Tori Bates Courtship

[OrchidBlossom]

Just now, MorningMist said:

At least they feel comfortable enough to joke about it, I guess.

I don't know, I think I felt uncomfortable because of Tori's reaction how she said "We are leaving this conversation where it is at!" and sounded really scandalized or something, like the idea that someone might have learned general information about sex or biology from an encyclopedia is an inappropriate thing. Like, I don't know something about the whole interaction just felt "off" like they were trying to tease or be playful about the wedding night but couldn't quite. I can't really articulate what I mean well, so I'm not sure if I am making sense.

[formergothardite]

Just now, OrchidBlossom said:

I don't know, I think I felt uncomfortable because of Tori's reaction how she said "We are leaving this conversation where it is at!" and sounded really scandalized or something, like the idea that someone might have learned general information about sex or biology from an encyclopedia is an inappropriate thing. Like, I don't know something about the whole interaction just felt "off" like they were trying to tease or be playful about the wedding night but couldn't quite. I can't really articulate what I mean well, so I'm not sure if I am making sense.

ITA. I felt like Michael was uncomfortable with the conversation and that the whole thing was set up by the UP producers. It didn't come off as natural to me. 

[OrchidBlossom]

Just now, formergothardite said:

ITA. I felt like Michael was uncomfortable with the conversation and that the whole thing was set up by the UP producers. It didn't come off as natural to me. 

Yeah, I think Erin seemed the most comfortable (maybe because she is married and so her having knowledge and experience in this area is okay?) but even she seemed like a little stilted as opposed to her usual self, like she was trying to come off funny and light hearted but was embarrassed or something. I kind of felt bad for Michael because there is no real right answer for her, and its her impending de-virginization they are discussing. 

[BeccaGrim]

34 minutes ago, OrchidBlossom said:

Yeah, I think Erin seemed the most comfortable (maybe because she is married and so her having knowledge and experience in this area is okay?) but even she seemed like a little stilted as opposed to her usual self, like she was trying to come off funny and light hearted but was embarrassed or something. I kind of felt bad for Michael because there is no real right answer for her, and its her impending d

Quote

de-virginization they are discussing.

 Is this a term?  I love it. LOL

 

[Snarkle]

I thought the same as some of you - that Bobby and Ashley will stun everyone and run off together - the duet is just the catalyst.

[HereticHick]

Dang it--I thought the multiple visits to Pensacola Christian College meant that Carlin was going there in the fall (yes, it is a bible-thumping college, but it would still be good to get away from the mega family), but maybe she was just tagging along as Tori's chaperone.

[Dandruff]

Hope this isn't a silly question...but how did Bobby and Tori meet and get to know each other well enough* to court if he's going to college in FL?  Were they on a mission trip together like John and Alyssa?

* I realize they don't need to know each other very well to court, in fundieland, but still.

[IReallyAmHopewell]

On 5/1/2016 at 0:02 PM, formergothardite said:

The difference is that they realized using the terms "boyfriend and girlfriend" makes them look less like freaks. Nothing really changed except how they present it to viewers. 

I wonder about the number of marriages in this family.  This is unusual even among ATI families. I wonder if the house is hell and since marriage is the only means of escape, they all take it as fast as they can. Can you imagine living as a teen and a young adult in a house where your parents have cameras mounted all over the place so they can monitor you? 

Thank you. All those "the Bates are different folks"--I've been mentioning the cameras for a while now. Glad someone else is. I'm guessing when the cameras aren't rolling, food is pretty sparse.

[HereticHick]

24 minutes ago, Dandruff said:

Hope this isn't a silly question...but how did Bobby and Tori meet and get to know each other well enough* to court if he's going to college in FL?  Were they on a mission trip together like John and Alyssa?

* I realize they don't need to know each other very well to court, in fundieland, but still.

In the refreshments line at Big Sandy Family Camp, of course!

[divadivine]

38 minutes ago, HereticHick said:

In the refreshments line at Big Sandy Family Camp, of course!

Or maybe in the ALERT store in the book section? 

[MorningMist]

16 minutes ago, divadivine said:

Or maybe in the ALERT store in the book section? 

They may have locked eyes watching grown men putting diapers on dolls at a baby shower planned by Sierra?

[Palimpsest]

10 hours ago, elliha said:

Agreed, Ashley in particular is really pleasant to listen to. 

If you really like listening to people singing flat.  She is projecting well but her pitch is badly off.

