Sikh Temple Mass Shootings/Hostage Taking

[maybeizfundie]

I wondered right away if he had mistaken them for Muslim. I agree that very few people understand that there's a difference, or care. In my parents small town, a Sikh man basically caused a traffic jam just walking down the street. Everybody slowed waaaaaaay down to goggle at the brown man in the turban. I was so ticked and felt so bad for him when I finally got far enough up to see what people were slowing down to see.

It would still have been horrific if they were Muslim, but if that was his motivation, it just adds a whole extra level of stupidity to the already extreme level of hate. :(

So sad. :(

[Visionoyahweh]

One of the survivors said he had a 9/11 tattoo. :(

ETA: Oh god Raine, I'm so sorry.

[latraviata]

You know, you're quite a bitch who puts words into other people's mouths.

The only reason the firebombing of the Jewish temple was not as horrible was that it wasn't done when people were not there so people didn't die. It still was a horrible, horrible thing.

YOU DON"T KILL OR HARM BECAUSE SOMEBODY BELIEVES DIFFERENTLY THAN YOU DO.

ETA- and if you'd read. He didn't throw a bomb. He walked in and started shooting. Then shot at two police officers who were trying to stop him.

That is exactly my point, I wholeheartedly agree.

Ok he started shooting, horrible and my point is no matter at what people he aimed his guns, bombs or whatever, it is sick and horrible why does that make me a bitch?

[latraviata]

I wondered right away if he had mistaken them for Muslim. I agree that very few people understand that there's a difference, or care. In my parents small town, a Sikh man basically caused a traffic jam just walking down the street. Everybody slowed waaaaaaay down to goggle at the brown man in the turban. I was so ticked and felt so bad for him when I finally got far enough up to see what people were slowing down to see.

It would still have been horrific if they were Muslim, but if that was his motivation, it just adds a whole extra level of stupidity to the already extreme level of hate. :(

So sad. :(

That is exactly what I mean.

[WokChop]

Pretty sure it was because he thought they were Muslims. I used to know the shooter. :(

He is/was a neo-nazi skinhead and has played in a bunch of white power bands. He had been in the Army before that and was very anti-Muslim.

I'm still wondering what would make him do this though because he used to be pretty laid back and wasn't one of the people I'd expect to be very violent, but they may have changed in the last 10 years or so.

How on Earth did you run into someone like him? :o

[Maggie Mae]

This was posted as a comment on an article I was reading. I know nothing about the infowars.com site, but it looks like crazy conspiracy theory nonsense. It makes me sad that people believe this crap.

http://www.infowars.com/eyewitness-4-ma ... -shooting/

[latraviata]

How on Earth did you run into someone like him? :o

Very often the most terrible people look frighteningly normal.

[Kaylee]

How on Earth did you run into someone like him? :o

We ran in the same circles. I was a "White Nationalist" for years, and a neo-nazi skinhead for most of that time. I knew the guys in several of the bands he's been with and had gone to a lot of their shows. We never really hung out outside of events, but he still didn't strike me as the type to do that sort of thing.

I'm almost to the point where it doesn't surprise me anymore. In the past couple years, just in people I'd known through the movement, one guy went nuts and killed his family and himself, one was killed by his own son, one who was found in South America and turned out to be a mass murderer there (I had a lot of suspicions against this guy from the day I met him, but being a killer was not one of them), one killed his own mother, two were found dead in their own homes, one was attacked by a rival group and had his eyes gouged out, and more people than I can count (at least 20 or 30) are in jail or prison for various things.

I'm just so glad we got out of things and broke off ties with most of those people when we did, because I have no doubt I'd have gotten involved with a certain group and been caught in one of the last mass arrests I heard about if I'd still believed in it and and stayed a part of things.

[WokChop]

We ran in the same circles. I was a "White Nationalist" for years, and a neo-nazi skinhead for most of that time.

Okay, that answers my question. From what I've read about the guy, he didn't sound like he ran in any normal, mainstream circles and a neighbor described him as "unfriendly". It seems like his whole life was devoted to his hateful ideology.

[Sunnichick31]

The senseless violence that is going on is seriously depressing me. :( I hope that the families affected are able to heal/grieve in peace without the media trying to get statements and stories and this and that. There are a lot of Sikhs in my neighborhood and every time I see one, I just want to go up and give them a hug after what happened yesterday.

Now a mosque in Missouri has been attacked too. I really hope that there are no other acts of racism commited after this.

usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/06/13146671-mosque-in-missouri-burns-to-the-ground-one-month-after-arson-attack?lite

[gustava]

He was also being tracked by SPLC. I'm increasing my donation this year.

