Meghan and Harry 2: Now with Archie

[meep]

Yeah I don't think Meghan is necessarily an angel either. But the reasons people putting forth about this "scandal" is ridiculous, especially compared to the other royals who do things that are on par or worse, yet they get passes. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why. And if Meghan is ghastly in person, how does it justify the way the media or the royal family has treated her? I see so many comments saying "how dare Meghan do this [uh, Harry is just as responsible? He's a big boy....] after the royal family has been so welcoming!" Did everyone forget the Christmas lunch/dinner/whatever two years ago where Princess Michael wore that black slave brooch? This is a woman who told black people in public to "go back to the colonies" and has admitted to "pretending to be an African." I don't believe for a second that's a coincidence and if this is the stuff that happens in public, I can only imagine what Meghan has endured in private in that family. Mix that with the UK media calling her child a "chimpanzee" and accusing her of "putting Princess Charlotte's life in jeopardy" over her wedding flowers [*insert mega eyeroll here*] or being "vain" and "acting" over something as normal as touching her baby bump, anyone with clear eyes and ears can understand why Harry (yes, HARRY) is representing his little family in tomorrow's meetings to live life away from this vicious circus that already traumatized him 23 years ago and something he doesn't want to repeat. 

[Snarkangel Gabriel]

 Might be a bit dated now (Gordon out Dave in refers back to our last Labour PM) and is a bit British centric (Ian Huntley is a rightly-reviled murderer here but probably not known outside the UK). However, this still sums up the Daily Mail quite well.

 

 

[Pleiades_06]

58 minutes ago, Snarkangel Gabriel said:

 Might be a bit dated now (Gordon out Dave in refers back to our last Labour PM) and is a bit British centric (Ian Huntley is a rightly-reviled murderer here but probably not known outside the UK). However, this still sums up the Daily Mail quite well.

 

 

What about The Sun? I know it’s a tabloid-but where is it on the spectrum of trash?

17 hours ago, acheronbeach said:

Jesus murphy what Canadian hellhole spawned these ignoramuses?  I've never encountered that word, ever, nor any other slurs, and I've lived in various small Ontario and BC towns, a lot of the time with my racialized partner.  That said, I tend to socialize with people who are fairly educated or at least bright, so that might explain it...

 

@laPapessaGiovanna I don't really see that list as an example of the mainstream British media being racist.  Your examples prove that the Daily Mail is racist.  The Daily Mail wrote two articles pre-MM and PH's marriage that were racist, and they have  been criticized across the board by other media outlets for it.  The BBC presenter who compared Archie to a primate did so on his own  social media and was immediately fired and BBC rightfully apologized.  I was pretty surprised at how effusive most of the Brit media were toward her at the outset.  I say that just thinking back to the headlines about Waity Katy, Lazy Kate, Wisteria Sisters, Fat Frumpy Fergie, Duchess of Pork, Daddy's a Perv, Mrs. Tampon, Homewrecker, Rottweiler...

Either way it's all gone downhill.  I agree that the Fail has been racist but I'm not seeing it from the respectable and not so respectable other mags.  

You can be educated and racist. You can be bright and racist. You can be uneducated and not racist.

[viii]

On 1/11/2020 at 6:15 PM, tabitha2 said:

Please don’t yell at me but when has the the mainstream print media or Digital media ever been been racist in the least to her? In fact They usually idolize her and think she can do wrong  that I haves even. The Comments section of a Yahoo or Daily Mail is best ignored and not worth mentioning. I mean a national newspaper or News program.  The legit stuff. 
 

Seem to me If the London Times or other National paper say was so relentlessly  racist about Meghan they would looking at law suits and massive Backlash. 
 

People always claim this but where is it? 

Majority of the articles are subtle in their racism. They’re not out there calling her slurs in their headlines. It’s the negative articles in general that are the issue because Meghan gets condemned for things no one else does. Huh, I wonder why. Oh wait. 

[Pleiades_06]

I like Meghan Markle. She’s a feminist and an activist and has Chomsky’s endorsement 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/dec/01/meghan-markle-could-shake-up-monarchy-says-noam-chomsky

I think the royal family could really use this to their advantage-accepting H & M’s decision would certainly make them look more progressive in the eyes of many. Honestly, the monarchy is such a sexist, imperialist institution—they should embrace any breath of fresh air before they become completely irrelevant.

