Please Tell Me Togas Will Be Involved -Dougie/Greece -Merge

[snarkyjan]

Booooh! Oh well, at least it made me giggle like a twelve year-old, writing dirty words onto the lavatory walls in school. :lol:

Dougie has already reassured the interns that they won't need telescopes to study Uranus (yeah, chalk me up as another twelve-year-old).

[Childless]

Good god! $5700?!?!?!? What the hell are they doing over there? I spent two weeks in Greece. Flight, hotel, transportation between cities and islands, meals, tour guides, admission to museums and ruins, and tips cost me around $3000. An overpriced trip with a pompous ass who will do nothing but criticize the country constantly? Thanks, I'll pass.

[JesusFightClub]

Yeah, OK. Sure. Whatever you say.

This.

I've read the sort of shite fundies think ought to earn them a PhD, and if I'd handed it in for my fucking undergrad degree I would have got my arse kicked by my lecturers from one end of the Royal Mile to the other. Hell, if I'd handed it in in my last year of high school public humiliation would follow. And the state school I attended is bottom of the league table for that area.

Also, a Marxist perspective on history is a valid one (though very open to challenge). A "Christian" perspective on history is not. It's relying on a holy book of what the author believes to be truth, so you're never going to get past "Goddidit". With a Marxist interpretation you are going to need a wide variety of sources and a really solid backing for your argument which isn't just you waving a copy of Capital around. Christian perspective on history only needs the Bible, which, duh, not everyone accepts as the Absolute Word of God.

A "Christian and Southern" perspective on history is an opinion column in WorldNutzDaily, not a PhD thesis.

(True story - I was in classes with a fundie at Uni. Fundie-lite, but. Anyway, we had to do presentations in our tutor group and he confidently stood up and announced his was going to be on the increasing level of evil and lack of Biblical morality in [country x]. The tutor about tore him to shreds. ZOMG THE PERSECUTION OF CHRISTIANS, expecting them to actually conform to academic standards... :roll: )

[hoipolloi]

Incredibly principled in his theology and history, Bill was the top Ph.D. candidate with high ranking grades at the College of William and Mary, but was denied his Ph.D. by the Marxist history chairman (a former “Weatherman†radical at the University of Wisconsin) because of his overt Christian and Southern perspective on history.

Dog whistles, anyone?

:whistle:

[jenny_islander]

Actually a Christian perspective on history would start with the Christian Bible and take into account the movers and shakers in Christendom who pointed to their Christianity as their motivator (for various reasons--political, visionary, etc.). But I think I take your meaning: The Christian perspective on history is not a theory; it can't be disproven. As such, it is a fit topic for theology class, not for history class. Now, any history of Christendom that does not take the Christian faith and Christianized culture of most of its inhabitants into account is useless. It can be framed by any theory of history, but ignoring the strong motivating power of belief, as well as the Christian assumptions embedded in the culture, invalidates the argument.

ETA: Doug Phillips is a tool. A greedy tool. I could go down to my travel agent on Monday and get a quote for two weeks in Greece for a lot less than $7,500.

Anybody want to bet that he gets the locations of assorted events noted in Acts and the Epistles completely wrong? And mixes up the names of the gods and goddesses? And gets himself photographed with at least one object with unfortunate implications that a few minutes on Google could have warned him about? . . . Actually, this could be a drinking game.

ETA 2: I don't know whether to be relieved or disappointed that he isn't taking the manly camping trip to the wild snow lots of Anchorage. Profit margin too small, I suppose.

[YPestis]

Good god! $5700?!?!?!? What the hell are they doing over there? I spent two weeks in Greece. Flight, hotel, transportation between cities and islands, meals, tour guides, admission to museums and ruins, and tips cost me around $3000. An overpriced trip with a pompous ass who will do nothing but criticize the country constantly? Thanks, I'll pass.

A friend interested in a 2 week all expenses paid trip on a Mediterranean cruise said it was something like $4000/person, not including plane tickets. That's about a trip operating on a much larger scale than what Dougie offers. I can believe that the smaller venture he's suggesting would be far more expensive. I'm not trying to excuse the (outrageous) price he's charging----duh, he's going to make a healthy profit if he can fill the ship----but the number may not be completely out of left field when compared to other cruises.

The scam is that the "tour guides" have questionable understanding of the area. Plus, that "private yacht" will hardly compare with the luxury of a professional cruise ship with it's floating buffets, large pools, nightly shows etc. You know, all the FUN stuff associated with going on a cruise.

