Catholic Friar Blames Sexual Abuse Victims

[rock_girl]

But Ms Gillard said the inquiry would not be limited to the Catholic Church but would include churches, schools, foster homes, state services, police forces, sand the not-for-profit sector.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political ... 29862.html

It's not limited to the Catholic Church. So annoyed with her right now for what appears to be a concession to Abbott. Wtf? The issue is not so much the child abuse, but the fact that the Catholic church has been covering it up for god knows how long. There's clearly a culture of encouraging, or at best, looking the other way while paedophiles run rampant in Catholic institutions.

Abbott really is the lowest of the low. I'm not saying that other religions are without blame, but none have a documented history of aiding child abusers in the way the Catholic church does. Fuck him and his rosaries.

eta: oops, just realised you noted that it wasn't limited to the the Catholic church, Antipodes. My mistake! Still, my irritation stands - everyone knows that the main problem is with the church, and including other religions and groups in this enquiry means that their pr gurus will be out there shifting blame like nobody's business.

[RosyDaisy]

You crazy, mother-fucking son of bitch. You blame the victim? There's a very special place in hell for Friar, and I hope you burn there for all of eternity!

[Antipodes]

Rockgirl sometimes you annoy the crap out of me!

Seriously, read before you post.

Apology accepted btw. Kind of you.

Let's proceed with a sharper focus.

[Antipodes]

.............

[Antipodes]

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[rock_girl]

Rockgirl sometimes you annoy the crap out of me!

Seriously, read before you post.

Apology accepted btw. Kind of you.

Let's proceed with a sharper focus.

A sharper focus? Are you serious? Do excuse me for getting emotional over a subject which is fairly close to my heart given that I've dealt with a relative's lifelong dysfunction after being abused by friar fuck while he was away at boarding school. I'm sure you feel very important seeing your friend on television (although I think I win there because I see an ex-bf on tv alllllllllll the time) and I hate to take away from that but, Christ, this is not a kindergarten classroom.

[FaustianSlip]

I don't know if the decision to include organizations other than the Catholic church was a concession, necessarily. The Orthodox Jewish community in Australia, particularly in Melbourne, has just gone through a pedophelia scandal not unlike the Catholic church; apparently, there were teachers and rabbis within the Lubavitch community that were abusing kids whose behavior was hushed up by other rabbis and authority figures in the same community. Failed Messiah has been reporting on it for quite some time now; the only reason these cases aren't more widespread, I suspect, is because with the exception of a few groups like Lubavitch, there isn't a central, controlling authority in the Jewish community that would have the means to move an abuser from city to city. Even without that, though, there have been similar scandals in London and New York within the Haredi community. So while this could be a concession to Catholic lawmakers, it's just as likely that Gillard is trying to cover all of the bases, given recent events.

[Patsy]

I do see it as a PR concession, but I'm a QLDer, and quite removed from what you're talking about, FaustianSlip. In QLD I'd assume there's a fair bit among the Exclusive Brethren, and I've met some people who were in more local cults, and based on their behaviour I'd assume they are also the sort of environments that allow that stuff to fester. I believe there have been studies in the U.S. that it's almost as common in Protestant churches, and there was an Anglican, I think, diocese in the U.S. where a bishop or something was covering things up? The reason I see it as a concession, then, is because I see the Catholic stuff is SO much more endemic, entrenched, and defended all the way to the top: I think that makes it exceptional.

I am just fucking spitting spiders over some of the public response to the story, for so many reasons. If I start going into the ways known and condoned Catholic paedophila personally affects me, I'll never fucking stop, but... JESUS. Your sacred cow is raping babies, could you maybe just maybe fucking let someone inspect it for a second? Spit, spit, spit, I need a cup of tea.

[FaustianSlip]

I think the stuff in the ultra-Orthodox Jewish community is probably just as entrenched and defended, but because it's a much smaller group of people and a much more insular community, it's easier to keep things hidden. People are becoming more vocal about it in the last few years, but I think there's probably way more of this kind of thing going on in Haredi schools and yeshivot than one might expect, and families who bring it up have been threatened with having their other kids expelled from schools or otherwise facing reprisals.

