Old Schoolhouse Leaders Covered Up Child Abuse

[Et Moi]

I've been lurking for a few months but haven't posted. I know I saw a thread about Paul and Gena Suarez and the Old Schoolhouse a while back. But there have been recent developments and apparently there a bunch of other people who knew about the abuse and did nothing. It's pretty awful.

When Homeschool Leaders Looked Away: The Old Schoolhouse Cover-up

[apple1]

Assuming that the info in that article is correct - there is some info that is rather damning of Gibbs III - definitely not the victim advocate that his representation of Lourdes Torres would lead one to think -

disclaimer - assuming this source is truthful.

Seems like Gibbs III is on whatever side is likely to get him some money.

[Et Moi]

Assuming that the info in that article is correct - there is some info that is rather damning of Gibbs III - definitely not the victim advocate that his representation of Lourdes Torres would lead one to think -

disclaimer - assuming this source is truthful.

Seems like Gibbs III is on whatever side is likely to get him some money.

Gibbs is definitely not to be trusted. Just because his hatred of Doug Phillips outweighed everything else doesn't mean he was ever a good guy.

Gibbs though, just one of a whole number of powerful names in the homeschool movement who worked together to cover up this abuse. That's the real story--it's not just one guy, it's a whole lot of people who pretend that they care about children in the abstract but will do anything they can to silence children who were victimized. The movement is more important than lives, even if it means a concerted effort to keep child molesters from justice.

[DGayle]

I think the hatred among these leaders is because they all want to be the one and only top dog.

Is it just me, or are the more devout Christians and Catholics more likely to molest kids than non-believers or loosely-religious?

[Jasmar]

If there is a correlation, I suspect it's that abusers (narcissists and sociopaths) are attracted to authoritarian systems. And some are especially drawn to Christian groups because those groups add to the mix naïveté and a generally bass-ackwards approach to dealing with sin (hurling judgment at non-Christians while protecting equally egregious sin within the group).

Speaking as an evangelical, that's my simplistic take on it.

[FoxyMoxie]

I think the hatred among these leaders is because they all want to be the one and only top dog.

Is it just me, or are the more devout Christians and Catholics more likely to molest kids than non-believers or loosely-religious?

Well, Catholics are Christians for one thing.

I don't think it's about religion making them more likely to molest kids, it's just that child molesters are drawn to positions where they'll be in power over kids - which includes religious positions. There are plenty of molesters of other religions (you can be non-Christian and religious!) and of no religion, they'll just be school caretakers or teachers or police officers etc etc instead of in a religious job.

[Palimpsest]

Thanks for delurking, Et Moi, and welcome.

Gibbs is definitely not to be trusted. Just because his hatred of Doug Phillips outweighed everything else doesn't mean he was ever a good guy.

Gibbs though, just one of a whole number of powerful names in the homeschool movement who worked together to cover up this abuse. That's the real story--it's not just one guy, it's a whole lot of people who pretend that they care about children in the abstract but will do anything they can to silence children who were victimized. The movement is more important than lives, even if it means a concerted effort to keep child molesters from justice.

Similar disclaimer to Apple1: If the information in the article is true and if we are not looking at confusion with David Gibbs II, as has happened in the past. I seem to remember that Gibbs II has been involved in this case for a while. Apple1 can you confirm that? Your memory is almost certainly better than mine about the assorted Gibbses.

That said, it's really bad if Gibbs III is involved in "mediating" this case - and it looks like he is. It seems to me (notalawyer) that Gibbs III has a clear conflict of interest here.

From the article:

one of Jenefer’s children realized Gibbs was a part-owner as well as a corporate sponsor and organizational partner of the Great Homeschool Conventions—the company that just banned Jenefer from their convention and featured Heidi St. John. GHC has only three corporate sponsors: one is The Old Schoolhouse and another is David Gibbs’ National Center for Life and Liberty. Jenefer also found out Gibbs was a columnist for The Old Schoolhouse.

Aren't there rules for lawyers about that sort of thing? It stinks of professional misconduct, IMO.

What I really don't get is why Jenefer agreed to mediation in the first place. The whole situation is incredibly toxic. I know it's hard, but stop worrying about being shunned and blow the whole alleged (although I certainly believe it's possible if not probable) cover-up wide open please. This has gone on long enough.

Edit: clarification

[Palimpsest]

FYI, another take on the Old Schoolhouse scandal:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfem ... andal.html

Link not broken because it's Libby Anne.

I tend to agree with her. This has the potential to be bigger than Doug Phillips and Gothard because it involves so many more people.