I think that one reason the royal family and the press are mad is that their departure calls into question everything about the institution. Harry is a relatively popular member, and his leaving may make younger people question its relevance. Then there’s the press: A Sun photographer was interviewed today about how photographing Harry was his livelihood. He was so frank in how this affected him-no mention of how H & M are people leading their own lives-just his selfish need for photos for the Sun.

Edited January 13, 2020 by Pleiades_06

[Seahorse Wrangler]

11 hours ago, LittleOwl said:

@HerNameIsBuffy I guess it is because they get high traffic and sales.  

For example, The Sun has Page 3 and the Evening Standard is shoved in your face on the tube after work and it's free. 

The Sun got rid of it's Page 3 girls back in 2015..

 

I was rather amused to read at the time that one of the regular Sun-Stunna  ladies was complaining about bra-less, comfortable shoe-wearing feminists spoiling it for every-one.

 

 

Meghan Vs Kate in the Bump Wars

 

Meghan vs Kate make-up wars

[LittleOwl]

5 hours ago, Seahorse Wrangler said:

The Sun got rid of it's Page 3 girls back in 2015..

Yes, but the legacy would have created lifetime readers out of habit...

[formergothardite]

7 hours ago, Seahorse Wrangler said:

Meghan Vs Kate in the Bump Wars

I didn't think about when Meghan was getting so much hate, but I went ahead and googled Kate putting her hands on her pregnant stomach. and there are tons of pictures of her doing the exact same thing. 

There is an element of racism and just loving to hate someone to Meghan being constantly crucified in the news for something Kate did and it wasn't a big deal. 

There are very real things to criticize Meghan and Harry for, but the fact that even in this thread, we have posters who put all the blame on her for their life choices shows that there is a real issue on how people are treating her. 

[just_ordinary]

12 hours ago, meep said:

Yeah I don't think Meghan is necessarily an angel either. But the reasons people putting forth about this "scandal" is ridiculous, especially compared to the other royals who do things that are on par or worse, yet they get passes. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why. And if Meghan is ghastly in person, how does it justify the way the media or the royal family has treated her? I see so many comments saying "how dare Meghan do this [uh, Harry is just as responsible? He's a big boy....] after the royal family has been so welcoming!" Did everyone forget the Christmas lunch/dinner/whatever two years ago where Princess Michael wore that black slave brooch? This is a woman who told black people in public to "go back to the colonies" and has admitted to "pretending to be an African." I don't believe for a second that's a coincidence and if this is the stuff that happens in public, I can only imagine what Meghan has endured in private in that family. Mix that with the UK media calling her child a "chimpanzee" and accusing her of "putting Princess Charlotte's life in jeopardy" over her wedding flowers [*insert mega eyeroll here*] or being "vain" and "acting" over something as normal as touching her baby bump, anyone with clear eyes and ears can understand why Harry (yes, HARRY) is representing his little family in tomorrow's meetings to live life away from this vicious circus that already traumatized him 23 years ago and something he doesn't want to repeat. 

The thing is: apart from the Duchess of Gloucester we have absolutely no proof of any mistreatment of her by the royal family. The family ‘she never had‘, Harry’s own words in the days before the wedding. You would think that if there were problems they had already realised that. There was no need to go so over the top if there were indeed resentments and struggles.
Now, I do think the fact the the Duchess felt comfortable enough to wear that brooch could be a sign that the BRF isn’t as progressive as they might want everybody to believe. But still, there have been no other incidents we know of.

It is pretty complicated because you find leaks, palace / courtier / friends sources for every angle. And while I do enjoy this conspiracy aspect I am very careful to make up my mind on it. What they personally say in public and what they actually do are much better fundaments.

9 hours ago, viii said:

Majority of the articles are subtle in their racism. They’re not out there calling her slurs in their headlines. It’s the negative articles in general that are the issue because Meghan gets condemned for things no one else does. Huh, I wonder why. Oh wait.There is still a difference between saying that the articles show racism or saying she got very bad press because let’s face it, drama with royal females is always a click worthy story. It don’t argue that we have seen the ugly face of racism with Meghan and I do think this must be addressed and legally prosecuted if possible. But I would also argue that 75% of what happens is not out of the ordinary compared to what other European royal ladies had to endure. Doesn’t make it nice though.

