TTC

[flyawaystray]

We call it a crop sharing service. You get a box of veggies, no fruit. It is expensive, the one I looked up is $586 for 26 weeks. I absolutely can't afford that. It may be cheaper in other areas, but that is the price here on Long Island through one of the farms.

There is an option to add fruit but that costs more money.

[BlondeAgent007]

We have a lot of crop shares in my area. The first link I clicked is $600/6 months, which comes out to $25 or less a week. It includes vegetables, any seasonal fruit, and a dozen brown free range eggs a week. During peak summer months, a full share gets a bushel of produce for the week. It's a little expensive, but everything is fresh, seasonal, and delivered to your home. I think the fruit and eggs make it worth the money.

[Conuly]

Over here it is CSA, Community Supported Agriculture.

The price varies, but the one I use ranges from $340 for the single share at the subsidized rate to $830 for the double share at the other end of the sliding scale, for six months of food every week. That rate does not include eggs, meat, milk, yogurt, honey, maple syrup, or fruit. And they accept food stamps.

It's pricier than buying at the supermarket, but a lot cheaper than buying the same produce at the farmer's market. I know, they write up a price comparison every week and send it home!

Most importantly, even if our budget gets completely fucked later on if, say, somebody loses their job, I can rest assured that we always have food coming in. The slightly greater expense compared to supermarket food is worth it to know that if push comes to shove I don't *need* to go shopping in any given week. To me, the psychological benefit of that pays for itself.

August, I must say, even at $3 a pound I don't think lentils are that pricy you should not risk wasting them. You know what, I have to run by the store again today. I'm going to try to con the butcher out of chicken skins. While I'm there, I'll take a picture of the price on the lentils. Then we can trust that none of us is fudging in these price comparisons!

Edit: I did the math, and $586 for 26 weeks is $22.50 a week. This, of course, is another example of poverty costing more. $22.50 a week is cheaper, probably, than the same food bought weekly, but only if you have the money upfront.

[Anny Nym]

THX all for the info, crop sharing is a lovely term :D

@ "poverty costing more" , I just saw a interesting documentary uploaded on youtube about this topic. It was tied to "inner city food deserts" <- I don´t get this: Why do US supermarket chains not build a store at inner cities? Don´t they miss out on alot of profit possibility?

Plus there was a discussion, this may have racist reasons. As I only have a foreign POV on that, so what do you US FJer think: Are food deserts tied to racism?

[E Street Fan]

THX all for the info, crop sharing is a lovely term :D

@ "poverty costing more" , I just saw a interesting documentary uploaded on youtube about this topic. It was tied to "inner city food deserts" <- I don´t get this: Why do US supermarket chains not build a store at inner cities? Don´t they miss out on alot of profit possibility?

Plus there was a discussion, this may have racist reasons. As I only have a foreign POV on that, so what do you US FJer think: Are food deserts tied to racism?

I do think food deserts are linked to racism. I heard a number of discussions about retail stores in Detroit during the twelve years I worked for Walmart. Almost every conversation ended with, "Can you imagine what the shrink would be in a Detroit store?!" Because, you know, all Detroiters are thieves. :roll: (There is a LOT of racism at Walmart, anyway. Largely Black stores are considered inferior to "good" stores even if they have superior sales and better shrink numbers. And I saw relatively few Black salaried managers, especially at the store manager or market level.)

There is a Whole Foods in Detroit's Eastern Market now. I like that there is fresh, healthy food available in Detroit, albeit not in a highly residential area. On the other hand, I know very few people who can afford to shop there. I think of that store as meant for hipsters and more affluent people, not for ordinary Detroiters and Michiganians.

[Anny Nym]

I do think food deserts are linked to racism. I heard a number of discussions about retail stores in Detroit during the twelve years I worked for Walmart. Almost every conversation ended with, "Can you imagine what the shrink would be in a Detroit store?!" Because, you know, all Detroiters are thieves. :roll: (There is a LOT of racism at Walmart, anyway. Largely Black stores are considered inferior to "good" stores even if they have superior sales and better shrink numbers. And I saw relatively few Black salaried managers, especially at the store manager or market level.)

