It's time for what some would call a vacation!

[lilith]

Something is definitely up with this stubble thing...........

I wonder if something new was laid upon Steve-Os heart.

Maybe they are adopting OT law about not shaving? Steve might fancy himself rocking a huge beard like a biblical prophet.....

[RachelB]

The photos on the rocky path don't bother me. What's the big deal? Parents are there within reach. I must be an awful Mother I let my baby/child toddle around on a pebble beach one holiday, swim in the sea, walk on tree root ridden forests etc. This lovely earth we live on is not made of marshmallows and soft bouncy manmade child protection. We are so sanitised in our childcare practices we forget that not all the world actually lives with footpaths, some Mum's might actually have to walk through worse than that with a child tied to their back just to get water.

Accidents happen anywhere with small kids, in that type of terrain parents tend to be vigilant, it's when the fall off some 'safe' piece of softplay equipment the injuries happen because ..well it's 'safe' dontcha know.

Kids look engaged and really interested in their new surroundings and considering this is MAXWELL we are talking about, anything that engages and piques their interest apart from Jesus is all good to me.

Yeah, this is actually one of the few things the Maxwells ever do that I appreciate and relate to.

Back in July, we did a few mountain hikes with my brother, sister-in-law, and nephews/niece. The longest one was 10 miles and included significant elevation change and some wonky footing. The youngest (14 months) was always in a backpack, but the middle one (3 years) walked part of the way and the oldest (5 years) walked almost all of it. (The Partner and I took turns carrying him across streams that he couldn't jump, or up steps that were way too tall for him.)

We went at their pace.* The kids loved seeing moose and icebergs, throwing snowballs when we got to our stopping point, looking at dead trees shaped like dragons, watching ground squirrels, and hearing people they met on the trail praise their hiking skills.

This kind of hike is probably the most intellectual stimulation the Maxwell kids ever get-- and if they get a quiet moment of pride at accomplishing something difficult, so much the better. (Just so they keep it to themselves; Stevus would not let that sort of thing stand.)

*For some reason, the 3-year-old likes running downhill, which means he trips a lot-- he's the one I worry about on an inclined surface-- I do not trust his judgment and keep in arm's reach of him. On the other hand, when he falls, he picks himself right back up and keeps going. If he does not run cross-country in high school, I will eat my hat.

[Rosie]

The photos on the rocky path don't bother me. What's the big deal? Parents are there within reach. I must be an awful Mother I let my baby/child toddle around on a pebble beach one holiday, swim in the sea, walk on tree root ridden forests etc. This lovely earth we live on is not made of marshmallows and soft bouncy manmade child protection. We are so sanitised in our childcare practices we forget that not all the world actually lives with footpaths, some Mum's might actually have to walk through worse than that with a child tied to their back just to get water.

Accidents happen anywhere with small kids, in that type of terrain parents tend to be vigilant, it's when the fall off some 'safe' piece of softplay equipment the injuries happen because ..well it's 'safe' dontcha know.

Kids look engaged and really interested in their new surroundings and considering this is MAXWELL we are talking about, anything that engages and piques their interest apart from Jesus is all good to me.

I have two teenage sons who have not been kept in cotton wrap during their lives. On the contrary, we have been very "free-range" in our approach around here.

At the same time, when they were very mobile but lacked any common sense or judgment of any kind (say, under 3 or 4yo), I would never have taken them on terrain involving sharp rocks on a slope unless it were necessary for some reason. Sure, accidents happen anywhere - but they are more likely to happen, to a toddler, in a place replete with sharp edges with no discernible pathway. One instance of bad footing, one misjudgment of distance, or one toddler fall of an everyday nature on terrain like that could have terrible results.

[MamaJunebug]

Intriguing that this topic has veered into what's safe and what's over-protective ... I wonder if the paragon of over-protectiveness (the Steve/Terifying duo) has thrown down the gauntlet to OfNathan and her husband.

I wonder if OfNathan (aka Melanie) indicated that she wasn't all that keen on going into a rocky field and Nathan and Steve instructed her that she would, by gum. And so she did, but by golly she wasn't about to give the in-law version of The Patented Smile.

Power play, anyone?

