Do You Believe In Prayer?

[latraviata]

I never responded to you about your son's death or you taking meds in a Christian way or a Non Christian way. I never responded to you period. I'm sorry but you have me confused with someone else and I don't know why you feel the need to single me out so much and bash my veiws and get upset when others do the same to you. Please, stop and leave me alone as I am doing with you.

I'll post it again, you are a bloody hypocrite. You have recommended me to take antidepressants because you thought my opinion about wedding attire required accute medication.

You said sorry about that, when I informed you that I already take the medication because of my sons death last year, but in the same sentence you compared me with a posh cat in a commercial and now you play innocent?

Please, you are as nasty, unpleasant and dishonest as the average fundie.

[Guest Anonymous]

I no longer believe in God, so I no longer pray. When I was a Christian I used to find prayer enormously helpful as an emotional release and as a way to feel relaxed and peaceful. Now I talk to other people for emotional release and I use relaxation exercises/meditation to feel peaceful.

[bunny]

I certainly do.

I have a few stories, but I'll just give you one. About three years ago a friend of mine decided I needed a car. My husband used our one car for work (he's in real estate) so normally if I needed to get somewhere I either walked, he dropped me off, or I'd get a ride from a friend.

My friend started praying for me. Mind you, I was content-I wasn't working at the time, so I didn't feel like the car would be an absolute necessity, altho yes, nice to have....fast forward a few weeks and some woman I didn't know was calling me and asking me if I wanted a car. She was giving one away. (My praying friend didn't know her either. )

After I got the car (this lady paid all the fees involved in transferring title) I was praying for a job, and I prayed some particular specifics. Three days later my husband ran into someone he knew who owned a business, and the guy told him to tell me to stop by.

I got the job, and it went exactly with the specifics I'd prayed.

Now, mind you, God can and does say no to some prayers, and mind you my prayer life is not usually made up of me asking for stuff for me. But I have to say that yes, He does answer prayer.

[Koala]

I agree. I think believing in prayer is just a self-soothing comfort mechanism. People want to see God's hand behind random occurances because it makes them feel better (kinda like "Religion is the opiate for the masses" or whatever. Prayer is the same way- just a "feel good" thing)

Agreed.

[fundiefan]

I certainly do.

I have a few stories, but I'll just give you one. About three years ago a friend of mine decided I needed a car. My husband used our one car for work (he's in real estate) so normally if I needed to get somewhere I either walked, he dropped me off, or I'd get a ride from a friend.

My friend started praying for me. Mind you, I was content-I wasn't working at the time, so I didn't feel like the car would be an absolute necessity, altho yes, nice to have....fast forward a few weeks and some woman I didn't know was calling me and asking me if I wanted a car. She was giving one away. (My praying friend didn't know her either. )

After I got the car (this lady paid all the fees involved in transferring title) I was praying for a job, and I prayed some particular specifics. Three days later my husband ran into someone he knew who owned a business, and the guy told him to tell me to stop by.

I got the job, and it went exactly with the specifics I'd prayed.

Now, mind you, God can and does say no to some prayers, and mind you my prayer life is not usually made up of me asking for stuff for me. But I have to say that yes, He does answer prayer.

I've been in need of a job for months, years, and I have next to zero specifics other than income. Yet, no one has 'granted' me one because I ask no matter how desperate my need. I beg, plead and collapse in fear of what is to come without it. Why did you get your job while I, who will be homeless without one, don't get one? Why were your car and job prayers answered, while I am ignored? OK, you prayed for a job and I don't, but does god really pick and choose which of his creations to 'give' and answer for?

Did you maybe get your job because you are educated and had the skills that matched the employers needs? Did you look for certain benefits and responsibilities, and get what you worked for? Did god really just give you that job without regard to who could do it best or who could maybe even 'need' it more?

That makes me really, really uncomfortable. If there is some deity determining my life, that deity hates me and wants me to fail in epic proportions. No wonder I can't find a way to believe anyone or anything else has control or even impact.

[gingernut]

This is an interesting thread to me since I don't know how I feel about it. I believe in a God....not certain what that God is like. More like a Great Spirit type of God. I probably fall more into a deist mentality. I draw much strength in hard times from nature, from God, but don't ask much of anything from God...just for courage and strength to get through and be a good person to others....I don't think God answers specific prayer. He didn't when I was a Christian, now I don't expect it anymore. I do get much strength and love from the woods, trees, sky....I call it God.

