Remember "Bringing Home Rebecca?"

[Koala]

I just looked at his fb. He went to highschool in a fairly wealthy community about 15 mins from me. Small world.

[MrsFoxx]

I'm just glad they got her out of "the workplace". For all we know there could have been convicts there! :o

Yes, who knows what kind of a man she could have ended up working for.

Also, for the record, it really pisses me off when SAHM's call their husband as their employer. Being a SAHM is great, I'm glad people are able to do it, but do it with pride and consider yourself self-employed.

[Black Aliss]

So her headship commits (federal?) crime, is busted, and they have no problem expecting strangers to support them? As long as the strangers don't support them through taxes paid to welfare?

Why do I find this all so confusing...

Well, no, going on welfare would be expecting strangers to support them. I'm sure the begging box is up there only for their friends in Christ, who believe as they do.

I'd like to know more about his illegal arms shipments. What and to whom?

[Hisey]

If Rebecca had stayed in the workforce back in 2006, perhaps her husband wouldn't have felt such financial pressure, and would've been less inclined to crime.

If she'd stayed in the workforce for the 6-7 years till they had kids, she could've saved money and been prepared for this crisis.

[Georgiana]

Well, no, going on welfare would be expecting strangers to support them. I'm sure the begging box is up there only for their friends in Christ, who believe as they do.

I'd like to know more about his illegal arms shipments. What and to whom?

Also, they are conveniently leaving out the fact that most states have a work requirement for assistance. Rebecca in all likelihood would not qualify for aid long if she refused to get any sort of job. My state requires proof of employment or proof that you are actively seeking employment, except in cases of incredibly extenuating circumstances.

Welfare is not "free money". The state really regulates it, requires you to meet with social workers/job counselors, and will pry into the details of your personal life to prevent abuse. I'm not sure any state would allow her to just collect welfare when she has the skills necessary to be gainfully employed.

[Burpies]

I guess I just don't see what the big damn deal is. You're a mother. You were able to stay at home with your kids for some time, but now your husband is unable to support you in the lifestyle that allowed that, so that means you need to get a job to make sure your kids have the things they need, like heat, food, electric (though I know Rebekah Pearl doesn't consider this a necessity), safe shelter, ect. Maybe this will be temporary, maybe not, but it is your responsibility as a person who has children to do whatever you can to make life as stable, and as safe and healthy as you can. Refusing to work and praying (begging) that 'Godly' people will support you is so arrogant. I would be working two jobs and explored my options with the state and fed governments before I begged family, much less strangers, for money!

Just get a fucking job!

[hoipolloi]

Wonder if Tait & Lauren Zimmerman -- fundie arch-beggars themselves (littletait.com/) -- will return the favor and donate to the Colemans' felony support fund...

[Koala]

That Go Fund Me page isn't bringing in very much money. They better get a plan B if she doesn't want to work for the next 2 years.

[Georgiana]

That Go Fund Me page isn't bringing in very much money. They better get a plan B if she doesn't want to work for the next 2 years.

2+ years. Finding a job after prison is tough times.

[slickcat79]

Looks like they've edited the gofundme page. The section quoted in the OP about Rebecca not working and the family being too GODLY for welfare has disappeared.

Sam just seems really upset that he was given 2 years in jail, when he only "deserved" a warning. But it sounds like he could have been sentenced to 10+ years, so maybe he should be thankful it wasn't worse. It also looked like they don't owe any fines, which they certainly would not be able to pay. Given how unbelievably stupid he was, I think he got off lucky here.

[formergothardite]

They have also edited the goal. It was $32,000 and now it is $12,000

On the Factual Resume attached to the plea deal, I had to make sure some of the wording was vague enough so that I wasn't lying in signing to it's truthfulness.

This is a guy who knowingly sold and shipped items without a license to do so and who lied on federal forms about what those items were and how much they were worth suddenly wants to be "truthful" and not admit that he knew what he was doing was wrong?

[Marian the Librarian]

You're right - their Go Fund Me page has definitely been edited since last night. My bad, for not taking a screen shot!!

[Megan]

The adoption in process, I understand, but the court delayed the process so they could START another adoption? Is this a sibling situation, or other extenuating circumstance? Otherwise, I can't imagine WTF the court was thinking!

Based on the gofundme information, the children are not full siblings. One was born in February 2013, the other in May 2013. It's possible they have the same father, though I doubt this. The two children do resemble one another, though.

The children don't look Chinese to me, though I know trying to ID race is hokey and subjective. Given that the comment about them trying to adopt from China was from 2008 and he lost his job that same year (though ahthelife claims he quit...), I imagine they would have had a difficult time adopting at that point.

[Megan]

Unfortunately for him, the cache exits. I've saved the original page.

A comparison website mainly notes changes in the part Marian quoted originally.

Cached:

Rebecca has not had to work since 2006. And we don't want the boys to suddenly be without both parents and thrown into daycare. Although we would very likely qualify for welfare, we don't want to subject our boys or ourselves to that system. Our church has a benevolent care fund and has offered to open some of that to us if we aren't able to raise enough money on our own.

The McKee family suggested we write our story and set up a fund raising effort to help support my wife and children while I'm in prison. We would love for Rebecca and the boys to be able to stay in our home while I am away but if we can't raise enough money to meet our goal then we do have the option to cut costs by moving in with a family at church and potentially renting our home (but renting the house would mean a long list of repair expenses immediately, which is it's own set of problems.)

