Erin and Chad 11: How Does Anyone Sleep?

[JermajestyDuggar]

27 minutes ago, vienna said:

I am reading about a fight between Carln and Erin here again and again. Can someone please clue me in? I know Erin left the boutique due to a disagreement with Carlin it seems, but do you know more details?

No, it’s always been speculation. It’s obvious there is a rift between them. But we’ve never figured out why. We have many guesses though. 

[rebeccawriter01]

52 minutes ago, vienna said:

I am reading about a fight between Carln and Erin here again and again. Can someone please clue me in? I know Erin left the boutique due to a disagreement with Carlin it seems, but do you know more details?

We don't have firm details on why she left the boutique. We can only speculate, as we can assume she would not have left if she was happy and content with the boutique.

[SassyPants]

Erin posted a photo on IG of She, Tori and Josie with their baby boys. Josie’s son is 4 months younger than Erin’s and so much bigger. Although mine were each 7lbs at birth they were really roly poly just like Miles. I was always amazed at the different rates that babies grow, despite their size at birth.

[Kiki03910]

I just bought this shirt on eBay, thinking it'd be super cute in the winter, but on review I'm absolutely terrified that it's something Erin would wear HELP ME.

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

unless you're wearing it with a just past knees A line skirt and a full face of make up you should be ok.

 

[Kiki03910]

1 hour ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

unless you're wearing it with a just past knees A line skirt and a full face of make up you should be ok.

 

Lmfao more like leggings, bedhead, and no makeup. 😘

[Melissa1977]

On 6/10/2024 at 3:47 PM, Kiki03910 said:

Lmfao more like leggings, bedhead, and no makeup. 😘

Put a skirt over the leggings, you sinner!

[Kiki03910]

7 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

Put a skirt over the leggings, you sinner!

Lmfao! I think (hope) the shirt is tunic length!

[Johannah]

I just watched Erin’s “testimony” interview with her dad, in which she barely speaks. 

The summary is that he grew up going to church, and he thought it was a real church and that he was a Christian, but he actually wasn’t. He needed a friend to take him to a fellowship of Christian athletes meeting at his high school to make him realize this. (How are these still legal in public schools?? It’s crazy to me that fundies are so terrified of their kids being exposed to worldly influences, when it’s actually religious organizations allowed at public schools that coerce kids into joining fundamentalist Christian cults!)

Anyway, Gil was a 15 year old who was apparently doing a lot of beer drinking with his buddies. He thought Jesus was in his heart, but then he realized he actually wasn’t and that he might not be guaranteed a ticket to heaven. He speaks very literally about hell and the threat of hell (chains dangling over pits of fire and whatnot), and that basically his sole motivation for fundie conversion was a fear of hell.

He tells a story about quitting drinking because he saw that the Bible condemns drunkenness (Gil, drunkenness is not the same as drinking alcohol). He also says he had never read a book. Ever. Any book. At age 15. He announces this as though it is not abnormal or concerning. No wonder his children are poorly educated and lack any intellectual curiosity!

Anyway Jesus entered his heart for real, he started announcing himself to people as a Christian, became an official fundie, and the rest is history. Bill and Jane must have thought he had lost his mind and hoped this was a phase.

 

 

[Kiki03910]

11 minutes ago, Johannah said:

I just watched Erin’s “testimony” interview with her dad, in which she barely speaks. 

The summary is that he grew up going to church, and he thought it was a real church and that he was a Christian, but he actually wasn’t. He needed a friend to take him to a fellowship of Christian athletes meeting at his high school to make him realize this. (How are these still legal in public schools?? It’s crazy to me that fundies are so terrified of their kids being exposed to worldly influences, when it’s actually religious organizations allowed at public schools that coerce kids into joining fundamentalist Christian cults!)

Anyway, Gil was a 15 year old who was apparently doing a lot of beer drinking with his buddies. He thought Jesus was in his heart, but then he realized he actually wasn’t and that he might not be guaranteed a ticket to heaven. He speaks very literally about hell and the threat of hell (chains dangling over pits of fire and whatnot), and that basically his sole motivation for fundie conversion was a fear of hell.

He tells a story about quitting drinking because he saw that the Bible condemns drunkenness (Gil, drunkenness is not the same as drinking alcohol). He also says he had never read a book. Ever. Any book. At age 15. He announces this as though it is not abnormal or concerning. No wonder his children are poorly educated and lack any intellectual curiosity!

Anyway Jesus entered his heart for real, he started announcing himself to people as a Christian, became an official fundie, and the rest is history. Bill and Jane must have thought he had lost his mind and hoped this was a phase.