People are better off either joining a tour group or signing up for a professional cruise. It would be cheaper and people would get a real understanding of the local history. I'd also bet the ship activities will be more fun.

I, too, am baffled by how people can afford the $5700/head. I assume most families would only sign up their older children (if even that), but even two people would go over $10k for a 2 week vacation. I'm assuming that doesn't include plane tickets or incidentals. Either some fundies are really dipping into their savings or the Vision Forum crowd has some people with some extra cash lying around.

[hoipolloi]

I, too, am baffled by how people can afford the $5700/head. I assume most families would only sign up their older children (if even that), but even two people would go over $10k for a 2 week vacation. I'm assuming that doesn't include plane tickets or incidentals. Either some fundies are really dipping into their savings or the Vision Forum crowd has some people with some extra cash lying around.

Yeah, enough need to pay so that the $57K costs for the entire Phillips family are covered. :roll:

@twin2 - fantastic job on the family write up under Fundamentalist Family and Organization Summaries. Thank you!

@ VF Interns - better go check out twin2's summary, you might learn something! :dance:

Doug Phillips Is A Tool

[NovemberRain]

If there is a picture of Sam Turnley in a Toga i will be seriously Defrauded!

[moodygirl86]

http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Travel-g189430-c7504/Mykonos:Greece:Gay.Mykonos.html

I am sure they will fit right in :lol:

I wonder where they are staying.

Mykonos is also a really beautiful island.

You just reminded me of this:

http://videosift.com/video/Queen-Nathan ... nion-Movie

[samurai_sarah]

http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Travel-g189430-c7504/Mykonos:Greece:Gay.Mykonos.html

I am sure they will fit right in :lol:

I wonder where they are staying.

Mykonos is also a really beautiful island.

Oh, I only just saw what you really did there. Sorry about boo-ing you. Somehow I only saw the last two sentences. :oops:

[moodygirl86]

Oh, I only just saw what you really did there. Sorry about boo-ing you. Somehow I only saw the last two sentences. :oops:

No problem, I should have only quoted the Gay Hotels bit! Blame it on Sunday morning laziness.

[samurai_sarah]

No problem, I should have only quoted the Gay Hotels bit! Blame it on Sunday morning laziness.

Sorry, that was directed at OKTBT...I think. I booed her yesterday, not seeing that she'd edited the post of hers you quoted. Sorry, I need more coffee, and will stop spreading confusion now. :oops:

edited for missing words

[garciarodrigez]

I swear, I knew just by the title of this thread that it was gonna be about The Tool. Lol.

[OkToBeTakei]

Sorry, that was directed at OKTBT...I think. I booed her yesterday, not seeing that she'd edited the post of hers you quoted. Sorry, I need more coffee, and will stop spreading confusion now. :oops:

edited for missing words

I think I edited after you boo-ed. My error :lol: I am still fascinated to see which gay friendly hotel they pick. But yes my inner 12 yr old concurs that they will 'fit right in' :dance:

[Childless]

A friend interested in a 2 week all expenses paid trip on a Mediterranean cruise said it was something like $4000/person, not including plane tickets. That's about a trip operating on a much larger scale than what Dougie offers. I can believe that the smaller venture he's suggesting would be far more expensive. I'm not trying to excuse the (outrageous) price he's charging----duh, he's going to make a healthy profit if he can fill the ship----but the number may not be completely out of left field when compared to other cruises.

The scam is that the "tour guides" have questionable understanding of the area. Plus, that "private yacht" will hardly compare with the luxury of a professional cruise ship with it's floating buffets, large pools, nightly shows etc. You know, all the FUN stuff associated with going on a cruise.

People are better off either joining a tour group or signing up for a professional cruise. It would be cheaper and people would get a real understanding of the local history. I'd also bet the ship activities will be more fun.

I, too, am baffled by how people can afford the $5700/head. I assume most families would only sign up their older children (if even that), but even two people would go over $10k for a 2 week vacation. I'm assuming that doesn't include plane tickets or incidentals. Either some fundies are really dipping into their savings or the Vision Forum crowd has some people with some extra cash lying around.

