sex tape went public. Pam was a mom by then and her and Tommy went out to a club for the evening. Massive amounts of paparazzi were on top of them, converging all around them and you can hear one guy angrily screaming over and over, “Pam, where is your BABY?! WHERE is your BABY?! WHERE IS YOUR BABY?!” as if she was somehow guilty of being a bad mother and neglecting her child because she went out for the evening (whom her mom was watching). You know, these disgusting patriarchal dudes want women to act like the Virgin Mary after they give birth, and the fact that Pam was a hot young woman who enjoyed sex AND was also a mother was just too much for their pea sized penis brains.

[seraaa]

On 2/3/2023 at 3:25 PM, libgirl2 said:

I read it fairly quickly, two days. I was surprised that I enjoyed it for the most part. I didn't necessarily agree with everything that was written, but I did find some common ground. Yes, she was kind to her parents and really bashed Gothard. Not as much as I thought there would be about Josh though. And  yes, she spoke of this site. She said something like we were well meaning. 

Overall, it might not be everyone's cup of tea, but I came out of it kind of liking her. 

Yeah, I felt the same.

She clearly feels passionate about her denomination of reformed Christianity, and was keen to highlight which parts of the Gothard teaching were personally unhelpful for her.

It is not a family tell-all, but she does discuss how Gothard's teachings can be damaging. In multiple places I thought "say more about this!", although she does reference all of the main points, and, and condemn them.

One of the thing she does speak about is how Gothard teaching's expectations for men and women in marriage are unhelpful. She said that the culture led men to get away with all sorts of things with no accountability, and that the burden of keeping everyone happy and keeping a relationship functional is placed on the woman, who should never criticise or even *have* expectations of her husband. She says this is an attitude she had to unlearn. (I get the impression they would subscribe to a form of complementarianism, tho she never states it outright. But the version endorsed here is more the type where the husband also has obligations to fulfil).

But I would say it is as it has been advertised - a personal account of her particular faith journey, a religious memoir.

Also, it was refreshing to read something about a topic with without feeling that I was engaged in a vitriolic discourse. It is making me rethink my social media usage, tbh. It was not a stressful book to take in and her presentation of it was engaging (I listened to the audiobook). Theology is interesting, and it me reflect on the differences between the Reformed and Catholic understanding of atonement and salvation.

She stated that she wrote the book to help people, and I could see this being the case for others that can relate to her position of feeling trapped a their particular religious system, but who do not want to let go of God. The act of re-examining ones beliefs is relatable even to non-religious people. Anyone interested in this as a process may be encouraged by reading an account of someone's journey of re-examination.

Edited February 4, 2023 by seraaa

[shesinsane]

14 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Jinger in interviews is saying she has great parents. And I’m over here wondering what bad parents look like to her if she has great parents. 

Bad parents let other people educate raise their children. Bad parents let their children dress immodestly and allow them to spend time without accountability partners. Bad parents let their children listen to any kind of music and don't ban books, movies, or television shows from their households. Bad parents do not make Jesus the focal point of their children's lives. Bad parents abandon each other when one is convicted of crimes against children.

-----

Sorry, I was trying to imagine Jinger's version of bad parents but ended up with Anna Duggar's. 😬

[SunnySide]

On 2/2/2023 at 1:25 PM, Idlewild said:

It could be that she is worried she’d be forbidden from contacting her younger siblings who are still at home if she went all out and trashed JB & M. I can see JB being shitty like that. Or, more cynically, she realised there would be a backlash from the old school humpers who still think the Duggars are godly and didn’t want to alienate all of them as no doubt some are buying her coffee brand or downloading her cooking podcasts still.

I wondered about this too. Some of the kids that are distancing themselves from JB&Michelles way of life might be scared they’ll lose contact with their younger siblings, some of whom they might be close to because of the whole buddy group situation. Also, a lot of times when people leave a situation Like this (cult, toxic family) very rarely is it a sudden and clean break with no fallout whatsoever. Usually it’s little chips here and there. Deconstructing slowly is still deconstructing. I won’t pretend I know what anyone in this situation is thinking but there’s so many reasons I could guess all day and probably never be correct. I wonder if any of them have the critical thinking skills to play the long game. As in “play nice until all my siblings are 18 and then let them know there’s a way out of this Fundie life if they want out”. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

Just now, SunnySide said:

I wondered about this too. Some of the kids that are distancing themselves from JB&Michelles way of life might be scared they’ll lose contact with their younger siblings, some of whom they might be close to because of the whole buddy group situation. Also, a lot of times when people leave a situation Like this (cult, toxic family) very rarely is it a sudden and clean break with no fallout whatsoever. Usually it’s little chips here and there. Deconstructing slowly is still deconstructing. I won’t pretend I know what anyone in this situation is thinking but there’s so many reasons I could guess all day and probably never be correct. I wonder if any of them have the critical thinking skills to play the long game. As in “play nice until all my siblings are 18 and then let them know there’s a way out of this Fundie life if they want out”. 

