Shaking with anger - Kelly Crawford is awful

[Effie]

Miss (Effie) says:

November 8, 2012 at 12:33 pm

If public school taught me to value socialism it was because I realized that other people matter too. I do consider other people’s needs to be of great importance.

The 30 % taxes I pay go to people who need those money better than I do. I fully support that. I am glad I can help people that way. I do not need a fancy house someday. All I need is a life of quality.

I was born into poverty. Back in the 80s we didn’t always have heat during Winter-time (it was very cold here in northern Europe back then). Neither did we have running water. When my mother decided to go to the social services, she got some financial help (social allowance + child allowance). That way we had enough – most of the time. My mum is not wasteful, mind you. She is an economist.

Social welfare was a necessity to us. It was not a luxury. It was something we needed for a while, until we could one day manage without it. My mum wanted to be able to provide for our little family. With some part-time-jobs and training allowance, she finally managed to support us by herself. She never gave up. She struggled to give us a better life. After 20 years she got a permanent employment.

I am glad I can help other people, while earning enough to support myself as well. I am convinced that no one deserves poverty, no matter what kind of bad decisions they could have possibly made. (Most often I do not think bad decisions lie behind poverty.) No matter what, children do not deserve to starve only cause their parents have made bad choices.

Often illness lies behind poverty. Anyone can become sick, any time. Then it’s good knowing there’s social security available.

Socialism is not about entitlement. You are very clueless if that’s your idea of the system I’m living in.

How can socialism be selfish? I can’t see that. I do not support this system for myself. If I only thought about myself, I would not happily pay my 30 % in taxes. Since I care about other people than myself, I pay my taxes with a big smile on my face. I have experienced this system my whole life, and I have seen how it improves people’s living conditions. All systems have faults, even the best ones. It’s hard for me to understand people who are against socialism. I can’t see how they can be driven by any other motives than selfish ones.

Reply

Word Warrior says:

November 8, 2012 at 1:05 pm

Miss,

Your comment is terrifying. It is the raving evidence of what happens when people have been steeped in a mindset and indoctrinated to depend on the government for their needs. Let me address a few things you brought up:

First, socialism has nothing to do with “caringâ€. I am a Christian and am both commanded and delighted to “care†for the needy (the truly needy). I do not need the government to steal money from me in order to distribute to whom they deem needy. If you care about poverty, what prevents you from giving on your own?

Some of the money that is stolen from me is going to pay for birth control. That is not caring for the impoverished and I don’t agree with it and I don’t have a big smile on my face about it.

Poverty. That’s an interesting word. There are those truly impoverished. As I said, not believing in socialism does NOT equate with “not caringâ€. We are commanded to care for those in need. Socialism is forced. True caring and giving is voluntary. You must understand the difference.

Furthermore, you have NO idea of the number of capable, able people who take gov. subsidies because it’s easier–nothing else. Conversation I heard YESTERDAY. A young man, in fact that used to live with my parents told them this:

“My (live-in) girlfriend and I (with a baby) aren’t getting married because if we do and I claim my income (he makes about as much as my husband does) we won’t qualify for food stamps.â€

Pause, and think about that.

Obviously, I’m not saying everyone fits that category, but I think we’d be shocked to know how many do. We live in a country where anyone feasibly determined and able to work can make a living. I know, because we’ve done it.

And there are other, better answers than socialism. Socialism has brought a host of trouble to every country where it reigns. The answers can’t be immediate, mind you. If you know nothing else, you can’t possibly imagine anything else.

Reply

Word Warrior says:

November 8, 2012 at 1:49 pm

Some other thoughts on Socialism:

“..socialism may show early signs of success. But any accomplishments quickly fade as the fundamental deficiencies of central planning emerge. It is the initial illusion of success that gives government intervention its pernicious, seductive appeal. In the long run, socialism has always proven to be a formula for tyranny and misery.

A pyramid scheme is ultimately unsustainable because it is based on faulty principles. Likewise, collectivism is unsustainable in the long run because it is a flawed theory. Socialism does not work because it is not consistent with fundamental principles of human behavior. The failure of socialism in countries around the world can be traced to one critical defect: it is a system that ignores incentives.â€

Read “Why Socialism Failed†for more information

Reply

Corrie says:

November 8, 2012 at 2:16 pm

Just to add… socialism is never sought as an ends. It is ALWAYS pursued as a means or vehicle to something else- communism. Socialism’s sole purpose is to lead to communism. Thus far, communism has ALWAYS lead to unspeakable suffering and evil, and the murder of large amounts of people. Aside from the intrinsic moral evils in communism, this “system†of “government†won’t work any better in the future than it has in past due to man’s fallen nature. In other words, as long as there is still evil in this world, communism will always lead to horror for a vast majority of people. You must be careful to look at the big picture and not get caught up in the talking points of the here and now.

