Rarely Have I Felt So Low - thinkingaboutsuicide.com

[Burris]

I've come across my share of bullshit while reading about the Christian culture in general and the fundie subculture in particular. A critic of both, I see them – the public relations side of them especially – as being exploitative rather than helpful.

Every time I think I have seen the absolute nadir of how certain para-Christian groups exploit the weak, however, I somehow happen upon another even more appalling example.

Ladies and gentleman, I give you thinkingaboutsuicide.com – a valuable domain name, for obvious reasons, but squatted on by a group of people I can only describe as being highly predatory.

Let's first take a look at what appears on the flagship article - a piece called, “Feeling Suicidal?â€

I’m so sorry you are going through a hard time. But the good news is that you really do have hope. And besides, time will change the current situation that you are in. Although it may not seem like it right now, your dark feelings will not last and you can find peace and joy.

For now, just keep breathing, living your life, even if but moment by moment, and you’ll get through this.

Years ago, I found a helpful article at metanoia.org called, “Suicide...Read This First,†which is more in line with the protocol human services professionals use in their efforts at suicide prevention.

I have taken a basic two-day course in suicide prevention as part of my ongoing commitment to providing as high a level of care as I can to those who may approach me with a need.

The protocol for speaking with someone who has expressed suicidal ideation is first to assess the current threat level. For example, is the person merely feeling so overwhelmed and is considering suicide - or does he have a method, a time, and a plan? Part of the threat assessment is to find out whether the individual has either thought about or attempted suicide in the past.

One key point, hammered home time and time again, is that a layperson confronted with someone who feels suicidal should do his or her best to 'connect the individual back to life' by asking questions about family and support networks and whatever coping mechanism the individual used during previous crises. There's more to it, but that's the gist.

One thing you do not tell a suicidal person directly, however, is not to do it.

(Instead, it is best to call for professional assistance as soon as possible, and also to help the person in distress to develop a useful action plan: Help to ensure the person is safe, which might require a period of hospitalization; help the individual, if he or she wants assistance, to build a support network of professions and, if possible, family and friends; help the person with getting and accessing referrals to long-term counseling with a licensed professional.)

Continuing on...

I’m not promising that you will not have difficulties, but keep praying, seeking God, and His direction and the next thing you know this storm will pass. The sun will shine again. And this dark period of your life will be behind you.

Okay, so the individual responsible for this article has shown a distinct lack of professionalism and respect coupled with an incessant need to inject her own ideology into a situation where it does not belong.

In the meantime, please go get a check up from your doctor and tell him how you are feeling. If you think you are at risk for suicide, please go to the hospital or call 911. Do not do anything to harm yourself.

We are praying for you. God is going to see you through this dear one. Please, please do not do anything to hurt yourself. Wait on God. In the meantime, if thoughts of suicide get too heavy, go to the hospital or call 911. Call your doctor as well.

It's clear the author of this article - 'Just call your doctor' - is a member of a privileged socio-economic class. The only realistic option for a lot of people, beyond calling a suicide hotline, is a hospital emergency room.

Our Recommendations:

1. We need others for encouragement.

Find a church home. See if you can find a small Bible study of people in your age range. Call some of the bigger churches in your area and see if they have anything to offer for your age group. This could be a home Bible study or a Sunday school class. CLICK ONE OF THE FOLLOWING TO FIND A CHURCH:

Any Church, For Travelers, Christian, Lutheran ELCA, Assemblies of God.

2. Listen to inspirational music.

There’s a lot of great music in different styles, like at http://www.klove.com/listen/.

3. Take time to read the Bible.

If you don’t have a Bible, there are versions available on the web that you can read. Gospel Book of John

4. Read good books like Purpose Driven Life or Where is God When it Hurts. See our Book List

5. Take our Bible Study.

I briefly skimmed this “study.†It's nothing more than an insultingly simplistic pitch for Christianity.

But whatever you do, don’t do anything to harm yourself.

As I said before, it may be tempting to tell a person considering suicide not to do it, but that isn't in the least bit helpful.