 It was clear that the tabloids would be playing the duchesses against each other. Everyone who thought differently is delusional. Kate got shit right up to Harry’s wedding. People celebrated that this power driven work shy grifter would be upstaged by an accomplished, educated woman that has even had a real career. Now the narrative has changed.  Lots of people have obviously not been around when Kate was pregnant with her first two. Because people did relentlessly criticise her for touching her bump. At least in comment sections. She was accused of using her pregnancies to secure her role and as excuse to be lazy instead of working. People hate her make up that makes her look like a panda, and people detected so many breeches of protocol it is miracle she is still allowed around the Queen. Wiliam just settled for her but cheats frequently, she is a slap in the face for every modern woman and how she fills her role is a danger for feminism. His family hates her and his friends make fun of her middle class upbringing. Kate knows everything better, is incredible high maintenance, makes staff retire/quit, doesn’t listen to advice. She hates other women and destroys Wiliams friendships..... and that’s just right on top of my head without even thinking hard about it. Yadayadayada Nothing new here. At least half of these topics were covered with Meghan as well. I don’t see how this makes them racist (we have had examples that definitely were. No one is denying that). And while the approach of royal females is much worse so there is definitely systemic sexism at play, Wiliam and now Harry get a good load of bad press for themselves.

I am still a fan of Meghan (less so if Harry but it’s not as if I dislike him). Removing yourself from a harmful situation is a good idea. I stated weeks ago that they should decide if they want to play part in this circus or not. They might have decided it’s not for them. That’s great. They can have their own stage to do things as they want. They could be very successful. They are free people after all. But that is at this point not what they did. They still want to be royals and leave this backdoor open. I honestly believe that if they issued a statement, renouncing their professional ties (titles, finances and the added pressure and perks) people would have supported them all the way. Apart from haters but those would hopefully found piece in the fact that they would be rid of them.

The decisions that are going to be made will likely be precedents for the next generations. A quick fix might be to give them what they want, sit out criticism and it might go away. But if they concerned about the survival of their monarchy a complete break might be the best decision. Everyone who is not the heir apparent (down the line) could be a private citizens without further titles. Or at least hold them off of using it as a brand label or for personal gain. And with how things have gone south, I don’t think an interview about how bad it  all was, AFTER you didn’t get what you wanted wouldn’t change the public’s perception. It would look like revenge. And when you keep quiet for payment it doesn’t shine a favourable light on your character in my books.
 

@formergothardite: I do agree. It’s pretty troublesome that people blame all this on her. Harry has shown glimpses that made careful observers predict a similar outcome years ago. 

[ViolaSebastian]

 

[just_ordinary]

20 minutes ago, ViolaSebastian said:

 

Especially love the comparison between the Kent’s and Tywin Lannister. Hilarious 

[Bajovane]

Princess Michael of Kent is widely known to be a racist bitch and she isn't exactly thought of kindly by most of the royals.  I'm sure she was given hell by the senior royals for that brooch.   

Seeing how readily Meghan has tossed her own family aside, it's not surprising she expects Harry to do the same.   She wants to make mega millions off of Harry's position without even considering how the Queen would feel about that.  I don't see this marriage lasting much longer.   She'll dump Harry as soon as she realizes that this mega million dollar empire fails to get off the ground. 

William was right about Harry going way too fast with the relationship.  Meghan evidently had zero plans to assimilate into the BRF.  

[adidas]

The Queen has released a statement:

Today my family had very constructive discussions on the future of my grandson and his family.

My family and I are entirely supportive of Harry and Meghan's desire to create a new life as a young family.

Although we would have preferred them to remain full-time working Members of the Royal Family, we respect and understand their wish to live a more independent life as a family while remaining a valued part of my family.

Harry and Meghan have made clear that they do not want to be reliant on public funds in their new lives.

It has therefore been agreed that there will be a period of transition in which the Sussexes will spend time in Canada and the UK.

These are complex matters for my family to resolve, and there is some more work to be done, but I have asked for final decisions to be reached in the coming days.

[viii]

The Queen's statement seems sad. I'm sure this is all very upsetting for her, since she's so traditional. However, it's good that she's at least putting on a public display of support for Harry and Meghan. I just hope it's carried through privately as well. Harry and the Queen always seemed to have a special bond, and so I hope that isn't destroyed. 

