The 2017 March for Life

[Wenny]

My mother flipped from anti-choice to reluctant pro-choice when a doctor told me I shouldn't be able to say no to an anmio because there was a small chance we could lose the baby.

 

[Carm_88]

13 minutes ago, Meridae said:

I still want to know how it's moral to force a woman to carry a pregnancy that she doesn't want. Pregnancy wreaks permanent havoc on a body...I certainly wouldn't want to be forced to go through that.

Because babies are more important than the woman. She should have closed her legs. That's the way he feels about it. 

[Palimpsest]

25 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

I know Gabe can sounds insufferable, but I hope that perhaps he will at some point pause to think about all this. 

FTFY.  Yes, I hope so too.

I admire the patience of everyone who takes time to reason with this arrogant, angry, and rude young man.   At this point he is absolutely convinced he is right, is citing anti-choice propaganda as truth, and lacks the educational background to make sense of anything vaguely scientific.  He's demonstrated that in the other thread.  So he tosses medical and scientific arguments, and anything that contradicts his world view, aside like so much waste paper.  Particularly the views of women, because he has an all powerful penis.

He's young, wet behind the ears, and woefullly ignorant.  It's a pity he can vote.

He may come to a point where he can listen and learn but he's not there yet. 

13 minutes ago, AmericanRose said:

To me, the Republicans lost their claim to "moral" when they lined up behind him.

Yep, me too.  I would also not be at all surprised to learn that Trump has paid for a few abortions over the years.

It would be nice to get back to topic instead of letting Gabe control discourse.

[Meridae]

2 minutes ago, Carm_88 said:

Because babies are more important than the woman. She should have closed her legs. That's the way he feels about it. 

So sad. I'm one of those people who HATE small children and babies, the thought of being pregnant absolutely disgusts me. If I was to get pregnant and be told I had to carry to term Or Else, I would absolutely have a mental breakdown. I'm sure there are other women who feel the same, and if I could get my tubes tied, I would. However, people have the right to have sex, and getting pregnant should not be used as punishment. That's so dehumanizing for both mother and child.

[Carm_88]

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/world/a-baby-is-a-gift-from-god-thousands-of-abortion-opponents-gather-for-march-for-life-in-washington

Ugh back on topic. It's a disgusting one.  On the plus side, it doesn't look like it was near as big as they would have wanted.  

[JermajestyDuggar]

26 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

In his defense, he is probably getting it all from quack anti-choice science that many of us had beat into our heads growing up. It wasn't till I became a member here that I discovered that the Silent Scream was faked. And I spent years truly believing doctors delivered babies, stabbed them in the head with scissors and sucked their brains out with a vacuum. Young pro-life version of me thought I knew science and all about abortion but truly knew nothing. 

I know Gabe can sound insufferable, but I hope that perhaps he will at some point pause to think about all this. 

You are more optimistic than me. Just by the way he has acted on a couple of FJ threads, he really seems like a smug know it all that isn't interested in the alternative facts of the liberals. I suppose if he does come around, it would be years from now.

[polecat]

5 hours ago, Gabe said:

If an accuser (advocate for the child) accuses a mother of intentionally aborting her child an investigation of a miscarriage would be appropriate.

 

This is repulsive. 

As a woman who had multiple miscarriages (including miscarrying the twin of one of my children), I can confidently say that you have no fucking clue what you're talking about. 

5 hours ago, Gabe said:

I support the prosecution of murder (commonly called abortion) and the execution of convicted perpetrators.

So a man decides that his wife who has just miscarried did it on purpose. He calls the police with his accusation. They take her in before this pro-life kangaroo court, they convict her because she (drank a caffeinated beverage, ate a processed snack, didn't floss her teeth every day, was overweight when she got pregnant -- all things, btw, that could affect a pregnancy's outcome) ... and now she gets the death penalty. 

Pro-life my ass.

[Crocoduck]

4 minutes ago, Carm_88 said:

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/world/a-baby-is-a-gift-from-god-thousands-of-abortion-opponents-gather-for-march-for-life-in-washington

Ugh back on topic. It's a disgusting one.  On the plus side, it doesn't look like it was near as big as they would have wanted.  

The hypocrisy of KellyAnne Conway being held up as a person of virtue is just... beyond my ability to understand. And Pence calls himself an "evangelical Catholic?" That is not a thing.

I personally know one woman who participates in this march every year. She is a very conservative Catholic and lives in the D.C. area. She has a large family and has suffered through at least 3 or 4 miscarriages. I sometimes wonder if her militancy comes from her pain at not being able to have more children.

[dramallama]

7 minutes ago, polecat said:

This is repulsive. 

As a woman who had multiple miscarriages (including miscarrying the twin of one of my children), I can confidently say that you have no fucking clue what you're talking about. 

