North Dakota bans abortion.

[Minerva]

How about these morons who dreamed this crap up have to wade through a couple dozen pitch black hallways filled with legos and little green army men before they can send that bill through.

They should have to be hooked up to one of those labour simulators for 12 hours before they can pass it. Informed consent and all that.

[Minerva]

The first time a doctor refuses to treat a pregnant woman because it might harm the fetus and the woman ends up dead or severely incapacitated, the law will be repealed (if it even lasts that long).

Maybe sooner. A lot of North Dakotans are going to get the shock of their lives if their birth control becomes illegal. Oh what I would pay to be a fly on the wall when Douchy McLawmaker's wife tells him he can't have sex with her because he made her birth control illegal.

[FreeJosie]

"which would endow fertilized eggs with all the rights of U.S. citizens"

Oh FFS

I agree...what a scary thought.

[dairyfreelife]

Does this mean people will now have a conception certificate to prove the start of their existence? If a couple conceives in another country, does that mean the fetus isn't a legal US citizen?

[ShadowyOne]

What if the fetus inside a woman isn't human? Does it deserve rights?

Well, I have jokingly referred to my (very wanted) currently gestating fetus as a xenomorph. You never know. Other than that, the people behind this legislation can go DIAF while standing on Lego. No woman who doesn't want to should have to go through pregnancy, and I count myself as very lucky that I never had to before I was emotionally and financially ready.

[JenniferJuniper]

Does this mean people will now have a conception certificate to prove the start of their existence? If a couple conceives in another country, does that mean the fetus isn't a legal US citizen?

Bring your pee stick down to the local city hall for an "Embryo Existence Certificate" and you'll be able to apply for Social Security number for your little blessing-to-be. We recommend picking a unisex name, as even Jesus in heaven doesn't know yet whether it will be a girl or a boy. Instead of DOB we'll be using DOLC (Date of Likely Conception) so be sure to keep excellent records regarding your sexual activity. Log books will be available at your local pharmacy for a nominal fee. Most importantly, should something go wrong and you miscarry, immediately report to your local Uterine Investigation Center so a criminal investigation into whether you played any role in the demise of your embryo can begin. If you are cleared, you’ll be issued a death certificate which you can use for tax purposes. In the event you are found to be responsible for the termination of the pregnancy, you will be arrested and charged with First Degree Murder, so be sure to leave any existing children you may have in the care of trusted relatives before arriving at the Center.

[MandyLaLa]

I wish there was a way that this law would make any ejaculation that is not inside a woman's vagina illegal somehow. If men couldn't masterbate theirs no way they'd pass this law.

I think it'd be awesome if women in ND refused to have sex while this law is in effect.

[Syd+Marky]

I guess now would be a lucrative time to set up an abortion clinic in East Grand Forks,Minnesota.

[MonkeyMomma]

My husband and I would like to know if families can get tax credits for embryos, if they are endowed with the rights of citizens. If that's the case, we are moving to North Dakota and putting 20 embryos on ice indefinitely. That would really reduce our tax burden.

[MandyLaLa]

My husband and I would like to know if families can get tax credits for embryos, if they are endowed with the rights of citizens. If that's the case, we are moving to North Dakota and putting 20 embryos on ice indefinitely. That would really reduce our tax burden.

Nd you'd have more kids J'uterus :lol:

[Childless]

That's what I want to know! Or what if the woman falls ill and miscarries; will police be waiting at the hospital to arrest her for manslaughter?

If women want to end a pregnancy and can't abort, does this mean they'll be flinging themselves down the stairs before they go for the coat hangers? Way to go, North Dakota.

Hell, even caffeine can trigger a miscarriage in some women. Will women be denied the right to drink soda or eat chocolate while pregnant? If you do something like drink alcohol or take medication before you even know you're pregnant and it causes a miscarriage will you be arrested and thrown into prison? Ugh. North Dakota politicians are among the stupidest people I've ever seen. Thank god I don't live there. All of these attempts at "personhood" laws makes me want to stop trying for another child. My only child is a boy. If I have another one, I might run the risk of bringing a girl into this mess.