God bless!

Reply

Jennifer says:

November 8, 2012 at 3:46 pm

The world doesn’t work that way. People don’t thrive in a world where they’ll never rise, never make more than people working 5% of the time they do, especially living in a world where the government steals from them and others.

[RosyDaisy]

What a cold-hearted, holier than thou bitch. She has absolutely no concern for anyone but her own damn self.

[Effie]

I became quite mad and started spamming her blog with comments. :oops: Oops I guess I will be banned now.

Miss says:

November 8, 2012 at 5:00 pm

“Pause and think about what?†I am a social worker! I know perfectly well how the system works (billion times better than you do). There will always be people who will try to cheat the system. But they are a minority. The cheaters are not a reason enough to ban the system. The 2 % who cheat matters little to me, when I know that most other people will get money which they need.

This social democratic country has been doing tremendously well during the financial crisis in Europe. We have a lot of money, the government recently said so. They started putting a lot of extra billions to build the rail system and support the higher science education. You, on the other hand, have been through a financial crisis.

What misery? YOU have the highest child poverty in the developed world."

Corrie says:

November 8, 2012 at 2:16 pm

Just to add… socialism is never sought as an ends. It is ALWAYS pursued as a means or vehicle to something else- communism. Socialism’s sole purpose is to lead to communism. Thus far, communism has ALWAYS lead to unspeakable suffering and evil, and the murder of large amounts of people. Aside from the intrinsic moral evils in communism, this “system†of “government†won’t work any better in the future than it has in past due to man’s fallen nature. In other words, as long as there is still evil in this world, communism will always lead to horror for a vast majority of people. You must be careful to look at the big picture and not get caught up in the talking points of the here and now.

God bless!

Reply

Miss says:

November 8, 2012 at 5:05 pm

Communism has nothing to do with socialism.

“I became a democratic socialist when I, as a very young man, stood eye to eye with the oppression of communism and saw the persecution of people in the communist states.†– Former prime minister Olof Palme (before he got shot, like John F. Kennedy)

Miss says:

November 8, 2012 at 5:03 pm

Hah, why socialism failed? My country is a living example of why it succeeded.

Your country is a living example of why your system is failing (and no, you do not have socialism, except in the new health reform).

Reply

Miss says:

November 8, 2012 at 5:07 pm

Early signs of success? We had socialism already in the 30s. 80 years later I wouldn’t call it “early signs of success†but actual success.

/Note. I didn't mean to paint your country in black colours. I know I overcoloured it little.

[marmalade]

Maybe she should be reminded of her pleas for luxury goods after her house was totaled. SHE lives off the largesse of her parents; she couldn't maintain her lifestyle without that base.

I'd say SHE's a bigger mooch than anyone who accepts government money during rough times. She should also be reminded that most of Europe, from whence her ancestors came, have socialist tenets and aren't communist. Imagine that!!!!!111 Single out England and Canada and use examples of how they got medical care that they wouldn't have qualified for in America unless they paid thousands of dollars a month for the "privilege" of geetting said care.

Fuck her.

[Linnea]

Effie, your comment for Kelly was great, and there's so much stupid in the responses from her and her readers. Let me just take one sentence:

We live in a country where anyone feasibly determined and able to work can make a living. I know, because we’ve done it.

1. Yes, Kelly, because obviously everybody in America lives in the same kind of circumstances that you and your family do. Everybody's parents have land that they can build on, and a gullible internet following to donate money to them in case of disaster.

2. Also, it may have escaped your notice that the internet exists outside of the U.S. Effie is from Sweden, if I recall correctly.

[Anxious Girl]

Dammit, these people are the 1s who're ignorant of economics, government, history and philosophy. They should read on these subjects before opening their ignorant mouths.

[linnea27]

very apropos:

http://money.ca.msn.com/investing/the-w ... us-nations

... but of course, that's biased Liberal media, right?

the gist: the US is no longer in the top 10 most prosperous nations, according to the study. The countries that make the list are all more socialist-minded: Norway, Sweden, Denmark, the Netherlands, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc.

ETA: the organization that did the study summarized their findings here: http://www.prosperity.com/ . It's actually quite interesting.

[Anxious Girl]

So having no government support on basic needs such as healthcare is finally making America a 3rd world country because we want to be better more backwards and prove that because we're backwards it works better and all the other countries are doing it wrong? I thought that since we were a superpower we are more progressive by not being like all those socialist countries? America doesn't need to be like the other countries who won't bow down to Creationism under fundie pressure and allow LGBT marriage and no hate speech because it's Christian persecution because we're the best country evah!

