Brexit? Thoughts?

[mango_fandango]

Thank God my area voted to remain, 62.9% to 37.1%. The area where my grandparents are voted leave. Not entirely sure which region they come under- if it's one region the margin was 50.5/49.5... Seriously. Other region was more like 52/48. 

[prayawaythefundie]

How ironic would it be if England won UEFA Euro 2016 now?

[CoveredInBees]

6 minutes ago, prayawaythefundie said:

How ironic would it be if England won UEFA Euro 2016 now?

Don't worry, it's highly unlikely  

Will we still have the EU presidency next year? because that will be fucking hilarious........... (scuse my French  )

[laPapessaGiovanna]

2 hours ago, Geechee Girl said:

Would this equate to one of our states wanting to break free?  

I feel so sad for the other EU countries too.

To the first question: not even remotely. We aren't as thightly binded to each other as you are, not historically, not culturally and not financially. Most importantly UK isn't an € country, for this reason the backlash will be much stronger for the UK than for EU countries.

As for the second part, this is the mind boggling part for me: Italy would have much more to gain and much less to lose from leaving than UK. We are literally crushed by this currency and the market agreements don't play in our favor on many regards. We pay to the EU much more than what we get back. We are the ones (with Greece) who rescue and collect migrants/refugees from drowning in the sea and we are also obliged by EU Dublin treaty to keep here everyone who identifies as an asylum seeker, de facto we are being punished for being in a particular geographical position. And yet UK is the one leaving. The only rational argument I've read pro UK leaving is something about fishing rights not being limited by EU market agreements anymore. It's absurd.

Anyway I hope that  this will shake EU institutions enough to produce some serious change. The arguably biggest problem with the EU is that it's not a "we Eu" or "us EU", it's as a sort of half abstract half real bureaucratic exoskeleton that doesn't belong to anyone. If we delegate sovereignty we should do it to directly elected representatives, there should be true European parties that can debate European matters beyond single countries interests and get elected to do the interests of Europe as a whole. Otherwise they can't pursue truly effective and united foreign policies, nor we can craft economy to benefit us all. We can't leave the project of a better Europe in the hands of single States leaders and unelected functionaries, because the risk is that people like Marine Le Pen, Nigel Farage and the others will gain consensus for lack of representation of a more objective criticism of the EU. We need to create an European political culture that goes beyond the governing elites involving all citizens, otherwise playing with what divides us instead of what unites us is just too fucking easy.

1 hour ago, theinvisiblegirl said:

I'm from the US and heard about this on Last Week Tonight with John Oliver, then talked it over with a friend who lives in the UK. I just read online that this referendum isn't legally binding, meaning they don't really have to take this Leave vote into account since Parliament is sovereign. Is David Cameron likely to invoke the Lisbon treaty? Has he given any public comments on what he'll do?

He would be an idiot if, after calling the referendum, he decides to ignore the result because he doesn't like it. Anyway the leaving process would take at lest two years.  In two years many things can happen. 

[CoveredInBees]

5 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

SNIP

Anyway the leaving process would take at lest two years.  In two years many things can happen. 

Except staying in. As Juncker says, "Out is out"

[MorningMist]

Update #1: I'm still up.

Update #2: Farage has just said on live tv that the Brexit campaign that money spent on the EU would be given to the NHS was a 'mistake'.

Update #3: Hannan says they will probably no change in immigration.

Update #4: Farage is calling today independence day like we weren't the biggest colonisers in the world...

Scaremongering and propaganda at it's finest tbh, hats off to them.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

1 minute ago, CoveredInBees said:

Except staying in. As Juncker says, "Out is out"

If Juncker wants to save his precious Europe he'd better resign, today is as much his defeat as is Cameron's. And yet everyone is doing as if it's a problem for UK only. UK hasn't moved further into the Atlantic as far as I know,  we will always have to deal with each other that we like it or not.

[Anny Nym]

18 minutes ago, laPapessaGiovanna said:

If Juncker wants to save his precious Europe he'd better resign, today is as much his defeat as is Cameron's. And yet everyone is doing as if it's a problem for UK only. UK hasn't moved further into the Atlantic as far as I know,  we will always have to deal with each other that we like it or not.

That would be probably a very good idea nonetheless. It´s people like Juncker (and Merkel), who see Europe as "theirs" in a megalomanic sense, that are the downfall of the European Union.

The EU is not the EUSA. And it will never be.