So a man decides that his wife who has just miscarried did it on purpose. He calls the police with his accusation. They take her in before this pro-life kangaroo court, they convict her because she (drank a caffeinated beverage, ate a processed snack, didn't floss her teeth every day, was overweight when she got pregnant -- all things, btw, that could affect a pregnancy's outcome) ... and now she gets the death penalty. 

Pro-life my ass.

That whore had a brie and deli ham sandwich after cleaning the cat box, off with her head!

Ugh.

[polecat]

1 minute ago, dramallama said:

That whore had a brie and deli ham sandwich after cleaning the cat box, off with her head!

Ugh.

 

Pregnancy is really the best excuse ever to get out of litterbox duty. 

Otherwise ... hazmat suit up! 

Funny thing is, from what I understand, women around the world keep on eating soft cheeses and eating big fish and doing all sorts of things American women would faint dead away over. And as careful bordering on paranoid as we are, we're STILL looked at askance when we miscarry. 

[Terrie]

42 minutes ago, polecat said:

Do you realize how dangerous it would be if Plan B actually worked like this? Fertilized eggs can and do implant in fallopian tubes when the tubes are blocked by scar tissue (or something else). If Plan B worked by constricting the tube, it could result in ectopic (or tubal) pregnancies and could kill women. Never mind that fallopian tubes don't even constrict in the first place.

Plan B works in three ways:

1. It stops ovaries from releasing eggs.

2. It prevents fertilization.

3. It makes the uterine environment hostile to implantation (this is the only one you could possibly use to call it an abortifacient, btw).

Then maybe learn some.

As I noted, not really. You can't abort until there is fertilization, because until implantation, you're not pregnant and abortion means termination of a pregnancy. Now, if he wants to argue that interfering with a fertilized egg implanting is the moral equivilant of mruder, he can. But it's not abortion.

[polecat]

9 minutes ago, Terrie said:

As I noted, not really. You can't abort until there is fertilization, because until implantation, you're not pregnant and abortion means termination of a pregnancy. Now, if he wants to argue that interfering with a fertilized egg implanting is the moral equivilant of mruder, he can. But it's not abortion.

 

 

 

I saw that, but I was going by what Plan B actually says. I realize the science doesn't necessarily back that up. 

http://planb.ca/how-it-works.html

 

ETA: Oh, never mind. I misunderstood.

That said, in the pro-life world, I'm afraid this really is a distinction they can't and won't see. As far as they're concerned: fertilized egg = newborn baby = adult human (male, though, not female because females are only baby cookers)

[Terrie]

Doesn't mean we have to let them get away with it. Like I said, if they want to make the argument that it is morally equivalent, I won't stop them. I'll disagree, but I won't stop them. But, factually, they are not correct to call it pregnancy and abortion until there is implantation. That's not what the words mean. It would be like if Catholics started condemning condoms because they cause abortion. I might admit they can say it's immoral, but I'm not going to avoid calling them out on the blatant misuse of words. Conception is not the same thing as pregnancy.

[Carm_88]

3 minutes ago, Terrie said:

Doesn't mean we have to let them get away with it. Like I said, if they want to make the argument that it is morally equivalent, I won't stop them. I'll disagree, but I won't stop them. But, factually, they are not correct to call it pregnancy and abortion until there is implantation. That's not what the words mean. It would be like if Catholics started condemning condoms because they cause abortion. I might admit they can say it's immoral, but I'm not going to avoid calling them out on the blatant misuse of words. Conception is not the same thing as pregnancy.

And really we should give him some actual facts. He might not think about them now but hopefully someday, he will realize that we were right. 

[ShepherdontheRock]

Only saw one post about "I am the pro-life generation" on my feed, as opposed to double to triple digit women's march posts. Thank god.

You know, I think I've realized a lot of anti abortion people aren't "bad." I think they do genuinely believe what they're saying. I think they're more naive and misinformed than anything else,@Gabe included.

That said, it doesn't make them any less dangerous. Especially now that they've got someone like Pence as their leader. Way to be as pro woman as you claim you are, guys!

[Mercer]

So, it's estimated that probably a good 50% of fertilized eggs spontaneously fail to implant. (I've heard as high as 75% - due to the nature of the question it's hard to get an exact figure.) In the vast majority of those cases the woman is not aware anything even happened, let alone taking steps to actually cause it. From a religious standpoint, either God is the biggest serial killer of all and is literally murdering half the population (which begs the question of why He would be viciously opposed to humans doing the same thing on a fraction of the scale?) or else it's not a an ensouled human life yet. I feel like "it's not a human life yet" is the much more sensible conclusion, personally.

[smittykins]

I'm surprised they don't say "God did it/allowed it to happen so that's totes different."

[polecat]

8 minutes ago, smittykins said:

I'm surprised they don't say "God did it/allowed it to happen so that's totes different."