There is a Whole Foods in Detroit's Eastern Market now. I like that there is fresh, healthy food available in Detroit, albeit not in a highly residential area. On the other hand, I know very few people who can afford to shop there. I think of that store as meant for hipsters and more affluent people, not for ordinary Detroiters and Michiganians.

o_0 Now that´s not just a overall sad thing, but I´m somewhat baffled by the Detroit "reputation". Is that a wide-spread assumption? I always thought Detroit was/is the home base of the patriotic blue-collar american. When Detroit declared bancruptcy recently and rich chinese bought it, it was covered in news and late-night discussions like on FM4 or ORF a bit and everyone was quite suprised about this (including me).

I saw this one post on buzzfeed about Whole Foods being "Hipster Walmart" and racism being a issue too.

Going to search for it....

[flyawaystray]

Over here it is CSA, Community Supported Agriculture.

The price varies, but the one I use ranges from $340 for the single share at the subsidized rate to $830 for the double share at the other end of the sliding scale, for six months of food every week. That rate does not include eggs, meat, milk, yogurt, honey, maple syrup, or fruit. And they accept food stamps.

It's pricier than buying at the supermarket, but a lot cheaper than buying the same produce at the farmer's market. I know, they write up a price comparison every week and send it home!

Most importantly, even if our budget gets completely fucked later on if, say, somebody loses their job, I can rest assured that we always have food coming in. The slightly greater expense compared to supermarket food is worth it to know that if push comes to shove I don't *need* to go shopping in any given week. To me, the psychological benefit of that pays for itself.

August, I must say, even at $3 a pound I don't think lentils are that pricy you should not risk wasting them. You know what, I have to run by the store again today. I'm going to try to con the butcher out of chicken skins. While I'm there, I'll take a picture of the price on the lentils. Then we can trust that none of us is fudging in these price comparisons!

Edit: I did the math, and $586 for 26 weeks is $22.50 a week. This, of course, is another example of poverty costing more. $22.50 a week is cheaper, probably, than the same food bought weekly, but only if you have the money upfront.

That's exactly it. I would try it, but I don't have the money upfront, and besides, I can't eat $20 in veggies a week. So it doesn't make sense for me. I could grow my own stuff for cheaper. The person who does the CSA and told me about it even admitted that her rations have been on the smaller side this year because the crops haven't been the best.

[OkToBeTakei]

Lentils are £1 for 500g on a price comparison here.

August might want to order them from abroad sounds cheaper to do. You can great P&P deals. :)

Campbells lentil soup in a can is 89p. Cheapest.

Unfortunately Augusts super expensive lentils, onions and carrots might not make it comparable but for me one can is maybe 2 servings max. 2 carrots an onion and a hambone, generally around 30p from most butcher counters here maybe only a third of that pack of lentils maybe more will make at least 8 servings. This also goes with the kid to school for packed lunch.

Little fruit and veg shop in my town, nice to support local. I bought one carrot there for 12p. Sure he looked at me funny, it was for a school project, the ones I had at home were too small.

Lentils and garlic are very tasty actually, basis of a lentil pie I make. Couscous is fairly bland alone, as well as cheap, add some coriander to that and BOOM!

Maybe lentil soup is just not a thing there. It's a very common basic and favourite winter soup here. Same as leek and potato, pea and ham. Scotch broth etc. Plain nutritious old fashioned type dishes. Like Shepherds pie which is NOT anything else except lamb mince :lol:

Comfort dishes vary across the world.

[Arete]

I did a CSA for a couple of years. First year as an "individual" share, the other years as a "family" share that got split among the tribe. Even with the individual share, it was a LOT of produce. We did get fruit as well as veg. The onions and garlic lasted throughout the year (stored cool). The tomatoes HAD to be canned or frozen, because we got way too many to eat fresh. Same deal with the spinach, squashes, beans, and beets. That was rounded out by lettuces in the spring, greens throughout the growing period and cabbages in the fall. Had to freeze the surplus. I am ashamed to say that even with this effort sometimes things went bad.

On the one hand, we got WONDERFUL fruit and veg, and a lot of it went beyond the 26 weeks of our share cycle. Outside farmers would show up once every 2 weeks and sell honey and eggs separately. But you absolutely had to have an excellent knowledge of both cooking and preserving techniques. You also needed the money up front, or you could do a three payment plan.