[DGayle]

Well, Catholics are Christians for one thing.

I know, but I know a lot of people, Catholic and not, who see Catholicism as being apart from Christianity. Better, or not Christian, depending on their views

[apple1]

Thanks for delurking, Et Moi, and welcome.

Similar disclaimer to Apple1: If the information in the article is true and if we are not looking at confusion with David Gibbs II, as has happened in the past. I seem to remember that Gibbs II has been involved in this case for a while. Apple1 can you confirm that? Your memory is almost certainly better than mine about the assorted Gibbses.

That said, it's really bad if Gibbs III is involved in "mediating" this case - and it looks like he is. It seems to me (notalawyer) that Gibbs III has a clear conflict of interest here.

From the article:

Aren't there rules for lawyers about that sort of thing? It stinks of professional misconduct, IMO.

What I really don't get is why Jenefer agreed to mediation in the first place. The whole situation is incredibly toxic. I know it's hard, but stop worrying about being shunned and blow the whole alleged (although I certainly believe it's possible if not probable) cover-up wide open please. This has gone on long enough.

Edit: clarification

Palimpsest, most of my info and knowledge about the 2 Gibbs is from IFB circles, but not from homeschool circles (hope that makes some sense). So I don't know the answer about whether Gibbs II was previously involved in this case.

It is definitely the case that the 2 Gibbs are fairly frequently confused and the actions of one of them attributed to the other - many times by people speaking "authoritatively" while being factually wrong.

Changing topic slightly - I also would like to know about the legalities of some of this - at best - unprofessional conduct that clearly involves conflict of interest.

[Et Moi]

FYI, another take on the Old Schoolhouse scandal:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/lovejoyfem ... andal.html

Link not broken because it's Libby Anne.

I tend to agree with her. This has the potential to be bigger than Doug Phillips and Gothard because it involves so many more people.

This bears repeating. Just the fact that HSLDA was brought into it and did nothing is huge, especially in light of what Libby Anne said about them finally creating a page on their website about sexual abuse. It's a PR game--pretend you care by putting something on the website, look the other way when they're told a child molester is being protected by major homeschool leaders.

BTW, it is Gibbs III, the Homeschoolers Anonymous article specifically identifies him, and the article says they have access the mediation agreement, so it's not something they could confuse. The man is playing both sides.

Oh, and thanks for the welcome everyone :)

[freehannie]

What a horrible mess. I have nothing but sympathy for the children abused and anger at those who covered this up. I am once again struck by how the intersection of business interests, concerns about the reputations of perpetrators, and religious rhetoric end up silencing people who try to do anything about abuse. How can anyone defend this as Christian behavior? It just shows how in these circles money, power, and image are the true motivators and maintaining control matters much more than protecting the innocent from harm.

[Palimpsest]

Palimpsest, most of my info and knowledge about the 2 Gibbs is from IFB circles, but not from homeschool circles (hope that makes some sense). So I don't know the answer about whether Gibbs II was previously involved in this case.

It is definitely the case that the 2 Gibbs are fairly frequently confused and the actions of one of them attributed to the other - many times by people speaking "authoritatively" while being factually wrong.

Changing topic slightly - I also would like to know about the legalities of some of this - at best - unprofessional conduct that clearly involves conflict of interest.

Thanks Apple1. Re. the confusion between Gibbses, I did a quick search this morning, and believe that I was misremembering this article re. Gibbs Jr. being involved in the case:

homeschoolersanonymous.wordpress.com/2014/06/24/paul-and-gena-suarez-old-schoolhouse-publishers-accused-of-protecting-known-child-predators/

It's another good overview for people unfamiliar with TOS scandal, but the article itself was confused about which Gibbs was involved at the time. I couldn't find any other references to Gibbs Jr. and TOS but they may be out there.

Julie Anne at SSB contacted Gibbs III and tried to clarify who was involved where when Lourdes retained him. The comments section got really interesting a couple of weeks later (scroll down to the bottom) but I missed it. JA had to put a disclaimer on her original post:

spiritualsoundingboard.com/2014/05/26/which-attorney-david-gibbs-leads-the-lawsuit-of-lourdes-torres-manteufel-vs-douglas-phillips-the-father-or-the-son/

This person who posted at SSB has a huge bone to pick with Gibbs III and gets into conspiracy theories regarding the big split between Gibbs Jr. and Gibbs III: jeriwho.net/lillypad2/?p=14122

She also states that III covered up his past involvement in the Roloff Homes case for political reasons. Be that as it may ...

