Leah Remini: Scientology and the Aftermath

[K'Z'K]

1 hour ago, Howl said:

So, Sea Org people work themselves to the bone doing....what exactly?  I recall that some of it amounted to being an indentured servant, doing housekeeping, cooking, groundskeeping and the like.

That's pretty much it, plus doing the endless reissues of the books and making propaganda. They run $cientology. They don't actually accomplish anything.

 

1 hour ago, Howl said:

 Do they dispatch local Scientologists to natural disasters? Is there a part of Sea Org that trains people to help at natural disasters?

No and no. For one thing, there probably aren't any local Scilons. They have "Volunteer Ministers" (publics, not staff, and definitely not Sea Org) who fly in to wear yellow shirts and muck up real disaster relief by getting in the way. They also do "touch assists," which is where they basically tell you to tell the pain to go away. It's explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touch_assist  They do not do any sort of real help. They don't even supply the blankets and such--they distribute those provided by others and reportedly have gone to disaster areas without even supplies for themselves. The goal is to promote $cientology (to the media, and to the victims if they're not too poor to care about). That's it. If any Scilon has ever actually been useful at a disaster or accident, it's despite $cn, not because if it. They make John Shrader look competent, because he might occasionally (accidentally) provide benefits in the form of  entertainment.

An example of Scn's "help" after 9/11: http://www.xenu.net/archive/events/20010911-tragedy/

Fortunately, there really aren't many Vulture Ministers. The two or three you see in PR photos are probably the whole contingent, and the pictures might not even be from the most recent disaster because there weren't any VMs this time.

 

4 hours ago, Buzzard said:

1.6 million is better than a Duggar episode... just sayin... 

It's also greater than the number of active Scilons worldwide. A 2011 census only showed 2,418 Sclions in England and Wales.  http://tonyortega.org/2012/12/12/only-2418-scientologists-in-england-and-wales/

 

On 1/7/2017 at 3:44 PM, Queen said:

But from ex-Scientologists on YouTube I've heard another story; that any other sexuality than hetero is seen as perverse, and that members attracted to the same sex are forced to undergo "treatment" and are seen as failures unless they somehow become straight... Apparently this is because of Hubbard's own opinions from the 40s, explained in the Dianectics (or whatever it's called) book that is very basic and that I strongly suspect Prepon has read.

Like everything else having to do with Scientology, it's worse than you think. According to LRH, homosexuality is a physical illness and perversion. It's really spelled out in the book Science of Survival, which is one of the "basics" (Prepon has undoubtedly read it more than once). Mike Rinder explains it here: http://www.mikerindersblog.org/scientology-homophobia/

Here's a story Tony Ortega did for the Village Voice a few years back, about a guy who got kicked out of the Sea Org for being gay (he was eventually declared Suppressive): http://www.villagevoice.com/news/scientology-disconnection-and-homophobia-derek-blochs-story-6661519

I no longer have my $cn books (dumped them in a move) so can't verify this now, but I remember being shocked that not only was homosexuality rated 1.1 on the tone scale (the tone scale is kind of a chart of emotions/attitudes on a scale of -40 to 40. Anything below 2 is very bad: http://tonyortega.org/2013/05/28/scientology-gets-emotional-claire-headley-on-the-tone-scale/) but rape was 1.5. Still bad, but not quite as bad. Yeah.

 

2 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I have heard about their narcanon programs, but I dont know much about their long term success rates since they absolutely deny they psychological part of addiction.

That's Narconon, deliberately named to be confused with NarcAnon, which is what people call Narcotics Anonymous (they prefer the full name or "NA"). You can remember the spelling because it has CON in the name. "Treatment" involves LRH's Purification Rundown, which means lots of running, sitting in a sauna, and taking megadoses of niacin. The staff consists of former patients. Their success rate is claimed at 75-80% but it. . . isn't. Like all Scn stats, it's bullshit. I have no idea how many people go through it and actually get clean and stay clean, but if any do it's all because of their own sheer force of will and/or no longer being able to afford the drugs, not because of NarCONon.

Old (last updated 2003) but generally accurate site: http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Narconon/

Wikipedia's take:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narconon

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purification_Rundown

 

The Scn rabbit hole is so deep the rescue ferrets will need rescuing.

[quiversR4hunting]

On Leah's show, Rinder and her are talking with the 3 journalists - 2 of which Rinder harassed. Tony Ortega, John Sweeney & Mark Bunker.

[DaisyD]

9 hours ago, MamaJunebug said:

There used to be a message board called xenu.net or xenu.org that had scads of stories like these. If no longer available, just search ex-scientologists. I promise you an experience that definitely requires rescue ferrets. 

It's still around. Google Operation Clambake. Make sure you go to the faq to see why it's called that. It's hilarious. 

[Queen]

I saw Going Clear on Netflix yesterday and learned about things I didn't know before, like the Hole and other CoS prisons... The more I learn, the scarier the cult gets! I admire Leah for doing this, especially since CoS policy against critics is scaring them into silence (and apparently they tried to murder Paulette Cooper, the journalist who wrote a book on them back in the 70s). 

