Willis Family including rape charges

[faraway]

5 hours ago, Whydon'ttheyspeakintongues said:

Let me guess: Satan got a hold of him and the devil made him do it....

I just hope that law enforcement takes this seriously.  No prayers followed by forgiveness.

If he wants to be forgiven by his "god" then that's his business.

Those of us here on earth want to start seeing justice.

I doubt this would be their approach, they lived too much in the real world. I truly believe their world has been shaken to the core, those kids were taught to be their absolute best and the parents were their only mentors. They also worked all by themselves, Jeanette managed the social media. They would have gotten the backlash in full force directly into their lives. Deleting was probably the best thing. I have a feeling if those allegations prove to be true, their world and everything they stand for will fall apart. It wouldn't surprise me if the band will be done as well.

[RosyDaisy]

Let me guess: Satan got a hold of him and the devil made him do it....

I just hope that law enforcement takes this seriously.  No prayers followed by forgiveness.

If he wants to be forgiven by his "god" then that's his business.

Those of us here on earth want to start seeing justice.

This! The victim has been dealing with this for 12 years. She deserves justice.

[MorningMist]

7 hours ago, socalrules said:

I don't know much about the Willis family other than seeing the commercials for their show and reading a little about them here. So I have a question. Were they always a fundy family or did something happen to lead them down that road? I ask because if what is alleged is true, I was wondering if 2004 is when they turned to a fundy lifestyle. Most fundies seem to have some event that makes them close themselves off from the world. I was wondering if that was the case here. 

I've been following a few fans of them and stuff and I've seen the show and they kinda addressed it on the show. 

The parent's grew up incredibly fundy and had like no dancing at their wedding that the mum (Brenda) really wished she had done differently. Because they didn't like their upbringing, they've kinda forced the kids to live for them sort of so they are all champion dancers/musicians/wrestlers (which was the dad's high school sport). They still believe in gender roles, and no premarital sex but like the kids usually don't have a chaperone unless they are far away from the parents or something. They watch star wars, play video games and have a dog named after a wood in lord of the rings, and are big harry potter fans, so they aren't too far removed from pop culture. They even know hip hop so Ben can fit right in with them!

I would say they were borderline fundy, they seem to have a foot in each world. But that's the kids, the parents still grew up fundy, it probably messed them up - case in point.

[Natalie22]

I think we need to be a bit more careful with how we talk about this.  Some people have mentioned multiple victims, but so far he has only been charged with one count of rape, which means one known victim.  It is possible that there are more, but since there is no evidence of this, I think it would be better to keep to the facts as this is bad enough.

I feel horrible for his kids though.  He's set up his family so all his children idolize him.  I'm sure the younger bunch are having a really hard time with it too.  Since it seems the oldest has now separated herself from the family a bit, I wonder how that is playing out.  Also, with his decision to not get another rental property until they finish their current tour, it's going to be very hard on those kids to not feel like they have a safe place to retreat to, not to mention tough on the older ones who may want to have their own private discussions on this.

I also wonder if his wife knew at all.  Some, like Michelle have covered up these things in the past, but that was her own child, so maybe it's too different from this situation.  I can't imagine how she's taking it if she just found out.  Infidelity is hard enough, but to know your husband cheated on you by raping a child younger than her eldest child, that would be incredibly hard to process.

[JesusPony]

Not surprised. Never surprised with these super-controlling, purity-obsessed fundies. Now, the oldest daughter moving out of the family home without getting married, like a normal young adult? That was shocking to me.

I feel bad for the rest of the family. That's a lot of lives to put back together.

I'm trying not to think about the things that seemed questionable to me before this news broke - particularly, the manly manliness the boys were expected to display.

[mstee]

I watched the show a few times. I never liked how the dad was very forceful about what he wanted. I remember this episode where he wanted his daughter to practice singing, and she was crying with anxiety over it. You could tell she wanted to just say "no!", but wasn't allowed to. I didn't think at the time, well he's an obvious rapist or anything, but I thought the way he imposed his will onto his kids was over the top. And you could definitely see how the parents wanted to live out their dream childhoods through their kids. Those poor kids. Either this is rocking their world or they are secretly relieved. 

