Joy & Austin 21: Still Talking About Baby Gideon

[karen77]

11 hours ago, metheglyn said:

In the first part of the birth special Joy is asked by Roxanne if she "has a plan B if something happens" during the homebirth (Presumably this is scripted, since they always ask the weirdest questions on camera.)

Joy specifically replies that if they decide the situation means she needs to get checked out they're going to the "closest" hospital, "which is like 25, 30 minutes away." In a subsequent TH she elaborates that she picked a home birth because "it's more comfortable" and she wanted to "at least try it" and they're "only 30 minutes from the hospital, so it's not too bad." 

Do they realize just HOW FAST things can go wrong, and that 30 minutes is PLENTY of time for things to tank horribly? Yes, yes, God is Good and all that, but they are so naively optimistic for having already had so many problems within their OWN family.

I agree! I said something to this effect further back in the thread, this is SOOO risky, especially on your first birth. Just stupid, really.

[justoneoftwo]

I wonder if the bad births of the others made her even less worried.  "well things when south with Jill and Jessa and it all worked out, so 30 min, no big deal."  I can even kind of see the attempt at logic...

[NakedKnees]

I wonder if the lack of awareness about healthcare and medical emergencies is a direct result of how sheltered the Duggars' upbringing was. Before Josie, they claimed to live a pretty charmed injury-and-illness-free life (just one broken arm, or something like that). Of course, you'd think Josie's multiple issues, Jason's (?) spill through a stage, and Michelle's gallstones/preeclampsia would teach them something nonetheless.

I have a huge extended family with medical issues including alcoholism, depression, down syndrome, and a few others. However, we've had a remarkably good luck with avoiding issues such as cancer or rough pregnancies/births. If it weren't for my exposure to that sort of pain and struggle from being out in public school, or at my diverse metropolitan church community, or even from watching TV, I might have missed learning about those things. By "learning" I mean "developing a healthy sense of fear and caution."

I wonder if that's the case for the Duggars. Maybe they genuinely haven't seen enough images of medical emergencies to be able to conceive of them on a normal level.

[Seculardaisy]

1 hour ago, justmy2cents said:

I agree. My sister's hospital is about 30 minutes away. She left the house with what she described as mild contractions. About 15 minutes later her water broke and she could feel the baby's head. Crossed her legs and screamed at her husband to drive faster. Baby came 7 minutes after they got to the hospital.

Ah I feel her (literal) pain. My labor just went from 0 to 100, water broke in the car, then bam my son popped his head out lol. Laboring in a car is so painful because you’re so restricted in your range of motion. I always recommend, to my pregnant friends that they listen to their bodies, so often you hear that you shouldn’t go to the hospital or ABC until your contractions are a steady three to five minutes apart and for me that never happened. 

[Glasgowghirl]

Yes 30 minutes is a big deal. Almost 12 years ago my sister shouted me into the bathroom to tell me her waters broke 10 weeks early, the maternity hospital was about 20 to 30 minutes away and luckily she didn't go into labour and was observed until she got a section two weeks before her due date. 

I know someone from same town as us who gave birth two streets away from the hospital premature, they drove baby to hospital and he was ok. 

Home births should only be attempted with qualified midwifes and when pregnancy is low risk. Obviously sometimes baby comes quick and no their is no time to get medical assistance but the Duggar girls seem to take too many risks when it comes to home births. Jinger and Kendra please go to the hospital or birthing centre.

[AtlanticTug]

30 minutes is several lifetimes. Those who have been on the wrong side of the statistics will be able to tell you all about how much each minute can count.

It will be interesting to see with Joy how soon she gets pregnant with #2. The odds of a VBAC are very, very low if she gets pregnant very soon but I am just not sure I see her lasting until the "ideal" 18 month window between pregnancies. Then again, I was surprise that Jill made it that far.