Now that the family gardens are up and running, the families produce some of their own veg and I do get some overflow of tomatoes and zucchinis. We all grow herbs either in pots or in the ground. Peaches, apples, strawberries, raspberries, blueberries, sour cherries and plums come from roadside fruit stands. Anything that grows in state that we don't grow or can't get from roadside stands either comes from the farmer's market or supermarket. Tropical fruit and citrus come from the supermarket.

Oh, lentil soup: Ya don't need a meat broth. Scottish people (sigh). Lentils, onions, carrots, garlic, tablespoon of tomato paste, some dried oregano (or basil, or thyme, or Italian seasoning, you get the picture). Warms the bones. :mrgreen:

[Coconut Flan]

Lentil soup is extremely common among my family and neighbors here in the states. I think if someone bought Red Mill premium lentils at Whole Foods that might be somewhat pricey. I buy mine in bulk from a neighborhood health food market.

[OkToBeTakei]

I did a CSA for a couple of years. First year as an "individual" share, the other years as a "family" share that got split among the tribe. Even with the individual share, it was a LOT of produce. We did get fruit as well as veg. The onions and garlic lasted throughout the year (stored cool). The tomatoes HAD to be canned or frozen, because we got way too many to eat fresh. Same deal with the spinach, squashes, beans, and beets. That was rounded out by lettuces in the spring, greens throughout the growing period and cabbages in the fall. Had to freeze the surplus. I am ashamed to say that even with this effort sometimes things went bad.

On the one hand, we got WONDERFUL fruit and veg, and a lot of it went beyond the 26 weeks of our share cycle. Outside farmers would show up once every 2 weeks and sell honey and eggs separately. But you absolutely had to have an excellent knowledge of both cooking and preserving techniques. You also needed the money up front, or you could do a three payment plan.

Now that the family gardens are up and running, the families produce some of their own veg and I do get some overflow of tomatoes and zucchinis. We all grow herbs either in pots or in the ground. Peaches, apples, strawberries, raspberries, blueberries, sour cherries and plums come from roadside fruit stands. Anything that grows in state that we don't grow or can't get from roadside stands either comes from the farmer's market or supermarket. Tropical fruit and citrus come from the supermarket.

Oh, lentil soup: Ya don't need a meat broth. Scottish people (sigh). Lentils, onions, carrots, garlic, tablespoon of tomato paste, some dried oregano (or basil, or thyme, or Italian seasoning, you get the picture). Warms the bones. :mrgreen:

I use veggie stock mainly :P It was August's tasteless assertion I thought the bone you know..might throw her a bone :P With everything being so expensive, maybe bones eh.

Tomato puree in lentil soup? That's then lentil and tomato soup :lol: Keep it simple. I have a friend who puts rice in her tomato soup, which is good and filling. Just when you expect plain old tomato soup the bits are a bit surprising. She now sarcastically tells me lunch is Tomato and RICE soup :lol: It's all good. She thinks I'm a heretic for adding grated carrot to Cock-a-Leekie. I whine..but it looks so pale :cry: :lol:

Broth has barley in it. Stock is just simply stock either meat or veg here. First time I saw a US cooking show talk about Chicken broth she had a chicken stock, I was like WTF...what is she talking about. Ina Garten I think. Jeeeeeeeeeeeeffrey.

[Anny Nym]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmm..... lentil soup *droolingteeth*

Tomorrow´s dinner plan was "no-cook" spring rolls with peanut sauce, but fuck that hippie shit - instead I will make THIS

FYI, we buy lentils in this big cans with the unedited-since-the-russians-left logo on it, 60 cents a 400g can

I will willingly trade a pallet of it with you lentil-screwed oversea-ers for 6 bottles of Voodoo tequila or a king-size bag of Lucky Charms :mrgreen:

[Arete]

OKTBT,

Tomato paste, not puree, and only a tablespoon. It gives a "body" and a certain bright flavor to the soup, but you should in no way put so much in that it becomes a "lentil and tomato" soup. I've seen some recipes that call for a few splashes of wine vinegar after the soup is off the heat, and I think it probably has the same effect as tomato paste.

[Coconut Flan]

I can't take the wine vinegar version unless it's only a tiny bit. Way to ruin a good lentil dish for me. Of course, I have a daughter who thinks the more seasoning the better. :ew:

[August]

THX all for the info, crop sharing is a lovely term :D

@ "poverty costing more" , I just saw a interesting documentary uploaded on youtube about this topic. It was tied to "inner city food deserts" <- I don´t get this: Why do US supermarket chains not build a store at inner cities? Don´t they miss out on alot of profit possibility?

