Training Fleshy Flesh

[debrand]

I worry that new people to this site might not understand why so many of us are disgusted by the Pearls. So, I decided to dig up some of their articles.

http://nogreaterjoy.org/articles/traini ... ys-the-rod

This is a magazine so I am not breaking the link. I am including a variety of quotes from the article without much comment. There really isn't much to add. The Pearls' words speak for them.

not to touch guns by placing an unloaded and broken gun in the living room where the children could reach it.We carefully watched them. If they touched it, we spanked their hand with a little switch. One to three switchings was sufficient to prevent the little crawlers and toddlers from ever touching a gun.

and

One home is full of nagging, gripping, criticism, constant rebuke and threat with many spankings, and “go to your rooms.†The other home is continuously cheerful and ordered because the parents have trained, occasionally using the switch in the training sessions, and have been consistent to demand complete and uninterrupted obedience

and

When they become teenagers they finally find someone who understands them. The rock musicians rapping our cynicism, rebellion, and hate express their feelings. Friends who gather in the dark and indulge the flesh become their family. Parents are square, out of touch. It’s reaping day, parent. And he went from such a nice little boy who was “hyper active†to human trash in just ten years. It happened on your watch. Proper training behind a smile would have prevented this.

For those of you who don't know about the Pearls, they use a lot of scare tactics to convince parents to follow their methods

The rod plays its part in removing the guilt. Parents are running a mini divine kingdom, sanctifying their children. I get many letters from parents telling of how their miserable, whiney, stubborn child suddenly became happy and began to enjoy everything with a smile after just three days of force obedience and discipline.

[fluttershies]

I worry that new people to this site might not understand why so many of us are disgusted by the Pearls. So, I decided to dig up some of their articles.

http://nogreaterjoy.org/articles/traini ... ys-the-rod

This is a magazine so I am not breaking the link. I am including a variety of quotes from the article without much comment. There really isn't much to add. The Pearls' words speak for them.

and

and

For those of you who don't know about the Pearls, they use a lot of scare tactics to convince parents to follow their methods

So awful. Forced obedience isn't true obedience, it's like torturing someone for information. Actually torture is exactly what the Pearls' methods sound like.

[debrand]

When they become teenagers they finally find someone who understands them. The rock musicians rapping our cynicism, rebellion, and hate express their feelings. Friends who gather in the dark and indulge the flesh become their family. Parents are square, out of touch. It’s reaping day, parent. And he went from such a nice little boy who was “hyper active†to human trash in just ten years. It happened on your watch. Proper training behind a smile would have prevented this.

He is calling teens who listen to rap music and indulge the flesh(have sex?) human trash. I would leave the word, trash for people who encourage others to beat children until they die. Or who teach parents how to hide their abuse from authorities.

[luckylibrarian]

Thank you for posting this, debrand. Shit like that is why this forum exists.

[MollySee]

Holy SHIT. That is insane.

[mrs]

I have problems with parents sleep training...reading about the Plears makes me sick.

[finleeport]

THIS....is an advocate for Child abuse mixed with Sadomasochism :shock:

(I always pictured the Pearls as sadomasochists)

[debrand]

THIS....is an advocate for Child abuse mixed with Sadomasochism :shock:

(I always pictured the Pearls as sadomasochists)

I agree.

The Pearls methods are evil.

[chiccy]

He is calling teens who listen to rap music and indulge the flesh(have sex?) human trash. I would leave the word, trash for people who encourage others to beat children until they die. Or who teach parents how to hide their abuse from authorities.

The "human trash" thing really got to me. How is that even a Christian attitude? What happened to "love the sinner" etc.? Not to mention that it's just a repulsive thing to say about another human, whether you call yourself a Christian or not...

[EmmieJ]

And he went from such a nice little boy who was “hyper active†to human trash in just ten years. It happened on your watch

This exposes the real lack of true parental love the Pearls have for children, their own or anyone else's I would never consider my teenager "human trash" even if he went into full rebellion mode, listened to music I absolutely hated, and spoke only in monosyllabic grunts. He is and will always be my child, the one I love more than any other human. The mindset that could see their own flesh and blood as human trash -- or see any human as "trash" -- is about the furthest thing from Christ-like as you can get. In other words, the Pearls are of the devil, if you will.

