Bates Family Part 6

[Screamapillar]

23 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

I"m not sure how long they have been on it, but wasn't Chad's dad mentioned in the lawsuit because he did a check up on one of the women after they were abused?

I admit I couldn't make it through reading the entire lawsuit. It was sickening and rage inducing. But in my cynical mind involving all things Fundie, I imagine having a Doctor on your Board to examine those you abuse would be a handy way to keep said abused from seeking help from a doctor who would actually feel compelled to report the abuse.

[nokidsmom]

24 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Seriously it's like they live in bizzaro world - raising kids (much less several hundred of them) without steady income is a sure source of panic for most rational people...not a point of honor.

Indeed it's bizzaro world.  When Mr. No lost his job in the recession with the job market absolutely in the dumpster so we could expect him to have no steady source of income for some time, I was in a state of panic!   And I still had my job.   I can't imagine being actually proud of no steady income, neither parent stepping up to work, have eleventy kids and keep on trying to add more.  Total insanity.  

[iknowright]

18 minutes ago, Screamapillar said:

I admit I couldn't make it through reading the entire lawsuit. It was sickening and rage inducing. But in my cynical mind involving all things Fundie, I imagine having a Doctor on your Board to examine those you abuse would be a handy way to keep said abused from seeking help from a doctor who would actually feel compelled to report the abuse.

I thought doctors were obligated reporters of abuse to authorities of minors?  Now with the ten women who have come forward, would it be possible for Dr. Paine to lose his medical license since he examined one of the victims, failed to report it, and did not offer proper medical treatment (power bar?????)

[singsingsing]

I hope this helps convince people that the Bateses and the Paines don't shit rainbows and roses. The fact that Gil Bates and Stephen Paine knowingly and systematically swept abuse like this under the rug for years is disgusting and they need to be held accountable.

No wonder Jill and Jessa Duggar insisted that molestation happens in a lot of families. Clearly physical, emotional, and sexual abuse is out of control in this cult, sanctioned and perpetrated by their highest authorities.

I wish this were more widely reported. You'd think the media would be interested in exposing the dark underbelly of the Duggars' cult since the Josh scandals got so much press.

[Georgiana]

28 minutes ago, iknowright said:

I thought doctors were obligated reporters of abuse to authorities of minors?  Now with the ten women who have come forward, would it be possible for Dr. Paine to lose his medical license since he examined one of the victims, failed to report it, and did not offer proper medical treatment (power bar?????)

Generally they are mandated reporters, however, there could be some difference depending on the situation.

For example, there are certain things expected of my doctor friend Phyllis if I make an appointment and see her professionally in her practice.  Not all of those things are expected if I see Phyllis over the weekend and say "Hey, P, can you take a quick look at my ankle?"  Phyllis is mandated to report on her patients, but she is not mandated to report on something she sees while out running the lake (except as a general citizen).  

In many cases, the additional professional responsibilities placed on doctors, lawyers, teachers, etc. only apply when they are acting in a professional capacity.  If Dr. Paine was just at IBLP headquarters for board member functions (aka non medical) and was asked to take a look at something quickly and informally, then he may not have any additional responsibilities over any layperson.

If he in any way was seen to establish a patient/doctor relationship, however, then he could be in hot water.  

[halcionne]

1 hour ago, Screamapillar said:

How long has Gil been on the IBLP Board? And Chad Paine's father? I can't recall and the information isn't on the IBLP site. Though they do have this gem in Gil's bio:

The "all without a steady income" sentence ending in an exclamation point is very amusing to me. Not having a steady income is exclamation point worthy?

I checked the wayback machine a while back to find an answer to this question. I don't remember what I found and I can't look it up right now, but there is definitely an iteration of the board makeup on there that does not include Gil.

[Kelsey]

For some reason I thought that he was a chiro. Perhaps they have different reporting requirements than an actual MD/DO.

[Snarkle]

2 hours ago, nokidsmom said:

Indeed it's bizzaro world.  When Mr. No lost his job in the recession with the job market absolutely in the dumpster so we could expect him to have no steady source of income for some time, I was in a state of panic!   And I still had my job.   I can't imagine being actually proud of no steady income, neither parent stepping up to work, have eleventy kids and keep on trying to add more.  Total insanity.  

in their world they would say you and/or Mr No didn't pray hard enough, because God will provide.

[Of course in their world, everything is an alternate reality.]

[imokit]

1 hour ago, Georgiana said:

Generally they are mandated reporters, however, there could be some difference depending on the situation.

