child bride in Australia, Sheikh not charged

[FundieWatcher]

The rapist husband got 7.5 years. Dad is out on bail. The man who performed the ceremony was not charged.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/offbeat/a ... ar-AAaiqyc

I know this isn't nothing unusual in certain parts of the world. But it is sad these men lived in a Western country but didn't appreciate child marriage was wrong. And even more so, they didn't care that 12 yo got pregnant.

[DGayle]

If that happened in America, I fear there might not have been charges. Religious freedom, and all.

[Cleopatra7]

I don't see why the sheik who officiated at this "marriage" wasn't charged with anything. Aren't the clergy supposed to be first responders when it comes to child abuse (at least in the us; I don't know about Australia )?

[ghost]

:wtf: The girl's father didn't want her to have sex outside of marriage so he pimped her out to a 26 year old man. This is wrong on so many levels.

:angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

[Jana814]

:wtf: The girl's father didn't want her to have sex outside of marriage so he pimped her out to a 26 year old man. This is wrong on so many levels.

:angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

Agree!

[lilith]

The Islamic clergy in Australia are largely self or community appointed and not officially affiliated with larger organisations in the way most Christian clergy are associated with and accountable to a denomination. I would suppose that any Sheikh willing to conduct a wedding for a 12 year old girl would be even more isolated from oversight than the more moderate and mainstream leaders in the big mosques. It's highly unlikely he knew that he was a mandatory reporter or that he would have done anything differently if her was aware.

[DGayle]

I don't see why the sheik who officiated at this "marriage" wasn't charged with anything. Aren't the clergy supposed to be first responders when it comes to child abuse (at least in the us; I don't know about Australia )?

Churches in the US notoriously hide abuse, and many clergy are abusers.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

If that happened in America, I fear there might not have been charges. Religious freedom, and all.

That's not true at all. No one has the freedom to break the law and arrange the rape children. Thats one of the reasons Warren Jeffs is in prison - for arranging child marriages.

[Cleopatra7]

Churches in the US notoriously hide abuse, and many clergy are abusers.

I know that, which is why this sheik should have been arrested along with the "husband" and the father. If nothing else, he was contributing to the delinquency of a minor.

That's not true at all. No one has the freedom to break the law and arrange the rape children. Thats one of the reasons Warren Jeffs is in prison - for arranging child marriages.

Even though Jeffs is in prison, the FLDS, the Kingston clan, and other fundamentalist Mormon groups are still marrying child brides and/or close blood relatives (I know Jeffs only has authority over the FLDS but I mention the others to show that this phenomenon isn't confined to just that group). It seems that law enforcement and the public at large know that this is going on but doesn't do anything, either because they don't want negative publicity a la the Short Creek Raid or because no one in the group would inform on anyone else (i.e., no one to press charges). While John and Jane Q. Public don't have the freedom to rape children, it appears that these isolationist religious groups do. :disgust: :angry-banghead:

[NotALoserLikeYou]

True, but the same could be said for any family that doesn't go to the authorities. Most rapes, children or not, don't ever get reported. People are all too willing to protect abusers.

[Idolatry]

That's not true at all. No one has the freedom to break the law and arrange the rape children. Thats one of the reasons Warren Jeffs is in prison - for arranging child marriages.

Actually, that isn't why Warren Jeffs is in prison at all. He's in prison on the Texas charges, which are sexual assault. Those accomplice charges are the AZ/Utah charges, which never stuck, and don't matter now. Only Texas stood up to this fuck and got it done.

[Idolatry]

I know that, which is why this sheik should have been arrested along with the "husband" and the father. If nothing else, he was contributing to the delinquency of a minor.

Even though Jeffs is in prison, the FLDS, the Kingston clan, and other fundamentalist Mormon groups are still marrying child brides and/or close blood relatives (I know Jeffs only has authority over the FLDS but I mention the others to show that this phenomenon isn't confined to just that group). It seems that law enforcement and the public at large know that this is going on but doesn't do anything, either because they don't want negative publicity a la the Short Creek Raid or because no one in the group would inform on anyone else (i.e., no one to press charges). While John and Jane Q. Public don't have the freedom to rape children, it appears that these isolationist religious groups do. :disgust: :angry-banghead:

Warren Jeffs was sued and indicted by AZ and Utah years before Texas actually put him in prison. Don't underestimate the courage that took for Brent Jeffs in 2004, years before the FBI and other authorities gave a shit. He wasn't indicted in Texas until 2008.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Actually, that isn't why Warren Jeffs is in prison at all. He's in prison on the Texas charges, which are sexual assault. Those accomplice charges are the AZ/Utah charges, which never stuck, and don't matter now. Only Texas stood up to this fuck and got it done.

That the charges "never stuck" isn't exactly accurate. He was convicted of accomplice to rape but later had the conviction overturned. Anyhow, it's obviously hard to proceed with victims unwilling to testify, but I still don't think it's fair to say the U.S. excuses child rape due to religious freedom. I think the religious groups, no matter the location, just tend to hide the evidence and sadly brainwash victims.