 

 

Poor Bill and Jane. Poor Bates brood. All this collateral damage because Gil was a dumb, drunk jock who listened to other dumb shits.

ETA: not poor Kelly Jo. She knew what she was doing; she's clearly brighter than Gil.

Edited June 15 by Kiki03910

[JermajestyDuggar]

29 minutes ago, Johannah said:

I just watched Erin’s “testimony” interview with her dad, in which she barely speaks. 

The summary is that he grew up going to church, and he thought it was a real church and that he was a Christian, but he actually wasn’t. He needed a friend to take him to a fellowship of Christian athletes meeting at his high school to make him realize this. (How are these still legal in public schools?? It’s crazy to me that fundies are so terrified of their kids being exposed to worldly influences, when it’s actually religious organizations allowed at public schools that coerce kids into joining fundamentalist Christian cults!)

Anyway, Gil was a 15 year old who was apparently doing a lot of beer drinking with his buddies. He thought Jesus was in his heart, but then he realized he actually wasn’t and that he might not be guaranteed a ticket to heaven. He speaks very literally about hell and the threat of hell (chains dangling over pits of fire and whatnot), and that basically his sole motivation for fundie conversion was a fear of hell.

He tells a story about quitting drinking because he saw that the Bible condemns drunkenness (Gil, drunkenness is not the same as drinking alcohol). He also says he had never read a book. Ever. Any book. At age 15. He announces this as though it is not abnormal or concerning. No wonder his children are poorly educated and lack any intellectual curiosity!

Anyway Jesus entered his heart for real, he started announcing himself to people as a Christian, became an official fundie, and the rest is history. Bill and Jane must have thought he had lost his mind and hoped this was a phase.

 

 

What’s interesting is that Gil/Kelly and JB/Michelle started their relationship like more mainstream conservative Christians of that time. Gil and Kelly met at college. They didn’t save their first kiss for the wedding and they dressed mainstream. Same for JB and Michelle. They started out using birth control and dressing normal. But both families got more into the IBLP when they had to homeschool their kids. That’s when they really got sucked in. The small Christian groups JB brought Michelle into and the jock who influenced Gil were not IBLP. It’s like those groups were the primers for Gothard to work his way in. 

[sixcatatty]

3 hours ago, Johannah said:

I just watched Erin’s “testimony” interview with her dad, in which she barely speaks. 

The summary is that he grew up going to church, and he thought it was a real church and that he was a Christian, but he actually wasn’t. He needed a friend to take him to a fellowship of Christian athletes meeting at his high school to make him realize this. (How are these still legal in public schools?? It’s crazy to me that fundies are so terrified of their kids being exposed to worldly influences, when it’s actually religious organizations allowed at public schools that coerce kids into joining fundamentalist Christian cults!)

Anyway, Gil was a 15 year old who was apparently doing a lot of beer drinking with his buddies. He thought Jesus was in his heart, but then he realized he actually wasn’t and that he might not be guaranteed a ticket to heaven. He speaks very literally about hell and the threat of hell (chains dangling over pits of fire and whatnot), and that basically his sole motivation for fundie conversion was a fear of hell.

He tells a story about quitting drinking because he saw that the Bible condemns drunkenness (Gil, drunkenness is not the same as drinking alcohol). He also says he had never read a book. Ever. Any book. At age 15. He announces this as though it is not abnormal or concerning. No wonder his children are poorly educated and lack any intellectual curiosity!

Anyway Jesus entered his heart for real, he started announcing himself to people as a Christian, became an official fundie, and the rest is history. Bill and Jane must have thought he had lost his mind and hoped this was a phase.

 

 

Gil, hate to break it to you but whatever you joined isn't a guaranteed ticket to heaven. That's up to God and God you ain't.

[rebeccawriter01]

3 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

What’s interesting is that Gil/Kelly and JB/Michelle started their relationship like more mainstream conservative Christians of that time. Gil and Kelly met at college. They didn’t save their first kiss for the wedding and they dressed mainstream. Same for JB and Michelle. They started out using birth control and dressing normal. But both families got more into the IBLP when they had to homeschool their kids. That’s when they really got sucked in. The small Christian groups JB brought Michelle into and the jock who influenced Gil were not IBLP. It’s like those groups were the primers for Gothard to work his way in. 

This isn't exclusive to IBLP but groups like it (Gothard was good at this) create this scenario for religious people who have needs. They present themselves as the answer to problems. Jim Bob was sent to workshops by his mother, reportedly, to be a better Christian and leader. She sent him to Gothard taught or developed ones. Gil reportedly attended one to learn more about Godly ways of getting out of debt and supporting yourself. They hook you in that way by providing a lesson that is common sense but they call it biblical messaging. It works (at least at first) and then the person comes back for more. 