[Cleopatra7]

I never followed this family and only knew that they were another singing fundie group. Based on the what others have said, it seems like an odd mix of fundie beliefs and stage parenting, which is probably a special brand of toxicity. Hopefully, the kids have skills to make it apart from their reality show/show business identities, because I don't see that continuing.

[Pukingpearl]

2 hours ago, Natalie22 said:

I think we need to be a bit more careful with how we talk about this.  Some people have mentioned multiple victims, but so far he has only been charged with one count of rape, which means one known victim.  It is possible that there are more, but since there is no evidence of this, I think it would be better to keep to the facts as this is bad enough.

I feel horrible for his kids though.  He's set up his family so all his children idolize him.  I'm sure the younger bunch are having a really hard time with it too.  Since it seems the oldest has now separated herself from the family a bit, I wonder how that is playing out.  Also, with his decision to not get another rental property until they finish their current tour, it's going to be very hard on those kids to not feel like they have a safe place to retreat to, not to mention tough on the older ones who may want to have their own private discussions on this.

I also wonder if his wife knew at all.  Some, like Michelle have covered up these things in the past, but that was her own child, so maybe it's too different from this situation.  I can't imagine how she's taking it if she just found out.  Infidelity is hard enough, but to know your husband cheated on you by raping a child younger than her eldest child, that would be incredibly hard to process.

I think my biggest problem with fundies isolating themselves through homeschooling/home church has to do with this idolization. Even if nothing this extreme happens, your parents are going to let you down at some point, and it's probably earth shattering for these kids in a way it would never be for someone in our culture. They're taught their whole lives that their parents are the ultimate authority and are protecting them and guiding them, and then they discover they're just as flawed as the people they're supposed to be protected from. On top of all that, then they don't have outside support to turn to because their whole world is a bubble. 

I can only imagine  the feelings those kids are having now that their idol is being accused of rape.

[Whydon'ttheyspeakintongues]

7 minutes ago, Pukingpearl said:

I think my biggest problem with fundies isolating themselves through homeschooling/home church has to do with this idolization. Even if nothing this extreme happens, your parents are going to let you down at some point, and it's probably earth shattering for these kids in a way it would never be for someone in our culture. They're taught their whole lives that their parents are the ultimate authority and are protecting them and guiding them, and then they discover they're just as flawed as the people they're supposed to be protected from. On top of all that, then they don't have outside support to turn to because their whole world is a bubble. 

I can only imagine  the feelings those kids are having now that their idol is being accused of rape.

And most fundies would have limited places to go for help.  Any church contacts are likely connected to the family.  They don't have school counsellors/teachers/parents of friends that would be guaranteed to take an impartial approach and do what the could for the child. 

[Four is Enough]

Is there any hope that this dad will simply take the punishment handed to him and NOT blame the victim? I just don't think I could stomach hearing another set of ridiculous rationalizations such as, "satan", "skimpy clothing", "defrauded me", "tempted me"... just plead guilty, do your time, apologize to the victim, and have done!!!!

[unsafetydancer]

I hadn't really heard much of these guys until yesterday.

Really horrible for the kids, I hope that the only one who is made to suffer is the family member who actually committed a crime. The kids seem a bit more in touch with the real world from what I have been able to learn by googling them so they might have a shot at a normal life. I really hope so.

1 hour ago, Four is Enough said:

Is there any hope that this dad will simply take the punishment handed to him and NOT blame the victim? I just don't think I could stomach hearing another set of ridiculous rationalizations such as, "satan", "skimpy clothing", "defrauded me", "tempted me"... just plead guilty, do your time, apologize to the victim, and have done!!!!

It would be good if this happened for once and it would mean that the victim doesn't have to relive their experience all over again in court. The defense lawyers can come up with some horrible excuses for their client and lay the blame on the victim even when both the abuser and the victim are not fundies.

[faraway]

I doubt we'll hear about satan and skimpy clothing, they don't do modest dress themselves. Plus we're talking straight-on child rape here, the Willis' don't strike me as dumb enough to use this kind of excuses.

Since this happened so long ago, my best guess is, he'll simply deny the charges. A.i. someone wants to harm his beautiful, talented, succesful family. 