[singsingsing]

I just want to second everyone who's saying that 30 minutes can be several lifetimes, as @AtlanticTug put it so well, when it comes to labour. I've never had a baby, but one of my good friends had an unintended homebirth because labour came on so fast there was just no time for them to get to the hospital. There wasn't even time for the paramedics to get there - her husband had to catch the baby! Thankfully everything was fine, but I know she wouldn't have chosen to do it that way.

[Cleopatra7]

29 minutes ago, NakedKnees said:

I wonder if the lack of awareness about healthcare and medical emergencies is a direct result of how sheltered the Duggars' upbringing was. Before Josie, they claimed to live a pretty charmed injury-and-illness-free life (just one broken arm, or something like that). Of course, you'd think Josie's multiple issues, Jason's (?) spill through a stage, and Michelle's gallstones/preeclampsia would teach them something nonetheless.

I have a huge extended family with medical issues including alcoholism, depression, down syndrome, and a few others. However, we've had a remarkably good luck with avoiding issues such as cancer or rough pregnancies/births. If it weren't for my exposure to that sort of pain and struggle from being out in public school, or at my diverse metropolitan church community, or even from watching TV, I might have missed learning about those things. By "learning" I mean "developing a healthy sense of fear and caution."

I wonder if that's the case for the Duggars. Maybe they genuinely haven't seen enough images of medical emergencies to be able to conceive of them on a normal level.

I think it has more to do with the fact that the entire anti-birth control mindset is based on the idea that limiting family size because considerations of material or infant health are irrelevant; if birth control is intrinsically wrong and being “open to life” an unambiguous good, then there’s no legitimate reason to not want to be pregnant. Furthermore, anti-birth controllers assert that giving birth is “natural” whereas contraception is “unnatural” since it requires misusing the sexual organs or tricking them into working in an “unnatural” way. Thus, if giving birth is so “natural” and safe, then there’s no reason why one can’t give birth at home, without any medical aid, or why one can’t just have a kid every single year. Anti-birth control people have convinced themselves that the risks of pregnancy are overblown and if you just trust god, it will all go well (never mind that WHO says that 800 women die every day from pregnancy and/or childbirth). I remember reading the comments section of a Catholic blog about the joys of NFP and one woman wrote a plaintive reply about how she and her husband were trying to follow Catholic teachings on contraception, but they now found themselves unemployed and homeless other four children and didn’t know what to do. The response? Just keep trusting in god and don’t dare think about using birth control.

With the Duggars in particular, their entire public identity is based on being a huge quiverfull family. Without that, they’d be just another weird but anonymous fundamentalist family. The Duggar women have seen how giving birth nets them positive coverage on People magazine and the like, so why wouldn’t they follow suite on the constant pregnancy train?

[justmy2cents]

40 minutes ago, Seculardaisy said:

. I always recommend, to my pregnant friends that they listen to their bodies, so often you hear that you shouldn’t go to the hospital or ABC until your contractions are a steady three to five minutes apart and for me that never happened. 

Funny you should say that. My BIL and my sister's OB tried to convince her not to come in yet, that she wasn't breathing heavy enough. She had an intuition and if she didn't listen to it her baby could have been born at home. This was her 2nd child. First one was 10 hours from 1st contraction to birth. My one labor lasted longer than both of her's combined.

[lizzybee]

Y'all are making me nervous. Last pregnancy the hospital/OB was 8 mins. Now it's about 20-30min because we've moved. I never went into natural labor last time so I have no idea what is going to happen if/when I do. There's another hospital that's affiliated a little closer in the opposite direction but I definitely would prefer to be where I was last time and with my own doctors. I think I'll mention the distance to the OB next visit and see what she says.

[Alice in Fundieland]

15 minutes ago, lizzybee said:

Y'all are making me nervous. Last pregnancy the hospital/OB was 8 mins. Now it's about 20-30min because we've moved. I never went into natural labor last time so I have no idea what is going to happen if/when I do. There's another hospital that's affiliated a little closer in the opposite direction but I definitely would prefer to be where I was last time and with my own doctors. I think I'll mention the distance to the OB next visit and see what she says.