The timing of David Gibbs III's "Letter to the Nation" is interesting. This was issued July 1, 2014 after his (IMO COI) participation in the "mediation" in TOS debacle. ncll.org/latest-from-ncll/193-ncll-7-11-14-national-letter

Particularly note the third bullet where he says that he "absolutely stands against child abuse cover-ups." Hmmmm.

Like Apple1, I'd love a real legal opinion here, but IMO lawyers should avoid even the appearance of conflict of interest. It doesn't look as though Gibbs III is doing that. At all.

None of this means that Gibbs III won't do a good job representing Lourdes in her case against Doug Phillips, but I think he should be regarded with extreme caution. He may not be practicing what he preaches.

ETA. forgot a link

[RosyDaisy]

What's been happening over the last year reminds me of the televangelist scandals of the 80s and 90s. Only these are much worse and not getting enough national attention. Something tells me these recent scandals are barely the tip of the iceberg. I hope they fall hard and end up in prison!

[Palimpsest]

This bears repeating. Just the fact that HSLDA was brought into it and did nothing is huge, especially in light of what Libby Anne said about them finally creating a page on their website about sexual abuse. It's a PR game--pretend you care by putting something on the website, look the other way when they're told a child molester is being protected by major homeschool leaders.

BTW, it is Gibbs III, the Homeschoolers Anonymous article specifically identifies him, and the article says they have access the mediation agreement, so it's not something they could confuse. The man is playing both sides.

Oh, and thanks for the welcome everyone :)

I agree, the whole thing stinks of wrong-doing and cover-ups. I also agree that the evidence is there that Gibbs III is involved, see my response above.

Et Moi, now you've delurked you need to keep posting. We don't all bite. :mrgreen:

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

I've been lurking for a few months but haven't posted. I know I saw a thread about Paul and Gena Suarez and the Old Schoolhouse a while back. But there have been recent developments and apparently there a bunch of other people who knew about the abuse and did nothing. It's pretty awful.

When Homeschool Leaders Looked Away: The Old Schoolhouse Cover-up

I guess that seeing churches and the Vaticunt doing so, --- and governments not doing anything about it, --- they decided to follow what the religious do while looking for the same type of impunity.

[Extricated]

What's been happening over the last year reminds me of the televangelist scandals of the 80s and 90s. Only these are much worse and not getting enough national attention. Something tells me these recent scandals are barely the tip of the iceberg. I hope they fall hard and end up in prison!

I have a terrible feeling that this is only the tip of the iceberg. I know many followers of some of these leaders, and it wasn't until the leaders fell that the churches that followed their teachings started taking some of the abuse allegations from children in their congregations seriously. The church elders realized that some of the teachings may have just been a means to for the leaders cover their own asses.

The Old Schoolhouse publishers have ignored allegations in the past and they went away quietly. I hope this time that the pressure stays on them until it's blown open. They still have young children at home that should be kept safe. I hope that the others involved speak up for the sake of those kids.

I know there are some lawyers here so I hope you don't mind if I ask the same question that others asked above. Are there any ramifications for Gibbs III's deceptions in this?

[ADoyle90815]

Well, Catholics are Christians for one thing.

I don't think it's about religion making them more likely to molest kids, it's just that child molesters are drawn to positions where they'll be in power over kids - which includes religious positions. There are plenty of molesters of other religions (you can be non-Christian and religious!) and of no religion, they'll just be school caretakers or teachers or police officers etc etc instead of in a religious job.

I think child molesters are drawn to positions where they'll have power over kids, especially if churches don't do any background checks before allowing someone to work with children. Also, child molesters know that parents are more likely to let their guard down with church members than they are with anyone else, so it's another reason they're drawn to religious positions. Often, if there's suspected abuse, parents are taught to let the church leaders handle the situation, and discouraged from going to the police.

[Gnostic Christian Bishop]

I think that if there are lawyers her, then they should be finding a way to make Governments repeal the Noble Lie that they have us living under and force the churches to behave or die.

Lawyers, with respect to some lawyers, have been sitting on their morals and allowing the churches to get away with constantly lying to us as well as assaulting our children.

With tax concessions of course.

Are we tired of paying priests to assault our children on out tax $$$ ?

I am.

At it's root. this problem is a legal one and it will be the lawyer who steps up who will solve this problem.

If any here have the means to hire a lawyer, then please do so.

[ViolaSebastian]

I guess that seeing churches and the Vaticunt doing so, --- and governments not doing anything about it, --- they decided to follow what the religious do while looking for the same type of impunity.

Please don't use a slang word for a women's vagina as an insult.