The beards ... what are the chances Steve knows about the Duck Dynasty phenomenon? If he's gone to Sam's Club or Walmart he's seen plenty and with 11 million-some viewers for its season premiere the show certainly is something you'd hear talked about in the grocery checkout line.

I like Duck Dynasty in spite of the family's politics, but I shudder at the patriarch's pronouncements, including one about how real men wear beards ... nasty, unkempt, untrimmed, patriarchy-channeling, designed-to-intimidate beards. Steve would certainly insist the facial hair be oh-so-clean and perfectly coiffed. (Do you coif a beard? Is "groom" a better word?)

But beards do give kind of a "stay away from me, I'm mysterious, you can't really see my face" vibe. E-w, ew. I can see Steve adapting that. For himself *and* his patriarchs-in-training.

[marmalade]

Something is definitely up with this stubble thing...........

I wonder if something new was laid upon Steve-Os heart.

Ironic since stubble is so hipster trendy right now.

I hope NR Anna didn't hike up on those rocks very far; she looks to be pretty far along in the one profile shot. That kid has HUGE hands in proportion to the rest of his body and it's not a distortion thing. Huge head and hands, and damn if he doesn't look like his Ultimate Creator, especially in the eyes. The poor kid already has the empty eyes down pat. :(

I wonder how Stehovah reacted when he saw Mel's (relatively) short hair for the first time. Her hair appears to be thick enough to grow longer, but she's always kept it around the shoulders, while Christopher seems to want NR Anna to keep her crowning glory long and well...glorious, keeping it wrapped up by day, but all over the place during what might constitute Maxwell "sexy time." Oh man, I went there, pass the :brain-bleach:

[already hungover]

Is Anna wearing a purple American Apparel sweatshirt in the what-some-would-call-a-vacation photos?!? Surely mine eyes deceiveth me!

[terranova]

Ironic since stubble is so hipster trendy right now.

I hope NR Anna didn't hike up on those rocks very far; she looks to be pretty far along in the one profile shot. That kid has HUGE hands in proportion to the rest of his body and it's not a distortion thing. Huge head and hands, and damn if he doesn't look like his Ultimate Creator, especially in the eyes. The poor kid already has the empty eyes down pat. :(

I wonder how Stehovah reacted when he saw Mel's (relatively) short hair for the first time. Her hair appears to be thick enough to grow longer, but she's always kept it around the shoulders, while Christopher seems to want NR Anna to keep her crowning glory long and well...glorious, keeping it wrapped up by day, but all over the place during what might constitute Maxwell "sexy time." Oh man, I went there, pass the :brain-bleach:

According to their announcement post Anna's not due until mid Feb, making her only 4 months or so along. I think her belly is mostly jacket tied around her waist.

[nelliebelle1197]

I have two teenage sons who have not been kept in cotton wrap during their lives. On the contrary, we have been very "free-range" in our approach around here.

At the same time, when they were very mobile but lacked any common sense or judgment of any kind (say, under 3 or 4yo), I would never have taken them on terrain involving sharp rocks on a slope unless it were necessary for some reason. Sure, accidents happen anywhere - but they are more likely to happen, to a toddler, in a place replete with sharp edges with no discernible pathway. One instance of bad footing, one misjudgment of distance, or one toddler fall of an everyday nature on terrain like that could have terrible results.

I also don't see what the big deal is. Parents are holding on to the kids and there twice as many grownup-ish people to watch the kids. It also looked like that was just a break and the little kids were in hiking packs.

I always find it amazing that people can so easily and haughtily judge others for their child rearing choices including me! I do it when I hear "free-range" because that signals to me a parenting style that completely disregards everyone else in favor of an individual child's "freedom". There are a lot of free rangers around me and I mostly want to spank the kids and shoot the parents. Yet we can't know what works in one family and why they made the choices they make. As to the Maxwells, for all we know the kids were safely tucked away on grownups backs and these photos were just a well-monitored snack break.

[formergothardite]

The photos on the rocky path don't bother me. What's the big deal? Parents are there within reach. I must be an awful Mother I let my baby/child toddle around on a pebble beach one holiday, swim in the sea, walk on tree root ridden forests etc. This lovely earth we live on is not made of marshmallows and soft bouncy manmade child protection. We are so sanitised in our childcare practices we forget that not all the world actually lives with footpaths, some Mum's might actually have to walk through worse than that with a child tied to their back just to get water.