I missed the private yacht part. But still, why pay all that money when you could fly to Greece and join a tour for half the price? And get more knowledgeable guides to boot. It just seems like a colossal waste of money. I can't believe he gets enough people to go to make it worth the cost. In the quiverfull, fundie subset, most people are somewhere between living paycheck to paycheck and dirt poor. Even the Duggars, in all their TLC glory, could barely afford to send someone on this trip. I just think it's a big rip off and Dougie's way of filching money to pay for a big vacation for himself and his family. Who would want to contribute to that?

[twin2]

I just think it's a big rip off and Dougie's way of filching money to pay for a big vacation for himself and his family. Who would want to contribute to that?

125 good Christian dumb assess. Followed by a 1000 or so good Christian dumb assess that will buy the DVD of the trip from Dougie for the low low price of $19.99 +tax+s/h.

Have you no shame Dougie? Of course not, you are a tool!

[mockingbird]

I went on a trip to Italy with my church when I was in high school. It was $2000/person plus airfare and we went to 7? cities over 10 days. We weren't staying in luxury hotels but that was everything included, tour bus and guide, hotels, food, fees to get into certain attractions, etc. I can't see Greece being that much more expensive, even though this was 7 years ago.

[Izzybee]

I'm not familiar with the Tool, but is there a history of filling up tours like this? I mean, does he have a solid base of Fundies with that much spare cash?

[kaetrin]

They couldn't get an actual New Testament or Early Christian scholar involved? Just the same two "historians" who "teach" every tour Doug gives? He claims MR. Potter can teach "all of world history" (!) and REV. Morecraft specializes in the Reformation.

And add me to the chorus of people who find this "denied" PhD extremely suspicious. Granted, I'm at a fairly conservative Catholic school, not a "liberal marxist" one, but I've never heard of someone getting denied a PhD at that level (if, as the story implies, he actually wrote the thing). I've known people who had trouble getting their initial dissertation proposals passed, for various reasons, but they re-wrote them until they got approved. As Jenny_islander said, even the personally religious historians I know are aware that "God did it" is not a historical argument and wouldn't expect such an argument to make it past any sort of faculty scrutiny. There are lots of stages in the process, and a lot of supervision by a wide range of people. If they think you can't cut it, you get gently encouraged to stop at the MA level (or you don't get any more funding :-) ).

[wtylcf]

Twin2, bless your heart for posting about this - I've been wanting to snark on it since I saw it on the VF website a few days ago. I think Doug wrote something about the trip following Paul's footsteps, which sounds pretty boring. The could be reading up on the ancient Greek tradition of pederasty, trying to understand "active" vs "passive" sexuality, which didn't bother with discriminating based on gender.

"It should be added that for Plato, the only type of real love is the love between two men, and he has dedicated two of his dialogues to that subject: the Symposium and the Phaedrus. After all, homo-erotic love is related to education and gaining knowledge, and this makes it superior to other types of love." (from http://www.livius.org/ho-hz/homosexuali ... ality.html)

Or they could be reading the beautiful, emotional poetry fragments of Sappho, which, yes, do seem to describe lesbian love.

[Dev83]

We did Ireland and England last spring for 5000 total for 2 people. And that included a hefty pub budget! Plus we actually experienced the culture...

[yewchapel]

I can't get over them going to Mykonos :lol: What's next, going back to London and checking out Heaven and G.A.Y.?

[YPestis]

The denied PhD thing is fishy. The process is 4-6 years long, and you are supervised and aided by the faculty. If you fail to successfully defend your dissertation, you get to do re-writes and try again. If this guy was denied, he pretty have had to quit, or he was asked to leave early on due to deep conflicts. I don't believe that he was some top light candidate whose career was squashed by those "Marxist" professors. If his scholarship was so awesome, they would have accepted it in some form.

[samurai_sarah]

I can't get over them going to Mykonos :lol: What's next, going back to London and checking out Heaven and G.A.Y.?

Regency/Napoleonic wars dress-up in Brighton? (While the ladies drink tea, Doug and the interns can engage in some swordplay? ) :D

[kaetrin]

The denied PhD thing is fishy. The process is 4-6 years long, and you are supervised and aided by the faculty. If you fail to successfully defend your dissertation, you get to do re-writes and try again. If this guy was denied, he pretty have had to quit, or he was asked to leave early on due to deep conflicts. I don't believe that he was some top light candidate whose career was squashed by those "Marxist" professors. If his scholarship was so awesome, they would have accepted it in some form.

What I was trying to say, but better. :-)