You are so loved. Please give your situation time, please allow God time to move. He may be waiting for you to give your troubles to Him, to say, God I will trust you, no matter what.

Try trusting God and see what will happen.

Also, please go in for a medical checkup and tell your doctor about how you feel emotionally. Your doctor may have medications that can help you get over this ‘bump’ in the road.

Also, I highly recommend counseling. You may find a pastor in your church or other local church or some other professional who will understand and help you with your struggles.

WE ARE PRAYING FOR YOU!

The author then adds – I shit you not – a “PS†under which she again suggests the person contemplating suicide should call emergency services personnel.

Further down, there are links aimed at atheists – including an overtly confrontational article called, “Not ready to consider God? Why not?â€

This is followed by a series of links to arguments for the existence of a Christian God – including an article called “Some Other Time,†which begins with the following condescension:

Having too much fun are we? Or, maybe this information is all too new to you. Or maybe your worried about your friends or family.

Are you really going to let that stand between you and God?

YIKES! DRIVE VERY CAREFULLY!

Okay, listen to me, don't wait until it's too late. ASK FOR FORGIVENESS THROUGH THE SON TODAY!

Yes, I'm sure the suicidal person reading that is simply having too much gosh darn fun to consider the existence of God.

Contrast that article with the far better one - “Suicide...Read This First†- that I mentioned previously.

The metanoia article discusses some of the reasons why a person might contemplate suicide, potential coping strategies meant to keep the distressed person alive until he or she can access help, and links to many other resources.

In contrast, thinkingaboutsuicide.com, which could have been life-saving, has been used for a far less noble purpose.

The most offensive thing about this site, however, is not merely the useless advice. It isn't even the crass attempts at religious indoctrination – although these are certainly bad.

No; there's actually - I can scarcely believe they managed it - a deeper level of exploitation here.

On the site's main navigation bar, directly to the right of the tab that reads “Feeling Suicidal?†is another tab that reads “Take Quick Test?â€

You may be wondering what kind of test this is. Is it, for example, a checklist for the synptioms of depression?

Nope. It's actually a low-rent version of the equally shitty “Good Person Test†Ray Comfort shat out a few years ago.

One article features a man who allegedly cured his depression through prayer.

Another article, Katy's Story, begings with the claim that depression is the result of Satanic attack:

Satan was out to destroy Kathy’s life—her children, husband, and future ministry. She almost fell prey to the lies he fed her through her suicidal thoughts and emotions.

Indeed the entire site is a hodge-podge of dangerous, thoughtless, heartless, brainless advice aimed at the most vulnerable and designed specifically to exploit them at their weakest.

The site is backed by Right to the Heart – a registered charity.

The operational team that maintains thinkingaboutsuicide.com includes 17 women, almost all of whom are either authors of fiction, with a few non-fiction writers thrown in to spice things up; or motivational speakers.

Only two of these individuals appear to have formal training in the delivery of mental health services: Laurie W. Sargent, the blog editor and a former counseler for the Crisis Support Network in Pacific County, WA; and Jeenie Gordon, a licensed Marriage and Family therapist. And neither of these authors was responsible for the site's main article on suicide.

Other contributors include Janet Perez Eckles, whose hilariously and wildly offensive bio reads as follows:

Although blind, bestselling author, Janet Perez Eckles helps thousands see the best of life. She reveals the path to freedom from despair and defeat. Her own victory over tragedy is detailed in her #1 bestselling book, Simply Salsa: Dancing Without Fear at God’s Fiesta.

Author Pat Ennis has another highly amusing bio:

Pat is the author of two books and co-author of three. Her primary life’s mission is to love her Lord with ALL of her heart (Matthew 22:37). Currently she is the Director of Homemaking Programs and Distinguished Professor at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary.

Well now I feel much better. Here I thought these ladies were just a bunch of self-absorbed fiction writers and motivational speakers without any formal training at all in the delivery of mental health services. But now that I know a professor of homemaking is on board, I feel so much better.