I also like the joint statement that William and Harry released together. People on official platforms need to stop publishing their speculations as facts. 

48 minutes ago, Bajovane said:

Seeing how readily Meghan has tossed her own family aside, it's not surprising she expects Harry to do the same. 

What an absolute garbage statement. Meghan appears to be very close to her mother. If you're speaking about the rift between her and her father and half-siblings, any moron can understand why Meghan has distanced herself from such toxic, harmful people.

Harry is a grown ass man, and has spoken about this issue years before he ever met Meghan, so I'm not sure why she's getting the full brunt of your blame. Oh wait, yes I do. 

[Bajovane]

Oh wait,  no you don't.   Meghan was once close to her father.  He invested in her education and gave her the advantage she needed to get to where she ended up in life.  Supposedly she loved him.  Did he screw up?  Yes, with help from his other daughter.  She and Harry probably should have handled the situation better than they did, maybe he wouldn't have felt so intimidated.

Harry's a grown man, but even he doesn't seem to value his own true friendships and instead seems to look towards Hollywood celebrity "friends".  Walking away from his own family is not going to end well.   I guarantee Meghan will drop him eventually.  

 

[adidas]

There seem to be a lot of posts alluding to Harry being forced into his role and hating it for a long time.

Harry was not forced to be a full time working royal. He left his desk job (one which was out of the public eye) because he wanted to be a full time working royal.

Now, I’m not saying that just because you choose a particular career path you must stick with it if you don’t like it - there are many people who change careers and I support that 100%. We change as we get older so we seek different paths for our future. I have no problem with that. I’m posting this because of the idea being alluded to: that Harry has never had a choice and was plodding along miserably, ball and chain being dragged behind him, to every public event he was forced to attend.

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.standard.co.uk/panewsfeeds/army-desk-job-for-prince-harry-9067396.html%3famp

https://time.com/3747314/prince-harry-career-army-charity/

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/prince-harry-to-quit-armed-forces-world-exclusive-end-military-career-more-charity-work-10074631.html%3famp

This is a guy who proudly and wonderfully created the Invictus Games. He has spoken up for servicemen and women, as well as climate change and mental health services, and until recently he did so with clear, obvious joy and happiness. He was not forced to do these things, he had a choice.

[hoipolloi]

2 hours ago, Bajovane said:

Princess Michael of Kent is widely known to be a racist bitch and she isn't exactly thought of kindly by most of the royals.  I'm sure she was given hell by the senior royals for that brooch.   

If so, it wasn't Prince Philip who rebuked Princess Michael.

For that matter, the Queen Mum was solidly colonial, and racist in her outlook, though she hid it pretty well from the public, with help from protective media & friends.

 

[Pleiades_06]

2 hours ago, Bajovane said:

Princess Michael of Kent is widely known to be a racist bitch and she isn't exactly thought of kindly by most of the royals.  I'm sure she was given hell by the senior royals for that brooch.   

 

Princess Michael was born in Nazi Germany ?

[viii]

29 minutes ago, Bajovane said:

She and Harry probably should have handled the situation better than they did, maybe he wouldn't have felt so intimidated.

You literally have ZERO idea of how they handled the situation. All you know is what was released in the media, and it's hardly accurate. Pretty bold of you to assume you know the inner workings of a family you've likely never met. 

[Bajovane]

3 minutes ago, viii said:

You literally have ZERO idea of how they handled the situation. All you know is what was released in the media, and it's hardly accurate. Pretty bold of you to assume you know the inner workings of a family you've likely never met. 

And who appointed you as the expert then?  Your entire quote can say the same thing about your own statements.

Hypocrisy galore here sweetie. 

 

[viii]

19 minutes ago, Bajovane said:

And who appointed you as the expert then?  Your entire quote can say the same thing about your own statements.

Hypocrisy galore here sweetie. 

 

LOL ok honey~

[FloraKitty35]

9 hours ago, just_ordinary said:

The thing is: apart from the Duchess of Gloucester we have absolutely no proof of any mistreatment of her by the royal family. The family ‘she never had‘, Harry’s own words in the days before the wedding. You would think that if there were problems they had already realised that. There was no need to go so over the top if there were indeed resentments and struggles.
Now, I do think the fact the the Duchess felt comfortable enough to wear that brooch could be a sign that the BRF isn’t as progressive as they might want everybody to believe. But still, there have been no other incidents we know of.