Accidents happen anywhere with small kids, in that type of terrain parents tend to be vigilant, it's when the fall off some 'safe' piece of softplay equipment the injuries happen because ..well it's 'safe' dontcha know.

Kids look engaged and really interested in their new surroundings and considering this is MAXWELL we are talking about, anything that engages and piques their interest apart from Jesus is all good to me.

ITA. We hike a good bit and took small children with us when they were small. We have pictures of my oldest as a toddler climbing and walking over rocks a lot like that. She had a blast and we were watching and being super careful so she managed to not die.

[VodouDoll]

I like Duck Dynasty in spite of the family's politics, but I shudder at the patriarch's pronouncements, including one about how real men wear beards ... nasty, unkempt, untrimmed, patriarchy-channeling, designed-to-intimidate beards. Steve would certainly insist the facial hair be oh-so-clean and perfectly coiffed. (Do you coif a beard? Is "groom" a better word?)

But beards do give kind of a "stay away from me, I'm mysterious, you can't really see my face" vibe. E-w, ew. I can see Steve adapting that. For himself *and* his patriarchs-in-training.

Neatly-trimmed beards can be okay. My dad has had one all my life. And Doug's beard is nice, though he is a tool. It's tidy and well-trimmed and suits his face.

Wow. I've said something nice about Doug. I never thought the day would come, but there you go. Anyway, if the Maxwells decide to all grow real beards at once, instead of just not shaving during vacation that it looks like they're doing, their beards would probably be more in the Doug-line than the Duck-line.

[Rosie]

I also don't see what the big deal is. Parents are holding on to the kids and there twice as many grownup-ish people to watch the kids. It also looked like that was just a break and the little kids were in hiking packs.

I always find it amazing that people can so easily and haughtily judge others for their child rearing choices including me! I do it when I hear "free-range" because that signals to me a parenting style that completely disregards everyone else in favor of an individual child's "freedom". There are a lot of free rangers around me and I mostly want to spank the kids and shoot the parents. Yet we can't know what works in one family and why they made the choices they make. As to the Maxwells, for all we know the kids were safely tucked away on grownups backs and these photos were just a well-monitored snack break.

1. Can you please specify what part of my post is "haughty?"

2. I have never heard the term "free-range" used in the way you describe w/respect to parenting. My use of the term refers to Lenore Skenazy's writings.

[OkToBeTakei]

1. Can you please specify what part of my post is "haughty?"

2. I have never heard the term "free-range" used in the way you describe w/respect to parenting. My use of the term refers to Lenore Skenazy's writings.

Is that the rather strange woman who has a TV show that basically tells parents who have major control issues to get a life (in my view most of them need some psychiatric help) and let their kids be well..........kids?

Free range is the eggs you buy when the chickens can walk about. They are not organic free-range, which is chickens which are free to walk about who are not fed on shit, not to be confused with organic chickens who are not free-range but are fed non-shitty food whilst quite probably being in a box, but are only marginally better than non organic non free-range chickens who are the shittiest of the shit chickens in respect to life experience.

OH wait we were talking about kids? Fucking stupid names to describe having kids to sound super intellectual piss me off can you tell? :lol: Attachment parenting my arse. We called that.........wait for it......carrying your baby. It's not a fucking science.

[WonderingInWA]

I see from the latest post that the grandchildren have indeed shown up on schedule. No mention of whether or not Stevehovah saw fit to let them feed the chipmunks yet.

I also see that Christopher has joined the brigade of hipster stubbly beards. But he looks to have been hiking in khakis! :lol: Kind of a contradiction in presentation, eh? Maybe he's taking his wardrobe inspiration from David Waller these days.

I am kind of surprised that NR Anna was pictured hiking along with the rest of them. I guess they don't worry about her falling and something happening to the next upcoming blessing?

I don't think Christopher owns a pair of jeans, does he? He seems to always be wearing khakis. And NR Anna was newly pregnant with Joshua 2 years ago during what some would call a vacation and she hiked then, too.

[MamaJunebug]

Free-range, shmee-range. I still think Melanie is not 1,000% on-board with what Steve proclaims as The Only Way To Live and she's becoming less afraid to let it show.