Back in the 1990s and somewhat earlier churches used to agree to let groups like IBLP come in and offer seminars at their church and sell videos and books in thGe lobby. The church received a fee and members of the church thought these books and videos, etc. were church-sanctioned. Gothard himself would travel to some of these churches and offer free lessons on discipleship and outreach that he promised the church leadership would double their membership. They got the stuff into campus ministries at colleges and universities. For a while they even offered free VBS stuff to churches so that IBLP and similar language was being taught within the church.

I attended a cult awareness workshop during my graduate work that talked about how they did this. I remember seeing pics and videos of Gothard being used as an example. People feel safe in their churches and organizations. So imagine Gothard coming to your church. Your pastor embraces him. Your pastor introduces him and says nice things about him. You're going to trust that message too. 

I'm not big on the whole fundie-lite label. No matter how you dress or what you act like on social media, there is some of it still bubbling under the surface (some closer to the surface than others). Many survivors of cults have said the same thing...I am okay if life is going well but when it isn't it is harder to change my thoughts and not fall back into that mentality. 

Jim Bob and Michelle had a crisis of faith with that first miscarriage. They dove into the IBLP pool head first. From what I can tell, Gil tiptoed around it for a while and then when he found a seminar and "teacher" who said he could and should quit his job, he seemed to do his own deep dive. Kelly has a myriad of issues, but not the least of which is her loneliness and sense of abandonment not growing up with her own siblings in the same home after their parents' divorce. She was a prime target for groups like IBLP where "we're all family." 

[JermajestyDuggar]

9 hours ago, rebeccawriter01 said:

This isn't exclusive to IBLP but groups like it (Gothard was good at this) create this scenario for religious people who have needs. They present themselves as the answer to problems. Jim Bob was sent to workshops by his mother, reportedly, to be a better Christian and leader. She sent him to Gothard taught or developed ones. Gil reportedly attended one to learn more about Godly ways of getting out of debt and supporting yourself. They hook you in that way by providing a lesson that is common sense but they call it biblical messaging. It works (at least at first) and then the person comes back for more. 

Back in the 1990s and somewhat earlier churches used to agree to let groups like IBLP come in and offer seminars at their church and sell videos and books in thGe lobby. The church received a fee and members of the church thought these books and videos, etc. were church-sanctioned. Gothard himself would travel to some of these churches and offer free lessons on discipleship and outreach that he promised the church leadership would double their membership. They got the stuff into campus ministries at colleges and universities. For a while they even offered free VBS stuff to churches so that IBLP and similar language was being taught within the church.

I attended a cult awareness workshop during my graduate work that talked about how they did this. I remember seeing pics and videos of Gothard being used as an example. People feel safe in their churches and organizations. So imagine Gothard coming to your church. Your pastor embraces him. Your pastor introduces him and says nice things about him. You're going to trust that message too. 

I'm not big on the whole fundie-lite label. No matter how you dress or what you act like on social media, there is some of it still bubbling under the surface (some closer to the surface than others). Many survivors of cults have said the same thing...I am okay if life is going well but when it isn't it is harder to change my thoughts and not fall back into that mentality. 

Jim Bob and Michelle had a crisis of faith with that first miscarriage. They dove into the IBLP pool head first. From what I can tell, Gil tiptoed around it for a while and then when he found a seminar and "teacher" who said he could and should quit his job, he seemed to do his own deep dive. Kelly has a myriad of issues, but not the least of which is her loneliness and sense of abandonment not growing up with her own siblings in the same home after their parents' divorce. She was a prime target for groups like IBLP where "we're all family." 

Yes, another example of this was Gwen Shamblin. Her tapes were all over mainstream Christian churches across the US in the 90s. She got her foot in the door. And that’s likely how she got a lot of her first cult followers. 

[Father Son Holy Goat]

On 6/15/2024 at 2:03 AM, rebeccawriter01 said:

Jim Bob and Michelle had a crisis of faith with that first miscarriage. They dove into the IBLP pool head first. From what I can tell, Gil tiptoed around it for a while and then when he found a seminar and "teacher" who said he could and should quit his job, he seemed to do his own deep dive. Kelly has a myriad of issues, but not the least of which is her loneliness and sense of abandonment not growing up with her own siblings in the same home after their parents' divorce. She was a prime target for groups like IBLP where "we're all family." 

I’m not as familiar with the Bates, what are Kelly’s myriad of issues?

[Bobology]

14 hours ago, Father Son Holy Goat said:

what are Kelly’s myriad of issues?

