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Jinjer 59: Cooking with Prepared Spice Mix


Coconut Flan

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27 minutes ago, vienna said:

Just wanted to say: I am really proud of Jinger. She came a long way and I am impressed by her. 

Indeed. I am not proud of Jeremy. I think he is exploiting Jinger as much as JB did-

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On 2/4/2023 at 6:29 PM, Coconut Flan said:

Once you eat the cake, you no longer have cake.  So you can have a piece sitting there or you can consume it, but you can't do both.  It's about greed.  

This is why I always order 2 pieces of cake!

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On 2/4/2023 at 3:29 PM, Coconut Flan said:

Once you eat the cake, you no longer have cake.  So you can have a piece sitting there or you can consume it, but you can't do both.  It's about greed.  

And green frosting melting everywhere. Especially if it is left out in the rain, 'cause it took so long to bake it, and I don't think I can take it and I'll never have that recipe again.

Edited by Leftitinmysnood
Riffles
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16 hours ago, Idlewild said:

@SassyPants I think Jeremy has dreams of being some sort of celebrity pastor- taking a high profile role in the McCarthy church and being available for talking heads on TV shows or anything else where they’ll pay him. I certainly don’t see him ministering to the needs of parishioners any time soon.

Jeremy thinks the J in JOY stands for Jeremy.

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On 1/19/2023 at 11:23 AM, Idlewild said:

Do any of the adults go to Big Sandy etc? Or is it just JB & M and the kids left at home?

Little late to respond, I know- but Justin and Claire do, and so do Jed and Katey.

I wouldn't be surprised if John and Abbie or Jeremiah and Hannah end up making an appearance there, either. I know the Burnetts and Wissmans attended those conferences regularly.

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I am not sure hiw fair ot is to trash Jeremy all the time. Jinger could have never freed herselve from the ibpl-cult without his support. Her self esteem is so much better (as opposed to not existing while under JBs umbrella of protection) and he has to play a big part here. Also in using birth control or not seeing her parents too often. Doesn't he? But I did not read the book. Maybe she states something else.

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59 minutes ago, vienna said:

I am not sure hiw fair ot is to trash Jeremy all the time. Jinger could have never freed herselve from the ibpl-cult without his support. Her self esteem is so much better (as opposed to not existing while under JBs umbrella of protection) and he has to play a big part here. Also in using birth control or not seeing her parents too often. Doesn't he? But I did not read the book. Maybe she states something else.

Well…I’m not sure JV chose LA because of its distance from NWA. I think he chose that location and school because of the adjacent lifestyle and fun opportunities for him.  I agree BC use is HUGE. It gives a couple some space and choice in determining if and when to add to their family and the physical and financial burdens associated. He might have gotten Jinger away from Gothard and JB, but she very much is still entrenched and beholden to a man who seemingly has put her to work, all while avoiding doing the same himself. Jinger is now responsible for supporting her family, much like she was in the TTH. If that is her choice (I doubt) then maybe she is partially free. In the last year Jinger has helped write a book aimed at adults, wrote a children’s book, started a coffee business, shilled for a meat company, had a YT cooking run and also pitched various other items on IG (Medishare, shoes, volumizing hair dryer, face cream). The girl is doing all this plus homeschooling Felicity and caring for a toddler, and she probably does all the housekeeping too. Now is she working harder than most young, working mothers? Probably not. But is she contributing more than Jerm? Undoubtedly. The Duggar name is what provide$ the opportunitie$, not the Vuolo name.

ETA- I think JV is far more concerned with keeping himself out of NWA, than he is in protecting Jinger. And frankly, I think they both believe that they are far too sophisticated to be hanging out in AR.

Edited by SassyPants
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2 hours ago, vienna said:

I am not sure hiw fair ot is to trash Jeremy all the time. Jinger could have never freed herselve from the ibpl-cult without his support. Her self esteem is so much better (as opposed to not existing while under JBs umbrella of protection) and he has to play a big part here. Also in using birth control or not seeing her parents too often. Doesn't he? But I did not read the book. Maybe she states something else.

Meh I'll continue to snark on his conceited self absorbed vanity. He gest like 1 bonus point for helping jinger and 100 negative points for his curated shoe collection and his insufferable pseudo intellectualism.

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On 2/5/2023 at 2:24 AM, Idlewild said:

The latest reels show Jinger and Jeremy dining on caviar at a fancy looking restaurant- I think this is what it’s all about for Jeremy- living the high life and someone else paying for it.

Really, who wouldn't like that?

 

3 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

Meh I'll continue to snark on his conceited self absorbed vanity. He gest like 1 bonus point for helping jinger and 100 negative points for his curated shoe collection and his insufferable pseudo intellectualism.

I think he deserves way more than 1 point for helping Jinger get out of there, and being a reasonably supportive husband.