[JesusPony]

The horrible stage dad episode is on YouTube:

Hope he stays locked up for a while, so those kids can breathe.

[unsafetydancer]

Wow even just from the intro this guy looks like a dick.

[CharlieInCharge]

I haven't been a follower of this family, but this scandal makes me wonder about their producer - Sean Overbeeke. He was the producer on the Duggars from early on until about three years or so ago. Then he went to produce the Willis family show which he is still currently doing according to his Twitter. He is based in TN and seems to have been in charge of shooting and packaging the families for TLC. 

Does he have a scandal-sense or something? Is he drawn to a-holes like JB and now the Willis dad? Did he know/hope drama would unfold? I dunno, but it just bugs me for some reason. 

 

Please note I am making no suggestions or accusations about the guy, but if he had a hand in the HBB show then I call shenanigans. 

[unsafetydancer]

@CharlieInCharge it's a spooky coincidence at the very least.

[holierthanyou]

FundyHumper Award 2016 goes to People Magazine, for their article published yesterday titled "4 Things to Know About the Willis Clan", and write a folksy little article where the author appears to not think "The father was arrested for raping a child" need to make the top 4 list...

 

But the fact the kids have J names merited one of those coveted top 4 spots.

 

The wretched article

[faraway]

One thing I would really like to know: Do they have anyone working for them or did all the organization go through Brenda? If yes, I assume her phone has been ringing a lot lately.

[AmazonGrace]

Oh that video is so sad, the kids are even guilt tripping each other for not having enough creative ideas to compose an album or whatever.

[lilwriter85]

1 hour ago, faraway said:

One thing I would really like to know: Do they have anyone working for them or did all the organization go through Brenda? If yes, I assume her phone has been ringing a lot lately.

I was wondering about that too. Seeing as how they live in Nashville they might have one of those PR people on tap who handles dealings for multiple lesser known bands/artists.

[amendgitan]

21 hours ago, doubleT said:

Wow, I was shocked when I heard about this earlier today. 

I've watched the show a few times, but its been awhile.  I never really cared much for the mom or the dad and I worried about the oldest son.  But I didn't think this.  Very, very sad. 

My thoughts go out to the children and certainly the victim.   

What worried you about the oldest son if I may ask? I watched very little of their program but I did watch their dance competition sets and researched a bit about the family. So I'm not that familiar with what's gone on, on the show. 

[choralcrusader8613]

Just now, amendgitan said:

What worried you about the oldest son if I may ask? I watched very little of their program but I did watch their dance competition sets and researched a bit about the family. So I'm not that familiar with what's gone on, on the show. 

I know that some of the other kids on the show called Jair "moody" and would talk about him getting in a state where people would have to get him out of his own head.

[amendgitan]

On May 23, 2016 at 2:54 AM, sockinshoe said:

 I occasionally watch the Williseseses on YouTube. The kids are all pretty great: talented, polite, engaged. Everything the Duggars aren't. However, I find myself completely unable to get into the kids' storylines because the dad is so creepy. This man feels the urge to micromanage every damn thing and can't let anybody go for even 5 minutes. The kids are all really talented and accomplished, but you wonder if they're happy or well-adjusted or doing any of this of their own volition. The way he plays favourites and takes such obvious pleasure in managing his children's lives is kind of gross. All his contrived and ridiculous institutions (family court and having to wrestle prospective in-laws, anyone?!) are things he made up because it makes his family seem more whimsical and eccentric. I doubt any of this stuff happens when cameras aren't rolling. It's like he's playing a game of the sims. 

Wow. Talk about foreshadowing. You got a bad vibe and now this. 

On September 9, 2016 at 8:44 PM, countingblessings said:

Nothing surprises me much anymore when it comes to fundie families. I was kind of fond of them in a way since they fell on the more 'normal' side as far as fundie families go. They played at a local festival and really seemed okay. Im heartbroken for his wife and kids. 

They may wear pants but they are part of the Christian Patriarchy and research is pretty clear that sexual abuse, sexual predation, child abuse and domestic violence are considerably more common in such cultures. 