I think Jill has likely learned how to think more critically. I also think Jill probably deconstructed or disentangled 🙄 faster than Jinger because she’s had therapy. I just wish for therapy for Jinger. But it would probably be some Calvinist pretend counselor associated with McArthur’s church. Which would do more harm. 

[neuroticcat]

I would not have minded paper plates, but the styrofoam plates drove me nuts.

I think it makes sense that the Seewalds were the influence. Ben and Jeremy are probably very similar theologically. Ben and his father came across as very reformed. That is very  different from Gothard even if it looks fundie, and it seems like many if Jinger’s critiques have theological roots.

I think it’s significant that Jessa and Ben moved to their own house from his job as a pastor. That shows some attempt at individuation. They may not be deconstructing or on the same trajectory as Jinger or Jill and yet they may also not want to be dependent on the Duggars anymore. I can imagine a scenario where Jessa and Ben slowly distanced while still being there for holidays, etc. 

I saw Kristin Nicole mentioned Jinger’s book on instagram, but only in a vaguely supportive way. I wonder if it’s cognitive dissonance for someone like that. They typically would support MacArthur, and Jinger’s at his church. But they probably have a lot of Duggarfan/ATI followers so may offend them if they are too enthusiastic. 

Hard truths are only for offending outsiders. 

[SassyPants]

3 minutes ago, neuroticcat said:

I would not have minded paper plates, but the styrofoam plates drove me nuts.

I think it makes sense that the Seewalds were the influence. Ben and Jeremy are probably very similar theologically. Ben and his father came across as very reformed. That is very  different from Gothard even if it looks fundie, and it seems like many if Jinger’s critiques have theological roots.

I think it’s significant that Jessa and Ben moved to their own house from his job as a pastor. That shows some attempt at individuation. They may not be deconstructing or on the same trajectory as Jinger or Jill and yet they may also not want to be dependent on the Duggars anymore. I can imagine a scenario where Jessa and Ben slowly distanced while still being there for holidays, etc. 

These folks all want to be dissociated with the Josh Duggar taint, and most don’t want JB controlling their lives, but they love the free stuff, the doors that are opened because of the TV notoriety and the ability to lead rather upscale lives with little skill or effort.

Where would Jeremy be without marrying a Duggar? Seriously with his effort and drive? Still living in a small apartment and leading a church of 20 in Laredo, TX ? He couldn’t even be bothered to learn Spanish, while living on the border. Seriously, he was on the road to nowhere.

Where would Ben be? Living at chez Seewald and repairing windows?

You cant have your cake and eat it too-

[Travelfan]

37 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

You cant have your cake and eat it too-

I’ve never understood this saying…what is the point of having cake if you can’t eat it?!!

[Jackie3]

38 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

Where would Ben be? Living at chez Seewald and repairing windows?

 

What's wrong with repairing windows? 

Isn't Ben just the pastor of a small church, anyway? I can't say that's terribly impressive or lucrative.

[Loveday]

20 minutes ago, Travelfan said:

I’ve never understood this saying…what is the point of having cake if you can’t eat it?!!

I've never quite understood it, either. And when I start trying to work it out, I find myself just wanting...you guessed it...cake! 🎂😆

[Coconut Flan]

Once you eat the cake, you no longer have cake.  So you can have a piece sitting there or you can consume it, but you can't do both.  It's about greed.  

[Travelfan]

2 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

Once you eat the cake, you no longer have cake.  So you can have a piece sitting there or you can consume it, but you can't do both.  It's about greed.  

I mean I get it but it seems silly because the only thing you can possibly do with cake is consume it, it gives no pleasure to have it. It’s either eat it or throw it away, it doesn’t keep. I understand the idea that once you use something it’s gone, but with cake the only point to having it is to consume it…

[SassyPants]

44 minutes ago, Travelfan said:

I mean I get it but it seems silly because the only thing you can possibly do with cake is consume it, it gives no pleasure to have it. It’s either eat it or throw it away, it doesn’t keep. I understand the idea that once you use something it’s gone, but with cake the only point to having it is to consume it…

Have you ever met a person who smells desserts and that satisfies their hunger for the dessert? Have you ever purchased a box of high end chocolates and smelled into the box? A whiff of Sees candy and my brain is flooded with Dopamine. It’s every bit as satisfying as eating the chocolate.