[Jezebel]

The "human trash" thing really got to me. How is that even a Christian attitude? What happened to "love the sinner" etc.? Not to mention that it's just a repulsive thing to say about another human, whether you call yourself a Christian or not...

I'm trying to imagine Jesus calling anyone "human trash," and, of course, failing.

But then again, The Pearls' ideas and methods have absolutely nothing to do with being followers of Christ, and everything to do with their own deeply internalized fear, shame, and self-hatred, which they project onto others--especially helpless children.

I don't use the word "evil" lightly, but the Pearls? EVIL.

[Cheesemaker]

I can't take anyone who uses the phrase "human trash" seriously, ever. The Pearl method is abuse.

[slickcat79]

THIS....is an advocate for Child abuse mixed with Sadomasochism :shock:

(I always pictured the Pearls as sadomasochists)

You're not the only one. This guy points out how much one of Pearl's articles reads like a rape fantasy:

7-iPgW2s3CU

[reds]

I just saw my son in that little girl in the story/video.

I have never heard of the pearls before this website but my god, if someone was babysitting my kid and hit him like that.. police would be involved.

[treemom]

We need to dig up the posts about plumbing line and the children who died at the hands of their "parents" who were following the pearls.

[breadprincess]

The rock musicians rapping our cynicism, rebellion, and hate express their feelings. Friends who gather in the dark and indulge the flesh become their family.

Rock musicians rapping? Are the Pearl's afraid that unwhipped children will become Limp Bizkit fans?

I'm a new member, and I would really appreciate if someone posted the links, Treemom. I've only been able to get through about half of the forum so far.

[treemom]

Here is a start. Thoughtful posted a lot about the ac episode wit the pearls and other discussion

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=5352&hilit=Lydia+schatZ

Nyt article and discussion

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4629&hilit=Lydia+schatZ

Another ac episode and we discus Lydia and Hanna's death

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4343&hilit=Lydia+schatZ

Hanna's parents are charged

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=3517&hilit=Hanna+Williams

[thoughtful]

Holy SHIT. That is insane.

Those were actually pretty mild, for the Pearls.

From To Train Up a Child, on applying pain (and this is by no means all of it):

TRAINING NOT TO TOUCH

There is much satisfaction in training up a child. It is easy and challenging. When my children were able to crawl (in the case of one, roll) around the room, I set up training sessions.

Try it yourself. Place an appealing object where they can reach it. When they spy it and make a dive for it, in a calm voice say, "No, don't touch it." They will already be familiar with the "No," so they will pause, look at you in wonder and then turn around and grab it. Switch their hand once and simultaneously say, "No." Remember, you are not disciplining, you are training.

--OBEDIENCE TRAINING--BITING BABIES

One particularly painful experience of nursing mothers is the biting baby. My wife did not waste time finding a cure. When the baby bit, she pulled hair (an alternative has to be sought for baldheaded babies). Understand, the baby is not being punished, just conditioned.

--- NEVER TOO YOUNG TO TRAIN

The parents who put off training until the child is old enough to discuss issues or receive explanations find their child a terror long before he understands the meaning of the word. A newborn soon needs training. The child needs holding, loving and lots of attention, but the mother often has other duties.

As the mother, holding her child, leans over the crib and begins the swing downward, the infant stiffens, takes a deep breath and bellows. The battle for control has begun in earnest. Someone is going to be conditioned. Either the tender-hearted mother will cave in to this self-centered demand (thus training the child to get his way by crying) or the infant is allowed to cry (learning that crying is counterproductive). Crying because of genuine physical need is simply the infant's only voice to the outside world; but crying in order to manipulate the adults into constant servitude should never be rewarded. Otherwise, you will reinforce the child's growing self-centeredness, which will eventually become socially intolerable.

-- STEPS TO OBEDIENCE

One of our girls who developed mobility early had a fascination with crawling up the stairs. At four months she was too unknowing to be punished for disobedience. But for her own good, we attempted to train her not to climb the stairs by coordinating the voice command of "No" with little spats on the bare legs. The switch was a twelve-inch long, one-eighth-inch diameter sprig from a willow tree.

