James and Stacy McDonald: Fighting COVID-19

[Ozlsn]

1 hour ago, Letgo said:

Rural areas in my state seem to be safer from Coronavirus now. We have fewer cases than the large cities and no deaths yet. 

From influenza modelling rural areas take longer to peak with cases than urban areas (pretty much because of distance) but then are hit as badly as urban areas, partly due to population demographics (tend to be higher numbers of at-risk people) and less availability of healthcare. I hope that's not the case with coronavirus (not least because my parents and in-laws live in a rural area and fall into the at-risk demographic) but it is worth keeping in mind. (I know I linked to this information somewhere in here before, but no idea where. If I find it again I'll link again.)

Edit: Found it!

"Many other factors will hurt rural voters more than urban ones. For example, the healthcare system has much less capacity in rural areas. The rural population tends to have worse health, so a higher likelihood of comorbidities that increase the fatality rate of coronavirus. On top of that, they don’t even get more spared by infections: the flu season tends to be delayed in rural areas compared to urban ones, but when it hits, it hits much harder."

There's a graph that I couldn't get to copy properly and some discussion about why in the legend. It's in section 2. of the article.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Ozlsn
Found it!

[Themanda Duggar]

4 hours ago, Howl said:

I was also a child in the 50s, and remember pictures of people in iron lungs. It was scary.  But by the time I was old enough to be frightened by those pictures, the Salk vaccine was widely available and I was vaccinated by 2nd or 3rd grade. 

My father was one of Jonas Salk’s test patients.  His whole first grade class was.  Dr Salk came to their class, and administered the injections himself. 
Can you imagine how scared of polio all those parents must have been, to allow their children to be used as test subjects?  
I really wish I had known about this before my grandparents died.  I’d have loved to talk to them about it.  My father remembers knowing that it was a big deal, but not any of the conversations around it.

[danvillebelle]

My grandfather's little sister died in one of the waves of the last polio epidemic, in 1941.  She was 15 and died in an iron lung.  She was the youngest and the only girl, it devastated the family.  I remember my grandmother telling me stories about the polio fear in the 30's and 40's and how they were all terrified at first because right before my great-aunt started showing symptoms, my grandmother had spent a night in the same bed with her during a visit.  I remember VERY vividly getting the polio drops when I was about 3, and not understanding why the dr. and my mom were making such a big deal of it.  I understand now.  

[hoipolloi]

8 hours ago, danvillebelle said:

I remember my grandmother telling me stories about the polio fear in the 30's and 40's

This is when my parents were growing up and, as I said, they were the same. 

There was little that anyone knew about polio at that time, but they did recognize that polio infections peaked during the summer months. So, everyone avoided any summer event or gathering where people congregated, from the local swimming pool to a baseball game. I recall my dad talking about how hard it was, as a child, having to stay away from the beautiful municipal swimming pool in his town during the hottest days of summer because of the fear of contracting polio.  

We now forget, or never knew, that contracting polio was a death sentence for many, and those who survived a bout have often been left with lifelong health issues as a consequence. 

[Coconut Flan]

Now we still have people with post polio syndrome.  A friend of mine has it even though she's younger than I am due to not having complete vaccinations and a "mild" case of polio.

[Alisamer]

 

18 hours ago, Ozlsn said:

From influenza modelling rural areas take longer to peak with cases than urban areas (pretty much because of distance) but then are hit as badly as urban areas, partly due to population demographics (tend to be higher numbers of at-risk people) and less availability of healthcare. I hope that's not the case with coronavirus (not least because my parents and in-laws live in a rural area and fall into the at-risk demographic) but it is worth keeping in mind. (I know I linked to this information somewhere in here before, but no idea where. If I find it again I'll link again.)

 

I suspect this will probably be true with COVID-19 - but with the added issue of access to testing.

I'm taking all case numbers with a huge lump of salt, because testing is still relatively limited. There are going to be tons of people who had or have it but either didn't show symptoms, didn't show severe symptoms, or for other reasons didn't qualify for testing. 

My sister MIGHT have had it a few weeks ago. We may never know. She showed symptoms, though mild, and tested negative for flu and strep so her doctor ordered her to quarantine for two weeks and get a test... but she was never able to get the test. They didn't have any, then she hadn't traveled out of the country, then this, then that... 

This dude needs to realize quoting numbers of cases is useless unless testing is widespread and easily available. Did his county really only have a few cases, or were there only a few people tested?

[Ozlsn]

3 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

We now forget, or never knew, that contracting polio was a death sentence for many, and those who survived a bout have often been left with lifelong health issues as a consequence. 