Then again, I'm overly optimistic most days.

ETA: VodouDoll, "More Doug-line than Duck-line," I love it!! I spent a couple hours in the company of a Doug almost-lookalike (this guy is clean-shaven) last night, guy is openly gay and pretty fabulous. A good time was had by all but especially in my head, because I kept thinking, "This is probably how Doug's friends see him and they're all sure he's a hetero manly man."

And now *I've* hijacked the topic from Maxwell-critiquing to something else. Mea culpa... :doh:

[nelliebelle1197]

1. Can you please specify what part of my post is "haughty?"

2. I have never heard the term "free-range" used in the way you describe w/respect to parenting. My use of the term refers to Lenore Skenazy's writings.

I didn't mean you specifically in this incidence- I meant that was the reaction that so many people IN GENERAL have when criticizing other parenting styles- including my own sometimes. I am amazed at myself when I react this way, since I swore I would never be THAT person. Sort of a marvel....

In my little neck of the woods, a lot of people use the "free-range" term very literally to describe the fact that their spechul snowflakes deserve the whole universe to rip apart because they are so special. I think it is jsut the trend around here and it is annoying.

[nelliebelle1197]

I don't think Christopher owns a pair of jeans, does he? He seems to always be wearing khakis. And NR Anna was newly pregnant with Joshua 2 years ago during what some would call a vacation and she hiked then, too.

Maxwells don't wear jeans. DUHHHHH. :naughty: :naughty: :naughty:

[nokidsmom]

Checked out the hiking pics and I don't understand how the women and girls can hike in skirts. There's a few pics where they are nearing a summit and the going is pretty rocky. I am surprised that a) they don't trip in them and b) wearing pants might be a good idea in the wooded areas as better protection against things like ticks, which have the potential of carrying Lyme disease. Or at least wear pants or leggings under the skirts

ETA: I know they figure that only godly women wear skirts but don't understand skirts only on hikes yet they take other hiking safety precautions such as bringing enough water and taking breaks. Makes me want to :head-desk:

Also, Melanie didn't look happy. She's the only Maxwell DIL who came from a normal family so can't imagine she's totally on board with all the family weirdness.

[WonderingInWA]

Maxwells don't wear jeans. DUHHHHH. :naughty: :naughty: :naughty:

I don't think Christopher or Nathan wear jeans, but I'm pretty sure I've seen John and Joseph wearing them when they do house projects.

[sparkles]

I don't necessarily think Melanie is unhappy, but she was just caught in a candid moment. Let's face it, 99.99999% of the Maxwell photos we see are posed so that everyone is always "caught" with a whistle-while-you-work happy face. The most candid shots we ever see are taken when they're conversing with the elderly, conference attendees or select "friends" when they've got to be in full-bore Maxwell mode. I would hope that they haven't progressed to the point where Steve insists that they smile 24/7/365, no matter what they're doing but...

Well, now that I think of it, it probably HAS gotten to that point.

[Maggie Mae]

...snip...

The beards ... what are the chances Steve knows about the Duck Dynasty phenomenon? If he's gone to Sam's Club or Walmart he's seen plenty and with 11 million-some viewers for its season premiere the show certainly is something you'd hear talked about in the grocery checkout line.

I like Duck Dynasty in spite of the family's politics, but I shudder at the patriarch's pronouncements, including one about how real men wear beards ... nasty, unkempt, untrimmed, patriarchy-channeling, designed-to-intimidate beards. Steve would certainly insist the facial hair be oh-so-clean and perfectly coiffed. (Do you coif a beard? Is "groom" a better word?)

But beards do give kind of a "stay away from me, I'm mysterious, you can't really see my face" vibe. E-w, ew. I can see Steve adapting that. For himself *and* his patriarchs-in-training.

I doubt he knows anything about it. I, like Steve, (ugh) do not watch TV. I get news and stuff from the internet and I have a couple of shows I like from iTunes or Netflix, but I don't care at all for 98% of television programming. I am also far too busy with activities to have time to keep up on all of that stuff. That being said, I know nothing about Duck Dynasty other than it's a TV show that my cousin watches and occasionally makes references to on facebook. I've never seen or heard anyone other than her talk about it. I doubt it's so very popular that people are discussing it at the grocery store. (Also, how the hell do they get news from the grocery?)