[Austin]

Ack, Kelly should pause and think about that meth-brow look she's got going on ;)

She's an arrogant bitch and I wouldn't give her a moment's attention. She lives on Jon Stewart's Bullshit Mountain and hasn't gotten the memo that there was an avalanche there recently.

[Deleted03]

I guess it is easy to say that when your house was built by voluntary workers. When you don't have to pay rent. When instead of accepting federal loans, you asked for donations.

Who built your roads honey? Who pays the police to protect you? the firefighters to help you after a tornado?

Her attitude is exactly why you need the state to decide who is poor or not, rather than some wacko who takes their children to the vet, and asks for donations and donated work to build their house when there is a federal program of temporary aid all set up to go.

[Anxious Girl]

... Tell me where this Bullshit Mountain is located. I would love to send plenty of ignorant relatives to live there.

[GolightlyGrrl]

I wonder how much money Kelly has donated to help out the victims of Hurricane Sandy.

Yea, right.

[Effie]

I wonder how much money Kelly has donated to help out the victims of Hurricane Sandy.

Yea, right.

Good point.

I should have known better than to waste my time and energy trying to reason with her. (It just made me quite upset to the point I got a headache. :doh: )

Does the church help everyone? Non-believers, Muslims, Jews etc.? Kelly mentions that people should be more dependent on each other and the church. She thinks socialism makes people anti-charity:

"One example of why socialism is bad is precisely this: when there are so many government programs to be utilized, it robs us of our need/desire to show compassion and help. In other words, if you need help, most people are inclined to say, “there’s a program for you†than they would be if people were more dependent on each other and the church."

Most people? How can she tell? Half of the people I know of spend at least some hours volunteering at their free-time each week. We are not anti-charity here. There's a great opportunity to meet new people and get new friends through volunteering (it's very unusual for my generation to go to church, so we do not meet new people that way). It's quite interesting when I think of it: I don't have a single Christian person from my own generation in my circle of acquaintances. (I know some Muslims in their 20s though.)

"I’m glad you are pleased with socialism. For me, even if there weren’t so many examples of failures and shifts to communism (and there are), it is contrary to biblical principles of charity and love; it thwarts the Christian’s responsibility to show the love of Christ and breaks the laws of God. "- Kelly

I can't see how socialism is contrary to 'charity' and 'love'.

Btw. I didn't know that my nation Sweden is considered one of the most prosperous nations in the world. That means we are doing something right. :dance:

[Deleted03]

it breaks the law of God? Wow!

[linnea27]

Btw. I didn't know that my nation Sweden is considered one of the most prosperous nations in the world. That means we are doing something right. :dance:

Or a lot of things right. I love Sweden and would move there in a heartbeat. We have pics from our travels to Sweden and Norway all over our house.

[fundifugee]

it breaks the law of God? Wow!

Clearly Kelly's version of The Bible does not contain the passages in Leviticus, Ezekiel and Jeremiah describing God's own prescribed economic plan, including redistribution of land and wealth and cancellation of debt every 49 years, and more minor redistributions (such as cancellation of debt/wage-slavery) every seven years. Sounds kind of like forced government intervention into economic system, 'stealing' people's accumulated wealth and distributing it evenly on a regularly scheduled basis. Not very capitalist, or reliant on individual charity either.

Ignoramus.

[aggythenostic]

I know it was one of us! Congratulations! Usually my posts get 'poofed' in .20 seconds...;) Man, I love when people make these kind of ignorant statements. What is it, 1955?

I think what Kelly gets frustrated about is when people on govt assistance live high on the hog on OUR tax money. I was just in the grocery store a week or two ago, and the lady in front of me paid with the access debit card, and she had a huge pork loin(about $25), name brand coffee and sugar, and might I add she was about 200lbs overweight…not trying to pick on plump people, but apparently she wasn’t skimping, but getting overweight on the public tab. Or when poeple using access cards have the newest cell phones and Ipads and such…I know that if I had disabled children, I would look for any and all ways I could to help them, and if some of it was through govt assistance, I would do it…AN old neighbor of mine who had a disabled daughter needed a ride to the store once…she had a “back†problem…and claimed to need a wheel chair to get around…yet at the store, she bent over and picked up a 20 pound bag of potatoes with one hand…not a whimper, not a whine… I would say, in so far as it depends on each of us, let us care for our own lives/families as much as we are able…and if we use any govt assistance at all, try and be worthy of and grateful for the assistance received…and not abuse or defraud our fellow citizens. I’d also like to make a point, in the past when charity was private, poor people had to receive their help at the hands of the rich…and I am sure it was convicting to be rich and doing your duty, see the difficult situations in which people lived…and would spur feelings of compassion in you…rather than knowing that there are “poor†people out there, but not knowing any, never helped any, because the govt does it…

High on the hog? Is she serious? Because she witnessed ONE woman buying ONE roast, she's convinced she's being ripped off? Did it occur to her that perhaps that roast was feeding a very large family? And how DARE she drink coffee! Why isn't she dumpster diving like a true Christian!