Plus there was a discussion, this may have racist reasons. As I only have a foreign POV on that, so what do you US FJer think: Are food deserts tied to racism?

I think it's more socioeconomic. The supermarkets I've shopped at which are in white poor areas are just as bad as black poor areas. Fresh immigrant poor areas are the place to go for food. Remember the definition of food desert is a mile to a supermarket. I would guess their market area is usually bigger than that.

[Coconut Flan]

A mile to a supermarket is a food desert? Yikes, then by that definition I would live in one which I definitely do not. A quick search revealed some other definitions and by those this area would not be a food desert.

[bluelady]

I was at the grocery store today. I live in a very small town in a not overly diverse part of the country. Lentils are definitely not on the menu in most homes around here and I could get 900 g of lentils for $2.50 CAD. So, I could get approximately 2 lbs of lentils for about $2.40 USD. I forgot to check onions and garlic, as I didn't need any today, but they're typically fairly cheap.

Cream of soups were on sale today for $0.50 a can.

There are really only two recipes I make that call for cream of soups. The first is to brown pork chops in a pan and use cream of mushroom to "deglaze". It makes a gravy-like substance. It's not my favourite, but I'll eat it. My SO loves it, though.

The other is a casserole of ground beef, chopped veggies, elbow macaroni, cream of tomato and Cheez Whiz. Sound gross? Maybe, but I grew up on it, so it's total comfort food for me.

I will say, though, that neither of the above are on my regular meal rotation.

I remember a few years back, I found a recipe for homemade tomato soup, so I gave it a try. I was shocked at how much it tasted like tomato. I hadn't realized until then that canned cream of tomato soup tastes nothing like the actual vegetable it comes from.

[hapamama]

I'd like to see you buy an onion for under $1, and a pound of lentils for under $3, anywhere I've lived in the US.

I live in CA, in a fairly affluent suburb, in an area with a higher cost of living. Even at the regular grocery store (Safeway) I could get an onion under $1 and a pound of lentils for under $3.. and still have money left over for a head of garlic and a carrot or two. At the local small health food store, Whole Foods Market and Sprouts, a pound of lentils is even cheaper from the bulk bins... less than $1 rather than the $1.89 for the prepacked bag from Safeway.

At some of the specialty and Ethnic markets, I can get a couple of carrots, a head of garlic, a pound of lentils and an onion for under $3. It's all about knowing WHERE to shop and taking advantage of things like bulk bins and sales. There's always some grcoery store around here that has onions on sale, for instance.

[OkToBeTakei]

OKTBT,

Tomato paste, not puree, and only a tablespoon. It gives a "body" and a certain bright flavor to the soup, but you should in no way put so much in that it becomes a "lentil and tomato" soup. I've seen some recipes that call for a few splashes of wine vinegar after the soup is off the heat, and I think it probably has the same effect as tomato paste.

I may try it in my 'ordinary' lentil soup. It's strange though, as much as I love spicy food and trying new twists on old recipes, when it comes to comfort food I tend to leave it plain. My BIL offered to make a Ne'er Day Steak Pie, somewhat a tradition here. Mr OK was devastated it had vegetables and some tomato puree in along with various herbs. See that is a Steak and Veg pie. It was really lovely if you were not expecting traditional Steak pie :lol: Some things should be left well alone.

I do a spiced lentil which is fairly simple. Oil for frying

a small piece ginger, peeled and grated

1 tsp cumin seeds

an extremely larger pinch chilli flakes (or not :lol: )

1 onion, finely chopped

2 large carrots, peeled and grated

150g red lentils

1l vegetable stock fresh, cube or concentrate

1 lime, juiced to taste

a small bunch coriander leaves.

Interesting opinion I found re. food deserts.

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/20 ... erts/?_r=0

As The Times also reported last week, however, some new studies have questioned whether food deserts are as pervasive a problem as the government and other researchers have long believed they are. The studies also challenge whether efforts to increase access to supermarkets in low-income areas will achieve the ultimate goal of these policies: reducing obesity and other diet-related diseases among the people who live there. When I wrote my column last week, I had not seen this new research. Since then, I read the studies, as well as a number of others, and spoke to more food experts. I’m still convinced that convenient access to fresh food remains a significant barrier for many low-income people around the country, but I have been persuaded that the standard way “food deserts†have been defined [1] may overemphasize — and in some cases mischaracterize — the problem of access and draw attention from other factors that influence what people buy and eat, like food prices, preparation time and knowledge, marketing, general levels of education, transportation, cultural practices and taste.