[SquirrelySquirrel]

"One pair of hands hard at work will accomplish more than a thousand heads bent in prayer."

Sums up my feelings quite well, if the question is whether or not I think prayer actually produces results.

I believe that it give some people peace of mind, comfort, time for reflection, etc. But if there is a god and prayer does work, then it's no god I'd ever want to worship even if there were physical proof of him or her right in my face. I'll take hell over someone who lets innocents suffer and children starve, thankyouverymuch.

[ladypuglover]

Removed because it isn't worth my time.

[duplessis3]

Fundiefan - there are gobs and gobs of other gods to whom one could pray. To be so centered on the Abrahamic faiths version of God limits us to a very narrow world view.

Why just this afternoon, my youngest declared himself (in a game we were playing where you had to decide what god of Olympus you would be, and design a throne) the God of Value!

[Patsy]

I'll post it again, you are a bloody hypocrite. You have recommended me to take antidepressants because you thought my opinion about wedding attire required accute medication.

You said sorry about that, when I informed you that I already take the medication because of my sons death last year, but in the same sentence you compared me with a posh cat in a commercial and now you play innocent?

Please, you are as nasty, unpleasant and dishonest as the average fundie.

That was someone else: http://freejinger.yuku.com/topic/7069/W ... ing?page=4

[ladypuglover]

That was someone else: http://freejinger.yuku.com/topic/7069/W ... ing?page=4

Patsy, don't bother, she has it in her mind that I'm some evil nasty person and will not change her mind. But thank you for taking the time to show I didn't say the lies she said I did. :)

[jjmennonite]

I believe in positive thinking and energy of the mind and lots of people praying or sending light or however they describe it, might affect an outcome. Or at least the possibility exists.

I am aware that I may believe this stuff, just as a comfort to me, and I choose the comfort. Guardian angels are a wonderful thing to believe in for a parent. So I cling to my belief in guardian angels, for my daughter. Logical, no, but it gives me comfort.

I am all for the opiate of the masses. Unfortunately, religion is usually used to control the masses, rather than sedate us.

edited for spelling

[Effie]

People create their own karma. It's not a universal, cosmic thing, it's a consequence thing. Make your choices and act on them. The consequences of those choices are your karma. We all create our own karma by the choices we make. Yes, sometimes it can take years but in the end, those choices and consequences do and will have an impact on you.

I love your explanation of karma. I can totally relate to this: Karma is a consequence thing. In one way I think that karma could be how we feel afterwards we have done something bad for example. I did something when I was younger which I regretted and felt bad for, for several years. I guess that could be seen as karma. The thoughts could not let go of me. That was my consequence of what I had done.

[latraviata]

That was someone else: http://freejinger.yuku.com/topic/7069/W ... ing?page=4

You are right, nonetheless her comment addressed to me in that particular topic was bluntly insulting and not very chistian for that matter.

[failsafe]

You are right, nonetheless her comment addressed to me in that particular topic was bluntly insulting and not very chistian for that matter.

I think perhaps you should let go. It is the internet - sometimes people are rude and sometimes they hurt your feelings and that's life. I see little point in carrying a grudge, and I think if you respond to people like this

Please, you are as nasty, unpleasant and dishonest as the average fundie.

and don't even apologize for the fact that you were blatantly wrong about what LPL said to you, you're in no position to throw stones about others' insults. JMO, of course.

[treemom]

That was someone else: http://freejinger.yuku.com/topic/7069/W ... ing?page=4

Ahh thanks! I didn't recall LPL doing anything of the sort.

[treemom]

Also, there was an internet slap fight over wearing shoes in the house? I think that trumps my slap fight over plucking eyebrows.

[latraviata]

I think perhaps you should let go. It is the internet - sometimes people are rude and sometimes they hurt your feelings and that's life. I see little point in carrying a grudge, and I think if you respond to people like this

and don't even apologize for the fact that you were blatantly wrong about what LPL said to you, you're in no position to throw stones about others' insults. JMO, of course.

Yes I was wrong, but if you take the time to read the entire thread, you will notice that some people commented with the most ridiculous accusations because I didn't share their opinion about wedding dresses and I tried to explain something about the mores in my 'culture' and they just don't read properly. So conclusions were drawn, I was a racist, arrogant, needed to be on Xantax, shoving my views and heritage through their throats it became increasingly worse and grossly blown out of proportion. I don't feel I need to apologize at all.