Such was her fascination with climbing that four or five sessions had not made her stop. The thought of further spankings was disconcerting, so I conceived an alternative. After one more spanking, I laid the switch on the bottom step. We later observed her crawl to the stairs and start the ascent, only to halt at the first step and stare at the switch.

-- We have progressed to the place where a discussion of the use of the rod is in order. Let's talk about spankings--sometimes called "whippings."

This seems to go exactly opposite to the feelings of many parents and educators. The passage clearly states that a failure to apply the rod is due to the parents' hating the child. "No!" cries the mother, "I love my child too much to spank him." The parent who responds thus does not understand: 1) the authority of God's word, 2) the nature of love, 3) his (or her) own feelings, 4) the character of God, or, 5) the needs of the child.

---A spanking (whipping, paddling, switching, belting) is indispensable to the removal of guilt in your child. His very conscience (nature) demands punishment.

--- THE MAGIC WAND

Don't think of the rod as a weapon of defense or a show of force; think of the rod as a "magic wand." The first time parents see its restorative powers they are amazed. Picture a child of any age who is miserable, complaining, a bully to the other kids. When you look at him, all you can see is the inside of a bottom lip. Every device has failed to bring relief. The kid feels that he is living in foreign, occupied territory. He is obviously plotting the day of throwing off the yoke. Bribed, threatened or swatted, he only gets worse. Fail to use the rod on this child, and you are creating a '"Nazi." I still marvel at the power of the little rod. After a short explanation about bad attitudes and the need to love, patiently and calmly apply the rod to his back-side. Somehow, after eight or ten licks, the poison is transformed into gushing love and contentment. The world becomes a beautiful place. A brand new child emerges. It makes an adult stare at the rod in wonder, trying to see what magic is contained therein.

--When the time comes to apply the rod, take a deep breath, relax, and pray, "Lord, make this a valuable learning session. Cleanse my child of ill-temper and rebellion. May I properly represent your cause in this matter." No jerking around. No raised voice. The child should be able to anticipate the coming rod by your utterly calm and controlled spirit.

At this point, in utter panic, he will rush to demonstrate obedience. Never reward delayed obedience by reversing the sentence. And, unless all else fails, don't drag him to the place of cleansing. Part of his training is to come submissively. However, if you are just beginning to institute training on an already rebellious child, who runs from discipline and is too incoherent to listen, then use whatever force is necessary to bring him to bay. If you have to sit on him to spank him then do not hesitate. And hold him there until he is surrendered. Prove that you are bigger, tougher, more patiently enduring and are unmoved by his wailing. Defeat him totally. Accept no conditions for surrender. No compromise. You are to rule over him as a benevolent sovereign. Your word is final.

Otherwise, tell him to bend over on the bed or couch; and while he is in this position give some choice admonition. You have his undivided attention. Slowly begin to spank. If you go too fast, you may not allow time enough for the inner transformation to occur.

Use your own judgment as to what is effective. I found five to ten licks usually sufficient. Sometimes, with older children, usually when the licks are not forceful enough, the child may still be rebellious. If this occurs, take time to instruct and then continue the spanking. A general rule is to continue the disciplinary action until the child is surrendered.

--- Any spanking, to effectively reinforce instruction, must cause pain, but the most pain is on the surface of bare skin where the nerves are located. A surface sting will cause sufficient pain, with no injury or bruising. Select your instrument according to the child's size. For the under one year old, a little, ten- to twelve-inch long, willowy branch (striped of any knots that might break the skin) about one-eighth inch diameter is sufficient. Sometimes alternatives have to be sought. A one-foot ruler, or its equivalent in a paddle, is a sufficient alternative. For the larger child, a belt or larger tree branch is effective.

---If a father is attempting to make a child eat his oats, and the child cries for his mother, then the mother should respond by spanking him for whining for her and for not eating his oats. He will then be glad to be dealing only with the father.

We broke this tendency to selective subjection early. When one of us would be spanking a child and he cried for the other, then the other parent would come over and contribute to the spanking.