[MorningMist]

Update #5: Cameron is stepping down by October. Completely understandable decision and I hate the Tories. We cannot expect someone to lead us through this who doesn't believe in what we are doing.

[samurai_sarah]

What a thing to wake up to!

I personally just lost the right to live and work in the UK. As of now, my voice will go unheard in local elections, but my taxes will still gladly be received. I am now a "dependant", no longer my own person, because my work situation is impermanent. And there I rather liked having rights. It was nice, while it lasted.

Thanks to Brexit, thousands of people are in the same situation as I. UK citizens in the EU, and EU citizens in the UK. I "only" lost my voice. Others are in a far more dire situation.

Of course, we will have about two years to sort ourselves out. As for now, I'm going shopping before my money loses all its value.

[CoveredInBees]

The pound drops to it's lowest level in 30 years and we wipe £200 billion off the stock market.

Independence day? looks more like Black Friday to me .

 

[caszandra]

I am so disappointed this morning, proud of my country for voting to remain but as usual our voices don't mean jack shit in the bigger picture of the UK. Farage is a wanker, can't bloody stand the man. Now we get a new Prime Minister who we didn't even vote for to guide us through the exit, bloody brilliant work Leave campaign, thanks a lot for tanking the Pound in the world markets.

[CoveredInBees]

The government petitions site has crashed, as we all try to sign the petition for a second referendum:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/brexit-petition-for-second-eu-referendum-so-popular-the-government-sites-crashing-a7099996.html

[Anny Nym]

27 minutes ago, caszandra said:

I am so disappointed this morning, proud of my country for voting to remain but as usual our voices don't mean jack shit in the bigger picture of the UK. Farage is a wanker, can't bloody stand the man. Now we get a new Prime Minister who we didn't even vote for to guide us through the exit, bloody brilliant work Leave campaign, thanks a lot for tanking the Pound in the world markets.

No worries (?), that usually leads to early new elections.

[Bushes of Love]

I feel sick, do you think if I go back to bed I'll wake up and this will be over?

Farage calling this 'Independence Day' makes me angry because he said it was managed without a single shot being fired...Jo Cox, anyone?

I am just feeling a bit numb now.

[EmainMacha]

I'm gutted. Partially because I believe that a (perhaps large) minority of Leave voters voted that way due to xenophobia. This suggests a further rise of the right wing which terrifies this lefty.

And then there are my friends back home and here in London who essentially rely on the EU for their wages. They're screwed now.

Also have got fuck all work done so far this morning.

[Bushes of Love]

1 minute ago, EmainMacha said:

I'm gutted. Partially because I believe that a (perhaps large) minority of Leave voters voted that way due to xenophobia. This suggests a further rise of the right wing which terrifies this lefty.

And then there are my friends back home and here in London who essentially rely on the EU for their wages. They're screwed now.

Also have got fuck all work done so far this morning.

I think a lot of the vote to leave was people wanting to 'get our country back'. Thing is, it's a referendum not a time machine. We aren't suddenly going to go back to the 1950s.

(Can I just say, when I saw your profile picture I instinctively said 'careful now'. I watch too much Father Ted!)

[morri]

Oh brexit by the way. What a bunch of tossers, I bet the UK will now be an unoffical state of America instead...

oh and the majority of the brexit (out) voters was the doddering old farts club, yea thank you for deciding young britons future

[CoveredInBees]

1 hour ago, Bushes of Love said:

I feel sick, do you think if I go back to bed I'll wake up and this will be over?

Farage calling this 'Independence Day' makes me angry because he said it was managed without a single shot being fired...Jo Cox, anyone?

I am just feeling a bit numb now.

I know, it's just proof that he lives in an entirely different universe to the rest of us.

Nicola Sturgeon is currently setting out her stall for another Scottish referendum........

[samurai_sarah]

I personally idly wonder: Farage's wife is German. Will she lead the campaign of EU citizens leaving the UK?

[helenprev]

Count me in as another English person who voted to remain in the EU and is absolutely gutted this morning.

[CoveredInBees]

One thing that keeps being said on Mumsnet (sssssh........ yes I frequent other forums  ) is that we're turkeys who've just voted for Christmas.

Most accurate analogy so far.

[samurai_sarah]

The UK might possibly break up over this:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36621030

[CoveredInBees]

If Scotland get the chance to stay in the EU and leave the UK they should take it.

[LittleMy]

I'm another person who voted to remain, and l'm sad and worried this morning....plus wondering if l can afford to move to Scotland.......