[Peas n carrots]

Hell, even caffeine can trigger a miscarriage in some women. Will women be denied the right to drink soda or eat chocolate while pregnant? If you do something like drink alcohol or take medication before you even know you're pregnant and it causes a miscarriage will you be arrested and thrown into prison? Ugh. North Dakota politicians are among the stupidest people I've ever seen. Thank god I don't live there. All of these attempts at "personhood" laws makes me want to stop trying for another child. My only child is a boy. If I have another one, I might run the risk of bringing a girl into this mess.

I don't think these lawmakers think this all the way through when they vote (in which the citizens of ND need to do a better job when going to the polls). Or, the lawmakers are more likely thinking about their next primary. If some of thr GOP lawmakers DIDN'T vote for this, I'm sure their opponent in the next primary would bring this up. As we saw in the presidential primaries last year for thr GOP it has become a race to the bottom to say the most batshit thing possible on a wide range of subjects. And guess what, in a splintered party that worked for Santorum in many of the more conservative states.

Im no expert on North Dakota politics, but I wouldn't be surprised if some of the lawmakers might think personhood is stupid, but they vote for it so they can stay in office.

[Rosa]

OF COURSE you would be able to be prosecuted for doing anything that may or may not have caused a miscarriage - remember the Iowa woman who was charged after she fell down the stairs, and that poor Chinese immigrant woman who went to prison for trying to kill herself?

The key, the VERY BEST thing about these laws, for the assholes who promote them, is that of course it's ludicrous to investigate/prosecute every miscarriage. So you have this tool you can use only against the women you want more power over - poor women, Native women, women on public aid, immigrant women, women who divorce their husbands - the woman in Iowa, her soon-to-be-ex husband was the one who thought she was trying to harm the baby.

There's already only one clinic in N. Dakota and it's staffed by doctors who fly in from Minnesota. Putting a clinic just over the border would just get that clinic bombed. A few years ago when South Dakota was doing similar shit, the President of the Oglala proposed having PP build a clinic on Pine Ridge (which is, remember, the absolutely poorest county in the country) and was impeached by the tribal council over it.

[MandyLaLa]

Melissa Harris Perry is doing a fantastic segment on MSNBC right mow, interviewing director of the clinic in Fargo.

[spinsterwv]

Food for thought:

http://www.unc.edu/news/archives/jun99/wilcox2.htm

Conception is the point where the sperm fertilizes the egg. Depending on the day of ovulation, up to 80 percent can simply never attach and pass on through. That's a lot of eggs with full rights, when the woman was not even pregnant yet!

[Fargood]

Here's another good opinion on Rep. Bette Grande and her quixotic ambitions:

inforum.com/event/article/id/393833/group/Opinion/

Her husband owns a law office in Fargo. His partner has a public history of spousal abuse and stalking.

[DutchieV]

I live and vote in North Dakota. Before this, I've lived and voted in several other states.

And while I'm not going to get into the actual issue(s) at hand, I can tell you that North Dakota politics are strange. A lot of people who live in North Dakota are just... different. There is a strong Norwegian population that tends to be isolationist, and focused on taking care of oneself. And I have noticed across a large range of issues, where they tend towards liberal or conservative - if they feel like it's being propelled or puppeted by outside factors - BOOM. It's over. That is especially in constitutional, population-voted matters. They generally do not like to feel like they are being told what to do by anyone else.

Issues in the last 3 years that I can specifically think of that this was a problem: Last month's effort to protect someone due to their sexual orientation, November's attempt at implementing a rudimentary animal abuse law, the election before that was the proposal that there will be no legislation that compromises the freedom to practice religion however one sees fit. There are two more that I can't remember the details of, that it was a STRONG outcry against outside forces, and the population voted the measure down overwhelmingly.

I don't know where I was neccessarily going with that, except to say that North Dakota is a different place. Until recently, we were a state with a Republican Governor, Two Democratic Senators and 1 Democratic Representative for many years. Things work differently here, and there will be fall out from outside interventions, however they manifest.