------A SWITCH AT NAP TIME SAVES MINE

When your baby is tired and sleepy enough to become irritable, don't reinforce irritability by allowing the cause and effect to continue. Put the little one to sleep. But what of the grouch who would rather complain than sleep? Get tough. Be firm with him. Never put him down and then allow him to get up. If, after putting him down, you remember he just woke up, do not reward his complaining by allowing him to get up. For the sake of consistency in training, you must follow through. He may not be able to sleep, but he can be trained to lie there quietly. He will very quickly come to know that any time he is laid down there is no alternative but to stay put. To get up is to be on the firing line and get switched back down.

---SINKING FEELING

When our children were coming along, we lived in a house with a pond in the immediate yard. As they grew to be toddlers wandering around outside, we always watched them closely. Yet, knowing the possibility of one getting out of sight, we cranked up the training. On a warm spring day I followed the first set of wobbly legs to the inviting water. She played around the edge until she found a way to get down the bank to the water. I stood close by as she bent over reaching into the mirror of shining color. Splash! In she went.

Girl, it was cold. I restrained my anxiety long enough for her to right herself in the water and show some recognition of her inability to breathe. When panic set in (mine as well as hers--not to mention her mother's), I pulled her out and scolded her for getting close to the pond. She didn't swallow any water, and there was no need for resuscitation--except on my wife who took several hours to begin breathing normally. We repeated the same process with all the children. It took only one time for each of them to learn respect for the water. And it got easier on us.

We did have trouble with one of them. She is the one who became mobile early, crawling at four months and walking at seven. She always had marvelous coordination. She just wouldn't fall in. I got weary taking walks to the pond. So, to bring the class to graduation, I pushed. Oh, she didn't know it. As she was balanced over the water, I just nudged her with my foot. To this day, I still believe that if I had left her alone she would have swum out. But, it distressed her enough to make her not want to play around the pond.

--PERSISTENCE

Some have asked, "But what if the child only screams louder, gets madder?" Know that if he is accustomed to getting his unrestricted way, you can expect just such a response. He will just continue to do what he has always done to get his way. It is his purpose to intimidate you and make you feel like a crud pile. Don't be bullied. Give him more of the same. On the bare legs or bottom, switch him eight or ten licks; then, while waiting for the pain to subside, speak calm words of rebuke. If the crying turns to a true, wounded, submissive whimper, you have conquered; he has submitted his will. If the crying is still defiant, protesting and other than a response to pain, spank him again. If this is the first time he has come up against someone tougher than he, it may take a while. He must be convinced that you have truly altered your expectations.

-- -If you stop before he is voluntarily submissive, you have confirmed to him the value and effectiveness of a screaming protest.

--- If they are grouching, discipline them to get control of their self-centeredness. If they are mad, switch them. Don't let your child stay unhappy.

[meow139]

Just the thought of me ever using a switch on any child makes me want to kill myself brutally.

[thoughtful]

Fearmongering, Godwin, and "you're a bad Christian if you don't do this" crap in To Train Up a Child (again, only a small sample):

We must deal with our own impurities for the sake of the child; for if the child doesn't receive this kind of training, he will greatly suffer.

---UNDERSTANDING THE NATURE OF LOVE

You may have strong feelings that prevent you from spanking your child, but it is not love. The God who made little children, and therefore knows what is best for them, has told parents to employ the rod in training up a child. To refrain from doing so, based on a claim of love, is an indictment on God himself. Your actions assume either God does not desire what is best for your child or you know better than He.

---Philosophy of the Rod

THE TEACHING ROD

The growth of a child under the tutorship of the parents is time spent in God's moral workshop being fitted for heavenly citizenship. As the child develops, the parents should accurately recapitulate the moral government of our Holy God. The rod is the parents' main tangible aid to bring the child to understand the judgment of God--and eventually the grace of God.

To the small child, the father and mother are the guardians of all law, the protectors of truth and the dispensers of punishment and reward. The parents are a window through which the child gets his first impressions of the foundation principles of Divine government. If you make rules and do not respect them enough to enforce them, you will be making a statement about law in general. Your responses to transgressions are stage-playing the responses of God. By application of the rod they will understand their accountability to God. Unless all transgression, rebellion and meanness of spirit be treated as God treats sin, the child's world view will be false.