This is what they usually say, actually -- you hit the nail squarely on the head.

And if they are talking to someone who actually has lost a pregnancy, they usually add some sort of callous comment like, "Well, God knew best" or "He can always bless you with another in his own time" or "This was God's will" or "The baby is in a better place." There's really no reasoning with some of them, well-meaning or not.

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, ShepherdontheRock said:

Only saw one post about "I am the pro-life generation" on my feed, as opposed to double to triple digit women's march posts. Thank god.

You know, I think I've realized a lot of anti abortion people aren't "bad." I think they do genuinely believe what they're saying. I think they're more naive and misinformed than anything else,@Gabe included.

That said, it doesn't make them any less dangerous. Especially now that they've got someone like Pence as their leader. Way to be as pro woman as you claim you are, guys!

If you watch the news there are a bunch of teens and early 20s kids in attendance. They young, immature, naive and just don't get it. They are acting like it's a big fun friendly fellowshipping event. They have no clue their beliefs kill women. 

[formergothardite]

2 hours ago, polecat said:

So a man decides that his wife who has just miscarried did it on purpose. He calls the police with his accusation. They take her in before this pro-life kangaroo court, they convict her because she (drank a caffeinated beverage, ate a processed snack, didn't floss her teeth every day, was overweight when she got pregnant -- all things, btw, that could affect a pregnancy's outcome) ... and now she gets the death penalty. 

Pro-life my ass.

This is the logical conclusion of every fertilized egg is a sacred life. While many anti-choice folks wouldn't want to go this far, there are those who do and if people start making laws based on a fertilized egg being equal to a human life, well before you know it miscarriages will be investigated as a potential murder. Women who miscarried could be charged with murder. Pregnant women could be charged with child neglect if they did something seen as putting the life of the fetus at risk. It is a scary world when a fertilized egg is considered equal to a human who is already born. @Gabe needs to think if this is the world he wants. Would he want Brigid put through and investigation if she miscarried? 

 

Gabe, are you outraged at Trump's latest policy about refugees? More people will die if we refuse to help. Do those lives not matter? 

[Toothfairy]

I see fundies say science says it's life. But fundies believe in bible not science. 

 

The black lives matter and black kids have nothing to do with abortion. 

 

 

Roe vs wade wasn't about abortion. It was about does the government have a right to tell you want to do with your body? 

 

Mike Pence is gay. Can we say that here? I'm sorry he is. He fights too hard against homosexuality. Yet he is prolife but kids in foster care, inner cities,  and poor families are going without food, hoysing, insurance, jobs. Remember Flint? They're still without water. 

1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

If you watch the news there are a bunch of teens and early 20s kids in attendance. They young, immature, naive and just don't get it. They are acting like it's a big fun friendly fellowshipping event. They have no clue their beliefs kill women. 

Catholic and Christian schools force them to go. It's a field trip. 

[quiversR4hunting]

3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

 I would also not be at all surprised to learn that Trump has paid for a few abortions over the years.

I wouldn't be surprised either. I would bet he paid for the abortion and then gave hush money and kicked her to the curb. Trump seems like that kind of guy. 

 

4 minutes ago, Toothfairy said:

Catholic and Christian schools force them to go. It's a field trip. 

Um, no. My hubs was a former Catholic School vice principal and they didn't even have a school sponsored bus for those that wanted to go. I also went to Catholic school and my Alma mater didn't and still doesn't force anyone to go. (They also don't have a school sponsored trip for it.)

[Toothfairy]

8 hours ago, Buzzard said:

 

 

The "atrocity" of a women's march?  

Do they realize they're giving their bodies to the government? I'm against soda. Let's ban soda

2 minutes ago, quiversR4hunting said:

I wouldn't be surprised either. I would bet he paid for the abortion and then gave hush money and kicked her to the curb. Trump seems like that kind of guy. 

 

Um, no. My hubs was a former Catholic School vice principal and they didn't even have a school sponsored bus for those that wanted to go. I also went to Catholic school and my Alma mater didn't and still doesn't force anyone to go. (They also don't have a school sponsored trip for it.)

Certain schools do. I don't think they force. They might encourage. I know it's not true for every school. But ice seen some make it into a field trip. 

[Toothfairy]

8 hours ago, formergothardite said:

There is nothing quite like a man who doesn't understand the basics of birth control telling women what to do with their bodies. 

It is easy to ban abortion when you never have to address what denying abortion does to women. Women become disposable incubators whose lives don't matter one bit. Their lives can be tossed to the side.

Lol. No chance at life. Cure for cancer,end world hunger. All born kids can do but they can't because they have no clean water,healthcare, good education, and no chances. 

[Jana814]

My friend went to a Catholic High School. She liked a picture on the Facebook page of the girls that went on a school trip to the March.