For example, there are certain things expected of my doctor friend Phyllis if I make an appointment and see her professionally in her practice.  Not all of those things are expected if I see Phyllis over the weekend and say "Hey, P, can you take a quick look at my ankle?"  Phyllis is mandated to report on her patients, but she is not mandated to report on something she sees while out running the lake (except as a general citizen).  

In many cases, the additional professional responsibilities placed on doctors, lawyers, teachers, etc. only apply when they are acting in a professional capacity.  If Dr. Paine was just at IBLP headquarters for board member functions (aka non medical) and was asked to take a look at something quickly and informally, then he may not have any additional responsibilities over any layperson.

If he in any way was seen to establish a patient/doctor relationship, however, then he could be in hot water.  

I don't about in America, but for UK doctors if you take a look at something even on an informal basis, you are establishing a duty of care and are thus bound by good medical practise.  Thus you can be in trouble with liscensing for doing something stupid, or not doing something your supposed to.  If you don't have a duty of care, you can't be in trouble.  But any advice or care automatically establishes it even if informal.

Eg - you (a doctor) see someone collapse in front of you in public.  You carry on by.  Someone later finds out that you went past and did nothing and complains.  Morally, you have issues.  Medico-legally - you're fine.  You had no duty of care to that random person.

Alternatively;

you (a doctor) see someone collapse in front of you in public.  You stop and say you're a doctor.  You start helping.  It takes a while for ambulance to arrive, and you have somewhere you need to be, your also tired from the chest compression, you leave.  Morally, you have issues, like the other example.  Medico-legally - you're screwed.  By stopping you established a duty of care and leaving at that point is negligent.

 

My point is that depending on the licencing rules where Chad's Dad is, he could still be bound by them even when not in a formal consultation setting.  He may have still have a duty to report things.

[formergothardite]

According to his bio, Stephen Paine is currently a physician at a prison, so I don't think he is a chiro. He also served as the physician for the staff at the IBLP headquarters at one point. 

In the lawsuit it says that Dr. Paine was employed by IBLP at that time and he did the examination. Jane Doe II was a minor living at the training center as a student during at that time. He said she was suffering from extreme stress and told her to eat a protein bar. Jane Doe II had informed Gothard and the staff that she was a victim of sexual abuse. 

[JillyO]

2 hours ago, singsingsing said:

I wish this were more widely reported. You'd think the media would be interested in exposing the dark underbelly of the Duggars' cult since the Josh scandals got so much press.

Yeah. Unfortunately, I don't think the Bateses are high-profile enough to really shine a ton of attention on this issue. But why the press aren't all over this because of the Duggars' ties to IBLP, I absolutely do not understand. Especially since they still seem to be trying to get some kind of show back on.

[mango_fandango]

Fundies love the idea of self-employment and being debt-free but it just sounds worrying to me. The Bateses have had money issues. The Maxwells churn out shite books that have a very, very limited market. The Shupes (well, Bob) have a disaster clean-up kind of business, which is a fairly decent job (I don't know what Bob did before he was self-employed, he's only been self-employed for a relatively short period of time) but they have had periods of financial difficulty, e.g. for five months after the twins were born where Bob had no job. It's bad being unemployed at any time, much less when there's a new baby/babies in the family. Boob, of course, is a realtor, and IIRC they haven't had any major issues (have they??) Fundies just say "ah, but god will provide" etc etc, but I'd still feel worried without some sort of financial security.

[twinmama]

18 hours ago, Alye said:

It's not unheard of to have two kids so close together. My family is not religious at all yet all my siblings had 2 under 2 at some point because they wanted them close in age so they'd have a close relationship. I'll reserve my judgement until they have 4 in 4. I don't think that we can say that Erin's miscarriages says anything about her family planning beliefs without knowing her full medical history and her doctor's advice.

I had 2 under 2 minutes! But yes, I agree that I'm not judging anyone who wants their young kids close in age. Until they are having 3 and 4 kids back to back, they could just want them close and stop. Erin especially. Even if she has another relatively soon, with her medical issues she may want to get the scary child bearing times over with fast.

[tumblr]

I just watched the episode, did anyone else noticed that Gil's father said something along the lines of Zach being more realistic or more worried and then just let it trail off?

I don't really know what her meant as he never finished his sentence but it gave me the wiggins. He could simply mean Zach doesn't want a mega family but my first thought was that he meant Zach was some kind of doomsday fanatic or something...

[grandmadugger]

29 minutes ago, tumblr said:

I just watched the episode, did anyone else noticed that Gil's father said something along the lines of Zach being more realistic or more worried and then just let it trail off?