I think Charles Dickens would be appalled by these loonies. And it was better for rich people to to be 'convicted' to hand out their cash? Yeah. That worked. [eye roll]

There's no way to add this up into anything but 'How dare my TWENTY CENTS OF TAXES be used to help anyone without my say so! Because I need those 20 cents for my little army of God! If they were living right, the church would help. Don't blame me if you're starving, LAZY. " Interesting talk from someone who hasn't mentioned a charity on her blog except herself in the years I've been reading it.

[kaetrin]

I saw your first comment on GC earlier today, Effie, and I thought it was very interesting and reasonable. I was shocked that she called it a "raving example of indoctrination" or whatever. Raving and indoctrination is in the eye of the beholder, I guess. Good job; try not to let them get to you.

[Creaky Mom]

It might make Kelly feel better to know that Canada's road to perdition, I mean socialism - caring for those in distress, the sick, the widowed, the orphans, the unemployed - was kick started by a Baptist preacher turned politician, Tommy Douglas. He saw the need for the Christian value of taking care of people to be adopted by a country's government. Wasn't that thoughtful of him?...applying "true religion", to a secular system?

This is what I've always thought to be so hypocritical about too many American Christians - complaining their government may do things the Bible actually recommends doing and peeing on countries who have made it work. We are not in debt by trillions. Thank you very much. It also makes them look stupid, selfish and cold.

[marmalade]

I know it was one of us! Congratulations! Usually my posts get 'poofed' in .20 seconds...;) Man, I love when people make these kind of ignorant statements. What is it, 1955?

High on the hog? Is she serious? Because she witnessed ONE woman buying ONE roast, she's convinced she's being ripped off? Did it occur to her that perhaps that roast was feeding a very large family? And how DARE she drink coffee! Why isn't she dumpster diving like a true Christian!

I think Charles Dickens would be appalled by these loonies. And it was better for rich people to to be 'convicted' to hand out their cash? Yeah. That worked. [eye roll]

There's no way to add this up into anything but 'How dare my TWENTY CENTS OF TAXES be used to help anyone without my say so! Because I need those 20 cents for my little army of God! If they were living right, the church would help. Don't blame me if you're starving, LAZY. " Interesting talk from someone who hasn't mentioned a charity on her blog except herself in the years I've been reading it.

Great minds. That post evoked Dickens with me as well. If only he was alive today to show these ladies how "charitable" the rich were to the poor in Victorian London. :doh:

[notsocommon]

I don't get the bitching about the $25 pork loin. Those can be cut up and made into several meals. I do that all the time! I can usually get 3-4 meals (for 3 people) out of one, depending on how big it is.

I also do not get how having to pay taxes, which only a tiny portion goes to pay for welfare, prevents anyone from helping those around them. I saw someone on FB who was posting about how she gets 'livid' when she sees people in need and can't help because she pays taxes. Really? her husband has a high dollar profession, my husband and I both work and only make a fraction he makes, yet we manage to help people in need without killing our budget.

Some people

[Austin]

My husband cooked a big pork loin in the crock pot yesterday and served it with mashed potatoes and carrots and a salad. Then he shredded what was left and we had pulled pork sandwiches for dinner tonight and there is still a large tupperware container of the pulled pork that everyone can use for their brown bag lunches tomorrow. Cooking a big roast is usually pretty economical, as far as meat goes, especially if you can find it on sale.

I'm sure Kelly would much rather see any poor person surviving on hot dogs and ramen noodles, though :roll:

[Hisey]

Here's an unbelievable quote from Kelly (taken from the comments:

"When we struggled, we had family members that just expected me to get a job because “that’s the way it isâ€, instead of those members rallying around to help us so that I could stay home with my young children."

She was mad at family members because they expected her to get a job to support her kids. She actually expected them to support her (or "rally round" her, as she says).

[Miranda]

She's just a lazy mooch who expects the world to bend over backwards for her while she gives nothing in return. Funny how she thinks it's perfectly fine for others to bankroll her chosen lifestyle, yet other people who need assistance are all abusing the system.

[marmalade]

What an entitled bitch. As if we didn't already know that from her behavior after the tornado, but that remark takes the cake.