The reason it's so endemic in the Catholic community is, I suspect, in large part because the Catholic church's network is so large and so widespread. When you add up the numbers of people whose kids have either attended a Catholic school, received aid from some kind of Catholic social program or spent any significant amount of time in a Catholic church, that's a hell of a lot of people. By contrast, Jews are about two percent of the world's population, and Orthodox Jews constitute something like thirty percent of world Jewry, so the numbers are going to be much, much smaller. It definitely goes on, though, and in organizations like Lubavitch that are very widespread and responsible for all kinds of schools and other religious instruction and rely on donations from within and without the Orthodox community to function, there's plenty of motive there to sweep incidents of abuse under the rug. I would also love to see the Exclusive Brethren investigated, as well, speaking of shady, ultra-insular communities.

Anyway, I agree that the people tying themselves in knots trying to justify all of this are just out of their minds. I get that this is something that will really shake a person's faith and all, but good Lord, it's not like it's just some unpleasant rumor. Everyone knows that this stuff is going on, and everyone's known for the better part of a decade now. Maybe instead of trying to find ways to defend it, it's time to go full-bore and address the problem once and for all. The only person in the Catholic hierarchy I've heard of coming right out and saying, "This is disgusting, we are a disgusting organization for letting it go on so long, and there's little reason for people to trust us enough to stay anymore" is the Archbishop of Dublin, and he's been taking serious flak from his fellow clergy for it. The whole thing is just foul.

[snarktastic]

Just read that interview and WHAT THE!!!

The idea that teenagers go round seducing priests - teenagers think 25 = ancient / gross!

Ugh ugh ugh.

[rock_girl]

From a purely pr pov (and this was never my field, but I had to work with plenty of pr people in a previous life) this is a huge win for the Catholic church. I know that there are other organisations - religious and secular - which cover up abuse, but none do it on such a huge scale as the Catholics. Obviously the church having the lion's share of abusers is because social welfare organisations and schools are dominated by Catholic religious orders. But the lengths they've gone to to cover up the abuse goes beyond anything a small hasidic community can achieve, even if 99% of its adult members supported the paedophiles in their ranks. For that reason the church needs to be held accountable on its own. It needs to have its scandals aired without other, far smaller scandals being used by their pr people to make it look as though the church is fairly tame when compared to those funny looking people with long beards. The leadership needs to be shown that knowing something is wrong and looking the other way is just as despicable as participating in cover ups.

The reaction by prominent Catholics - especially those in leadership positions within the church - to the issues at St John's College shows that the church is never going to be in a hurry to do good unless its hand is forced. They need their foul actions to be exposed and scrutinised over and over until the abusers and those who helped them along the way are punished. That's not going to happen when the gutter press can focus on a few abusive imams or rabbis. I totally support investigating abuse in other religions, but it needs to be done in a way that doesn't detract from the abuse in the Catholic church and the extraordinary effort put in to not only cover up that abuse, but in many cases to aid the abusers.

[Antipodes]

A shout to ROCK GIRL . I would like to sincerely apologise for my mean and ridiculous post. I was on planet angry and it was extremely unfair of me to take that out on you.

I can't take it back all I can do is say a heartfelt sorry.

These priests have caused volatile damage to people's lives. Yesterday I allowed the anger at how I felt about what happened to my family hurt you ROCK GIRL . I am very sorry. I have dismounted my high horse, eaten some humble pie and smacked myself soundly.

[Antipodes]

Hi folks, I am concerned because I have been a total dickhead in my post to ROCK GIRL. I am not yet able to send private messages. If any of you would kindly PM her to let her know of my apology I would be grateful. Not for mysake but for Rockgirls sake I don't want her to have discomfort over my idiocy.

[Antipodes]

What do I do this Christmas? How do we proceed. All the young people are oblivious as they should be, we are eagle eyed and are protecting them.

All those church traditions make me want to vomit. But the teen children want them to continue.