I don't really know what her meant as he never finished his sentence but it gave me the wiggins. He could simply mean Zach doesn't want a mega family but my first thought was that he meant Zach was some kind of doomsday fanatic or something...

I'll rewatch this weekend but I took it mean that Zach's more realistic and worried about finances.  Zach's old enough to remember the Nabisco days, when things were stable, and then when Gil lost his God given brain and gave it up.  That's gotta be in his mind as his family expands.  Police only make so much.  I've always gotten the feeling that Zach and Alyssa were closer to Bill and Jane than the rest were for whatever reason. 

[singsingsing]

Zach just needs to move to Canada. Police where I live can easily make upwards of 100 grand a year. Of course, he'd need a university degree to stand a chance of getting hired.

I definitely don't see Zach as the crazy doomsday prepper type, but hey, you never know.

[Ofglen]

3 hours ago, formergothardite said:

According to his bio, Stephen Paine is currently a physician at a prison, so I don't think he is a chiro. He also served as the physician for the staff at the IBLP headquarters at one point. 

In the lawsuit it says that Dr. Paine was employed by IBLP at that time and he did the examination. Jane Doe II was a minor living at the training center as a student during at that time. He said she was suffering from extreme stress and told her to eat a protein bar. Jane Doe II had informed Gothard and the staff that she was a victim of sexual abuse. 

He told her to do what?!

[accountingstar]

It looks like Lawson has a new sidekick in Trace. He just posted another video of them talking about the NFL playoffs.

Here's Lily and Ellie's recap (http://www.batesfamilyblog.com/) if anyone is interested:

Quote

Bringing Up Bates "Welcome Back Bates"...

• With three (soon to be four) kids married and two (Nathan and Tori) taking college classes, Gil and Kelly Bates joke that they are having empty nest syndrome.
• “It’s just starting to hit me as it gets closer, that this is actually my wedding and I’m the one moving away,” shares Michael.
• As the big day approaches, Gil and Kelly take Michael to Petals & Lace in Nashville, Tennessee, to find her dream dress. “It’s worth anything to find the dress for Michael,” says Gil. “I hate seeing [her] feel the pressure trying to find something [she] can’t.”
• Several of Michael’s sisters (and brothers, surprisingly) come along. “When Lawson and Nathan caught wind of it, they were not going to be left out of something fun,” says Kelly.
• “Girls think they know what looks good, but the truth is, you have to have a guy’s opinion to know if something is really good,” says Nathan.
• Petals & Lace has many styles of dresses, including strapless. Gil's comment makes his wife and daughters laugh: “Most of these wedding dresses, they’re missing all the tops!”
• “Most people don’t wear them, Dad,” responds Carlin. “He’s not been to many modern weddings has he?” says Kelly, chuckling.
• Everyone takes a seat, and the fun begins. Lawson and Nathan, who just want to finish and grab pizza, keep things interesting with their witty remarks.
  • “That looks like my grandma’s wedding dress.” (Nathan)
  • “Do y’all ever want to get a dress, or y’all just want to keep talking about dresses?” (Lawson)
• When Michael walks out of the fitting room wearing THE dress, Gil starts bawling. “I can’t think about it,” says the dad of 19. “We’ve kind of grown up together. She’s always been here. It really is sad.”
• The proud father braces himself as the attendant prepares to announce the cost, but when she informs him that it will be $600 including tax, he is incredibly relieved.
• One month before Michael’s wedding, the Bates family travels to Mebane, North Carolina, to watch Kelly’s sister Beth marry her long-time boyfriend.
• The wedding is outdoors in the middle of summer, and as Gil says, it’s “H-O-T.”
• Kelly and Michael take note of Beth’s decorations as they plan for Michael’s big day. “Mom is amazing,” shares the bride-to-be. "She’s best mom, matron of honor, best friend, all in one.”
• Kelly, Michael, Addallee, and Ellie head inside to give Beth a pep talk before the ceremony.
• The guests are nervous when they hear thunder, and although it starts to sprinkle during the vows, the wedding still ends up being a beautiful occasion.
• For the next big Bates adventure, the family drives down to Honea Path, South Carolina, for Papa Bill’s 4^th of July birthday party. (Papa Bill and Mama Jane are Gil’s parents.) 
• Zach, who is in the middle of his training at the police academy, isn’t able to attend the party. Michael, accompanied by Callie, stays home so she can go to her scheduled dress fitting.
• Mama Jane loves having her grandchildren over, but the lack of organization is hard on her. Every year, the kids manage to break Mama Jane’s hammock, and every year Mama Jane mends it. “The year before last when it broke, she took her shoe off and took it to a few of them,” shares Gil. “This year, she responded a lot calmer.”
• Papa Bill, 77, has been having heart problems, so the extended Bates family cherishes every moment spent with him. During the party, the guests take time to share how Papa Bill has influenced their lives.
• Whitney’s genuine comment brings everyone to tears: “…It’s really encouraging to watch all y’all as a family, how tight y’all are. [Zach] respects you, and he thinks a lot of you.”
• Later, Kelly and Tori impress everyone during an all-generations kickball game.