Current:

R could return to work if necessary and the boys' daycare would be paid for. However, we don't want the boys to suddenly be without both parents if it can be avoided. An elder at our church is allowing R and the boys to move in with their family while I am away and another family has taken on the responsibility of managing the rental of our home. We've minimized expenses and have some savings. It is not quite enough to last the entirety of this prison term so the McKee family suggested we write our story and set up a fund raising effort to help support my wife and children while I'm in prison.

[slickcat79]

How does a suspected felon even get approved for an adoption? I mean, if I were a birth mother and there were tons of families out there who wanted to adopt a baby, I certainly wouldn't be thinking "wow, an arms dealer, great choice!" :?

I also keep comparing this situation to Ah the life's update post. How does any of this constitute being "financially responsible" before getting married and having children? Sam couldn't keep a job, so he creates his own home business and commits various illegal acts to raise money. They buy a house that they may not even be able to rent because of all the work that it needs, but they were fine with moving their own babies into it. Ridiculous, all of it.

[chaotic life]

Some independent private adoptions don't require background checks. Additionally, given how close to the previous adoption the second one was, the background check from the first adoption may have still be valid and he might have been able to hide the situation. Having a felony conviction doesn't automatically disqualify you for adoption. It depends upon what you were convicted for.

In our second adoption, the social worker told us about a couple that declared they had no criminal convictions. When she ran the background check, the husband showed up with a child pornography conviction. He thought because he had his record expunged it wouldn't show up and the social worker had to tell the wife that not only did he have that conviction but she would never pass a homestudy with him on it.

Those children are not from China. They had it on one of those websites that they were adopting two children from China.

So, she's got housing provided, she's got at least enough rental to cover her house payment, perhaps a small income if they followed the debt-free rule so many fundies abide by. She has daycare costs covered. She clearly has some type of work history since she didn't stop working until she was 27. Yet, they don't want to subject her to the government system nor require her to work so the boys don't have to go to daycare.

Whatever. Get a job!

[Emme]

How does a suspected felon even get approved for an adoption? I mean, if I were a birth mother and there were tons of families out there who wanted to adopt a baby, I certainly wouldn't be thinking "wow, an arms dealer, great choice!" :?

I also keep comparing this situation to Ah the life's update post. How does any of this constitute being "financially responsible" before getting married and having children? Sam couldn't keep a job, so he creates his own home business and commits various illegal acts to raise money. They buy a house that they may not even be able to rent because of all the work that it needs, but they were fine with moving their own babies into it. Ridiculous, all of it.

If he wasn't convicted at the time, maybe they didn't have to report it yet? Not sure.

[Koala]

I wonder where the parents/grandparents are???

[Georgiana]

You know, we talk about a LOT of less than genius level people here, but this guy might take the cake.

My main question since day one back in April 2010 was "Am I still guilty if I didn't know sending parts was illegal?" I still, to this day, don't know the answer to that.

Yes. Ignorance of the law is not a defense unless specifically provided for within the law itself. If you are shipping weapons internationally, it is YOUR responsibility to familiarize yourself with all appropriate legislation surrounding their shipment. Businesses avoid picking up new lanes of business all the time because they cannot responsibly do this.

"Knew or should have known" is a common legal phrase. You never have to prove someone ACTUALLY knew something. That's almost impossible. The fact that they should have known is enough.

[chaotic life]

That's what I thought was the definition from CJ classes, but I'm not a lawyer. I just was really sure that the threshold is that a reasonable person should have known it was wrong, not whether you personally understood it to be wrong. Frankly, the fact that he states he originally questioned his employer on the legality of it clearly demonstrates he should have known. That he chose to risk his freedom on the answer not of the legal authorities but his employer is NOT the fault of anyone but himself.

[GolightlyGrrl]

Listen, Lady, if you want to play princess and strut around being too Godly to work for another man, that's fine. If you're willing to sacrifice an additional income and prefer being home to having a career, that's totally up to you. Do what you want.

But don't you pretend that you are too good to work and ask ME for my hard earned money. Pride is a sin. You are NOT too good to go back to work. You are not better than every. other. woman. who works hard to make ends meet and feed her family. You are not a princess. Now get your head out of your pretend world and come back to reality.

Where you're a regular woman.

Who needs to get a job.

[Coconut Flan]

It's always a good idea to proceed with the idea that falsifying information on any federal form is a crime. It was probably printed on the bottom of the form he falsified. :shifty-kitty:

[Seven Severn]

It isn't so much they don't want to scrouge money from others. They just don't want the government to make them fill out paperwork to do so.

They don't want to be in the system, though being in Federal Prison pretty much put him "in the system" for the rest of his life.

He likely won't be able to legally own guns in the future(Though she can, so they won't have to be gun free at home) much less sell them or anything related to them. While he may or may not be a hero to fundies / tea partiers he is as likely a pariah for getting caught, or for fear the feds are tracking him when he gets out. It will be hard for him to find regular employment. Of course, since he's supposed to own his own business, he could run a lawn service, etc... but if he was ever lax about paying his taxes, he probably shouldn't be in the future, since he now has a history of not following federal law.

Why aren't her friends and family stepping up with childcare/babysitting so she can get a job. She even has a work history, which a lot of those fundie SAHMs don't have.

He won't be able to vote for X-number of years, also, right?

[Emme]

Why don't I have a like button anymore? I need a like button for this!!!

[Cheetah]

Why don't I have a like button anymore? I need a like button for this!!!

I found out how to get the 'like' button back on another thread (although now it shows these % stars instead of just # of likes): go up to the upper left of your page where it says 'user control panel' and click on that. Somewhere in there (and I don't remember how you get to it, and don't want to click thru again and lose what I've written) is the option for page style. You want the one called 'phpBB Default' (if your page is like mine, it will be on 'prosilver special' before you change it. HTH.