I'm also confused as to how a beard is "designed-to-intimidate" It's a beard. Men have facial hair, they've had facial hair, and it "was designed" (or it evolved) to help with mate selection (otherwise women would have it too). It also has the added benefit of keeping faces warm in cold climates.

I love a man with a nice beard. (Key word nice.) I don't think the beard, by itself, give off a "stay away from me" vibe. Most the beards I see give either an "I'm outdoorsy fellow who is laid back and likes to fish" or a "I ride motorcycles" vibe. (The second I think is because my uncle has the "gross, unkempt" beard and has a motorcycle. He does not intimidate. He's just gross and annoying.)

Edit: fix formatting

[Loveday]

I doubt he knows anything about it. I, like Steve, (ugh) do not watch TV. I get news and stuff from the internet and I have a couple of shows I like from iTunes or Netflix, but I don't care at all for 98% of television programming. I am also far too busy with activities to have time to keep up on all of that stuff. That being said, I know nothing about Duck Dynasty other than it's a TV show that my cousin watches and occasionally makes references to on facebook. I've never seen or heard anyone other than her talk about it. I doubt it's so very popular that people are discussing it at the grocery store. (Also, how the hell do they get news from the grocery?)

Sadly, Duck Dynasty is HUGE right now. It's probably the most popular show A&E has ever had. And the merchandise tie-ins are everywhere. You can buy Duck Dynasty sunglasses at the Walmart optical center. :? Steve couldn't avoid Duck Dynasty if he tried.

My 77 year old mother has a crush on Uncle Si.* I despair of her at times, I really do. :doh:

*it disturbs me deeply that I even know who Uncle Si is*

[MamaJunebug]

Maggie Mae, mileages vary and thank goodness for that! When Phil (the 66-year-old patriarch) Robertson appears with a bandanna covering most of his forehead, his dark wraparound sunglasses, and the bear that goes to mid-chest, to me, that's designed to be mysterious, dark and intimidating. He almost doesn't need the black-out on what little is left showing of his facial skin to go into the duck blind.

So, that's my mileage. And I think a large part of this is a carryover from years ago, during the Vietnam War, when I and many of my contemporaries admired the Amish because they were conscientious objectors by a century of religious tradition and so could avoid the draft for that unholiest of wars. It was before I understood how the Amish culture really could be.

But I digress! One of the things that we learned about the Amish (this is in the 1960s & '70s, mind) was that they grew beards but not moustaches because to them, the beard-moustache combination was warlike. Whereas the beard-only is .... to them, not warlike. So, it's been part of my comprehension of the world for lo, these many decades, that full beards have several uses, one of them being to intimidate.

And I identify full beards with patriarchal religious systems and I'm-a no like those. Thus my mileage, FWIW. :shrug:

[fundiefan]

What happens when the females need to find a way to balance on rocks that may involve a wide stance? Or one leg up on something with another down? Do their skirts allow for a full spread of the legs? Can't people see under those skirts to their girly parts if there is a wide stance?

I know others have defended the skirt thing but personally, I find it dangerous. Your legs and feet need to be free to move, sometimes quickly and instinctively, when climbing. Skirts don't allow for that freedom of movement - especially denim ones with no give what so ever - and I'd rather have pants on when I'm in a wide stance and someone is below me. I'm kind of modest that way. And what about scratches and cuts and bumps and bruises on bare legs? With pants on, a scrape against a rock can be a minor nuisance. With exposed skin, some real damage can be done.

I think they are stupid.

[Coconut Flan]

I know I've seen at least Terified with leggings on under the skirt. I was hoping all the women wore them, but it didn't look like Anna or Mary had them on during their big climb so far this year. Given the insects, rocks, etc. that they encounter I think it would be safer if they can't bring themselves to ditch the skirts for the mountains.

[Maggie Mae]

I don't think Christopher owns a pair of jeans, does he? He seems to always be wearing khakis. And NR Anna was newly pregnant with Joshua 2 years ago during what some would call a vacation and she hiked then, too.

I don't know which one is Christopher, but as far as I can tell, all the men are wearing hiking pants. Why would someone wear jeans on a hike?