Scary "Christan" alternative to Girl Scouts

[Terrie]

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/metr ... 78e53.html

So we've talked about the backlash against the Girl Scouts because they are highly inclusive in who the allow as members. This is an article on the alternative group "American Heritage Girls" which formed in 1995, in response to GS-USA allowing substitutions for "God" in their pledge. There's a terrifying quote from one of the moms who has her daughter in the Heritage group:

Shanna Stewart, who home-schools her two daughters in Wentzville, found American Heritage Girls after becoming concerned when she learned the Girl Scouts had invited a lesbian to speak at the national level. "They were encouraging girls to embrace whoever they were; it didn't matter what choices they made, as long as they were true to themselves. That was a concern."

To me, that says everything that's wrong about the groups we talk about here. The idea that you must be forced into a common mold, no matter who you are. We've always talked about it, but seeing it stated so plainly gives me chills.

[MonkeyMomma]

Now, if only we could get a secular, gay-friendly version of the Boy Scouts ....

[shesinsane]

A few weeks ago, there was something going around facebook telling you "what Girl Scout cookies fund."

honestgirlscouts.com/files/1112YouDeserveToKnowWhatGirlScoutCookiesFund.pdf

Its intention was to discourage people from supporting Girl Scouts, but all I saw were people using it as more of a reason to support Girl Scouts of America. :)

**edited because I know the difference between its and it's, I swear!**

[MadameX]

Wait, what is concerning about encouraging girls to be true to themselves?

This reminds me I bought Girl Scout cookies last month. I bet they're arriving soon.

[MamaJunebug]

Thank you, Terrie, srsly, for putting that word in double quotes.

I run with a couple dozen Christians who have no problem with the Girl Scouts' policy of "encouraging girls to embrace whoever they [are]." I wish STLToday had done the same.

Were I associated with the Lutheran congregation mentioned in the article, I would ask TPTB why Scouts there couldn't just keep acknowledging God, even if other troops used "my creator" or something similar.

I'm too young to remember it (srsly!) but decades ago, there was a split in Lutheran circles over whether or not congregations should sponsor Boy Scout troops. Maybe the ones who wanted to leave Scouting to itself were right. Good grief.

ETA, I'm curious now -- do troops have to be associated with, or sponsored by, an organized group? Such that a coterie of five or six parents couldn't get together and sponsor a troop? Seems a tempest in a teapot, but then only one of my Juniors ever got involved in Scouting, and it was pretty much a social thing. I truly don't understand.

[snarkbillie]

Now, if only we could get a secular, gay-friendly version of the Boy Scouts ....

*cough* Campfire *cough*

[MamaJunebug]

*cough* Campfire *cough*

Campfire! What *is* that, anyway? I had a friend who lived, ate and breathed it, but I can't ask her, right now. Is it secular? Does it require formal sponsorship? Gad, I'm glad my kids are grown!

[MonkeyMomma]

*cough* Campfire *cough*

Right after I posted that I looked up Camp Fire! There's one council in my state, but the website is broken. :( When Monkey gets older, we are for sure going that route, even if I have to start a local council. No Boy Scouts until they get off the haterade.

[valsa]

Wait, what is concerning about encouraging girls to be true to themselves?

Because people are, by nature, thieves, liars, murderers, whores, and deseve everlasting torture. If you let little girls be true to themselves, they'll soon be trying to earn badges for "lesbian orgies", "having an abortion", and one for each drug they try.

[SpeakNow]

Because people are, by nature, thieves, liars, murderers, whores, and deseve everlasting torture. If you let little girls be true to themselves, they'll soon be trying to earn badges for "lesbian orgies", "having an abortion", and one for each drug they try.

Oooooo! I want to earn the "I took birth control" badge!!!

