In Which Lori C & P's Fournier's Public School Diatribe

[Loveday]

Once again, Lori copies and pastes something without any research whatsoever. This time, it's Ray Fournier's "Behind Enemy Lines," which has been discussed here on FJ before. ( viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22955&hilit=ray+fournier )

 

The comments will be fun to watch.

 

lorialexander.blogspot.com/2014/12/public-school-teacher-says-get-your.html#idc-container

[nelliebelle1197]

L. Ron is posting in the comments!

[browncoatslytherin]

does lori ever have a truly original thought?

{L_MESSAGE_HIDDEN}:

eta: OMG L RON, I'M SO OVER THERE RIGHT NOW!

[sparkles]

Seriously, have NONE of these freaking fundies who fall all over themselves about Fournier's "awesome" message ever thought about how he's contributing to this terrible ebil he rails against? God loses out to money, I guess, since Fournier whores himself out on a daily basis.

[ViolaSebastian]

So public education is a big no-no, but if you can't stand your children enough to home school *ahem* and you have enough dough, it's totes okay to ship them off to a private school.

Gotcha. Kids can get an education outside of home schooling if you're wealthy; if you're poor, suck on it.

ETA: This: ***You don't think the following verse is a warning to parents about

sending their children to public schools?

Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offenses contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and AVOID them...by good words and fair speeches {they} deceive the hearts of the simple.

Romans 16:17,18

Nope, Lori, I most certainly do not think that verse is about public schools, being that public schools weren't even conceived of in the Western hemisphere until hundreds of years after it was written.

[browncoatslytherin]

So public education is a big no-no, but if you can't stand your children enough to home school *ahem* and you have enough dough, it's totes okay to ship them off to a private school.

Gotcha. Kids can get an education outside of home schooling if you're wealthy, if you're poor; suck on it.

homeschooling still isn't cheap though, since you have to buy all books and materials yourself. doing homeschooling right can still be pricey. so, poor christians have to do shoddy homeschooling, i guess?

[ViolaSebastian]

homeschooling still isn't cheap though, since you have to buy all books and materials yourself. doing homeschooling right can still be pricey. so, poor christians have to do shoddy homeschooling, i guess?

Yeah, just give em a math worksheet and have them read library books for a couple of hours in their rooms. If it was good enough for Lori's kids, it should be good enough for everybody's kids, right?

[jerkit]

Lori rule #1: you must do things exactly as I say, but I never did them that way.

[nelliebelle1197]

And Hiswife is there now! And she is not allowed to go "woot woot!".

[quiversR4hunting]

L. Ron is posting in the comments!

...and the comments now only show 4...bummer...missed any of the good ones!

never mind- I'm an idiot. I've had a sick kid since Saturday and I forgot the name L. Ron posts under...I have it now, I see his post. Don't mind me.

I do wonder how many deleted comments there have been :)

[browncoatslytherin]

And Hiswife is there now! And she is not allowed to go "woot woot!".

poor amanda. the post makes her feel like yelling "woot woot!" and fist pump, but it's "not her nature" so she's sitting still...

uh, amanda, honey, if you FEEL like doing something, THAT IS YOUR NATURE. :angry-banghead: i think what she means is "my husband doesn't like that, so i don't do it". the denial is strong in this one. i almost wish i was around for the original cabinetman debacle so i could see it from inception!

[jerkit]

I think public school is just a convenient scapegoat for fundies whose children choose a different life. It's pretty obvious from this comment, from a lady named Kathy who is one of Lori's FB leghumpers:

Sadly, my husband & I sent our two through the public school system, except for 5 years spent in charter school (elementary). Both of my kids are struggling with their faith in God, in which they have a strong Biblical foundation. One has been transformed into a doubter. The other is a full-grown prodigal. I'm seeing the same pattern in many of the Christian families I know who opted for the public school system. Pray for each & every child whose heart has been taken hostage by Satan and our evil world. AND IF YOU HAVE SCHOOL AGE CHILDREN, GET THEM OUT OF PUBLIC SCHOOL. The only other plea I have is "Come quickly, Lord Jesus!"