Susan Titus Osborn is another site contributor. Her distinctives include the following:

Susan is the director of the Christian Communicator Manuscript Critique Service. She has authored 30 books, her latest being Wounded by Words and and Too Soon to Say Goodbye: Healing and Hope for Suicide Victims and Survivors, co-authored by Jeenie Gordon and Karen Kosman. Books may be ordered from New Hope Publishers.

That's right: Osborn charges a fair sum of money – I checked her page – to offer a critique of your writing. Golly!

These services are all over the place, waiting for new and eager writers to pay out the ass for criticism that may or may not be in any way helpful in getting a book published.

The 'Our Team' page for the Thinking About Suicide website – complete with hyperlinks back to the authors' own sites, where depressed folks can buy a bunch of allegedly inspirational books – is actually longer and more detailed than the aforementioned article on suicide.

It is genuinely horrifying to consider that some poor people, in desperate need of immediate mental health services, ended up finding their way to that page. In my opinion, the site is nothing more than a predatory enterprise – and that, on at least two levels:

1) The authors are trying to capitalize on the pain and distress of people suffering from mental illness in order to wrack up more conversions - and perhaps more money as well.

2) Parts of the site, backed by a registered non-profit, are clearly commercial in nature: The site is heavily cross-linked with some of the other sites created by team members.

Please excuse me now, whilst I vomit.

[ETA]

[snarkbillie]

That's terrible. I called the suicide hotline once and this guy told me that I wasn't suicidal but just overwhelmed and needed a vacation. I was suicidal or as close to it as I've ever been. I couldn't take a vacation and if I could have it wouldn't have helped. I hated the way I was treated, and it made me feel even more hopeless because I couldn't even get the suicide help line guy to listen to me.... how worthless are you when people who volunteer to stop people from killing themselves just doesn't even care about listening to you?! I'm lucky that my neighbor stopped by as I was readying things for my suicide and convinced me that I should wait a week. He listened to everything I was saying and agreed that shit was bad. He didn't try to dismiss me or tell me to "cheer up", all he wanted me to do was to wait a week because I was really upset and you shouldn't make huge life ending decisions when you're so upset. It sounds trite now but it made sense to me a little bit then. It was the hardest week of my life. I met up with him for coffee and he convinced me to try to go to the doctor one more time. He saved my life.

Wow, that's off topic. Sorry, suicide is a really big thing with me.

[jjmennonite]

I mostly lurk here, but read daily. Your post, Burris, once again reminds me why I admire your eloquence and intelligence.

I was a suicidal 16 year old, well pickled in the kool-aid, obviously raised by parents who had also drank the kool-aid (Fundi-Mennonite, then Penticostel, then Baptist). I had read a lot about suicide and knew it was a cry for help, so I asked my parents for help. They took me to a minister who laid hands on me, and casted spirits out of me. I waited and prayed . . . . and waited for God to cure me. No cure forthcoming. So I asked my parents again - I was skipping school because I could not sleep at night. They were so ill-equiped to deal with this, their solution was to take me to another minister, who laid hands on me, casted spirits out, and again, I waited for god to cure me. After about 3 iterations of this, I finally swallowed several bottles of aspirin - as I had heard from my grade six teacher, a child-beater, and a king-pin in the Mennonite church, who used to tell us how the world was ending, and how aspirine would kill you if you were trying to commit suicide. I was then taken by ambulance to the hospital, and got to talk to a doctor, and was given some tools to help myself resume my life.

I continued to have suicial fantasies, believing that I would die and go to heaven, until I quit believing in God, when I was about 25. I never made another attempt though.

Sites like this make me FURIOUS. I have forgiven my parents, but seeing people making a profit using these ideas is truly despicable.

I love you, Burris - can we have a celestial union? You live 3 hours North of me.

[Cran]

Thanks for bringing this UTTERLY STUPID webpage to my attention! I'll comment on it as someone who has felt suicidal in the not so distant past, I hope you do not feel I hijack your thread.

"Dear author of bullshit,

I do not care if you are sorry for me. I do not know you, and it means nothing to me. I do not believe in God. All the 'hope' and bible quotes you offer me mean nothing to me.

I do not want to get through this. I do not want to prevent suicide. I will not see my doctor. Why? He will only send me to some psychiatrist or other, or commit me straight away and take away all my liberty to decide for myself. No, thanks. Or prescribe medications which won't kick in until weeks and weeks after, and in the meantime, might increase my risk of suicide due to mood swings. Hm. Perhaps I SHOULD get that prescription.

I want to end it. Got that? Perhaps you want to write it down, for future reference? I am sure inspirational music, your bible study and the Sunday service in two days will get me over that! After all, it is only a minor inconvenience, to feel suicidal, and requires no other advice than you'd give a rebellious teenager. Or an unhappy wife. Or anybody. I feel so special right now, like you really understand me.

Thanks for all your help. As I still can't get anything out of God and the bible, I will proceed to find a fast and secure method to dispose of my life, as obviously, a Non-Christian cannot find inner peace at all.

Now pray all you like, and at least one of us will feel better.

Sincerely,

someone suicidal."

[thoughtful]

What a shitfest.

They might as well have one page, that says "we don't care if you do it, but get saved (by our definition, please) first."

:(

[mirele]

Wow, Burris. This site is pushing a lot of hot buttons for me.

If someone told my depressed self that depression was caused by SAAAYTAN, depending on what kind of mood I'm in, I may or may not cuss them out. What I will tell them, pointedly, is that I have chronic major depression and I take pills every day for it, religiously. Prayer did not lift my depression, Lexapro and bupropion did. Telling me that my depression is the result of satanic influence....it's like the Scientology belief that your problems are caused by the spirits of dead space aliens clinging to your spirit. At least the good "Christians" aren't charging you a few hundred thousand dollars like the Scientologists. No, you get to hear their hogwash for FREE!

[charizbarb]

As a Christian AND as someone with ongoing mental health issues who has felt suicidal in the past, this is unprofessional at best and dangerous at worst. It's shit like this that downplays how serious depression and suicide are for those affected by it. Uplifting music, are they kidding me??

[pixydust]

That's pretty much the advise that I got as a suicidal teen from Christians. Pray more, read the Bible more, stop listening to "Satan's music" (who knew that The Violent Femmes were so damn satanic!), get an accountability partner, get a prayer partner. What no one ever did was ask WHY, probably because they didn't care why I was so depressed. Just shut up, smile, and say the right stuff....that's all that matters.

[Burris]

For those currently suffering suicidal thoughts, there is a link in FJ Chatter with international contact information for various distress hotlines. You may also take some comfort in themetanoia article I mention in the original post.

I would like to add as well that suicide is how some people try to resolve pain that is itself a result of mental illness (such as depression). Depression can be treated medically. The various means for carrying out suicide will always be around; they're not going anywhere. It is, in my opinion, best to try the therapeutic and medical solution first – to find out whether the pain of depression can be treated. Yes it does take a few weeks for the medications to kick in. When they do, however, a lot of people report feeling immensely better, 'as if a fog has lifted.'

Yeah, some counselors and first responders suck at dealing with people who feel like ending their own lives. Some of those same people are shit at dealing with those who are disabled or homosexual or overweight or in any other way different from the comfortable average.

As for the assholes running the site I deconstruct above, they'll get their due one day. Too bad so many people may suffer for their stupidity before that day comes.

[Maude]

When I began feeling suicidal as a teen, my family had just become enmeshed in a Pentecostal church. All the elders in this church could offer were harsh words for me and about me, along with prayer. It wasn't until I left that I started to feel less burdensome about my mental health issues.

Sites like this (TAS) are just dangerous to people who are suffering. :evil:

[MandyLaLa]

They sound like the assholes who love to tell people in crisis that God never gives more than you can handle. I hate that line.

[Visionoyahweh]

That site is a terrible crime.

[Maude]

They sound like the assholes who love to tell people in crisis that God never gives more than you can handle. I hate that line.

QFT. That's nothing but bullshit to someone who's obviously having trouble handling things.

[Angri-la]

QFT. That's nothing but bullshit to someone who's obviously having trouble handling things.

And it is NOWHERE in the Bible. I hate when people say that. My response to that is always "I must be the strongest bitch god ever made, then."

I have, unfortunately, known too many people who have taken their own lives. It goes with artists and rock and roll, sadly. None of them ever talked about it, and being told that Jesus loves them would not have helped. Makes me damn ill, the infiltration. It is much like those "Pregnant? Need Help?" ads that are just fronts for evangelical adoptions.

Burris, once again, your brilliance is showing.

[MrsKay]

That site sucks on so many levels. I've been feeling pretty low lately, although not suicidal yet, and reading that kind of made me want to punch something. I've gotten that bullshit so many times over the years. When following that advice didn't work, I came to the conclusion that God just fucking hates me. My father experienced the same thing, only in his case, he didn't have alternative resources that didn't make him feel like shit, so he killed himself. I'd love to create a site dedicated to people who have committed suicide after being fucked over by sanctimonious Bible thumpers - I know of so many just within my little corner of the universe. Thanks to those who shared links that are actually worth reading.

[VintageJen1984]

Feeling suicidal? Get Jesus.

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

Look, the truth is, I was most suicidal when I HAD Jesus, and could not reconcile that with my bisexuality.

Eventually I reconciled it, when through Bible study I discovered that the New Testament is NOT anti-gay. But if I'd come across this website before that, it truly could have pushed me over the edge. Like, I did what you said, so no, you're wrong. It won't help.

[ADoyle90815]

Feeling suicidal? Get Jesus.

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

Look, the truth is, I was most suicidal when I HAD Jesus, and could not reconcile that with my bisexuality.

Eventually I reconciled it, when through Bible study I discovered that the New Testament is NOT anti-gay. But if I'd come across this website before that, it truly could have pushed me over the edge. Like, I did what you said, so no, you're wrong. It won't help.

Same here, only that I couldn't reconcile that Jesus would want me to remain in an emotionally abusive marriage, and when I left the abusive ex and his church, my depression and suicidal thoughts went away with the help of a secular therapist and an antidepressant. It's been years since I needed that antidepressant, and the God I worship doesn't like people to remain in an abusive situation. While it's true my ex-husband wasn't a good Mormon, I was constantly told that if I prayed more and read scriptures, the depression would go away.

[ExCatholic]

It is so infuriating when religious people purposely prey on the emotionally vulnerable. The depressed, the suicidal, the women who need to walk in to that abortion clinic... my first year of college I was very very lonely. Looking back, I wonder if being away from all my friends and family for the first time didn't produce a mild depression. I went to class, ate, and slept. Didn't care enough to try more.

One evening in the cafeteria two older girls suddenly sat down at my table. They were super friendly in a way that immediately made me uncomfortable. Didn't take them too long to tip their hand either - they were recruiting for one of the campus women's ministries.

I didn't even have to energy to fight. I just stared and kept saying no to them, that night and the next and the next until finally they gave up on me. Now I wish I could go back and ask them why, what were they thinking to basically stalk a clearly unhappy girl night after night? Was it because they had been subconsciously taught that people like me would be grateful for attention and friendship?

Makes me sick. Not every problem can be solved with faith and prayer, and it is so so skeezy to actively seek out people who are hurting or confused and promise them relief.

[Cran]

I read a bit further on this page, and they have a link for people who do not believe in God. It took to a quiz with bible questions, and I answered them and at the end got the question "Do you believe all that?" (Being a sinner, Jesus being God etc.) and when I answered no, it took me back to the start. Very, very helpful.

[MandyLaLa]

I forgot to add these kind of assholes love the footprints story. I hate it when there have been one set of footprints in my life god wasn't carrying me. I made it through all that bullshit myself. Like hell I'd give credit to god for my willpower to live.