I notice that many people admire volume over pitch.  It has always bothered me.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Alright, so this would be Bobby's father:

http://www.primerica.com/public/PrimericaRep?rep=robsmithjr

Mom is Sheri. 

This site lists them as having three kids http://www.genealogy.com/ftm/b/o/w/Paul-S-Bowman-ID/WEBSITE-0001/UHP-0053.html

 

 

 

 

[Tomboy]

Bobby comes from a family of only three kids!!! Whaaaaat!

[Palimpsest]

On 5/1/2016 at 5:03 PM, hollywood said:

Why do we need to have a post about how dangerous the bates are on every page of every thread? We all know by now. Just because someone compliments them once or points out something positive doesn't mean we have forgotten about how crappy their beliefs are. 

Why, yes.  It is very obvious that we have a lot of newcomers who don't have the full picture, and too many starry-eyed fans here.  The ones  who want to deny the crappy the Bates's beliefs because they think they are "nice."  And so much nicer than the dastardly Duggars although they are, in fact, more dangerous. 

Seriously, if people want to leg-hump the Bateses - there are plenty of places on the internet where they won't be challenged.  

FJ is not that place.  Yet again, FreeJinger is not a Bates family fan site.  We exist to discuss the dangers of extreme Fundamentalism.  Have you not noticed that the Bates family are extreme Fundamentalist Christians?  

Perhaps you should stop criticizing other members for pointing out how dangerous the Bates's beliefs are in reality.

 

[NotALoserLikeYou]

They seem to be like the Websters. Pants wearing, sports watching fundies.

sister has some pics 

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001979626751&tsid=0.4448847472667694&source=typeahead

mom

https://m.facebook.com/sheri.r.smith.5?pn_ref=friends_search

 

Dad

https://m.facebook.com/robert.e.smith.10?pn_ref=friends_search

Bobby the third 

https://m.facebook.com/g8rdude?pn_ref=friends_search

 

 

[mango_fandango]

2 hours ago, Tomboy said:

Bobby comes from a family of only three kids!!! Whaaaaat!

Derick only has the one brother. 

[infooverload]

Has anyone heard of this Premica company? Is the family involved in ATI? If the family is not involved in ATI this would make only the second spouse who isn't involved or had a role at ATI

[Hisey]

It's pretty clear that the Bates have raised happier, healthier children who have gone on to have good marriages. That can co-exist with the fact that both families hold terrible beliefs. Holding a terrible belief doesn't mean you are going to raise children who are exactly the same.

All you have to do is look at Zach/Whitney, or Erin/Chad, or Alyssa/John, and you see young people beaming with happiness and love. Those are good, solid marriages--at least they are now (who knows what will happen in the future). All the menfolk have jobs--to me, that means these guys are more functional. The Bates kids are making decisions that are independent from their family of origin (Alyssa choosing to wear pants, Zach engaging in pre-marital kissing). To me, that's a sign of better mental health.

Compare that to Jessa and Ben. There is so much awkwardness and  uncertainty when they appear on the screen, their laughs are so uncomfortable. As for Jill and Derrick, they also don't seem as happy and content as any of the young married Bates. In fact, Derrick looks terrible--sick and unkempt. 

So, yeah, I think the Bates parents did a better job of raising kids, because their adult kids seem capable of living happy adult lives. That doesn't mean I agree with their beliefs, of course I don't. I think the Bates ended up with happier kids because they were a bit more flexible and less narcissistic in applying their belief system to each kid's situation. I also think that driving around trapped in a bus for weeks on end is bad for any family, and did a lot of damage to the young Duggar kids.

 

[JillyO]

1 hour ago, Hisey said:

It's pretty clear that the Bates have raised happier, healthier children who have gone on to have good marriages. That can co-exist with the fact that both families hold terrible beliefs. Holding a terrible belief doesn't mean you are going to raise children who are exactly the same.

All you have to do is look at Zach/Whitney, or Erin/Chad, or Alyssa/John, and you see young people beaming with happiness and love. Those are good, solid marriages--at least they are now (who knows what will happen in the future). All the menfolk have jobs--to me, that means these guys are more functional. The Bates kids are making decisions that are independent from their family of origin (Alyssa choosing to wear pants, Zach engaging in pre-marital kissing). To me, that's a sign of better mental health.

Compare that to Jessa and Ben. There is so much awkwardness and  uncertainty when they appear on the screen, their laughs are so uncomfortable. As for Jill and Derrick, they also don't seem as happy and content as any of the young married Bates. In fact, Derrick looks terrible--sick and unkempt. 