[browncoatslytherin]

I think public school is just a convenient scapegoat for fundies whose children choose a different life. It's pretty obvious from this comment, from a lady named Kathy who is one of Lori's FB leghumpers:

if my reply would be allowed on there (it totally wouldn't be) i would say this:

"you know, it's funny...i've only had four months of public school education. the rest of my school career has been a combination of christian-based homeschooling and christian school (pretty strict, fundamental, ifb). and yet, at 22, i left the christian faith entirely, after almost a lifetime of doubts. and today i identify as pagan. i highly doubt four months in a public school did anything to my faith, as i had doubts well before that. instead, doubts even grew more after i started not only attending christian high school but a pretty strict christian camp during the summer, especially including their leadership camp (northland camp & conference center, dunbar, wisconsin). funny how the more i was immersed in that world, the more i wanted to leave it. but, you know, that would totally undermine the whole argument here, so pardon me for trying to interject logic into it."

[quiversR4hunting]

if my reply would be allowed on there (it totally wouldn't be) i would say this:

"you know, it's funny...i've only had four months of public school education. the rest of my school career has been a combination of christian-based homeschooling and christian school (pretty strict, fundamental, ifb). and yet, at 22, i left the christian faith entirely, after almost a lifetime of doubts. and today i identify as pagan. i highly doubt four months in a public school did anything to my faith, as i had doubts well before that. instead, doubts even grew more after i started not only attending christian high school but a pretty strict christian camp during the summer, especially including their leadership camp (northland camp & conference center, dunbar, wisconsin). funny how the more i was immersed in that world, the more i wanted to leave it. but, you know, that would totally undermine the whole argument here, so pardon me for trying to interject logic into it."

I laugh at all their hysteria about all of this, all they see are the news stories of all the bad in the schools and of course what happens on the news is only a small percentage of what happens in the world on any given day. Plus there is a reason that preacher kids have a reputation.

And my reply (which also would never see the light of day) would be:

Our town has a great school- it's the only school in town and it is public. We have fellowship of Christian athletes that meet weekly before school, we have a local church that doesn't have their own building so they use the performance arts facility at the high school. I know many of the teachers and most of them are good people many whom are also Christian. I know many, many graduates that continue with their faith after graduation. The public school isn't destroying these kid's faith, if their faith is destroyed, it starts at home.

[lilwriter85]

homeschooling still isn't cheap though, since you have to buy all books and materials yourself. doing homeschooling right can still be pricey. so, poor christians have to do shoddy homeschooling, i guess?

Yup, it can be pricey. I knew a fundie lite family that homeschooled their three sons. They lived near my family when I was growing up. The mom told my parents that the books and materials were expensive, but she reused some of the books and materials. I don't know what programs/curriciulum she used. This was back in the 90s. I know a few people who did secular homeschooling in recent years and again they said some stuff was expensive and one secular homeschooling mom told me that she always shopped around for used textbooks for certain subjects. Increased use of computers and Internet has probably altered homeschooling expenses a bit, but that depends on whether a family chooses to use nothing but books and other materials or a program that combines computer/Internet use.

I think an example of shoddy homeschooling was Latisha aka Jessica from Idaho. She is one of the Zsu's biggest homegirls. When Jessica's oldest child was 6, she started homeschooling and IIRC, she didn't have a curriculum when they started and then she later enlisted a woman from church to help her out. Later on, I think Jessica commented on Zsu's blog about how they joined ATI and were using ATI materials for the kids.

[browncoatslytherin]

I laugh at all their hysteria about all of this, all they see are the news stories of all the bad in the schools and of course what happens on the news is only a small percentage of what happens in the world on any given day. Plus there is a reason that preacher kids have a reputation.

And my reply (which also would never see the light of day) would be:

Our town has a great school- it's the only school in town and it is public. We have fellowship of Christian athletes that meet weekly before school, we have a local church that doesn't have their own building so they use the performance arts facility at the high school. I know many of the teachers and most of them are good people many whom are also Christian. I know many, many graduates that continue with their faith after graduation. The public school isn't destroying these kid's faith, if their faith is destroyed, it starts at home.

lol i can hear lorken pulling out the "exception" clause for their blog :lol:

[jerkit]

The conspiracy is strong in this one. Thanks, Anonymous for the chuckle:

Great post. :)

Question: any thoughts for how to deal with the inequity between siblings because of age? Say a parent pulls their kids from public school, one is 14, the other is 8. The 14 year old had to suffer in P.S. more years than the 8 year old. Ideas on how to soothe resentments?