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She's not in Gothard's cult anymore.
She's in the cult of that dude Jer loves so much.


Yes, she has made positive changes, but the fact she won't call out her parents for choosing their firstborn son over him hurting 4 kids is just disdainable. I know, it's an easy thing to call out. But she's still trying to be that obedient little Gothardbot. When she can have an honest conversation and say 'Mom, Dad, I love you, but you're wrong,' then my ears will perk up. She's done the first step, but let's not convince ourselves she's truly out of it. 

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I don’t think anyone here is convincing themselves Jinger is truly “out of it”. We recognize she’s taken some steps to move away from the oppression of one cult while still being entrenched in a different cult. She may or may not evolve further; it remains to be seen. That she’s managed to take some steps to distance herself from Gothard and publicly discussed it and her upbringing is more than her siblings. So she gets some points. Just like judges on a reality show, different people will score her differently on that. I agree, Jeremy has brought her a bit more into mainstream life. She can have opinions and birth control and more clothing selections. As for being an obedient daughter, society conditions females to honor that parental connection regardless of religion so it’s a hard construct to break. She may always have mixed or conflicted feelings about her mom and dad and may not want to go public with that whole mess.
 

I would love to eat at a Michelin star restaurant. 

Edited by Cam
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About Jessa: since she is coming from a perspective of already being more voiced and also less of an 'helpmeet' in her relationship is might not feel as much as deconstructing as it did for Jinger. Which might also mean that she did not have to question her upbringing as much because she did not run into a position of contradictory views with her husband.

 

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I read the book and I've come to admire Jinger, although I will admit I scanned the theology passages quickly and focused on the anti-Gothard bits.  I felt so sorry for her when she said she had social anxiety, that she had found it difficult early in her marriage to talk to people because she never had really conversed with people outside her cult.  I was raised as a pre-Vatican 2 Catholic, and most of my world until I got to college was Catholic, Catholic schools, Catholic friends, etc. It wasn't as strict as Jinger's world, but I can relate on some levels.

I do wonder how Jeremy, and also Ben and Derrick, were able to be convince JB that they would be good spousal candidates since they were not in IBLP.  Especially Jeremy, because from what Jinger says, Jeremy spoke to JB weekly for something like 5 months before JB consented to a courtship. And from Jinger's account, whenever she was in the car as a chaperone for Jessa and Ben during their courtship, Ben would spout opinions that were definitely not in league with IBLP teachings.  Were these guys honest with JB? Did JB think that he would have a problem finding spouses for the girls who would be be Duggar-worthy within IBLP, so he modified his requirements for good husband candidates?  Or did he just want them the girls gone out of the house and no longer financially dependent on him? 

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52 minutes ago, Baba O'Riley said:

I read the book and I've come to admire Jinger, although I will admit I scanned the theology passages quickly and focused on the anti-Gothard bits.  I felt so sorry for her when she said she had social anxiety, that she had found it difficult early in her marriage to talk to people because she never had really conversed with people outside her cult.  I was raised as a pre-Vatican 2 Catholic, and most of my world until I got to college was Catholic, Catholic schools, Catholic friends, etc. It wasn't as strict as Jinger's world, but I can relate on some levels.

I do wonder how Jeremy, and also Ben and Derrick, were able to be convince JB that they would be good spousal candidates since they were not in IBLP.  Especially Jeremy, because from what Jinger says, Jeremy spoke to JB weekly for something like 5 months before JB consented to a courtship. And from Jinger's account, whenever she was in the car as a chaperone for Jessa and Ben during their courtship, Ben would spout opinions that were definitely not in league with IBLP teachings.  Were these guys honest with JB? Did JB think that he would have a problem finding spouses for the girls who would be be Duggar-worthy within IBLP, so he modified his requirements for good husband candidates?  Or did he just want them the girls gone out of the house and no longer financially dependent on him? 

If he wanted the girls out of the house and financially secure, wouldn’t he have red lined both Jeremy and especially, the teenage Ben? Even Dillard would have been a lackluster choice if financial security/independence factored into the decision. I think JB believed that courtships, weddings and newlywed lives, plus the obvious babies that would soon arrive, would continue to provide material for his show.

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One of the thing I have thought about the marriages of Jill, Jessa, Jinger and Joy is that JB wanted to get them married off before the sexual abuse by Josh became widely known.

JB therefore was able to convince himself that People covers and TLC specials were worth more than theology.  He probably though that Ben was young and could be led to his was of thinking.  Derrick at that time seemed to be vulnerable, therefore also able to be led by JB.

In the case of Jeremy, the perceived star power probably  overcame his  doctrinal doubts.  Jeremy had a back story of sin and redemption, plus a pro sports career plus was an actual minister with a congregation. He is also articulate and telegenic, always a plus.