Forget I think. People at the time knew that polio could kill or disable their child, and even though most cases were mild no one wanted to take this risk that their child would be the severe case. People in areas where polio has only recently been eradicated certainly know and would much prefer their child have the vaccine than this disease. Incidentally one of the main reasons for attempting to eradicate polio is so that wealthy countries can stop vaccinating against it, as happened with smallpox. Without eradication you need to keep vaccinating, because all you need is one active case in an unvaccinated population and you're back to essentially trying to get enough herd immunity to stop it while treating all the people who are sick. 

I really wish certain people could get through their heads that they are not in fact producing super special children with a super special innate immunity to disease but just ordinary human beings who are susceptible and as at risk as anyone else. Even if they were breastfed. Heh.

[JermajestyDuggar]

I was just reading a fundie Facebook post about polio and how plumbing eradicated it. Not vaccines. The vaccines actually caused all the children to be paralyzed, not the polio. ?

[Ozlsn]

33 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I was just reading a fundie Facebook post about polio and how plumbing eradicated it. Not vaccines. The vaccines actually caused all the children to be paralyzed, not the polio. ?

I really would like to see their evidence (contemporary newsreels, newspaper articles etc) of the mass plumbing effort in the USA in the early 1950s. Must have been on par with building the Hoover Dam in terms of government effort and labour.

[JermajestyDuggar]

13 minutes ago, Ozlsn said:

I really would like to see their evidence (contemporary newsreels, newspaper articles etc) of the mass plumbing effort in the USA in the early 1950s. Must have been on par with building the Hoover Dam in terms of government effort and labour.

She linked this when trying to prove her point that vaccines cause everything that’s wrong in the world:

https://freepress.org/article/did-vaccine-experiment-us-soldiers-cause-“spanish-flu”?fbclid=IwAR0ZI5Po90ZofxC0i42IYjKpBM7mAwO03b_WqG_A19Wdx6R6L73fA5SAbk4

[Ozlsn]

2 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

She linked this when trying to prove her point that vaccines cause everything that’s wrong in the world:

https://freepress.org/article/did-vaccine-experiment-us-soldiers-cause-“spanish-flu”?fbclid=IwAR0ZI5Po90ZofxC0i42IYjKpBM7mAwO03b_WqG_A19Wdx6R6L73fA5SAbk4

Short answer: no. No it didn't, any more than it caused H1N1 or H3N7 ffs.

I was reading about the sweating sickness,the Justinian plague and the Black Death last night (thanks to whoever linked to the sweating sickness discussion, that was very interesting), and I'm 100% sure vaccines didn't cause them either. 

 

 

[Petronella]

13 hours ago, Ozlsn said:

I really wish certain people could get through their heads that they are not in fact producing super special children with a super special innate immunity to disease but just ordinary human beings who are susceptible and as at risk as anyone else. Even if they were breastfed. Heh.

Oh, gosh YES. Do you remember the Indigo Children phase? (Which some people still subscribe to.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigo_children

So many traits that supposedly prove your child is the next step in evolution, rather than the more prosaic answer that these are perfectly normal childhood selfishnesses that become actual problems when they're coupled with lazy parenting and praised.

Sorry for the Indigo derail...I just saw your comment on the overall trend and, well, YES.

(This is a funny satire of the Indigo thing: https://www.mommyish.com/raising-an-indigo-child/2/)

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 hours ago, Petronella said:

Oh, gosh YES. Do you remember the Indigo Children phase? (Which some people still subscribe to.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigo_children

So many traits that supposedly prove your child is the next step in evolution, rather than the more prosaic answer that these are perfectly normal childhood selfishnesses that become actual problems when they're coupled with lazy parenting and praised.

Sorry for the Indigo derail...I just saw your comment on the overall trend and, well, YES.

(This is a funny satire of the Indigo thing: https://www.mommyish.com/raising-an-indigo-child/2/)

Lots of parents think their kids are super special. Fundies think they are super special. It’s someyhing fundies have in common with mainstream parents. I have a friend who is a gifted teacher and tons of parents think their kids are gifted when they are not. I remember telling my mom my older son is average intelligence and she took it as an insult to my son. There’s nothing wrong with being average. Yet many people think it is. 

[Petronella]

5 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Lots of parents think their kids are super special. Fundies think they are super special. It’s someyhing fundies have in common with mainstream parents. I have a friend who is a gifted teacher and tons of parents think their kids are gifted when they are not. I remember telling my mom my older son is average intelligence and she took it as an insult to my son. There’s nothing wrong with being average. Yet many people think it is. 