This, pretty much what some discussed here.

Third, as Abhijit V. Banerjee and Esther Duflo observe in their excellent book, “Poor Economics,†poor people “choose their foods not mainly for their cheap prices and nutritional values, but for how good they taste.†Being poor or near poor in the United States means being exposed to a million luxuries that are beyond your reach. Even simple things most Americans take for granted — like taking the kids to a movie — are unaffordable. But a tasty meal is not. Junk foods that combine fat, salt and sugar in proportions that make them highly desirable, maybe even addictive — foods that hit the so-called “bliss point†— are never too expensive or far from reach.

I would say this is not just the US. :(

[Conuly]

A mile to a supermarket is a food desert? Yikes, then by that definition I would live in one which I definitely do not. A quick search revealed some other definitions and by those this area would not be a food desert.

Do people in your area generally have easy access to a car? A mile isn't that far to walk one way, but it isn't something you want to do with three kids and a week's worth of groceries.

[flyawaystray]

Right? My supermarket is within a mile, it's about .7 miles one way. I know because I bike to and from there and I have a wireless odometer on my bike. There's a dollar van that stops a couple of feet away from the store. That's how most people in my area who can't afford a car do it. That, or call a cab depending. The MTA buses don't go near it, I think it's because there's a dangerous expressway and buses don't want to take the chance of getting into a bad accident. That, and there's always gridlock because people drive the way in order to avoid the tolls going into Queens.

[xReems]

I never grew up eating canned products, but then again, I grew up in a Gujarati (indian) household, so majority of the food my grandmother and mom cooked were fresh and homemade. Dal is a huge staple in our household (although, we don't consume it everyday), so we almost always have 2-3 gallon jars of various lentils. We live in an area outside of Atlanta that has a pretty decent Indian population, which means loads of Indian stores. It's amazing how much cheaper lentils are there than going to Whole Foods or another grocery store where the bags are much smaller. I always tell my gluten-free friends to go to the Indian store to buy chickpea flour instead of a health food store since it's cheaper and you get more out of it.

[lilah]

THX all for the info, crop sharing is a lovely term :D

@ "poverty costing more" , I just saw a interesting documentary uploaded on youtube about this topic. It was tied to "inner city food deserts" <- I don´t get this: Why do US supermarket chains not build a store at inner cities? Don´t they miss out on alot of profit possibility?

Plus there was a discussion, this may have racist reasons. As I only have a foreign POV on that, so what do you US FJer think: Are food deserts tied to racism?

I think it's more about institutional racism. Corporations exist to turn a profit, so the concern in economically disadvantaged areas is that the supermarket wouldn't make a good profit. There is also the concern w/shoplifting. I used to work in an area that had a large population of low income folks. The local supermarket had more security and rules about showing your receipts to security gaurds to discourage shoplifting. They also had rules about not letting unaccompanied minors into the store because kids had a reputation for stealing. My supermarket in a more affulent area did not have those rules.

[August]

I live in CA, in a fairly affluent suburb, in an area with a higher cost of living. Even at the regular grocery store (Safeway) I could get an onion under $1 and a pound of lentils for under $3.. and still have money left over for a head of garlic and a carrot or two. At the local small health food store, Whole Foods Market and Sprouts, a pound of lentils is even cheaper from the bulk bins... less than $1 rather than the $1.89 for the prepacked bag from Safeway.

At some of the specialty and Ethnic markets, I can get a couple of carrots, a head of garlic, a pound of lentils and an onion for under $3. It's all about knowing WHERE to shop and taking advantage of things like bulk bins and sales. There's always some grcoery store around here that has onions on sale, for instance.

... which makes lentils three times the price of beans. ie, not particularly cheap. Catching a bus across town with three kids after working two jobs in order to get a good price on pulses is exactly the issue. I can do it, because I have a car. But we're talking about food deserts, not people with cars and time.

Still not having any luck finding un-seasoned dal recipes, I see.

[BlondeAgent007]

There are no recipes for unseasoned dal. Just cooking basics like add water. It isn't a recipe until there's more than one ingredient.