Thoughts: A local public school was torn down and rebuilt. The former building was charming, but well dated. The new school had everyone buzzing... how great for our students! etc.

I want the old building back.

The student bathrooms are open. I'll try to describe this as best as I can. Boys and girls share one huge room separated by an island well below ceiling height with toilet stalls on each side. No door separating the bathroom from the main hallway, and no doors separating boys and girls sections. Boys on the left, girls on the right. Only doors on the stalls that don't reach to the floor - space is everywhere. My standards are high - I NEED more restroom privacy than that, and want it for any future daughters in law, nieces, and these precious young students.

The stairs in the building have holes/open spaces between the steps. Ladies wearing skirts walking up stairs know what I'm talking about here. If people are under the stairs, they can look up skirts walking up the stairs if there are spaces between the steps. Pair these steps with cameras all over the building and girls wearing shorter skirts nowadays, and we have a lady's nightmare!!! Boys can easily look, purposefully or accidentally, parents of all backgrounds can accidentally or purposefully look, and who is behind the security cameras? These young girls go skipping up the stairs every day. :(

The school is in an affluent area, financially. But, these are the trends. :(

[thoughtful]

Gee, Lori, keep up.

If you are going to steal ideas from others, at least steal recent ones.

[browncoatslytherin]

Gee, Lori, keep up.

If you are going to steal ideas from others, at least steal recent ones.

we can't judge lori too harshly for that, she doesn't have the goggle tactics

[formergothardite]

My reply would be:

Ken and Lori, I'm from a conservative Christian family of nine children. The oldest ones only attended a very conservative Christian school. I started at a Christian school but was pulled out to be homeschooled. My parents were members of the very same homeschool group the Duggars are. This upbringing is what drove me to stop believing in God. Of my siblings only one is still a conservative Christian. The rest are either atheists, agnostic, or very, very liberal Christians. We all agree that the way we were raised helped move us away from being a Christian like our parents are. I look at the people I knew growing up that went to public school and got to do all the things that we were not allowed to do and 90% are still active, conservative Christians. When I look at the conservative homeschoolers I was raised with, I see less than 50% stayed a fundamental Christian. Spending so much time immersed in the Bible can really help a person learn to hate God. My parents did all the "right" things and still ended up with children that are way more godless than their friends who did the "wrong" things and sent their kids to public school.

[usmcmom]

we can't judge lori too harshly for that, she doesn't have the goggle tactics

I think she "wrote" this post weeks ago when FJ was discussing this article. Then she just added it to her roster of scheduled posts. She's got a lot of things to steal...I mean...cover, guys! It takes time to get around to all of it.

[docmom]

Without public schools we'd all be living in a world much as it was in the 1700s. Without mass education we would have no skilled technical workers. We would have be without many of the innovations that make Lori's life so much easier than that of her great great grandmother because most of people who came up with those innovations did so because of public schooling. Lori would have died many years ago from her meningioma. Public schools have immeasurably moved society forwards and despite the fundie hankering for the glorious past, I don't think many of them would actually like to live in it.

[GolightlyGrrl]

If conservative Christians choose to pull their children from public school, well then, good! Conservative Christians have done nothing but add the dumbing down of America, not to mention far too many of them are nasty, bigoted bullies who make other people's lives a living hell.

[ViolaSebastian]

Only doors on the stalls that don't reach to the floor - space is everywhere.

What sort of public restrooms is this woman using where the stall doors reach the floor? I don't think I've ever been in one that has doors all the way down to the floor.

[Pammy]

In a layout like she discribes -- shared entrance, shared island of sinks, which is basically a shared washroom... If it's accurate, I'd expect fully enclosed stalls.

However, it could be an inaccurate discription of two washrooms accessed by separate hallway-twist style entrances (instead of doors) with some openness for light and air high above the separate sink areas, that happened to share a wall.