--THE FEAR OF GOD

A child must take seriously the moral law.

---

The proper use of the rod teaches a wholesome fear. Do not fall victim to the modern rewriting of "fear" as "respect."

--

The Scripture makes a distinction between honor, love, and fear

--

Though we don't have "the spirit of fear," we who understand eternity fear to be in opposition to the "Avenger" of all evil. Remember, you are preparing your child for real living in a real world and to face a real God in a real judgment of real accountability to a reward in a real eternity. This is no game; the rewards are great, the loss too horrible for a parent not to make this top priority.

---I DON'T HAVE THE TIME

Now, I know exactly what some of you are thinking. "But, I am pushed to the limit now. I don't have the time to watch and guard against every transgression." If you have duties outside the home that prevent you from properly rearing your children, give them back to the Devil. I mean that, even if they are church activities.

----I had trained them to jump upon command. They did. There may come a time when their safety or survival will depend on instant obedience. "Duck!" or "Hit the deck!" has saved more than one life.

----TRAIN FOR REALITY

The world is sometimes a hostile place. A child must learn early to take precautions. Don't give your child a modified sense of reality. Teach them about heights and falling, about guns, the danger of knives and scissors, the caution of sharp sticks and coat-hanger wires, the terror of fire, and the danger of poisons and electricity. School them. Drill them. Show them examples. Expose them to death--the death of a pet, or an accident victim.

----"Son, you know Hitler and his men had fun when others were suffering. They laughed while boys and girls cried in pain. Do you want to grow up to be like Hitler?" In complete brokenness, he says, "No Daddy, I don't want to be like Hitler

---I have had many parents look despondent and say, "I have waited too long. They are too old to train." It is true that the older a child gets the harder it is to mold them. Yet, no human being ever gets too old to have his actions conditioned--as military boot camp demonstrates. But, only in a controlled environment where the threat of force is real, can one that old be brought to bay. When a child gets old enough to seriously contemplate leaving, the power-discipline will lose its effectiveness.

----Reading back over the text, it seems that I have given a lot of negatives--what not to do, and what is wrong. If I were simply giving instruction for laying out a flower garden, it could all be quite positive; but if a surgeon is instructing student doctors on heart surgery, there will be a lot of negatives. A procedure so invasive requires cautious, narrow limitations with needful warnings. That which is successfully accomplished every day can end in tragedy if done negligently. Child rearing is an invasive procedure. You invade the soul of a developing human being, an eternal living soul. It is not an inconsequential procedure. The whole heavens stand in the waiting room in anticipation of the outcome.

[meow139]

Those were actually pretty mild, for the Pearls.

From To Train Up a Child, on applying pain (and this is by no means all of it):

By the lion... Who the hell pushes their own child in a pond?!

[treemom]

Thoughtful is like our kickass pearls expert. You have a copy of ttuac right?

[thoughtful]

Thoughtful is like our kickass pearls expert. You have a copy of ttuac right?

Aw, thanks! I think there are others here who know more, but I sure am passionate about it.

I am pretty close to being unshockable, but the idea that people actually think this is good for children still boggles my mind.

The whole book (old version -- other than the cover, I don't know if there is anything different about the second edition) used to be available for free online. That site now says this:

http://www.achristianhome.org/to_train_up_a_child.htm

But I did a C&P of it before it disappeared.

[thoughtful]

By the lion... Who the hell pushes their own child in a pond?!

Michael Pearl does -- and he seems to think it's very funny.

But he's such a nice, grandfatherly guy:

[thoughtful]

I wish we had even more evidence that the Duggars are fully invested in the Pearls, Tripp, Lessin, Fugate, or other whip-the-sin-out-'em folks.

I don't think most people believe that one could actually whip children into being able to sit still, smile and seem sweet and compliant. Or, even more bizarre, to have some of them actually convinced that they are happy, and saved from sin by such treatment.

So, they look at the Duggars and some one-big-happy-family fundie bloggers, and just can't imagine that was done with violence.

But, having read the Pearls, I now don't trust the happy-family facade of people like the Duggars. I want others to see it, too.