I hope you’re able to deliver at your hospital of choice with your own doctor and that you have a safe, successful labor and delivery. I can understand your concern but the fact that you are thinking about it, considering all your options, and consulting a trained medical professional greatly increases the chances that everything will be fine. This is something the Duggar daughters can’t seem to figure out. 

[Seculardaisy]

28 minutes ago, lizzybee said:

Y'all are making me nervous. Last pregnancy the hospital/OB was 8 mins. Now it's about 20-30min because we've moved. I never went into natural labor last time so I have no idea what is going to happen if/when I do. There's another hospital that's affiliated a little closer in the opposite direction but I definitely would prefer to be where I was last time and with my own doctors. I think I'll mention the distance to the OB next visit and see what she says.

Even after my second baby was born in the car I continued to opt for the hospital affiliated ABC that is about 25 mins. away. Even with my history the midwives and OB/GYN I met with all said this was okay as long as I closely mintored myself and basically as soon as I had any concern labor had begun or contractions that I thought might be real, I was told to just come in and get monitored. They just said “with your history, come in and hang out with us, if you’re not in labor we will all understand and just send you home.” 

You are already miles ahead of Joy and the other Duggar women because you’re asking a medical professional these questions. The Duggars two major flaws are 1) they wait far too long to seek medical help 2) they are naive and likely don’t consult with any real CNMs or OB/GYNs.

[llg1234]

Some (very LQ) pictures of Joy, Austin, and Gideon.

http://www.duggarfamily.com/2018/3/gideon-s-first-photo-album

[libgirl2]

3 minutes ago, llg1234 said:

Some (very LQ) pictures of Joy, Austin, and Gideon.

http://www.duggarfamily.com/2018/3/gideon-s-first-photo-album

In the last picture it looks like he is giving mommy an angry stare! 

[Carm_88]

I've never given birth but I have witnessed a life threatening situation, not birth related, while being 30 minutes from the nearest hospital. I'm glad that everything turned out well, but being caviler and trusting in Jesus, isn't the best backup plan. 

[TeaELSee]

Something else that stood out to me on the TLC video was when Jimbob read the text regarding Joy going to the hospital.

He looked genuinely alarmed and said, “they are transporting Joy to the hospital.” Followed up by, we can’t talk now.  Using the word transport sounds like an ambulance to me, it’s just not a term I would use in that instance. I would say we are driving or taking her to the hospital. Also, why couldn’t they talk? There were multiple people there.

It looked more like an emergency than a precaution.

[VBOY9977]

 

35 minutes ago, llg1234 said:

Some (very LQ) pictures of Joy, Austin, and Gideon.

http://www.duggarfamily.com/2018/3/gideon-s-first-photo-album

TLC released the HQ version of the pics

[Ace3]

On 3/15/2018 at 5:38 AM, Meggo said:

Do we know WHY she hasn't taken it? It seems like it would be a fairly simple thing to do, now that you've done the school or apprentice stuff and then taken the CPM test. 

I haven't caught up yet (page 21 of 24) but could it have to do with losing her hours? She was an apprentice under than Vanessa lady who lost her license and I thought that she (and Jana) would have to do all of her apprenticing hours over again. Maybe I'm wrong but I feel like I remember reading that at some point in time.

[allthegoodnamesrgone]

1 hour ago, libgirl2 said:

In the last picture it looks like he is giving mommy an angry stare! 

I thought that was a sweet picture, the way they are looking at each other. I'd love to see new pics he's already what 3 weeks old? They change so much the first 3 or 4 months that they can look like a totally different human after just a week or 2.

[libgirl2]

11 minutes ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

I thought that was a sweet picture, the way they are looking at each other. I'd love to see new pics he's already what 3 weeks old? They change so much the first 3 or 4 months that they can look like a totally different human after just a week or 2.

It was cute but he was giving her quite a look. 

