Young conversions

[Curly Girl]

It seems to me that the "saved" then baptized experience is all bout me/I. I am sinful. I apologize. I ask to be in a relationship with Jesus.

The infant baptism is more about God then I. God extends grace and forgiveness as a gift. God offers the first hand in the relationship.

This is very true, and one of my biggest frustrations with the evangelical movement. Not everything is about the individual....

[SoybeanQueen]

I find this really weird. People claiming to have become Christians when they were four, five, six or even three years old

I don't buy it. I would be really uncomfortable with any of my kids making that choice before the age of 10, and even then it would depend on the kid. I would want my kids to be able to express why they want to be a Christian and what it means, in their own words, first. I would really prefer that they wait until they're old enough to have a better grasp of what it means to struggle with sin (or even what sin is) and to put faith in something or someone.

Above all, if my kids grow up to be involved in any faith, I want it to be fully their decision, made consciously, and not just because someone told them it was the right thing to do. It is impossible to say that about a 3 year old.

[slickcat79]

Seems like a common southern baptist thing. My cousin posted this on FB a few weeks ago, along with the comment that her 8yo brother led her in the sinner's prayer so that she was saved...at the age of 6 :roll: I'm 27, went to church throughout my childhood and adolescence, and I have no idea what the sinner's prayer says. And of course they have the corresponding Precious Moments bible with Gold! Star! for being saved. Clearly not looking for parental validation AT ALL...

[celestial]

Seems like a common southern baptist thing. My cousin posted this on FB a few weeks ago, along with the comment that her 8yo brother led her in the sinner's prayer so that she was saved...at the age of 6 :roll: I'm 27, went to church throughout my childhood and adolescence, and I have no idea what the sinner's prayer says. And of course they have the corresponding Precious Moments bible with Gold! Star! for being saved. Clearly not looking for parental validation AT ALL...

:shock: I'm sorry, I'm sure that's normal for some people, but my reaction is just, what the fuck?? It just screams of brainwashing to me.

[ADoyle90815]

This is the way my church did it too. Thats part of the reason I never encountered being "saved" until I was an adult. The other part was being surrounded by mormons.

That's the way it was for me, although it was more to appease my Irish Catholic grandparents than anything. Other than baptism, my brother and I were never confirmed, but his baptism in the hospital when he almost died at a month old was enough for him to have a full Catholic wedding. My niece was also baptized, but technically she is still being raised in the Christian community as she goes to a different church with my SIL.

[No Cure for Stupid]

I was baptized at ten. Only people who were baptized got communion, and I wanted a snack at chuch. That's it.

I don't see how people as young as four or five are capable of making a decision that they want to "devote their lives to Christ." I guess that when you spend your life being forcefed about God and Jesus being your only salvation, you're more willing to make decisions supporting religion whether you understand them or not.

That's one of the things that bugs me about fundamentalism. There's no free will, which is something that is talked about freely in the Bible.

[nolongerIFBx]

"Saved" and "born again" are both terms found in the Bible which is why many believe that some sort of conversion experience is necessary. We've had this concersation a few times so this is mostly copied and pasted from the Yuku board:

Just to answer the question not start a debate- this does depend on your definition of Christian. Some believe that you are a Christian if you are not Atheist, Buddhist, Muslim, etc. Some believe you are a Christian if you regularly attend a Christian church. Some believe you are a Christian if you are "saved". Some believe you are a Christian if you live your life by Christian teaching and do good (works). Some believe in a combination of one or more of these.

I don't want to offend so don't read any further unless you want to read what I personally believe.

How I was raised (medium fundie) and what I still believe (more fundie-lite) is that a person must be born again or "saved". Nicodemus came to Jesus and asked him about being "born again".

John 3: 1-7 "Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. 2 This man came to Jesus [1] by night and said to him, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do unless God is with him.†3 Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again [2] he cannot see the kingdom of God.†4 Nicodemus said to him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?†5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. [3] 7 Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You [4] must be born again.’"

I believe that we are born already condemned (John 3:18 "whoever does not believe is condemned already") because I sin as a result of being a descendant of Adam (Romans 5:12- "Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned" the passage goes on to explain that this man was Adam). Because of my sin, I am condemned, and I need a Savior and I believe that is Jesus (John 3:17- "For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him."). I believe that to be "saved" one must accept that the gospel is what will save them (1 Corinthians 15:1-4- "Now I would remind you, brothers, [1] of the gospel . . . 2 . . . by which you are being saved. . .For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures").

Many people believe that you accept Christ by praying. I believe that can lead to thinking that there is some "magic prayer" and no matter what you think or believe as long as you say that prayer, you're good to go. I believe that it is your faith in the gospel that saves you. However, I see the point that prayer is talking to God and that praying to Him to tell Him that you believe the gospel is a sort of "confessing with the mouth and believing in the heart" as mentioned in Romans 10:13- "For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. " I don't believe there are any special words you must pray.

While I very much believe that once a person is saved they will express their belief in Christ through good works, I do not believe that they are a part of being saved (Ephesians 2:8-9- "8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast."). I do believe than many fundementalists think that the things they do are good works. Much as I love to snark on them, I also feel sorrow that they think that is how a Christian should act. But that's off topic.

If you read all this, I say again I am not trying to offend just answer the question as to "getting saved".

As to children getting saved, I remember the day that I got saved. I stole my brother's Easter candy. Of course I knew that it was wrong, but it was the first time that it clicked for me that I, me personally, was a sinner. It is at that point that I became accountable for my sin (age of accountability). I don't believe it is a certain age because people mature at all different ages (and some never do in the case of infant death, mental handicap, etc.) and will come to this realization at different ages. I made the choice that day to accept the gospel. I probably prayed. I don't remember. I do remember knowing I was a sinner and believing the gospel.

That said, I am not God. I have read the Bible through many, many times and this is what I believe it says. When I get to heaven, though, I won't be at all offended if God lets everyone in. And if there is no heaven, no God, I still believe that trying to live my life following Christ's example will not have done me any harm.