It is pretty complicated because you find leaks, palace / courtier / friends sources for every angle. And while I do enjoy this conspiracy aspect I am very careful to make up my mind on it. What they personally say in public and what they actually do are much better fundaments.

 It was clear that the tabloids would be playing the duchesses against each other. Everyone who thought differently is delusional. Kate got shit right up to Harry’s wedding. People celebrated that this power driven work shy grifter would be upstaged by an accomplished, educated woman that has even had a real career. Now the narrative has changed.  Lots of people have obviously not been around when Kate was pregnant with her first two. Because people did relentlessly criticise her for touching her bump. At least in comment sections. She was accused of using her pregnancies to secure her role and as excuse to be lazy instead of working. People hate her make up that makes her look like a panda, and people detected so many breeches of protocol it is miracle she is still allowed around the Queen. Wiliam just settled for her but cheats frequently, she is a slap in the face for every modern woman and how she fills her role is a danger for feminism. His family hates her and his friends make fun of her middle class upbringing. Kate knows everything better, is incredible high maintenance, makes staff retire/quit, doesn’t listen to advice. She hates other women and destroys Wiliams friendships..... and that’s just right on top of my head without even thinking hard about it. Yadayadayada Nothing new here. At least half of these topics were covered with Meghan as well. I don’t see how this makes them racist (we have had examples that definitely were. No one is denying that). And while the approach of royal females is much worse so there is definitely systemic sexism at play, Wiliam and now Harry get a good load of bad press for themselves.

I am still a fan of Meghan (less so if Harry but it’s not as if I dislike him). Removing yourself from a harmful situation is a good idea. I stated weeks ago that they should decide if they want to play part in this circus or not. They might have decided it’s not for them. That’s great. They can have their own stage to do things as they want. They could be very successful. They are free people after all. But that is at this point not what they did. They still want to be royals and leave this backdoor open. I honestly believe that if they issued a statement, renouncing their professional ties (titles, finances and the added pressure and perks) people would have supported them all the way. Apart from haters but those would hopefully found piece in the fact that they would be rid of them.

The decisions that are going to be made will likely be precedents for the next generations. A quick fix might be to give them what they want, sit out criticism and it might go away. But if they concerned about the survival of their monarchy a complete break might be the best decision. Everyone who is not the heir apparent (down the line) could be a private citizens without further titles. Or at least hold them off of using it as a brand label or for personal gain. And with how things have gone south, I don’t think an interview about how bad it  all was, AFTER you didn’t get what you wanted wouldn’t change the public’s perception. It would look like revenge. And when you keep quiet for payment it doesn’t shine a favourable light on your character in my books.
 

@formergothardite: I do agree. It’s pretty troublesome that people blame all this on her. Harry has shown glimpses that made careful observers predict a similar outcome years ago. 

I thought the blackamoor brooch was Princess Michael of Kent , not the Duchess of Gloucester.

[JenniferJuniper]

Seriously...let's not get so worked up over these insanely privileged people.

[LittleOwl]

@FloraKitty35 It was Michael of Kent, you're right.

[formergothardite]

1 hour ago, Bajovane said:

Meghan was once close to her father.  He invested in her education and gave her the advantage she needed to get to where she ended up in life.  Supposedly she loved him.  Did he screw up?  Yes, with help from his other daughter. 

 Thomas Markle was a grown ass man who can make his own damn choices. He chose to do all this.  And he not only used his daughter to make money he also then lied to her future husband about it. He then went on several more TV shows to tell "his side" of the story and make money. 

He said really awful shit like this:

Quote

would] be nothing without me. I made her the Duchess she is today.

If this was any of the fundie dads we talked about, people would be cheering her cutting off toxic relatives. One thing I've learned in therapy is that just because a parent has paid for something, you don't need to feel obligated to them when they behave in toxic ways.  So him paying for her education is irrelevant. 

I don't know Meghan, I don't know how she feels about her dad, but you can love your parents while also not wanting them to be in your lives. Love isn't having to keep a toxic parent who has used you for money and fame in your life. And that is what he did. 

I do think it will be shitty if they start making money off their royal name. If you don't want to be royals, then don't be royals. No making money off royalty.