[Iamtheway]

 

20 hours ago, Fascinated said:

You’ve touched on something here that I’ve always struggled with.  Our second baby was born at just over 28 weeks*. Over the years people have said things like, well, your next two would be different if that hadn’t happened. I know that the timing would probably have been different and that that is probably true. I have never been able to accept it though. It hurts because I didn’t want to think that he needed to die in order for us to have the children we had. Does that make sense?  Probably not. 

It makes sense to me. We had a miscarriage before Miniway and had that pregnancy gone to term we would have a different child now. Seeing as Miniway is awesome and the best kid ever that would be bad. But that doesn’t mean I’m happy about the miscarriage. We had been trying for five years when I got pregnant and the miscarriage happened the same week my sister had her second child. It was a horrible time. Probably the worst in my life. But it was early in the pregnancy and I got pregnant again really soon after so I got over it and don’t think about it very often at all now. Loosing your child at 28 weeks is totally different. I am so sorry for your loss. 

16 hours ago, metheglyn said:

In a subsequent TH she elaborates that she picked a home birth because "it's more comfortable" and she wanted to "at least try it" and they're "only 30 minutes from the hospital, so it's not too bad." 

Do they realize just HOW FAST things can go wrong, and that 30 minutes is PLENTY of time for things to tank horribly? Yes, yes, God is Good and all that, but they are so naively optimistic for having already had so many problems within their OWN family.

Only 30 minutes? We chose the hospital we gave birth in partly because the delivery rooms were less then 30 seconds from the operating rooms if something went wrong. 

[Satan'sFortress]

8 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

She probably WAS numb, it is called exhaustion. Also not everyone bonds instantly with their babies, I didn't, I was really out of it for a few MONTHS after my son was born, and my family was concerned because I had very little interest in my baby, I eventually got there but he was about 5 months old. With my 2nd baby it was totally different, mama bear came out with in minutes I had that instant bond, not sure what the difference was but it was.

 

Thanks for sharing that.  I had the opposite happen.  Bonded in a millisecond with my first, and I always hate to admit this---a few months with my second.  I don't know why.  The pregnancy and labor were both easier the second time, and baby #2 was an angel---sweetest thing ever.  I even had a hard time using his name for awhile---it just didn't feel right.  But, that all passed & everything clicked in.  I never heard of anyone else feeling like that.  I have promised myself that I will be sure to be supportive of my kids (or nieces/nephews)  if they ever have kids of their own & find a way to let them know that it isn't always automatic.

[justoneoftwo]

3 minutes ago, Satan'sFortress said:

Thanks for sharing that.  I had the opposite happen.  Bonded in a millisecond with my first, and I always hate to admit this---a few months with my second.  I don't know why.  The pregnancy and labor were both easier the second time, and baby #2 was an angel---sweetest thing ever.  I even had a hard time using his name for awhile---it just didn't feel right.  But, that all passed & everything clicked in.  I never heard of anyone else feeling like that.  I have promised myself that I will be sure to be supportive of my kids (or nieces/nephews)  if they ever have kids of their own & find a way to let them know that it isn't always automatic.

I felt like my LO wasn't real for the first few weeks.  I don't know how else to explain it, the whole thing wasn't real, just not my life.  It was hard, and H bonded instantly, so that was hard too.  My parents did say that for them it was a slow burn, not instant, so that helped.  It happens differently for people, and thats ok.

[Sky with diamonds]

As some say in Newfoundland "stunned as me arse". That's how the Duggar daughters appear to me with home births. 

It's awfully risky for them to try for home births. I cringe and I worry for mother and baby every time they talk about home birth. I think it's clear they are so unprepared for it all.

[TeaELSee]

9 hours ago, allthegoodnamesrgone said:

She probably WAS numb, it is called exhaustion. Also not everyone bonds instantly with their babies, I didn't, I was really out of it for a few MONTHS after my son was born, and my family was concerned because I had very little interest in my baby, I eventually got there but he was about 5 months old. With my 2nd baby it was totally different, mama bear came out with in minutes I had that in

Good point, I was just going on my experience and everyone is different.