I think it's nice to find the thing(s) that your kid is special at. Maybe an academic thing or sports thing or arts thing or social thing. I get wanting to discover whatever your kid's specialness is and encourage it.

I think it gets weird when "specialness" is considered a general state of being rather than a specific skill or passion. Like, rather than being "amazing at pitching a baseball" or "skipped two grades in math" or "center of a social group" or "sews amazing clothes", it's just general "specialness" or "betterness" or "next step on the evolutionary ladder."

Fundies go the general route, but a very specific generality: "godly." If the their kids start thinking about their unique selves, they might end of LGBTQ or atheist or *gasp* democrat!

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 minute ago, Petronella said:

I think it's nice to find the thing(s) that your kid is special at. Maybe an academic thing or sports thing or arts thing or social thing. I get wanting to discover whatever your kid's specialness is and encourage it.

I think it gets weird when "specialness" is considered a general state of being rather than a specific skill or passion. Like, rather than being "amazing at pitching a baseball" or "skipped two grades in math" or "center of a social group" or "sews amazing clothes", it's just general "specialness" or "betterness" or "next step on the evolutionary ladder."

Fundies go the general route, but a very specific generality: "godly." If the their kids start thinking about their unique selves, they might end of LGBTQ or atheist or *gasp* democrat!

Although my older son is very average when it comes to IQ, he has a high EQ. His emotional and social intelligence is higher than average for his age. He won’t become a Harvard professor or NASA scientist. However he would do very well in a job that requires a lot of human interaction and empathy. I’m never going to push him to be a sports star or valedictorian because it’s just not his thing. But I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s student body president. We live in an upper middle class area and I am afraid kids around him will think they are better than others. And I don’t want my kids to fall into that way of thinking. Just because you were lucky enough to grow up privileged doesn’t make you better than everyone else. Fundies do often seem to have that kind of thinking when it comes to religion. God likes them better than us heathens.

[hoipolloi]

Not only is COVID-19 entirely the fault of the Chinese Communist Party, but James says that the White House press corps need to quit asking stupid question at tRump's pressers. Oh, and tRump should absolutely be re-elected.

Quote

 

Case in point, the last question asked at today’s press conference went something like this, “President Trump, it looks like more Americans will die from the virus than died in the Vietnam War. My question is, should the current president be reelected based on that record?”

What kind of a question was that? How was that seeking clarification? How was that an attempt to report accurately? Obviously, all this reporter wanted to do was to anger or embarrass the President.

But, Trump has no reason to be embarrassed. His Administration didn’t create the virus. Like all the countries on the face of the globe, he had to lead as this unknown virus attacked our land. And, this President inherited a disaster. Due to actions of previous administrations, our medical support system as a mess, testing capacity was challenged, ventilator inventory was very low, we weren’t ready for the storm.

But, the results? Our mortality rate is lower than most countries on planet. The President called upon the commercial sector to work with the government to develop tests for a virus we had never seen, to crank out ventilators, masks, swabs, PPEs in record time. Unlike other countries, everyone who needed a ventilator had a ventilator. And, while the number of Americans who have died is sad, indeed a national tragedy, it is far lower than what was expected, in part because of the actions of this President.

Let’s go back to the question - should the President who has led through this unexpected attack on our country stand for reelection? I say “Yes!”

 

Lower mortality rate in the US? Sufficient PPE and medical equipment made available in "record time"? A far lower death rate? 

Could James have sustained neurological damage from his COVID-19 infection?

Alas, it's more likely that this is SNTFFWBS  - situation normal, typical fundie fuckwad bullshit.

Edited April 29, 2020 by hoipolloi

[Petronella]

17 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Although my older son is very average when it comes to IQ, he has a high EQ. His emotional and social intelligence is higher than average for his age. He won’t become a Harvard professor or NASA scientist. However he would do very well in a job that requires a lot of human interaction and empathy. I’m never going to push him to be a sports star or valedictorian because it’s just not his thing. But I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s student body president.

I think that *is* special. A broad view of the many abilities and passions that fill the world with wonderfulness is a lovely thing.

[Howl]

5 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Lower mortality rate in the US? Sufficient PPE and medical equipment made available in "record time"? A far lower death rate? 

Could James have sustained neurological damage from his COVID-19 infection?

