Something has been bugging about the christian fundies

[alysee]

More than usual. They say they aren't bound to old testament rules, but then they make the girls wear skirts...what's the deal with that?

[Sunnichick31]

Because they're hypocrites. They don't follow the old testament...but pants are sinful. They don't follow the OT...but gays are evil. They don't follow the OT... but they are fruitful and multiply.

[Glass Cowcatcher]

More than usual. They say they aren't bound to old testament rules, but then they make the girls wear skirts...what's the deal with that?

Isn't there something in the NT that women shouldn't dress like men? Paul I think?

Not that that means much anyway, since fashions change dramatically over time, including what is "proper" for either gender to wear. There's pictures of Teddy Roosevelt wearing a dress as a little boy, for instance, that was totally normal at the time.

[Kaylee]

Isn't there something in the NT that women shouldn't dress like men? Paul I think?

Not really. There's a verse that talks about modest apparel (more about wealth and propriety though) and the Greek word referring to women's garment's can be taken to mean long & flowing, which some interpret to mean dresses.

BUT, if you ask a dresses-only person for scripture, they'll almost always quote the OT instead of the NT because it's the only place that says anything about dressing as the other gender.

Some people still don't get the difference between personal preference and Biblical Commandment. If you prefer dresses - great, so do I, but don't claim that wearing pants is somehow a salvation issue.

[Snickerdoodle]

Some people still don't get the difference between personal preference and Biblical Commandment. If you prefer dresses - great, so do I, but don't claim that wearing pants is somehow a salvation issue.

This. Pretty much the definition of legalism - doing something that allegedly makes you more holy in God's eyes. It's not the real gospel. The concept of Christian liberty is scary to fundies.

[doggie]

the whole the earth is 6k years old scientists are all wrong and then using those items that those very scientists made possible.

[alysee]

This. Pretty much the definition of legalism - doing something that allegedly makes you more holy in God's eyes. It's not the real gospel. The concept of Christian liberty is scary to fundies.

I really wish we had a LIKE button! This was exactly what I was getting at but couldn't word it! Thanks!

[anniebgood]

I must be going to the bowels of hell tomorrow because I'm wearing nice dress pants and a very pretty top to church.

Our pastors wife has a congenital defect that makes one leg shorter than the other. She never has worn a dress as long as I have known her. Most of the old ladies at church wear slacks too. We're just heathen Lutherans though.

[gustava]

All the pictures of Jebus show him in a long dress. And long hair. And sandals.

[ElphabaGalinda]

More than usual. They say they aren't bound to old testament rules, but then they make the girls wear skirts...what's the deal with that?

Because they follow the OT when they feel like it. I feel like they think following random OT rules will make them appear more holy. Some of them argue that dresses/skirts are more modest, but I think they can be less modest. I tried explaining this fundie rule to my girlfriend, and she asked, 'but if you're thinking about sex all the time, don't skirts allow for easier access?' I was wearing a skirt at the time so I thought it was funny, but it's also true.

[Glass Cowcatcher]

Not really. There's a verse that talks about modest apparel (more about wealth and propriety though) and the Greek word referring to women's garment's can be taken to mean long & flowing, which some interpret to mean dresses.

BUT, if you ask a dresses-only person for scripture, they'll almost always quote the OT instead of the NT because it's the only place that says anything about dressing as the other gender.

Some people still don't get the difference between personal preference and Biblical Commandment. If you prefer dresses - great, so do I, but don't claim that wearing pants is somehow a salvation issue.

I could have sworn that was in one of the Gospels, too. I haven't read the Bible in years though and I don't even own one right now.

I think it's interesting/silly how fundy types don't seem to realize that even if a women is wearing pants, there's a world of difference between men's and women's styles.

[chiccy]

I hate hate hate Christian fundies' theologically inane co-opting of Old Testament rules, but I must say I don't think the skirts thing is necessarily that. I think they're trying to set themselves apart, show how conservative and old-fashioned they are, and insist on a high standard of so-called "femininity" (long hair fits in here too). It's not necessarily about Mosaic law.

After all, the dress-like-the-other-gender thing is really flexible by rabbinical standards; not all Orthodox Jewish women wear skirts. Also, when they do, it's considered a subset of the modesty laws (tznius about not separating the legs), not part of the don't-dress-like-the-other-gender rule.

[Glass Cowcatcher]

I hate hate hate Christian fundies' theologically inane co-opting of Old Testament rules, but I must say I don't think the skirts thing is necessarily that. I think they're trying to set themselves apart, show how conservative and old-fashioned they are, and insist on a high standard of so-called "femininity" (long hair fits in here too). It's not necessarily about Mosaic law.

/quote]

I think so too, plus I would add it's about specifically quashing femininity. I think that's why the denim skirts and frumpers have become a "uniform." Islamic ladies(in this country), by contrast, seem to have much more freedom to adopt current styles and don't seem to downplay their natural beauty.

[chiccy]

I think so too, plus I would add it's about specifically quashing femininity. I think that's why the denim skirts and frumpers have become a "uniform." Islamic ladies(in this country), by contrast, seem to have much more freedom to adopt current styles and don't seem to downplay their natural beauty.

Maybe you mean quashing sexuality/self-expression? Because I think they think the skirts are allll about "femininity"...

[Cannelle]

Because they follow the OT when they feel like it. I feel like they think following random OT rules will make them appear more holy. Some of them argue that dresses/skirts are more modest, but I think they can be less modest. I tried explaining this fundie rule to my girlfriend, and she asked, 'but if you're thinking about sex all the time, don't skirts allow for easier access?' I was wearing a skirt at the time so I thought it was funny, but it's also true.

It IS true. I wear a lot of long skirts when it's warm out (I like them, they look good on me, and they're cool. I have ridiculously long legs, and most shorts are VERY short on me, so I don't like wearing them to school). The other day, I was walking into school and it was breezy, and I had to clutch at my ankle-length skirt the entire walk from the parking lot to my class, because the wind kept threatening to send my skirt up right over my head. How on earth is that more modest than pants? Sure, the outline of my body would show if I were wearing pants, but my ENTIRE LOWER BODY was in danger of being seen for a good five minute walk. :lol:

[Bookworm89]

More than usual. They say they aren't bound to old testament rules, but then they make the girls wear skirts...what's the deal with that?

Well according to my fundy sister, they aren't bound by the old testament which is why they choose to follow certain things....

Still doesn't make sense to me, but I just roll my eye behind her back and smile and nod when she starts in on her rants. Safer that way instead of trying ot argue with her.

[chiccy]

Well according to my fundy sister, they aren't bound by the old testament which is why they choose to follow certain things....

Right--"We don't keep the Law in spite of being Saved; we keep it because we are Saved" (or because of Grace or something like that). :roll:

[DistantStar]

So they say they aren't bound by OT laws; instead they made up a shitload of their own to follow because they just gotta have rules. You'd think they might realize it's the same damn thing!

The hell with skirts, I wear jeans to church, except tonight, when I didn't have time to go home after work to change. I have to wear choir robes anyway so really I could wear nothing under there and nobody would know as long as I went into the bathroom to change!

[DarkAnts]

Well according to my fundy sister, they aren't bound by the old testament which is why they choose to follow certain things....

Still doesn't make sense to me, but I just roll my eye behind her back and smile and nod when she starts in on her rants. Safer that way instead of trying ot argue with her.

Perhaps its time to send her a copy of Matthew 23. Jesus hates hypocrites. I am sure that if he were here, he would call out many of the fundis including the Duggars as hypocrites. Better yet, send her a whole bible with all passages about the evil Pharisess highlighted. Pay particular attention to the time Jesus channeled Chuck Norris at the temple.

[ElphabaGalinda]

Right--"We don't keep the Law in spite of being Saved; we keep it because we are Saved" (or because of Grace or something like that). :roll:

And of course they only keep the laws that appeal to them. Why choose to follow certain laws and not others? I guess whichever ones are easiest for them are automatically deemed hollier. Can't go giving up the tasty shrimp or bacon, even if that's just as much a law. And they don't realize how ridiculous this sounds even if it's pointed out to them. :roll: Sure everyone picks adn chooses when it comes to religion, but they don't even have good pretend reasons for those choices.

[Witsec5]

Long skirts: Set you apart from all the others, if elastic--are easier to wear if your weight is always going up and down (example constant pregnancies), and allow for easy access when the menfolk return home.

[chiccy]

And of course they only keep the laws that appeal to them. Why choose to follow certain laws and not others? I guess whichever ones are easiest for them are automatically deemed hollier. Can't go giving up the tasty shrimp or bacon, even if that's just as much a law. And they don't realize how ridiculous this sounds even if it's pointed out to them. :roll: Sure everyone picks adn chooses when it comes to religion, but they don't even have good pretend reasons for those choices.

I think there are a fair amount of Christian fundie families that abstain from pork. I think it's a Gothard thing, for one (someone correct me if I'm wrong about that). Also, the full-on "fake Jews" of course abstain from pork. The fake Jews actually do a pretty good job of following most of the karaite laws; the reason they still live very differently from mainstream Orthodox Jews is that they don't follow the rabbinical laws--in addition to only knowing as much about Judaism as they can pick up from the Bible itself.

People like the Duggars, who follow some random laws (no talebearing, no pork...) but not others, are the ones who really get to me. Their problem is that they are theologically clueless. They think that "if it's in the Bible, it's legit," and so whenever they run into an Old Testament law, it seems like they jump and follow it, not realizing that it doesn't apply to gentiles, let alone Christians.

[bananacat]

Fundies make girls and women wear skirts, and unfashionable ones at that, to make them stand out and make it much harder for them to fit into society. It forces them to stick with their group and discourages them from doing things outside the group or doing mainstream things. It's a way to label them and isolate them while telling them that it's a badge of honor.

If they really cared about not wearing different-gender clothing, then why would both boys and girls wear nearly identical polo shirts on top? A white polo could be worn by anyone. They just use it as an excuse to keep women isolated. The men and boys get to look pretty much mainstream. Sure, they don't wear skinny jeans or hipster glasses, but if you saw a fundie man walking through a store you wouldn't even notice him.