And yes,the barefoot thing came up in the same thread.

[Patsy]

Latraviata, either I am not understanding your comment, or you have said the equivalent of: I accused my friend of spreading rumors about me, and then I realised it wasn't true. But if you'll notice, my cousin beat me up when I was seven, so I don't feel the need to apologise.

[keeperrox]

Wow, the persecution complex in here rivals that of many of our pet fundies.

[LilMissMetaphor]

Seriously. From what I've seen LPL is one of the more level-headed moderates around here. I was about to tell Latraviata to take a chill pill but I suppose that would be deeply offensive since she has stated she takes medication to deal with the loss of her son (which by the way somehow comes up in threads completely unrelated to loss and personal tragedy.) I don't buy the whole "I suffered a loss/survived cancer so no one can be the slightest bit rude to me and if I'm wrong well I don't need to apologize" thing.

[latraviata]

Wow, the persecution complex in here rivals that of many of our pet fundies.

Latraviata, either I am not understanding your comment, or you have said the equivalent of: I accused my friend of spreading rumors about me, and then I realised it wasn't true. But if you'll notice, my cousin beat me up when I was seven, so I don't feel the need to apologise.

Oh please again the exaggerations, a persecution complex and a ridiculous and completely irrelevant comparison.

I don't feel the need to apologise to anybody, because I could think of one or two who owe me an apology, just read the thread, it was about mores (take into consideration, English is not my first language and my backround is quite different).

And I don't like the so called (moderated) christians, commenting in a particularly nasty fashion, perhaps the wrong comment, but the right comment is not really a christian gem either.

On topic, no I don't believe in prayers ,prayer chains and positive energy.

Perhaps off topic, a very interesting and yet a very discouraging article.

http://atheism.about.com/od/atheistbigo ... urveys.htm

[Patsy]

Okay, if the comparison seems ridiculous and completely irrelevant, I'll try to make it more obvious.

John says Michael spat in his meal. Michael says he never did. It turns out Beryl did it. John points out that a while ago, Mary, Jo and Padraic pulled faces at him. Therefore, John won't apologise for accusing Michael of such a thing.

If that seems completely different to your interpretation of events, then please understand that that is what I'm getting from your explanation of why no apology is necessary. Are you, in fact, saying something completely different to what I am reading?

[failsafe]

I don't feel the need to apologise to anybody, because I could think of one or two who owe me an apology, just read the thread, it was about mores (take into consideration, English is not my first language and my backround is quite different).

I just reread. While it does seem that some things were lost in translation, and that's unfortunate, I don't think it's quite fair to blame people who took your comments at their word. No one can climb into your head and know what you "meant" to say or what your comment was "intended" to produce, just what it actually did produce. Sometimes that leads to misunderstanding, but that doesn't mean that one side is all wrong and the other is all right. Yeah, it seems like people didn't give you the benefit of the doubt. It happens.

People, I think, were responding to this statement primarily, and not later statements:

It is not done to wear black, it is not done to wear a strepless bridal gown, a hat after 5 pm, eating while walking on the street, answering the door barefooted, receiving and entertaining guests without wearing shoes. Call me old fashioned, but I appreciate a little bit of decorum.

You imply that decorum necessarily means: wearing black at weddings, strapless bridal gowns, hats in the evening, answering the door barefoot, etc. When others pointed out, at first gently and then more harshly, that decorum has different meanings in different cultures. You then tried to clarify what you "meant". I don't want to get into the argument again, and I want to acknowledge that you're correct - you tried to explain yourself, but people continued to respond to this original comment because, IMO, it was phrased poorly. Sometimes that happens. There's no need to stay angry about it as it seems like it was mostly a misunderstanding.

[latraviata]

Okay, if the comparison seems ridiculous and completely irrelevant, I'll try to make it more obvious.

John says Michael spat in his meal. Michael says he never did. It turns out Beryl did it. John points out that a while ago, Mary, Jo and Padraic pulled faces at him. Therefore, John won't apologise for accusing Michael of such a thing.

If that seems completely different to your interpretation of events, then please understand that that is what I'm getting from your explanation of why no apology is necessary. Are you, in fact, saying something completely different to what I am reading?

Yes I did.

I got two very nasty comments in the same thread mixed up.