Tom Cruise seems like a total douchebag, at least that was how he got portrayed in Going Clear. I admire Nicole Kidman and Katie Holmes for breaking with the CoS party line! Travolta seemed more empathic than Cruise for sure, so I harbour a small hope that he will one day speak out. CoS seems to have a lot of dirt on him - not just about his sexuality - though.  

[PennySycamore]

@Queen,  there was some thought that John Travolta might be wavering in his devotion to Scientology after his son, Jett died.  Jett had a history of seizures and was autistic. Neither would have been helped by Scientology.

[MamaJunebug]

9 hours ago, DaisyD said:

It's still around. Google Operation Clambake. Make sure you go to the faq to see why it's called that. It's hilarious. 

That's right!!!  Good memories. Thank you!

[louisa05]

I am seeing ads on Twitter from Scientology. I assume this is because I now follow Leah.

[Howl]

Re: frequent disclaimers on Scientology and the Aftermath

The disclaimers are posted with each new segment, as they switch the focus to a new person.  This makes perfect sense to me, because of Co$ litigiousness.  If there's anything to learn about Co$, it's that they use protracted litigation as a cudgel to destroy people financially and institutions as well,  and they have, for all practical purposes, bottomless pockets.   I'm hope I'm correct that the disclaimers protect the people whose stories are featured on the show as well as A&E.  

Each time you see the disclaimer, just remember that the Co$ is that vindictive, that dangerous, that scary, that extreme.  

My DVR  cut off the last 10 minutes of the current episode, but I'll catch it later.  The raw pain caused by disconnection can't be explained away by the Church.  It's hard to watch but you can't turn away. 

I think once someone sees the first episode, they're hooked.  

[DaisyD]

That's a good point @Howl. We were fast forwarding the commercials on, I think, the Headley episode and there was no disclaimer after one of the breaks. It must have been because they were still talking with Claire. 

[Cleopatra7]

22 hours ago, PennySycamore said:

@Queen,  there was some thought that John Travolta might be wavering in his devotion to Scientology after his son, Jett died.  Jett had a history of seizures and was autistic. Neither would have been helped by Scientology.

The way the Travoltas handled Jett's death has always rubbed me the wrong way. At first they blamed Kawasaki disease caused by chemicals for his death. But the exact cause of Kawasaki disease is unknown, and is rare enough that one can rule out household cleaners. Kawasaki disease damages the heart, so I'm not sure how that would have lead to the seizure that killed Jett ( full disclosure: my brother has Kawasaki disease). I think Kelly Preston just chose a random thing for Jett to have, because Scientology views autism and epilepsy as shameful and she couldn't admit to the public that she and John failed to give their son adequate care to help him.

[PennySycamore]

2 hours ago, louisa05 said:

I am seeing ads on Twitter from Scientology. I assume this is because I now follow Leah.

I've seen ads for the Co$ "Volunteer Ministers"  on Discovery ID and the Hallmark Channel, but I don't think I've seen them elsewhere.  

[louisa05]

I've seen ads for the Co$ "Volunteer Ministers"  on Discovery ID and the Hallmark Channel, but I don't think I've seen them elsewhere.  

Twitter ads are usually based on profiles and who you follow. This just started showing up last night. It contains a link "to find out what Scientology really believes". I assume they are targeting accounts that follow Leah, Mike Rinder and others who are speaking out.

[seattlechic]

Hi y'all. Three pages and I will be done with reading Leah's book. Girlfriend CRACKS ME UP. For reals. Book is easy to read and funsies.

On the other hand, Ron Miscavige's (David's dad) book, Ruthless, is a snooze.  Laaaaaaaaaaaaame.

[SamiKatz]

For reasons unknown to me, Leah Remini's book, "Troublemaker" is not available in Canada (through Amazon or Indigo), or at least at a reasonable price (Amazon Canada wants $133 for it).

 

 

[SilverBeach]

8 hours ago, DaisyD said:

That's a good point @Howl. We were fast forwarding the commercials on, I think, the Headley episode and there was no disclaimer after one of the breaks. It must have been because they were still talking with Claire. 

Ok, ok, maybe each person got their own disclaimer. Disclaimers won't stop the CO$ from litigating. I'll stop watching in real time and fast forward through them.

[Inky]

14 minutes ago, SilverBeach said:

Ok, ok, maybe each person got their own disclaimer. Disclaimers won't stop the CO$ from litigating. I'll stop watching in real time and fast forward through them.

True, they won't. But it's pretty hard to litigate when the other side is telling the truth and has multiple sources to back up their stories. This is what I'm really hoping. As long as Leah and the guests are telling the truth, it should protect them. Things have come a long way since the Paulette Cooper days. The internet is such a blessing for ex-$cientologists.

28 minutes ago, SamiKatz said:

For reasons unknown to me, Leah Remini's book, "Troublemaker" is not available in Canada (through Amazon or Indigo), or at least at a reasonable price (Amazon Canada wants $133 for it).