[No Fun My Babe]

A few weeks ago, there was something going around facebook telling you "what Girl Scout cookies fund."

honestgirlscouts.com/files/1112YouDeserveToKnowWhatGirlScoutCookiesFund.pdf

It's intention was to discourage people from supporting Girl Scouts, but all I saw were people using it as more of a reason to support Girl Scouts of America. :)

That was a very informative PDF! I pledge to buy at least twice the amount of Girl Scout cookies in the future. Not only are Samoas orgasms in cookie form, but they help fund ebil lesbianism, feminism, atheism, and abortions! Who knew? Now I'll feel even better about each gooey mouthful.

I should write to these people and thank them for opening my eyes. :twisted:

[Islandmom]

Which is exactly why I am a girl scout troop leader and dd is a girl scout. I want her to be proud of who she is no matter who that ends up being, and to embrace others no matter who they are, whether they share her beliefs or not. And our troops all meet at a local church and they are great supporters of it...of course we have 2 ministers, one male and gasp....one FEMALE (oh the horror!!! LOL)

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

I'm a little indifferent to GirlScouts now. I loved it as a kid, but I was a leader for 2 years and it absolutely sucked. No one paid their dues, the two sisters whose dues were supposed to be payed by GS were not, of course all that is par for the course. The two things that really bugged me were selling cookies (if you didn't sell five million boxes you were made to feel like crap), and the other leaders. They pretty much ate, slept, and breathed GirlScouts and they expected everyone else to do the same. It was completely ridiculous. We also had an amazing council head and she was replaced because the numbers for our council weren't increasing enough. It was so business oriented that it just didn't feel right after awhile. (Also, I don't camp.)

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

Forgot to mention, we also went to a Heritage Girl meeting to check it out. Blech. We never went back.

[Austin]

In the 1970's, I was a "Pioneer Girl" at my fundie-lite church. I honestly don't remember much about it, but it was the church's alternative to the ebil GS. Then we got AWANA. Which sucked.

[desertvixen]

I sort of want to go to a Heritage Girl meeting just to see what it's like - but dedicated to GS in this household.

My daycare provider's kids are doing AWANA, and they (kids, not parents) keep inviting my daughter to go to it, but I'm not supporting my kid's involvement in anything that involves a pledge to the Christian Flag...

[IReallyAmHopewell]

My daughrer was in AHG and I was a leader. It varies GREATLY among troops. It began in a Catholic parish and is very heavily "works for salvation" based. Yes, they are riding on the far right backlash against Girl Scouts, but you cannot generalize--we had single parents and many parents who could have cared less on just about any political issue. Other than the "works" thing it made me mad that girls who were Baptised (at least in our troop) got a special patch for their uniform. Otherwise, it's almost exactly the same as boy scouts or girls scouts--just with Bible imposed on it. There are very liberal Churches who host groups and fairly conservative one. I don't imagine they'd ever be conervative enough for Gothard/QF/P families though since pants are allowed gender roles are not pushed.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

Forgot--Ted Haggard's Church used to have "Royal Rangers" and Rangerettes which were more conservative, but still not for ultra right families.

[Katiebug]

The fundie Lutherans in the US (WELS) have the Lutheran Pioneers and the Lutheran Girl Pioneers. Apparently for a while the WELS had forbidden boys to join Boy Scouts but were marginal on Girl Scouts, then just said all scouting aside from their own was verboten. This is because the Scout promises "contain religious elements which imply the Scout can do his duty to God regardless of his religion". The WELS is notorious for not participating in any sort of ecumenical activity because that would imply that they think other denominations are legitimate, and they don't. So in their interpretation, scouting implies that all paths are equal and they feel it's a dangerous view for children to be exposed to.

The LCMS had a flap back in 2001 after an interfaith prayer service that a Missouri Synod pastor participated in, but that was later sorted out. And of course the ELCA doesn't care. :lol: Both LCMS and ELCA kids can participate in scouting.

The WELS are batshit crazy, and I say that as a lifelong Lutheran whose mother was born WELS. They don't allow women to have anything resembling a leadership role in a congregation and that includes not voting at the annual meeting or serving as a lector during worship services (the latter is because reading the Bible from the Lectern is deemed "teaching" and no woman can "teach" men). My mom went to a WELS service with me around 15 years ago for a school project and when we left she was pretty horrified by how things were.

