The Harris Brothers On Feminism

[debrand]

I searched the Rebelution website and discovered an article on feminism by one of the two brothes. On a positive note, they don't appear to think that women should be uneducated or not vote. Of course, they have no idea what feminism actually stands for.

therebelution.com/blog/2006/10/feminism-and-biblical-roles/

Here are some quotes from the article.

From a Christian perspective, the development of such a movement is entirely predictable. In the book of Genesis, chapter 3, verse 16, after sin enters the world for the first time, God says to the guilty Eve: “Your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you.â€

This word “desire†is properly translated as, “a desire to conquerâ€, and implies that Eve would have a wrongful desire to usurp authority over her husband. Furthermore, the word “rule†as used in the phrase, “he shall rule over you,†is a strong term usually used to refer to monarchical governments and containing nuances of dictatorial or absolute, uncaring use of authority.

The feminist movement understandably responded to this type of male dominance, but with an unwavering tendency towards female usurpation—a Biblically predictable scenario. At its core, however, feminism seeks to promote equality and combat harsh male dominance, two necessary and worthy goals.

Some of the commentors try to correct Brett's interpretation of the verse

Tefnut Says:

January 27th, 2007 at 10:35 am

Sorry, guys, the bible quote you bring doesn’t work that way. In the original Hebrew it says ‘Ve’el ishech tshukatech,’ which literaly translates as “and to you man your passion/desire.†The construction of the sentence can only mean “your man will be your desire.’ There is no way to read the original Hebrew in the way you propose….

invisible_hand Says:

January 27th, 2007 at 5:15 pm

sorry. this was not a very well-researched piece, from a biblical-studies stand-point.

the words in Gen 3:16 “your desire†(or translated as “your urge†by the NJPS) is found in the Hebrew original as “Teshukateikh.†this word has explicit connotations of sexual desire, not of political overthrow. Song of Songs (Canticle) 7:11 has “Ani L’Dodi V’Eilai TESHUKATO†(â€I am for my beloved, and my DESIRED one is for me,†tran. my own).

please do the philological reserch before you claim to know what the Bible is saying. I am a bible major, and it’s just insulting, especially when you use God’s word to do this.

Brett Harris Says:

January 28th, 2007 at 5:35 pm

Tefnut and Invisible_Hand: Our interpretation of the Hebrew word desire (Heb. “teshuqahâ€) is taken from Dr. Wayne Grudem’s, Systematic Theology and also from Susan T. Foh’s effective argument in “What Is Woman’s Desire?†This article, though far from perfect, does not reflect carelessness on our part. While I am not aware of Susan Foh’s credentials off the top of my head, Dr. Wayne Grudem has his B.A. from Harvard, his M.Div. from Westminster Theological Seminary, and his Ph.D. from Cambridge. It is his interpretation and his credentials that you take issue with.

Brett got a little snippy, didn't he?

[debrand]

So which is better: feminism or the Bible?

What an odd question. Feminism doesn't claim to be a religion. There is no reason that a Christian can't be a feminist.

Some more of his thoughts

Especially today, feminism attempts to reach equality by abolishing all distinctions between man and woman, based on the assumption that to be equal is to be identical. The Bible, on the other hand, assumes equality from the very beginning and uses that equality as a guard against abuse either in the form of male dominance or female usurpation

The Bible predicts that if the feminist movement reaches equality, it will not stop there. Instead, woman will replace men as the dominators—and perhaps that is their true goal.

[Austin]

So clueless. They must actually work at it.

[liltwinstar]

No, feminism doesn't try to "erase" distinctions between men and women!!! Things like family leave laws help men to be better/more involved fathers (and sons, if they're caring for aging parents) as well as helping women to have an equal footing in the workplace.

Helping women helps families. Strong, supportive families help men to be better people, more successful, more caring, etc etc. Why can't people see this? Feminism helps men too!

[desertvixen]

Why can't people see this? Feminism helps men too!

Because they're too busy being hung up on stupid ideas like feminism turning us women into man-hating, non-shaving, multiple-cat-owning ugly fat bitches with no sense of humor? Plus, feminists would actually hold men responsible for doing stuff like providing family care, and they'd stop getting cookies for changing one diaper.

It's an argument I have with my partner (who is from a more conservative background than I am) and I think we're finally making some progress.