[mpheels]

The more I read about this guy, the less convinced I am that he intended to attack Muslims, and didn't know the difference. Military training + long term participation in racist organizations means he likely knew very well that they is a difference between Muslims and Sikhs, but just didn't care because he hated them all equally. He was after any "other." I can't shake the sick feeling that he planned a much larger massacre involving multiple minority groups...

Ugh. There is a commenter on my local news site who wants to know how we are supposed to tell the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim. As in, can we blame people for "accidentally" attacking the wrong group when "they all look the same? It shouldn't matter if you can properly identify religion based on physical appearance because no one should be physically attacking anyone else, for religious reasons or otherwise. I really do need to stop reading the comments on news sites.

[CanadianHippie]

Very often the most terrible people look frighteningly normal.

Surprised your in this thread since we are talking about persecution of Muslims and you seem to think they are the ones doing all the persecuting...

[WokChop]

The more I read about this guy, the less convinced I am that he intended to attack Muslims, and didn't know the difference. Military training + long term participation in racist organizations means he likely knew very well that they is a difference between Muslims and Sikhs, but just didn't care because he hated them all equally. He was after any "other." I can't shake the sick feeling that he planned a much larger massacre involving multiple minority groups...

Ugh. There is a commenter on my local news site who wants to know how we are supposed to tell the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim. As in, can we blame people for "accidentally" attacking the wrong group when "they all look the same? It shouldn't matter if you can properly identify religion based on physical appearance because no one should be physically attacking anyone else, for religious reasons or otherwise. I really do need to stop reading the comments on news sites.

I totally agree with everything you've said. And, yes, you should probably avoid comment sections if you want to maintain some level of sanity. I am always compelled "just to peek" and usually about five comments in, wonder why the hell I did that!

[latraviata]

Ugh. There is a commenter on my local news site who wants to know how we are supposed to tell the difference between a Sikh and a Muslim. As in, can we blame people for "accidentally" attacking the wrong group when "they all look the same?

The stupidity, that was exactly my point. Without the intention to put words in somebody's mouth

[0KidsAndHappy]

There is a "person of interest" who showed up on the scene and filmed what was going on. He also had a 9/11 tattoo. Police are currently looking for him.

[latraviata]

There is a "person of interest" who showed up on the scene and filmed what was going on. He also had a 9/11 tattoo. Police are currently looking for him.

This was in the Dutch news:

http://splcenter.org/get-informed/news/ ... nhead-band

[Black Aliss]

Wasn't there a Sikh gas station owner, or maybe he was just pumping his own gas, in Phoenix after 9/11 who was killed, specifically because he was a "towel head" (the words the killer used).

Yes, and a Sikh cab driver in our community was pulled from his car and beaten to a pulp after 9/11.

[0KidsAndHappy]

This was in the Dutch news:

http://splcenter.org/get-informed/news/ ... nhead-band

Yep, before the news even started releasing photos of the guy, I found his band's page on MySpace full of Swastikas and other typical white supremacist filth.

There were Homeland Security warnings a few years back about white supremacists joining the military in order to gain training to use in home grown terror plots. So many on the right shrugged it off as a liberal conspiracy.

[latraviata]

Yep, before the news even started releasing photos of the guy, I found his band's page on MySpace full of Swastikas and other typical white supremacist filth.

There were Homeland Security warnings a few years back about white supremacists joining the military in order to gain training to use in home grown terror plots. So many on the right shrugged it off as a liberal conspiracy.

Conspiracies are the pet topics of the extremists, scary....

[deelaem]

And along the same vein...

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/08/second_fire_in_five_weeks_burns_missouri_mosque.php?m=1

[CanadianHippie]

Conspiracies are the pet topics of the extremists, scary....

So are generalizations.

[latraviata]

And along the same vein...

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/08/second_fire_in_five_weeks_burns_missouri_mosque.php?m=1

Very sad, violence committed by any group, religion or whatever is absolutely reprehensible

After the murder of Theo van Gogh by Mohammed Bouyeri some idiots tried to set a mosque on fire. Fortunately the mosque was vacant and the fire was extinguished before it could have caused any damage.

Completely pointless, stupid and it doesn't serve any purpose.

[Maggie Mae]

Very sad, violence committed by any group, religion or whatever is absolutely reprehensible

After the murder of Theo van Gogh by Mohammed Bouyeri some idiots tried to set a mosque on fire. Fortunately the mosque was vacant and the fire was extinguished before it could have caused any damage.

Completely pointless, stupid and it doesn't serve any purpose.

And yet who is being persecuted? The chicken-eaters.

[latraviata]

And yet who is being persecuted? The chicken-eaters.

I have no idea what you mean.