[freejoytoo]

I went to Brownies (which is the UK version of Girl Scouts) but my cousins went to some socialist version of it. I think they were called something like Woodlanders (which is funny seeing as they lived in London and there weren't many woods).

[AudreyE]

I was a Prim/Missionette at my friend's church growing up. I just thought it was fun; I didn't understand that their brand of Christianity leaned toward fundie-lite. I didn't even get that when they told me I couldn't be Missionette-queen (or some other bull shit title) for a week like all the other girls, because I was Methodist.

I was also a Campfire girl, though, and that was quite secular, if, perhaps, a little un-PC with the Indian stuff (but this was the 70s and 80s).

[mirele]

I was a Girl Scout. I liked everything except selling cookies. I'm very shy around strangers and I hated selling cookies. What made it worse was my mom was cookie chairman and we had hundreds of boxes of cookies in our garage. I used to make my sister sell my cookies. She was a natural.

As for Boy Scouts, they've really aligned themselves with the religious right because they hate teh gheys and the ghodless. In the Mormon church in the USA (don't know about anywhere else) Scouting is very much a part of the youth program for boys. (In fact, US Scouting is dominated by Mormons.) In the 1960s/70s, the Mormon church had requirements that for boys to hold certain positions within their Scout troops, they had to be ordained to various positions within the Aaronic priesthood. The problem was that you couldn't be ordained to the priesthood prior to 1978 if you were African-American. There was a lawsuit and voila! the rules were changed. (Amazing how that occurs, no?)

And for Mormon girls? There's nothing equivalent to Scouting. I don't know how many men I've told off over the years over this obvious discrimination.

There's a WELS church down the street from me, and I've been tempted to drop in on a Sunday just to see how whack it is.

[Eoywin]

I am Lutheran - grew up in the Missouri Synod (though currently am ELCA). I grew up hearing how batshit crazy WELS is :lol:

I was a Campfire Girl and I loved it - I'm actually pretty bummed that there is no Campfire in NC (at least the last time I checked).

[darareaksmey]

ETA, I'm curious now -- do troops have to be associated with, or sponsored by, an organized group? Such that a coterie of five or six parents couldn't get together and sponsor a troop? Seems a tempest in a teapot, but then only one of my Juniors ever got involved in Scouting, and it was pretty much a social thing. I truly don't understand.

No, when I was a Daisy leader about 7 years ago, there was no sponsor group. It was basically a group of parents who attended an information meeting held by the local council. We all came hoping to find a troop for our daughters to join. No troop existed in our area, but the lady from the council told us to organize ourselves, to find a place to meet, and to talk a couple of willing moms into being leaders. And thus was born a Daisy troop.

I loved scouting when I was a kid. I went all the way through Cadettes, which was the highest level offered in our area. I learned so much and made friends I wouldn't have known otherwise. I didn't learn one damn thing about sex or birth control, but I did learn how to cook a mean hobo dinner, how to build a latrine and how to sing "John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt."

[snarkbillie]

No, when I was a Daisy leader about 7 years ago, there was no sponsor group. It was basically a group of parents who attended an information meeting held by the local council. We all came hoping to find a troop for our daughters to join. No troop existed in our area, but the lady from the council told us to organize ourselves, to find a place to meet, and to talk a couple of willing moms into being leaders. And thus was born a Daisy troop.

I loved scouting when I was a kid. I went all the way through Cadettes, which was the highest level offered in our area. I learned so much and made friends I wouldn't have known otherwise. I didn't learn one damn thing about sex or birth control, but I did learn how to cook a mean hobo dinner, how to build a latrine and how to sing "John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt."

My daughter is in GS. She recently went to an optional program on a Saturday. They talked about healthy eating, exercise, self esteem, body changes, and respecting your own boundaries/peer pressure. They also talked about what to do if someone is abusing you emotionally, physically, etc. I noticed the curriculum was partially provided by PP. There was nothing mentioned that I had a problem with at all. (age range of the girls was 10-12)