[Idolatry]

That the charges "never stuck" isn't exactly accurate. He was convicted of accomplice to rape but later had the conviction overturned. Anyhow, it's obviously hard to proceed with victims unwilling to testify, but I still don't think it's fair to say the U.S. excuses child rape due to religious freedom. I think the religious groups, no matter the location, just tend to hide the evidence and sadly brainwash victims.

He is not currently convicted of anything in AZ or Utah. And yes, the charges did not stick because they were overturned, and many he was never even tried on because nobody cares enough to extradite him now.

It's pretty clear now that both Arizona and Utah could have done something years earlier, and probably even had enough information to do so if anyone gave a shit. They knew a lot after his nephew sued him in 2003 and various ex-members bravely went public.

I think the whole US learned a lot from Warren Jeffs and would now be much more responsive. I think people were horrified when they realized how bad it was and that so many people had been saying so for years.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Rape is hard enough to try and get a con victim even if you having someone willing to testify. It's even harder if the suspected victims won't testify. It doesn't mean they're protected more, it just means it's harder to build a case.

So basically what is your point, the government doesn't care about child rape? Or child rape in religious groups?

I was just responding to the allegation that in the US. he wouldn't be charged because of religious freedom. I think that if this case were in the U.S. He would be. It's clearly at least child abuse to sell your 12yo.

[Idolatry]

Rape is hard enough to try and get a con victim even if you having someone willing to testify. It's even harder if the suspected victims won't testify. It doesn't mean they're protected more, it just means it's harder to build a case.

So basically what is your point, the government doesn't care about child rape? Or child rape in religious groups?

I was just responding to the allegation that in the US. he wouldn't be charged because of religious freedom. I think that if this case were in the U.S. He would be. It's clearly at least child abuse to sell your 12yo.

There were plenty of people willing to testify. Lots of people were working hard to put Warren Jeffs in prison. Hell, his nephew sued in civil court. His Arizona charges were pending for years. There were a lot of people who dropped the ball when it came to actually dragging this fuck into court, but don't act like he didn't have a courtroom full of people ready to put him away, YEARS before anything actually happened.

So, yes, I think Warren Jeffs is a good example of authorities looking the other way/dropping the ball/not giving a shit or whatever you want to call it. In the end, Warren Jeffs got what he deserved, but it could have been stopped years earlier.

[Mama Mia]

Entirely different situation, but in my community for awhile we had a big issue with clashing cultural norms. An indigenous group from Southern Mexico was basically driven into the U.S. And farm labor by the fuck-all that is NAFTA. They didn't speak the common languages and had completely different customs regarding sexuality. It caused a big problem with social services and law enforcement because in their culture it was perfectly acceptable for 12 year olds to have sex and get married-- sometimes to much older people.

One of their traditions for weddings was for the grooms family to provide a cow and chickens etc for the wedding. So this got translated in the news accounts to 12 year olds being sold for cows. If CPS got involved the parents, who had thought they were doing nothing wrong in allowing their 12 year old to have a sexual relationship with a 30 year year old , had a steep learning curve on what's acceptable in the U.S. . Because they found it strange that you would constrain your child that way. And just getting the message across was extremely challenging because there were, at the time, virtually no workers who spoke the language.

I'm not suggesting the Australian situation, or Warren Jeffs, is remotely the same. But it's interesting when you get these extreme culture clashes.

[DaffyDill]

The husband has been gaoled as mentioned above, the father is out on bail, but was convicted for "procuring a child of under 14 for unlawful sexual activity". Although currently on bail, he may face gaol time as well - and should IMHO.

The sheikh who performed the ceremony at the father's house in free and hasn't been charged. The marriage is not recognised under Australian law - not sure if that made a difference at all.

The girl is in the care of authorities, so probably in foster care where I hope she can get past this, receive an education, and learn she is worth more than her father seems to think. Apparently, as she reached puberty, the father wanted her married off in case she committed the sin of having sex outside of marriage. Her mother said in court that she didn't agree with the marriage, But it appears the girl must have been in the father's custody, as the parents aren't together, and the wife testified against the husband.

This article is pretty dreadful in parts with some domestic violence, but interesting (and awful) to read how often young girls in Australia are married off young, and disappear under the radar of the authorities. http://www.theaustralian.com.au/life/we ... 6949239039 Didn't break link - news site.

[Toothfairy]

:wtf: The girl's father didn't want her to have sex outside of marriage so he pimped her out to a 26 year old man. This is wrong on so many levels.

:angry-banghead: :angry-banghead: :angry-banghead:

This is the most stupidest thing I've heard. First if any grown ass many as interest in a child then hrs a pedophile. Second allowing your 12 yo to get married just because you're worried she might break her seal of passage is sick and wrong. The father needs to be in prison with the 26yo. Poor kid has Noone to protect her.

[Trynn]

Actually, if the girl in question had reached puberty, the man is not a pedophile, but an ephebophile.

Which doesn't make what happened any less horrible, and he shouldn't have gotten involved with her.

[lilith]

The girl was the daughter of a convert. Which means she was probably a white girl with a mainstream primary school education which explains why she had the confidence to report this to the authorities and also (sadly) why it's front page news. These "marriages" happen to girls from migrant communities on a regular basis and fathers/husbands are very rarely charged and the girls don't go to the police because they fear "shaming" their families.