"RadicalFemininity," a treasure trove of fundie cliches

[clueliss]

My sister went Messianic after a group she was with when she was Seventh Day Adventist left SDA (for using non SDA literature in group teaching).  There is definitely a shared legalism between the two and whole attitude from my sister about having to worship on Saturday (per my sister -The true sabbath).  

[JMarie]

On ‎6‎/‎13‎/‎2017 at 1:55 PM, Pianokeeper said:

Silas's sister runs this blog. http://www.virtuousdaughters.com/about/

It includes a link to the family's courting questionnaire, so presumably Abigail was found worthy and answered correctly regarding card games, etc! 

http://www.virtuousdaughters.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/Updated-Questionnaire1.pdf

I would run for the hills if a guy came to me with a 170 question list.

[Curious]

 

Ho. Lee. Shit. 

That is all.

 

I tapped out at question 143

[JermajestyDuggar]

The wedding between Silas and Abigail looks pretty. Her dress is kind of cute. Not what I was expecting at all. I figured it would be plain and boring. It looks like the men wore jeans and cowboy hats. Her sisters were bridemaids and they wore bright coral. They seemed to have a bit of a cake fight when feeding eachother wedding cake. 

[Shiny]

There is no room for evolving as a person in that questionnaire. How awful. I wonder how long that would take to fill out. 

[BobTheWalrus]

On 16/06/2017 at 1:56 PM, CuttySark said:

I'm not in the US. But Jesus-focused "messianic Judaism" is an absolute contradiction in terms, because as far as Judaism is concerned, Jesus did not fulfill any of the requirements to be moshiach.

Some of the followers of the Lubavitcher Rebbe are veering pretty close to this as well, for a more modern example of a messianic cult mindset gripping some Jewish communities. (Also see Shabbatai Tzvi in the 17th century. This sort of thing happens fairly regularly.)

The people you're referencing would be ethnically Jewish, converting to a Christian sect which has appropriated aspects of religious Judaism as a smokescreen. Followers of Christ are by definition Christian, and embrace a core theology incompatible with Judaism. 

It's like saying... 'vegan meatloaf.' You can mess with the texture and add ingredients to change the colour and taste all you like to make it seem like meatloaf, but it'll never change the fact that there's no meat involved. 

The thing is, I'm going by what they have said about themselves, and it doesn't match up with what you're saying. I have no doubt that there are people who fit what you're talking about. These are people who are ethnically Jewish, but who believe Jesus *did* fulfil the prophecies of Messiah. In fact, for some of them, that is how they came to believe - they went through all of the Messianic prophecies and saw how Jesus did fulfil them, and become convinced that He was the Messiah they had been promised. I do understand, however, that most mainstream Jewish groups don't accept this.

The same with this idea that all groups like this have adopted some aspects of Judaism as a "smokescreen". I have no doubt that is true in some cases, but I think you're being too dismissive of what these people believe. The thing is, that in faith they might be considered Christian, but once you're Jewish, you never stop being Jewish. You can be atheist in belief, but you're still Jewish because God never breaks His side of the covenant (this is how my friend explained it to me). The understanding would be that they still worship in a Jewish way, but certain parts (like the need for animal sacrifice) have been done once for all by Jesus. So it's not that you no longer need animal sacrifice, but that it's been done for you, for all time. But as I said before, I do appreciate that most Jewish groups would not accept this understanding, even though they also have a huge range of belief and practice among them.

[CuttySark]

I think you're missing a very vital distinction between 'Jew' and 'Judaism.' One can be ethnically and culturally a Jew and follow Christianity as a religious faith - same as one can be culturally and ethnically Italian and convert to Buddhism instead of Catholicism, even do the rites in Italian or Latin. That doesn't make Buddhism Catholic.

Judaism does not include worship of Christ, and fundamental core beliefs of Christianity (such as the triune God) are incompatible with fundamental precepts of Judaism. Converts to Christianity happen - but it doesn't make their Christian practices Jewish. And calling something "messianic Judaism" is the problem, because it's a dangerous mistake at best and deliberately disingenuous at worst.

Along those lines, chicken bacon is the bomb, especially when camping. I finally had a BLT for the first time (cBLT?) recently and it was excellent.  But it's still listed on the packages as 'bacon-style chicken,' not 'bacon'. At least around here! 

 

[Lurky]

What I never understand about these courting questionnaires is how they weight the answers.  If you disagree on, IDK, question 8, about what Heaven is, is that a no? 

I also like the fact they're such leading questions.  Tons of simple Y/N questions, but if you pick one answer, there are a whole load of follow-ups!  So when the questions is:

Quote

What are your beliefs concerning evil spirits or demons? Can a born again believer be “possessed” by an evil spirit? Can they be “oppressed” or “harassed” or influenced by an evil spirit? If so, how do you believe we should deal with them?

the answer "I don't believe in them" is WRONG, right?

These ones, wow!  So leading, but also, so telling!

Quote

What are your beliefs concerning generational curses? Do you have concerns with any of your ancestors?

Quote

How do you believe about intermarriage between people from different ethnic backgrounds; for example ... blacks, whites, orientals? Is it OK for others, but not for your own family?

Quote

What do you think about swimming? Is it right or wrong? If you believe it can be done, what guidelines would you have for your family in this area?

Quote

Are you a vegetarian? If so, please explain.

I also am cackling at the table at the bottom, where they have to circle what personality types they are, with the odd spectrum.  For one thing, not all those things ARE a spectrum, but the thing makes no sense.  And if I was cold, domineering, suspicious, careless etc, I'm hardly going to include it in my answers to try to marry someone!