I would doubt that Jeremy lied about his beliefs, but JB was too greedy and wanted that wedding special to say no.

 

Edited by Lurker
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I think JB is and was narcissistic enough to think his daughters would never stray from their beliefs. He thought he had them controlled well enough that they would never stray from those beliefs. I think Jill Rod believes the same thing. And she will be in for a big surprise one day. 

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I also wonder if at the height of their fame JB didn’t think anyone in IBLP would be good enough for them. Or perhaps other families were intimidated to approach them or as Jessa said back in the day “weirdos “

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I think it’s a combination of things- JB wanted quick ratings winners time keep the show going and keep the whole family involved after 19KAC was cancelled, and I also think he didn’t want any of the big IBLP families muscling in on his fame- he’d brought the Bates into public view and now they had their own show- given the scandal he didn’t want the emphasis shifting to any in laws. Plus he’s a vain idiot and I’m sure Derick and especially Jeremy worked out how to play him.

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I think JB wanted guys who were better than the average fundie lads for his girls. Most of the sons-in-law have more education and more potential than the Bates did at the time. His favorite sons-in-law were Derick and Austin. I think he thought he could convert and control Derick. Austin had flipped houses, his family has the camp and he's from a fundie background. 

1 hour ago, Idlewild said:

I think it’s a combination of things- JB wanted quick ratings winners time keep the show going and keep the whole family involved after 19KAC was cancelled, and I also think he didn’t want any of the big IBLP families muscling in on his fame- he’d brought the Bates into public view and now they had their own show- given the scandal he didn’t want the emphasis shifting to any in laws. Plus he’s a vain idiot and I’m sure Derick and especially Jeremy worked out how to play him.

Actually he married his sons into big fundie families (with the exception of Jed!, whose in-laws are fundie, but not a big family). Kendra's parents are very good-looking and might have been able to get a show. 

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2 hours ago, Bluebirdbluebell said:

I think JB wanted guys who were better than the average fundie lads for his girls. Most of the sons-in-law have more education and more potential than the Bates did at the time. His favorite sons-in-law were Derick and Austin. I think he thought he could convert and control Derick. Austin had flipped houses, his family has the camp and he's from a fundie background. 

Actually he married his sons into big fundie families (with the exception of Jed!, whose in-laws are fundie, but not a big family). Kendra's parents are very good-looking and might have been able to get a show. 

Kendra's father gives me the screaming meemies on an absolutely EPIC scale.

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18 hours ago, Baba O'Riley said:

 

I do wonder how Jeremy, and also Ben and Derrick, were able to be convince JB that they would be good spousal candidates since they were not in IBLP.  Especially Jeremy, because from what Jinger says, Jeremy spoke to JB weekly for something like 5 months before JB consented to a courtship. And from Jinger's account, whenever she was in the car as a chaperone for Jessa and Ben during their courtship, Ben would spout opinions that were definitely not in league with IBLP teachings.  Were these guys honest with JB? Did JB think that he would have a problem finding spouses for the girls who would be be Duggar-worthy within IBLP, so he modified his requirements for good husband candidates?  Or did he just want them the girls gone out of the house and no longer financially dependent on him? 

Lots of great questions with many potential answers. I don’t think JB worried that much about financial support, he of “buy used, save the difference” mentality taught the girls to be thrifty. I tend to agree with those who say JB worried about the “not pure”-ness of his older daughters because of the molestations. Many in their church family knew the scandal so anyone in those ranks may have steered potential suitors away from the young women. JB could easily downplay the crimes to the unknowing Derick, Ben and Jeremy, the way I’m sure Anna was hoodwinked into not knowing the true facts about Josh.

Getting the older girls married made JB look “successful”. It really was about JB brokering these marriage deals. It made more relatable TV stories rather than the creepy “large family wearing outdated clothes all playing violins on church stage, then singing hymns in church bus, doing large loads of laundry, making large vats of food in industrial sized kitchen, all moving in tangent with one another.” (Think the last scene of the Mary Tyler Moore series where the entire newsroom staff embraced in a group hug shuffles over to the desk to get tissues).

And maybe JB had a man crush on Jeremy. Did the back and forth religious discussion appeal to JB in a way that Michelle did not? After all, JB wasn’t going to get into defending his beliefs with other young, dull, boring fundie guys who blindly follow what they’ve been taught and never question the status quo. But with Jeremy, JB liked the….stimulation. 

 

Edited by Cam
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My opinion on JimBob and the husband choices, and subsequent loss of the girls?  I think he remembered that when the daughter's marry, they give authority to the husband.  The husband does not go under the authority of the father.  However, if the husband's are not independently wealthy, they would have to defer to the show and family in order to get their bills paid.  Jill and Derrick were smart, biding their time while Derrick was in school and saving so they could GTFO.  Who knows if this book would have ever been written had the show stayed on the air?

 

 

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