GRRRR as a fellow Canadian (near Torontonian) this ticks me off. I hadn't gotten around to putting my list on the Kobo to get it when available. Maybe I'll have to wait even longer.

 

 

Yea, I don't know why the above screwed up - I have a bad cold. That's why. No wait, it is the scientologists...because I put a $ instead of an S.

[Jencendiary]

46 minutes ago, seattlechic said:

Hi y'all. Three pages and I will be done with reading Leah's book. Girlfriend CRACKS ME UP. For reals. Book is easy to read and funsies.

On the other hand, Ron Miscavige's (David's dad) book, Ruthless, is a snooze.  Laaaaaaaaaaaaame.

The way the show handles Ron Miscavige really rubs me the wrong way. It's the one major misstep, in my opinion. Because there is plenty of evidence to support the assertion that he's an abusive and manipulative spouse and parent. If they would present him as a flawed man, but one with insight into the upper echelons of the CoS that would be one thing. But they've got him cast as this sad dad who was abused by a sociopath he had no influence in creating at all. I would wager that a great deal of what we see in David is clearly old coping mechanisms he developed in the way of of being raised by and then essentially abandoned by Ron. No wonder why David would latch on to L. Ron Hubbard as a surrogate father and role model.

 

(I think the show goes way too easy on Mike Rinder, too. But I'm more forgiving of him, since he was raised to be a Scientology sociopath from basically birth.)

[seattlechic]

5 minutes ago, Jencendiary said:

The way the show handles Ron Miscavige really rubs me the wrong way. It's the one major misstep, in my opinion. Because there is plenty of evidence to support the assertion that he's an abusive and manipulative spouse and parent. If they would present him as a flawed man, but one with insight into the upper echelons of the CoS that would be one thing. But they've got him cast as this sad dad who was abused by a sociopath he had no influence in creating at all. I would wager that a great deal of what we see in David is clearly old coping mechanisms he developed in the way of of being raised by and then essentially abandoned by Ron. No wonder why David would latch on to L. Ron Hubbard as a surrogate father and role model.

 

(I think the show goes way too easy on Mike Rinder, too. But I'm more forgiving of him, since he was raised to be a Scientology sociopath from basically birth.)

I'm with you. Ron's first chapter is a classic wife beater apology. David did not become an asshole all by himself. Daddy had something to do with it. 

[seattlechic]

On 1/11/2017 at 7:43 AM, PennySycamore said:

@Queen,  there was some thought that John Travolta might be wavering in his devotion to Scientology after his son, Jett died.  Jett had a history of seizures and was autistic. Neither would have been helped by Scientology.

On this, I feel ZERO bad for Travolta and his wife. They should have been charged with medical neglect - shit, with negligent homicide. That child did not have to die --- those seizures could have been managed with medication. But these fucktards rather believed a mediocre Sci-Fi writer than the medical community.  Katie Holmes on the other hand, got out just in time - before her little girl ended up just like the Travolta kid, or Isabella Cruise (fucked up, much?).

[IreneIssh]

On 1/8/2017 at 5:17 PM, mirele said:

Just wanted to point out something--Monique Yingling is not a Scientologist. She is Catholic. It says volumes about David Miscavige that he doesn't want to appear on 20/20, nor does he trust any other Scientologist to appear on 20/20 to defend Scientology, but instead sends out the hired gun who isn't even of the religion!

Yeah, I was very surprised to learn she was Catholic. Is that totally true though? I always assumed she had a reason for working with the church for so long and attacking their defectors so vehemently. I want to know more about this woman. 

[Jana814]

John Travolta turned to Scientology after his older girlfriend (Diana something) died from cancer. After watching Leah's show I can see how he could have been looking for something after that experience. 

[PennySycamore]

@Jana814, you're thinking of Diana Hyland who died of breast cancer in 1977.  She was the original mom on Eight is Enough and was considerably older than John.

[Jana814]

15 minutes ago, PennySycamore said:

@Jana814, you're thinking of Diana Hyland who died of breast cancer in 1977.  She was the original mom on Eight is Enough and was considerably older than John.

Yes that's her. (Could not remember her last name). She was 18 years older then him. I think her death really effected him and he was looking for something in his life.  

[PennySycamore]

Discovery ID is airing a great special on Scientology at 8 (EST) tonight. (1/13/17)  It repeats at 11:00.   They're talking to a woman who got caught up in the Co$ as a college student, was tasked to steal patients' medical records from psychiatrists and to spy on Paulette Cooper.  She and her husband got sent to the Rehabilitation Project Force by L Ron himself.  She was 5 months pregnant at the time.  Paulette is on the show as is Nancy's husband.  

ETA: The woman's name was Nancy Many.  Her husband is Chris.  She and her husband were fortunate to escape with their toddler son.  Btw, I saw no disclaimers on tonight's program.

[SilverBeach]

It was an hour earlier here. I have set the DVR to record the 10 pm replay.

Thanks @PennySycamore for the notification.