[gilora]

North Dakota is a "taker" state. If it's going to defy the constitution and federal courts, perhaps it should lose its federal aid.

[jessablessa4realz]

If I lived in ND, I would get as many fertilized eggs going as I could and apply for welfare. I mean take my family of 1 to a family of 40. Jess-1 Republicans-0

[formergothardite]

If I lived in ND, I would get as many fertilized eggs going as I could and apply for welfare. I mean take my family of 1 to a family of 40. Jess-1 Republicans-0

I think it would take people trying to do this to show how stupid these sorts of laws are.

[MandyLaLa]

I live and vote in North Dakota. Before this, I've lived and voted in several other states.

And while I'm not going to get into the actual issue(s) at hand, I can tell you that North Dakota politics are strange. A lot of people who live in North Dakota are just... different. There is a strong Norwegian population that tends to be isolationist, and focused on taking care of oneself. And I have noticed across a large range of issues, where they tend towards liberal or conservative - if they feel like it's being propelled or puppeted by outside factors - BOOM. It's over. That is especially in constitutional, population-voted matters. They generally do not like to feel like they are being told what to do by anyone else.

Issues in the last 3 years that I can specifically think of that this was a problem: Last month's effort to protect someone due to their sexual orientation, November's attempt at implementing a rudimentary animal abuse law, the election before that was the proposal that there will be no legislation that compromises the freedom to practice religion however one sees fit. There are two more that I can't remember the details of, that it was a STRONG outcry against outside forces, and the population voted the measure down overwhelmingly.

I don't know where I was neccessarily going with that, except to say that North Dakota is a different place. Until recently, we were a state with a Republican Governor, Two Democratic Senators and 1 Democratic Representative for many years. Things work differently here, and there will be fall out from outside interventions, however they manifest.

Well perhaps is ND wants the rest of the US to leave them alone they shouldn't pass laws that go against federal law. Or they could just stop taking federal funding and secede.

[DutchieV]

Well perhaps is ND wants the rest of the US to leave them alone they shouldn't pass laws that go against federal law. Or they could just stop taking federal funding and secede.

There is a significant part of the state that probably would not mind seceding. There is an annual multi-billion dollar state surplus here, unemployment is 3.2%, and so many people come here for jobs that you can't find housing. Right or wrong, there would be many smug North Dakotans who would say they don't need the US federal govt.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

ND is booming lately with the Bakken shale oil stuff, isn't it? I see articles about it in railroad magazines (lots of freight up there).

[Rosa]

Yeah, good luck with that oil money if the Keystone pipeline doesn't get built. Even with the boom, ND gets more federal money than it pays back in taxes.

[Sumeri]

I live and vote in North Dakota. Before this, I've lived and voted in several other states.

And while I'm not going to get into the actual issue(s) at hand, I can tell you that North Dakota politics are strange. A lot of people who live in North Dakota are just... different. There is a strong Norwegian population that tends to be isolationist, and focused on taking care of oneself. And I have noticed across a large range of issues, where they tend towards liberal or conservative - if they feel like it's being propelled or puppeted by outside factors - BOOM. It's over. That is especially in constitutional, population-voted matters. They generally do not like to feel like they are being told what to do by anyone else.

Issues in the last 3 years that I can specifically think of that this was a problem: Last month's effort to protect someone due to their sexual orientation, November's attempt at implementing a rudimentary animal abuse law, the election before that was the proposal that there will be no legislation that compromises the freedom to practice religion however one sees fit. There are two more that I can't remember the details of, that it was a STRONG outcry against outside forces, and the population voted the measure down overwhelmingly.

I don't know where I was neccessarily going with that, except to say that North Dakota is a different place. Until recently, we were a state with a Republican Governor, Two Democratic Senators and 1 Democratic Representative for many years. Things work differently here, and there will be fall out from outside interventions, however they manifest.

Yep. Lived there for years myself. I get teary discussing any of this with my husband (who is a born and bred North Dakotan who would love to move back one day). My answer - no. fucking. way. We have a daughter. Fuck if I'll raise her in that mess.