No, James is a fundie droid for Trump.  This administration has been brilliant at one thing: They develop their talking points, deploy those talking points through people like Kayleigh McEnenany, then Fox talkers and a bazillion right wing radio shows from Limbaugh on down amplify those talking points,   more amplification through tweets and social media, it reverberates through the Base, and that brings us to where we are with James, who considers this, literally, the Gospel truth. 

Those like James (and one of my SiLs) who get no info outside of this bubble, truly believe that Trump has handled this so well, US exceptionalism + Trump's leadership have triumphed once again.  Hardly anyone is dying from this illness, there are plenty of tests, no one is lacking PPE, and anything else is a hoax or fake news, because God...or something.   This is the ONE reason I believe that Trump could be elected to a second term. 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Howl

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Petronella said:

I think that *is* special. A broad view of the many abilities and passions that fill the world with wonderfulness is a lovely thing.

Everyone’s special in their own way. My thing is that no one is so special that they are better than everyone else. That’s my issue I guess. 

[ExFundieMama]

Actually, if you watch his entire video of "I Was Wrong" fame....he says in the video that he has NOT been officially tested for Covid 19, but that after talking to a couple of people who looked at his tests, blood, etc. they agree he most likely had it. I have to admit, it crossed my mind that it would be very much like him, and Stacy, to grab the opportunity to become THE EXPERTS on coronavirus, even though technically he doesn't know for sure he has ever had it. He will forever be the authority....he is talking and speaking like HE HAD IT SO HE KNOWS...but admits he never had the test. At least not at the time of that video. Either way, he immediate xenophobia about the evil Chinese causing him to get sick made me...well....sick.

[hoipolloi]

11 minutes ago, ExFundieMama said:

Actually, if you watch his entire video of "I Was Wrong" fame....he says in the video that he has NOT been officially tested for Covid 19, but that after talking to a couple of people who looked at his tests, blood, etc. they agree he most likely had it.

He does say that he was given hydroxychloroquin and that it worked. If that's true, it seems as though his medical providers would have verified a COVID-19 infection before starting that treatment because it's hardly a low-risk protocol.

[Ozlsn]

12 hours ago, Howl said:

Those like James (and one of my SiLs) who get no info outside of this bubble, truly believe that Trump has handled this so well, US exceptionalism + Trump's leadership have triumphed once again.  Hardly anyone is dying from this illness, there are plenty of tests, no one is lacking PPE, and anything else is a hoax or fake news, because God...or something.   This is the ONE reason I believe that Trump could be elected to a second term. 

The thing that could derail that is if a second wave/first wave starts hitting the rural, red voting areas in the lead up to the election. At that point his rusted on voters will get to see how prepared and managed it is - but of course it'll be the Democrats fault because blue states used all the PPE. 

Although I'm sure those states will have mail in ballots, as they wouldn't want to take the risk of losing an election.

30 minutes ago, hoipolloi said:

He does say that he was given hydroxychloroquin and that it worked. If that's true, it seems as though his medical providers would have verified a COVID-19 infection before starting that treatment because it's hardly a low-risk protocol.

Or... He has no idea what he had but that is Trumps magical protocol so he must have had it and it worked! 

I am disinclined to believe a word he says considering he doesn't actually have confirmation of anything. Hospital discharge sheet proof requested. Heh.

[Ozlsn]

On 4/28/2020 at 10:08 PM, Petronella said:

So many traits that supposedly prove your child is the next step in evolution, rather than the more prosaic answer that these are perfectly normal childhood selfishnesses that become actual problems when they're coupled with lazy parenting and praised.

Some of the traits to me indicated that the child would possibly now be diagnosed as autistic - there were certainly some parents who seemed to prefer the "My child is a super special, possibly alien enhanced spiritually evolved human" to the slightly more prosaic "my child is autistic, and has some difficulty with social cues, but we're working on strategies to help."

[JermajestyDuggar]

I read that it’s a myth that boomers are not taking the pandemic seriously. They are actually reportedly taking it more seriously than younger ages. And we know a lot of boomers voted for trump. My parents are boomers and they are taking it seriously even though they are trump voters. Along with a lot of their boomer friends. 

[hoipolloi]

On 4/29/2020 at 12:55 AM, Howl said:

Those like James (and one of my SiLs) who get no info outside of this bubble, truly believe that Trump has handled this so well, US exceptionalism + Trump's leadership have triumphed once again.  Hardly anyone is dying from this illness, there are plenty of tests, no one is lacking PPE, and anything else is a hoax or fake news, because God...or something. 

Speaking of fake news, Jen Fishburne is busily pushing it for all she's worth: