Angry fundies and "lovely thoughts"

[Freyacat]

Kendal has up a post today about how it's important to reduce anxiety by thinking lovely thoughts and banishing bad ones. Which, first off, I have never understood why it's supposed to be good to never have a negative thought - sure, they shouldn't be the majority of your thoughts, but no one is really happy and shining all the time, and IMO it's healthy to let yourself feel negative sometimes, then push on past it. But also - what is it with "lovely?" Zsu's used it too - I swear I think above her comments it used to say something like "# lovely thoughts from lovely readers," although I just checked now and it just says "# comments." I've seen other fundies say things about "lovely thoughts," although I can't think who right now. Is this like the new version of "keeping sweet?" And don't folks like Zsu or Kendal, who are really critical and judgmental, realize how laughable it is when they claim to focus on "lovely thoughts?"

[Jezebel]

Oh, she's allowed to have negative thoughts--just not about her life, the men she's handed her power over to, her own frustrated desires, and her "God-ordained" role as a woman. Because as we've all seen, she has plenty of negative thoughts about people not like her, and those are perfectly okay.

Here's the thing about women getting angry that terrifies the patriarchal crowd: it's a potent catalyst for change. Allow women to get angry at their husbands' failings, over their own subordinate status and financial dependency, at the heavy burden of birthing and raising so many children (while keeping a house clean and extending hospitality at a moment's notice), or over the dreams they can never fulfill as long as they adhere to the patriarchal, dominionist, QF mindset? They might come to their senses, realize what a defective bill of goods they've been sold in the name of God, and demand better for themselves and their daughters (and yes, their sons too).

Making anger a shameful emotion is part of what keeps these women subordinate. Insisting that a true Godly Christian Helpmeet never gets angry, focuses only on the "blessings," and prays away any anger (or hopelessness, or depression) is part of the cage these women have to construct for themselves.

When having a good, heated bitchfest over coffee with your BFF is seen as a sign of grave spiritual weakness and ingratitude to God for the husband, home, and social role he's given you, what are you going to do? When you can't talk to anyone about it because all the other women in your social circle know that the only acceptable response is to tell you to pray, submit, and work harder to have a "servant's heart," you're on your own. You're stuck with it. And rather than being a justifiable response to being shit upon, your anger is instead a personal failing to be overcome. It's something that has to be prayed away.

But here's the kicker: the anger never goes away. It just gets projected onto safe targets, namely people who are not following the exact same rigid set of rules you are--especially if they dare to be happy and successful. And that anger? That's perfectly allowed. In fact, it's useful--get women angry enough at all the worldly feminists, harlots, lesbians, and other Unwomen, and they'll do their best to never be mistaken for one by demanding fairness, equality, respect, financial self-determination, and bodily autonomy.

[Freyacat]

That's a really insightful explanation of what's going on behind "lovely thoughts" and "keeping sweet." Thanks for that, it sheds a lot of light on the (very disturbing) point behind these attitudes, because I've never understood them.

[debrand]

Angry thoughts can sometimes be a warning sign that something is not right. By closing down their 'negative' emotions, fundies put themselves in danger. There have been times when I felt that someone was off. I couldn't say why or prove my feelings with facts but I knew that I should avoid that person. Usually, I've been proven correct.

[Kaylee]

Jezebel nailed it. I never really thought about it being useful to have that anger redirected onto "acceptable" targets but that makes a lot of sense.

I was going to say something about how keeping the focus on the anger keeps them from really examining the reasons behind it. Keep a woman trying to keep sweet and never be angry at her husband or "role" and that takes a lot of mental energy that she's not using to see why the worldview that's put her in that role is so fucked up or that her husband really may be an overbearing asshole. It's hard to even see the problems, much less try to change them, if every time you start to notice them you're distracted by trying to squash your anger or pray it away.

[dawbs]

other people nailed the reasons, but, if someone really has a mental illness that's at the root of the 'non-lovely' thoughts, this sort of thinking can be devastating/deadly.

Because depression is so much more than the funk of non-lovely-thoughts. It's looking at your life objectively and saying "I'm depressed/hate everything/whatever depressive mantra fits". And then it's examining the joy/blessing/etc in your life and saying "wow, I don't have any reason to be this unhappy/depressed/lethargic/insert symptoms here"

And that "there's no excuse" can quickly cycle into self-hate and feeling depressed about being depressed.

I don't think I'm saying that well, I wish I could say it better, but that cycle up there? of "I"m depressed. I shouldn't be depressed. Fuck, now I'm depressed about the fact that I shouldn't be depressed"? that's the cycle that almost killed my husband.

And these fuckwits preach that them just smiling and doing the 'fake it till you make it' will make it all OK.

[Kitty]

Isn't Kendal the fundie woman who wrote a blog post about beating one of her daughters for hours, and even calling her husband home from work to help? Considering Zsu has also made those types of posts, I bet the fundie women who don't let themselves think "un-lovely thoughts" take them out on their kids. Wouldn't surprise me, they have no control over themselves, so they take their need for control and the hurt and pain they might be feeling out on their kids.

And Dawbs is also 100% right. I'm not fundie, nor was I raised that way, but it was so ubiquitous when I was growing up that whenever I let people know I wasn't happy that they just told me to "be more positive." This toxic "think positive" horse shit has done a number on my mental health and on my relationships with people who don't exactly know how hard it is to be all positive and cheery and sweet when you're suffering from depression. Of course, getting the fuck away from where I grew up has helped a lot, but whenever I bring up something that's not going right I'm still urged to "stop being so negative all the time." Because trying to afford college in this ass-backwards country isn't difficult at all, especially when you've moved to a different state, and it's not stressful at all when college is just about the only thing that gets people away from Hometown. Nope, I have no excuse for my depression, none at all! :roll: Yes, it does lead to a lot of self-hate about being self-hating, and depression over being depressed.

Also, I'm beginning to think that Hometown may be a cult, whether or not its asshole residents realize it or not. I could use a bit more positivity, but at the same time I could use a little more to be positive about, kwim? I couldn't last two days in Fundie World. The 'fake it till you make it' approach doesn't work at all, and neither does the 'THINK HAPPY THOUGHTS THINK HAPPY THOUGHTS!!!!' approach.

It's scary how mainstream some of that shit is, or maybe the culture of the town I grew up in is more fundie than I thought.

[dawbs]

I think it's pretty widespread, Kitty.

If I could go back in time and kick young me in the head for telling people to be more positive, I would. :oops:

I think it's part of the human condition though, not just fundie-dom, that it's damn hard sometimes to 'get' how the brains of other people work. I mean, I've never dealt w/ chronic depression, myself. I've dealt w/ situational and I've watched my husband deal w/ it and that's the only reason I caught a clue. (On the flip side, it's a lot of work for my husband to understand how the ADHD mind works--he just doesn't understand, although he 'gets' it more and more).

So it's easy to say "well, acting happy helps ME feel happy, why doesn't it help YOU feel happy?"

It always comes back to the simple fact that emotions can be sensible/logical--if my dog died and I'm sad, that's a completely reasonable emotion (it would raise a flag if I were NOT sad).

But if I don't logic my way INTO the emotion, I can't 'logic' my way out of it.

[Kitty]

I think it's pretty widespread, Kitty.

If I could go back in time and kick young me in the head for telling people to be more positive, I would. :oops:

I think it's part of the human condition though, not just fundie-dom, that it's damn hard sometimes to 'get' how the brains of other people work. I mean, I've never dealt w/ chronic depression, myself. I've dealt w/ situational and I've watched my husband deal w/ it and that's the only reason I caught a clue. (On the flip side, it's a lot of work for my husband to understand how the ADHD mind works--he just doesn't understand, although he 'gets' it more and more).

So it's easy to say "well, acting happy helps ME feel happy, why doesn't it help YOU feel happy?"

It always comes back to the simple fact that emotions can be sensible/logical--if my dog died and I'm sad, that's a completely reasonable emotion (it would raise a flag if I were NOT sad).

But if I don't logic my way INTO the emotion, I can't 'logic' my way out of it.

Then Hometown is probably a cult for other reasons. Holy hive-mind, Batman...

My boyfriend is no psychologist, but his field of work brings him around a lot of people who are mentally ill to some extent, so he gets that I'm suffering from moderate depression and that I can't be happy all the time because of it. I've probably had the depression so long that I really just don't comprehend all this positivity stuff, and I don't get how other people can go through life without utterly hating everyone and everything at some point.

I can kind of understand the angry fundie women, because when you're suffering so much but not allowed to express it, the only thing you CAN do is just get pissed off. Getting pissed off at your kids, or the gay couple at that restaurant, or the black people down the street or the government is an acceptable outlet for any emotion. When being sad and tired is not an option, anger is the only thing that keeps you going. If you direct the anger at the outside, you can keep sane while you're inside. But if you direct it at the inside (i.e., the cult) you can finally take the steps to get out and heal and even get over the sadness and tiredness. I used to get pissed off at EVERYTHING because I hated my life so much I had to take the hate out on something.

It's easier now that I've moved to a new town, but it's still hard at times, both to just stop myself from drowning in the unwarranted sadness and to keep my anger in check.