[Travelfan]

30 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

Have you ever met a person who smells desserts and that satisfies their hunger for the dessert? Have you ever purchased a box of high end chocolates and smelled into the box? A whiff of Sees candy and my brain is flooded with Dopamine. It’s every bit as satisfying as eating the chocolate.

Nope, just seeing or smelling treats and not eating them would only frustrate me!  I get no joy from seeing it unless I’m about to eat it!!

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

1 hour ago, SassyPants said:

Have you ever met a person who smells desserts and that satisfies their hunger for the dessert? Have you ever purchased a box of high end chocolates and smelled into the box? A whiff of Sees candy and my brain is flooded with Dopamine. It’s every bit as satisfying as eating the chocolate.

Just seeing your statements about somebody else smelling chocolate makes me want to eat a whole box and make a cake too....and eat it.

[Idlewild]

The latest reels show Jinger and Jeremy dining on caviar at a fancy looking restaurant- I think this is what it’s all about for Jeremy- living the high life and someone else paying for it.

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

7 minutes ago, Idlewild said:

The latest reels show Jinger and Jeremy dining on caviar at a fancy looking restaurant- I think this is what it’s all about for Jeremy- living the high life and someone else paying for it.

I'm hurting my head I'm eye rolling so hard whenever I see some jinger clip lately where she's sitting there surrounded by a carefully curated fancy sneaker collection.

He's so damn vain. 

Edited February 5, 2023 by WatchingTheTireFireBurn
Typo as always

[Cam]

23 hours ago, seraaa said:

One of the thing she does speak about is how Gothard teaching's expectations for men and women in marriage are unhelpful. She said that the culture led men to get away with all sorts of things with no accountability, and that the burden of keeping everyone happy and keeping a relationship functional is placed on the woman, who should never criticise or even *have* expectations of her husband. She says this is an attitude she had to unlearn. (I get the impression they would subscribe to a form of complementarianism, tho she never states it outright. But the version endorsed here is more the type where the husband also has obligations to fulfil).

I definitely like that Jinger specifically addresses the different expectations of men and women in Gothard-dom. It would seem Anna fully embraced the Gothard rules. I wonder if she’s read Jinjers book. She of “at least I have a husband” fame, for whom the bar wasn’t set low, it wasn’t ever even raised off the floor.

I truly hope Jinger’s story speaks to as many koolaid drinking fundie females as possible, so they too will question if they need to blindly be good lil girls and do as they’re told, or if they can seek something different. In that respect, I don’t care that the book isn’t a massive expose of Duggar secrets. It’d be more important to me that Jinger help open some minds and open some doors for other young women to venture away from the lopsided IBLP male-female mandates. She’s no doubt more effective at reaching them by discussing incremental changes than blow off all religious teachings. 

[Scrabblemaster]

17 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

Once you eat the cake, you no longer have cake.  So you can have a piece sitting there or you can consume it, but you can't do both.  It's about greed.  

But i can bake a new cake. And I can eat that again.  And so on and so on and so on. Because now that I know how to do it, I can do it. Because I am a woman who can do stuff. Not against what @Coconut Flan said,  I just want to make a point. And  I baked a delicious cake today. And I will again. Eat that cake Bill Gothard. 

[SassyPants]

9 hours ago, Idlewild said:

The latest reels show Jinger and Jeremy dining on caviar at a fancy looking restaurant- I think this is what it’s all about for Jeremy- living the high life and someone else paying for it.

Yes, yes and yes. Now the question is, how will the Vuolos maintain this lifestyle? She’s written the book, dissed Gothard and tangentially her parents for inflicting the BS on the family, and made the media rounds. She has dined on fancy foods, and I have to say all I could think about when I saw those shots was how her palate has clearly changed from the open can and dump cooking of the TTH. But how will they maintain, at minimum, this lifestyle? He’s lazy and she’s shallow. What other tricks do they have up their sleeves, and at what cost to Jinger?????

[Idlewild]

@SassyPants I think Jeremy has dreams of being some sort of celebrity pastor- taking a high profile role in the McCarthy church and being available for talking heads on TV shows or anything else where they’ll pay him. I certainly don’t see him ministering to the needs of parishioners any time soon.

[JDuggs]

Jeremy looks super sexy with food on his lip.

Spoiler

 

[SassyPants]

37 minutes ago, JDuggs said:

Jeremy looks super sexy with food on his lip.

  Hide contents

 

He is a try too hard attention seeker without 1 humble cell in his body. 

[Lurker]

They ate at Cote, which is has a Michelin star.  It is a high end Korean steakhouse.