Doug Phillips is (wait for it)...............

[Buzzard]

A man is walking down the street and has some time to kill before his train. Starbucks is full and its pouring rain. He ducks into an open door, only to find that its a strip club. "This wont be too bad," he thinks and sits down at a table in the back. "Just one drink, and I'll go, my wife wont mind! She wouldnt want me catching cold!" The man orders his drink and stays for a few more. After a lap dance or two he forgets all about his train. That is, until his cell phone starts vibrating. His wife is calling, the train has derailed. He tells her that he's safe and missed his train.

Yup... lots of things are "gods will" and lots of things are just dumb luck. Saved by a strip club!

[Minerva]

Hello? Ever heard of condoms?

Or Natural Family Planning?

Or an IUD?

These birth control methods have no "abortifacient potentiality" whatsoever!

Why must pro-lifers such as Doug Phillips harp on how contraceptive methods are "killing our babies" -- without making the distinction between methods that do possibly have an "abortifacient potentiality" and ones that absolutely do not? Of course, I'm sure that Doug would not condone ANY birth control methods, but really, a couple spacing or waiting on children using condoms is not the same as them having an abortion!!!

IUDs mess with fertilized eggs (at least I know Mirena does, but I think Paragard does too) . If you believe a blastocyst is a person, all you can use are barrier methods.

[roddma]

Quote:

Randy Alcorn's book as mentioned in a comment above is an excellent resource on how birth control works....after the Bible which continously stresses children as a blessing from God. My question is, why would we want to prevent his blessing? Would we ever think of doing such a thing with his financial blessing, relational blesssing?

But is money really a blessing or a relaitonship? I look at them the same way as children. If blessings are defined as favor bestowed by G-d, is infertility , being single, or poor a sign of you not being blessed by G-d? I tried to explain this on FB 19 Kids with no luck.

[Maul the Koala]

IUDs mess with fertilized eggs (at least I know Mirena does, but I think Paragard does too) . If you believe a blastocyst is a person, all you can use are barrier methods.

The mechanism of action with the IUDs is hotly debated. It's late and I shouldn't be up reading scientific articles but some researchers have concluded that the Mirena prevents fertilization completely while others say it just prevents implantation. I haven't even looked at the literature on the copper IUD. I think my head is starting to hurt so I'm going to save that for another day.

I did come across a few articles that the researchers were essentially taking a rolled up newspaper and smacking the fundies on the nose. So many commentaries and research articles about various methods of birth control not being abortifacients. I guess Science is fed up with the fundies too.

[MamaJunebug]

But is money really a blessing or a relaitonship? I look at them the same way as children. If blessings are defined as favor bestowed by G-d, is infertility , being single, or poor a sign of you not being blessed by G-d? I tried to explain this on FB 19 Kids with no luck.[/quo

roddma, you get points in my book for trying!!

Great argument/answer. Hyperfecundity as a doctrine does dovetail well with the overall prosperity gospal heresy]Behave well and God will bless you, indeed, He must bless you, we have that much influence with The Old Boy, heh-heh, heh-heh.

Jesus never said that. Not AFAIremember anyway. Not htat I was there, or anything.

Also: the Bible "continuouly" promotes children as a blessing from God? Other than the quiver/arrows verse, I dare the writer to show me a verse per book, much less chapter. How frequent is something if it's "continuous," anyway?

[roddma]

But is money really a blessing or a relaitonship? I look at them the same way as children. If blessings are defined as favor bestowed by G-d, is infertility , being single, or poor a sign of you not being blessed by G-d? I tried to explain this on FB 19 Kids with no luck.[/quo

roddma, you get points in my book for trying!!

Great argument/answer. Hyperfecundity as a doctrine does dovetail well with the overall prosperity gospal heresy]Behave well and God will bless you, indeed, He must bless you, we have that much influence with The Old Boy, heh-heh, heh-heh.

Jesus never said that. Not AFAIremember anyway. Not htat I was there, or anything.

Also: the Bible "continuouly" promotes children as a blessing from God? Other than the quiver/arrows verse, I dare the writer to show me a verse per book, much less chapter. How frequent is something if it's "continuous," anyway?

I also point out Jesus had no kids and grew up modestly. It is like they are saying Jesus is less blessed. Many of his followers had no kids. It is gathered from scriptures Mary , Martha, and Lazarus had no kids. A great niece of Abraham was infertile but lived a life of purity. Though most were only infertile temporarily, it did mean they were not blessed before. I would hardly say I am less blessed than Octomom or Bill Gates because they have kids or money.

[Minerva]

The mechanism of action with the IUDs is hotly debated. It's late and I shouldn't be up reading scientific articles but some researchers have concluded that the Mirena prevents fertilization completely while others say it just prevents implantation. I haven't even looked at the literature on the copper IUD. I think my head is starting to hurt so I'm going to save that for another day.

I did come across a few articles that the researchers were essentially taking a rolled up newspaper and smacking the fundies on the nose. So many commentaries and research articles about various methods of birth control not being abortifacients. I guess Science is fed up with the fundies too.

Yeah, I've not got literature in front of me, but I doubt Paragard causes the changes in the endometrium believed to make it harder for eggs to implant. Your periods get heavier with paragard, so if anything it would make your endometrium thicker. No one really knows how paragard works at all, IIRC. I've heard it changes the pH in your uterus so as to kill any sperm that enter. I've also heard that it makes your immune system attack anything foreign in your uterus, be it sperm or an embryo.

Most combination pills tend to make periods lighter because they thin the endometrium, and progestin-only solutions (such as Mirena) do to a greater extent. I think the debate is around whether that changes the chances of implantation or not. My birth control information sheets usually list changes to the endometrium as one of the ways it prevents pregnancy, but they don't explicitly say it prevents implantation. My guess is that it's a compromise between the fact that they think it works that way, but don't know for sure, and don't want to stir up controversy anyway. My progestin-only pill information sheet says that, when taken properly, it prevents ovulation in 50% of cycles. Yet it has a failure rate similar to that of condoms. Maybe the thickening of the cervical mucus explains how effective it is despite letting ovulation happen every 2nd month, but I suspect the endometrial changes are at play, too.

[jan9206]

DOUG PHILLIPS IS A TOOL!