More cute photos of Bradley:

[nelliebelle1197]

8 hours ago, bal maiden said:

I don't know whether to be impressed or creeped out by this! 

I am creeped out that you even thought of this @clueliss These kind of comments are just as bad as the internet diagnosing. I adore many of you who sit around and figure out due dates and fundie sex lives, but it is no better than the squinty baby stuff. It squicks me the way internet diagnosing squicks AreteJo! We all have our things, I guess.

13 hours ago, JillyO said:

He is the most adorablest child ever!!! I would ask you to help me steal him, but then I'd have to kill you after, so...

I will see your Bradly Bates and raise you a Stephen Anderson, who is the cutest fundie baby ever despite the fact he was spawned from the loins of Zsucifer and the Little PeePee man.

7 hours ago, Screamapillar said:

How long has Gil been on the IBLP Board? And Chad Paine's father? I can't recall and the information isn't on the IBLP site. Though they do have this gem in Gil's bio:

The "all without a steady income" sentence ending in an exclamation point is very amusing to me. Not having a steady income is exclamation point worthy?

Can I just say I have no idea what your opinions on anything are because I get obsessed with both your name and your avatar every time you post. I am like a bird drawn inextricably to your shiny things.

[Sweet Fellowship]

So Whitney Bates is pregnant. I really thought it'd be Alyssa also.

[RosyDaisy]

My grandparents wouldn't put up withe shit the Bates pull. These people are ill mannered, inconsiderate brats. Even the older ones.

[RosyDaisy]

Beth"s wedding was deliberately featured to show that the Bates aren't racist. I mean WTH puts up pictures of famous Confederate leaders and has a sister who is black? Add that to the list as to why tge Bates are horrible people.

[Thorns]

6 hours ago, grandmadugger said:

I'll rewatch this weekend but I took it mean that Zach's more realistic and worried about finances.  Zach's old enough to remember the Nabisco days, when things were stable, and then when Gil lost his God given brain and gave it up.  That's gotta be in his mind as his family expands.  Police only make so much.  I've always gotten the feeling that Zach and Alyssa were closer to Bill and Jane than the rest were for whatever reason. 

Working in the force I would guess he's being exposed to a lot of different social strata that the others in his family hasn't, and is thus more aware of the risks of low economical status.The odds of getting and keeping a job in the force might be higher than in other lines of work, but the risk on the job (injury, death), is higher. Insurance costs money, and he might be seeing that if something goes wrong with him that leaves the family in financial trouble, and having seen what that might lead to makes him more worried.

I haven't actually seen the episode, so my answer might be totally out of context

[missegeno]

If people tweeted links to the lawsuit could Up and the Bates delete them? Flooding Twitter with information about what the Bates believe during this "twitter party" would be the best way to let fans know the truth about the family. Some still wouldn't believe, but it would give some of them a pause about adoring this family. It would also send the message to UP that people are very aware that their star family has some dirty little secrets. 

I'm a bit late to this party, but you make a great suggestion. They can't delete other people's tweets, and hashtags being hijacked in negative directions was always a big concern when I worked in social media marketing. If it happens, you have to get creative to flip it back to positive, but that is truly a craft that I am not cut out for. TLC also promotes their hashtags in the specials, so come clever tweets could actually turn the tide somewhat, at least within the twitter realm.

[missegeno]

Yeah, my former co-worker's sons are 13 months apart. She actually was using breastfeeding as birth control (or trying to, anyway). Now she tells everyone how that doesn't work.

After watching all of I Didn't Know I Was Pregnant, I warn everyone of that too! You are actually incredibly fertile after pregnancy. Breast feeding does mediate it (though that little time before you start really flowing is prime baby making time), but the sex waiting period after birth is one of the few fundie things that I don't really snark on because it protects mother and baby from another pregnancy too soon (though if it is still too soon is a whole can of worms to open).