So, yeah, I think the Bates parents did a better job of raising kids, because their adult kids seem capable of living happy adult lives. That doesn't mean I agree with their beliefs, of course I don't. I think the Bates ended up with happier kids because they were a bit more flexible and less narcissistic in applying their belief system to each kid's situation. I also think that driving around trapped in a bus for weeks on end is bad for any family, and did a lot of damage to the young Duggar kids.

 

Oh, for fuck's sake.

You have NO IDEA how the Bates kids' marriages are. You have NO IDEA if they are happy. There is no way you could possibly know that from the shiny, polished pictures you see on a TV show and on their social media. The only things you can know is that UP! is trying to make them look good, which TLC hasn't always been doing, and that they perform better in front of a camera. That's it.

[Melissa1977]

@Hisey I think there's something off in Michelle, that has made her mothership  worse than Kelly's. Not because Kelly is good at all, but because if mom is not mentally healthy, kids suffer more insecurity. Also, long time in TV, living with cameras, trying to appear perfect, wow it can damage kids!

[elliha]

My main theory is that Gil and Kelly are individually more at ease with themselves and mentally healthy and that they have a better marriage than the Duggars. I constantly get the creeps from the way JB behaves towards Michelle and she often seems insecure and scared to say the wrong thing while Kelly doesn't seem to have any of this. Both have docu-soaps that are scripted so I think that comparison is possible. Gil and Kelly do appear to have a better relationship to their kids and the kids in general seem more natural and less scripted on the shows. Sure, perhaps they are just better actors all of them but it is extremely hard to script young kids so I think I do see a genuine difference. Does this make their beliefs better? No, but on an individual level I think it is better to be a Bates than a Duggar most of the time. 

We all know that both Michelle and Kelly used child-rearing techniques most of us do not approve of but still there does seem to be a huge difference in turn out. I don't know why but I do know that small differences in approach can make a big difference in the long term outcome of child-rearing. 

[nastyhobbitses]

19 hours ago, Casserole said:

 

That was a pleasant surprise. They both actually sound great. Their sounds don't totally mesh together well, IMO, but much better than the average fundie who just thinks they're great. 

 

And of course it wouldn't be a birthday wish without calling her a "Godly young lady" 

They both have very good singing voices, and I'm pleased that Bobby isn't hulk-smashing the piano like it snubbed him at a party.

[formergothardite]

1 hour ago, elliha said:

We all know that both Michelle and Kelly used child-rearing techniques most of us do not approve of but still there does seem to be a huge difference in turn out. I don't know why but I do know that small differences in approach can make a big difference in the long term outcome of child-rearing.

Since they both basically raised their children the same, wouldn't it make a lot of sense to think that the difference might just be that:

1. The Duggars were put on reality television and made to look like freaks at an impressionable age.

2. A lot of them were also dealing with being molested.

I am not getting why people are downplaying the impact being raised as reality television freaks and being molested has on people and instead going with Gil and Kelly being better parents/people. Being raised on reality television is very, very unhealthy and is going to have a BIG impact on a person. But the Bates didn't get to do that to their kids because they are better in some way, it is because they didn't get the opportunity. And hopefully the Bates didn't cover up any of their kids being molested, but since Gil has no issue with covering up abuse, I think it is safe to say that they would have handled it the exact same way Jim Bob and Michelle did. 

We have no idea how their marriages are. They aren't going to show us anything less than shiny and happy. Just view it as fundie propaganda and it is a heck of a lot less convincing that their lives are all wonderful. 

[hollywood]

11 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Why, yes.  It is very obvious that we have a lot of newcomers who don't have the full picture, and too many starry-eyed fans here.  The ones  who want to deny the crappy the Bates's beliefs because they think they are "nice."  And so much nicer than the dastardly Duggars although they are, in fact, more dangerous. 

Seriously, if people want to leg-hump the Bateses - there are plenty of places on the internet where they won't be challenged.  

FJ is not that place.  Yet again, FreeJinger is not a Bates family fan site.  We exist to discuss the dangers of extreme Fundamentalism.  Have you not noticed that the Bates family are extreme Fundamentalist Christians?  

Perhaps you should stop criticizing other members for pointing out how dangerous the Bates's beliefs are in reality.

 

Excuse me, then. I just find it extremely repetitive. I am well aware this is not a fan site. There are posts everywhere showing it is not a fan site. No need to be rude. I was not wanting to start an argument. Just my opinion.