On September 10, 2016 at 10:24 AM, Tiny Bubbles said:

Ah geez. Watching him on the show I would think to myself that he was probably such a b***ard when the cameras weren't around - but I didn't see this coming. Wonder if more victims will come forward. 

I hope not but I'm not holding my breath. And I hope his kids aren't victims too. But anyone who can rape a little child is a danger to his own kids. 

Nevetheless, many predators who assault non-family never had their own in any way. And there's not if to suggest anything like that has happened here. 

But predatory types often have general "boundary" issues that can be transmitted to the whole family. Things like enmeshment. Control issues. Crossing of roles into ones that aren't natural. 

In retrospect, the little I've seen of the family I did see a couple things that bothered me. One, the lack of independence of the adults who were all living and controlled by their parents as if they were underage teens. That's always a red flag to me. 

Two, the dancing between the siblings. Some of the routines I saw on competition videos were suggestive. I'm not prudish at all. But when it's two siblings, espeically grown, and they're holding each other's waists and hugging from behind with their hands right under their sister 's boobs, or doing "sexy" little moves with flirtatious smiles and glances and butt wiggles with each other's siblings in a dance routine,  it just seems slightly boundary crossing to me. 

And if there is a member of the family who is a predator, that can translate to overall boundary issues among the family as a whole. And please note I am not talking about incest or sexual abuse in the family. That hasn't been reported. 

18 hours ago, hollyandivy said:

And I was hoping that just maybe he had an affair with a 17 year old or so... there goes that theory.

I just don't get it, aren't there any "normal" fundie families? Without huge skeletons in the closet???????

I think it's common for there to be this kind of thing within these cultures. 

http://philpapers.org/rec/BROCPA-4

http://psycnet.apa.org/psycinfo/1991-97446-001

http://people.auc.ca/redmond/Documents to upload/VirtuesSRedmond.pdf

https://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=&id=YpBLAwAAQBAJ&oi=fnd&pg=PA9&dq=Christian+patriarchy+abuse&ots=sPZKajX8XB&sig=RuPyMO6bU38ohkMHIpjJV2YDuXk

https://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=&id=WhhCQY_7sogC&oi=fnd&pg=PR9&dq=Christian+patriarchy+abuse&ots=6oXYm7c16P&sig=qudTDpCtKQudAneJxMO0Fb52_CY

 

7 hours ago, JesusPony said:

Not surprised. Never surprised with these super-controlling, purity-obsessed fundies. Now, the oldest daughter moving out of the family home without getting married, like a normal young adult? That was shocking to me.

I feel bad for the rest of the family. That's a lot of lives to put back together.

I'm trying not to think about the things that seemed questionable to me before this news broke - particularly, the manly manliness the boys were expected to display.

Can you elaborate on the last paragraph? I didn't watch the show really. 

6 hours ago, Pukingpearl said:

I think my biggest problem with fundies isolating themselves through homeschooling/home church has to do with this idolization. Even if nothing this extreme happens, your parents are going to let you down at some point, and it's probably earth shattering for these kids in a way it would never be for someone in our culture. They're taught their whole lives that their parents are the ultimate authority and are protecting them and guiding them, and then they discover they're just as flawed as the people they're supposed to be protected from. On top of all that, then they don't have outside support to turn to because their whole world is a bubble. 

I can only imagine  the feelings those kids are having now that their idol is being accused of rape.

Great point. 

[JesusPony]

Can you elaborate on the last paragraph? I didn't watch the show really. 

On their shows and on their various websites/social media, they have posted images of the boys - some as young teens - working out or rehearsing shirtless, often with comments about their physique. We joke about defrauding, but what purpose would sharing these pictures - particularly of the underage kids - serve? I haven't come up with any good answers.

[amendgitan]

5 hours ago, JesusPony said:

The horrible stage dad episode is on YouTube:

Hope he stays locked up for a while, so those kids can breathe.

Man. Is it just me or do all of them just seem so exhausted? Dad and some of the kids seem to have slightly slurred speech to me. 

And yeah. Totally overbearing. Ugh. The daughter is it Jessie? Who he ranting about needing to teach her younger sibling to sing like her? She seemed totally over it and barely able to tolerate her father. 

Talk about living through your kids.