[pixydust]

They sound like the assholes who love to tell people in crisis that God never gives more than you can handle. I hate that line.

I hate that, too! Nope, sorry I had more than I could handle. To be honest, I'm pretty damn broken from all that I was supposed to "handle".

[fakepigtails73]

As a person suffering from bipolar disorder, I've had my shares of dealing with suicidal thoughts and ideations throughout my life. I tell you that the religious website would do me more harm than good, that's obvious.

The metanoia linked article you posted, otoh, helped me alot a couple of yrs back, actually it was during my last suicidal period in 2010. It really, really helped me, and for that I'm so grateful. ;)

I wonder how many persons in distress ended up feeling more messed-up after reading the fundie christian suicide page? :think: :evil:

Disgraceful. :evil:

[Mela99]

I'm a catholic girl, but I'm calling horseshit on this.

OT: For five years of my life, from 13 until 18, I was severely depressed, suicidal and agoraphobic. I won't go into details, but I got to the point that I did not leave the house. Ever. Without panicking, vomiting, fainting, crying.

God did not get me through that. Medication, therapy, and slowly finding my path in the world did. I don't discount spiritual support, but when you are so low and so deep in a hole that you cannot see the sun, nobody is on your side. Nobody is there. I did not encounter God in that journey. As a matter of fact, I was convinced that there could not be one. If there was, they would never let someone feel that kind of pain.

Proselytizing makes me sick as it is, but to prey on the weak and those who genuinely need help is horrific. You're playing with peoples' lives and hearts and well being. That is never okay.

[rox]

I forgot to add these kind of assholes love the footprints story. I hate it when there have been one set of footprints in my life god wasn't carrying me. I made it through all that bullshit myself. Like hell I'd give credit to god for my willpower to live.

The footprints story is particularly annoying. I found a "fixed" version of that you might enjoy. I'm not sure how to embed it, but here it is (hoping you're a fan of a particular science fiction movie)

cafewitteveen.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/egsmv.jpg

[Burris]

I spent most of my late teens and early 20s engaging in as many dangerous behaviors as I could – all of them were thinly veiled attempts at chasing death in such a way that my family would not be stigmatized by a suicide in the family.

But then two things happened, both at different times, that would alter my life forever. The first was when I landed in hospital after my first and only obvious attempt at suicide, when my brother interrupted me in my effort to hang myself. There were nurses who looked down their noses at me, as if I were wasting their time, but then I encountered the doctor on my case. I only ever saw him once. He got me alone and told me a story I doubt he tells too many people – that he had in fact failed his first two attempts at finals while in medical school. This meant he had to return for remediation twice. It was only on his third try that he finally passed and was permitted into residency. He told me this quietly, in a room where we were alone. His point: That even the most successful-looking people often had a secret self that felt every bit as shitty as those who openly contemplated suicide. I said nothing of his story to anyone, and was released a few days later.

But when I was 24, I broke my leg in a sky-diving accident – another dangerous activity that could have resulted in death. There were so many nice nurses around for that one. Then one night, in a morphine haze, I was awakened by a brightness in the room. It was scarcely brighter than the sliver of light coming in from the corridor, but noticeable all the same. 'Morphine,†I thought. But then the light spoke. 'Okay, so morphine and complete insanity,' I thought.

I'll spare you the things it said. Whatever it was, though, it was massive and old – older than anything |I could ever imagine. The takeaway message is that people are here to help each other; and technology, when properly used, is there to help make life easier.

When I met my husband, he convinced me to get medication to help treat my depression – as he himself had found such medication useful in treating his own depression. I did. And, though there have been the inevitable rough patches from time to time, I've never looked back.

I learned that whatever is or is not out there, there are a lot of good people right here – and also a lot of people who need to be treated with compassion. Sometimes I fail miserably at it, despite my best efforts, but I always try because it is so very important.

It occurred to me – and no, I don't expect others to believe as I do – that God's answer to human suffering can be found in the effort of other human beings.