 

[FundieFarmer]

I tapped out at question 143

Heck, you got farther than I did. I went through one page, discovered there were 10 more to go, and noped the fuck out of there.

It took me probably 10 minutes (in my head) to get through the first page with short but thoughtful, exegetically-based answers. Not sure what their grading rubric is, but I'm guessing at least 2 hours to fill this shit out.

[Chocolatedefrauded]

Attention fundie teens, you know what is easier & takes less time than filling out a 170 point questionnaire? Dating, that's what! Give it a try. you can actually ask the same questions, in person, over time, while engaging in other activities. It's more fun than spending a few hours with a number 2 pencil!

[BrandoBarks]

On 17.6.2017 at 6:55 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

The wedding between Silas and Abigail looks pretty. Her dress is kind of cute. Not what I was expecting at all. I figured it would be plain and boring. It looks like the men wore jeans and cowboy hats. Her sisters were bridemaids and they wore bright coral. They seemed to have a bit of a cake fight when feeding eachother wedding cake. 

Hey, where did you find the pictures? I looked everywhere but I can't find them :-(

[lawfulevil]

That thing reminds me of "quick and easy, only 5 question" physics homework assignments that actually had like 30 sub-questions and every single one of them was a giant pain in the ass.

Except, you know, starting from "170" questions.

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 hours ago, BrandoBarks said:

Hey, where did you find the pictures? I looked everywhere but I can't find them :-(

I saw them on Facebook posted by relatives of Silas. Stephen Lagoy has the most pictures. But you will also find one or two pictures posted from some of the Washburns too. 

[L1o2u3]

I've seen the pictures on Abigail Washburn LaGoy's facebook site. 

 

What I liked about their wedding was that they seemed to have some kind of ballroom dancing  And I noticed that Abigail and Silas didn't have a completely hands-off courtship/engagement but lots of holding hands, side hugs and some frontal hugs  even though they saved their first kiss. They seem very in love with each other. 

 

In contrast, the older sister, Hannah, didn't even hug James Manderino in their engagement ceremony (you can find the video on her Facebook page) if I remember that correctly. 

[CyborgKin]

On 19/06/2017 at 8:18 PM, Lurky said:

What do you think about swimming? Is it right or wrong? If you believe it can be done, what guidelines would you have for your family in this area?

It's an excellent alternative to drowning   I would recommend "don't breathe the water", "watch where you're going" and "beware of sharks, jellyfish, crocodiles, strong currents, and hidden rocks or branches" as some good starter guidelines

 

Don't get me started on Christians who think they have to eat kosher, or are planning to organise the 'Feast of Tabernacles'.

[FundieFarmer]

"If you believe it CAN be done"...

Why yes, physically, anatomically it is possible.

I believe what is meant here is whether it "should" be done...

[CyborgKin]

Heh.

I wonder if they worry about their innocent fundiekids hearing about 'breast stroke'.

[Grimalkin]

On 6/19/2017 at 5:18 AM, Lurky said:

What are your beliefs concerning evil spirits or demons? Can a born again believer be “possessed” by an evil spirit? Can they be “oppressed” or “harassed” or influenced by an evil spirit? If so, how do you believe we should deal with them?

   RED RUM

On 6/19/2017 at 5:18 AM, Lurky said:

  Quote

How do you believe about intermarriage between people from different ethnic backgrounds; for example ... blacks, whites, orientals? Is it OK for others, but not for your own family?

       I'm not racist but..........

     

[Grimalkin]

Also, my cat is named Silas.

[CyborgKin]

Ugh, people who think 'white' is an ethnic background.  That's just a bizarre and wrong and terrible concept.

[L1o2u3]

There was a newsletter today that Hannah is able to continue the Shining Stars magazine, which she though she had to abandon because she would be too busy not depriving her husband and meeting his every needs. But her future headship graciously allows her to coninue her magazine... only that it won't be her magazine anymore, he's going to take control and she's allowed to be the assistant when she doesn't have chores to do. Yay! 

*Sarcasm. 

Here's the announcement. 

http://mailchi.mp/4274e083b80f/big-news-for-shining-stars-magazine

The baby convert will now tell others how to live their religion. Wow. If this was my magazine, I would be really pissed that he wants to control everything even though I had managed it for years. 

But in her world, she's probably so excited that she doesn't have to give up her hobby completely because that's what ladies do when they get married to serve their hubbies. 

[L1o2u3]

sorry for the spelling mistakes  I shouldn't post that early in the morning. 

[Lurky]

I don't quite understand how planning a wedding means there can't be a magazine this year - I mean, women all over the world plan weddings while working for a living, let alone in some hugely stressful circumstances, so how come a SAHD can't?

[BlackSheep]

1 hour ago, Lurky said:

I don't quite understand how planning a wedding means there can't be a magazine this year - I mean, women all over the world plan weddings while working for a living, let alone in some hugely stressful circumstances, so how come a SAHD can't?

They will have 2 less things on their to-do list than most people - no finding a DJ, no decision regarding the bar (Cash bar or open bar? Top shelf alcohol or not?).

Most of her time will likely be spent finding/sewing modest bridesmaids gowns.

[JermajestyDuggar]

5 minutes ago, BlackSheep said:

They will have 2 less things on their to-do list than most people - no finding a DJ, no decision regarding the bar (Cash bar or open bar? Top shelf alcohol or not?).

Most of her time will likely be spent finding/sewing modest bridesmaids gowns.

They do dance at weddings. I don't know if they just have a stereo, DJ, or a live band. That is one of the things they cherry pick from the Jewish. They seem to dance at every big gathering. And I wouldn't be surprised if they had some wine at the wedding.