Gil

[AussieKrissy]

14 hours ago, Bobology said:

Gil

Well you win the internet for me today. Lol
He is not her only one but def the top one lol 

[rebeccawriter01]

On 7/17/2024 at 7:37 PM, Father Son Holy Goat said:

I’m not as familiar with the Bates, what are Kelly’s myriad of issues?

Kelly's parents divorced when she was young. She was the youngest of the siblings with two older sisters and an older brother. For whatever reason their father took custody of her siblings and her mom got Kelly. Some have theorized that her separation from her siblings has created the weird dynamic with her grown children where she is more buddy than mother to them. She is fixated on her children liking her as a friend and often uses Gil as a scapegoat and enforcer to get the children to do things she wants. Example, when looking at Josie's preferred wedding dress she wanted a more modest appearance and wanted ivory or white underlay instead of skin tones. She told Josie that "Daddy" would be upset by it. When Michaela wanted Erin to be her matron of honor for her wedding, Kelly purportedly said something about Erin being recently postpartum and stepped in as matron of honor as well. 

Suffice it to say, most of her issues are in regards to how she treats her children - especially the older ones. She has made some dismissive comments in the presence of Michaela or left Michaela out altogether when referring to the married daughters - maybe because of Michaela's infertility issues? There are also some odd things with her sons where she basically disowns them and forgets them once they are married. I thought it was interesting that she gave Whitney Zach's baby book when Whitney was pregnant with their first. It just came off as he's your problem now. She also clearly plays favorites among her daughters. 

 

[JermajestyDuggar]

Erin and Chad only took Carson, Brooklyn, and William to the wedding in Oklahoma. Carson seems to get to go on all trips. He and William were the only ones who got to go to their recent trip to the farm. I don’t know if he’s ever left at home while the others get to go. 

[AussieKrissy]

27 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Erin and Chad only took Carson, Brooklyn, and William to the wedding in Oklahoma. Carson seems to get to go on all trips. He and William were the only ones who got to go to their recent trip to the farm. I don’t know if he’s ever left at home while the others get to go. 

William I get as he is most prob on the boob but Carson every time? those poor girlies, for so many reasons. 

[Melissa1977]

On 7/24/2024 at 11:44 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

Erin and Chad only took Carson, Brooklyn, and William to the wedding in Oklahoma. Carson seems to get to go on all trips. He and William were the only ones who got to go to their recent trip to the farm. I don’t know if he’s ever left at home while the others get to go. 

She usually takes the nursing baby with her when she travels. The only susprise here is taking Brook. Maybe she was a flower girl? Carson will be the favourite forever, but I wonder how Erin will react to Carson's teen ages. I bet she will get upset if he tries to be a bit independent, even with little decisions like a different dressing style o looking for a job out of the family circle.

[JDuggs]

I just watched one of Erin’s Instagram videos and she called Carson “Carson” and she called William “Willy.” So even though her intentions are to call them Charles and William, I don’t think it’s very natural for her.

I wonder if Brooklyn got to go to her uncle’s wedding because she’s started to question why only Carson gets to do all of the fun trips, and it’s starting to dawn on Erin on how unequally she treats Carson compared to the four girls. That’s probably wishful thinking.

[nolongerIFBx]

11 hours ago, JDuggs said:

I just watched one of Erin’s Instagram videos and she called Carson “Carson” and she called William “Willy.” So even though her intentions are to call them Charles and William, I don’t think it’s very natural for her.

I wonder if Brooklyn got to go to her uncle’s wedding because she’s started to question why only Carson gets to do all of the fun trips, and it’s starting to dawn on Erin on how unequally she treats Carson compared to the four girls. That’s probably wishful thinking.

Charlie would go right along with how she "ie"s everyone else's name. It seems like that would have been natural to her to call him that.

[JermajestyDuggar]

There’s a reason why nicknames exist. Because sometime a full name doesn’t seem to fit a newborn. It’s ok to give your young child a nickname and transition to a full name as an adult. 

[CanadianMamam]

On 7/24/2024 at 5:44 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

Erin and Chad only took Carson, Brooklyn, and William to the wedding in Oklahoma. Carson seems to get to go on all trips. He and William were the only ones who got to go to their recent trip to the farm. I don’t know if he’s ever left at home while the others get to go. 

I think there are a couple reasons. Erin is pretty attached to Carson, but I also think he is by far her easiest child. He comes across very gentle and sweet and easy going, the girls all seem more vivacious, especially Holland, that child seems exhausting even from short videos, she just has so much energy. 
 

I do think it is weird to only bring half the kids to a family wedding though.