Michaella/Michal/Michael Bates

[Deleted07]

Is this why she's a bad role model? Because she caught her husband being a man-whore and said something about it?! Sounds like my kind of woman.

My thoughts exactly! :D

[Someonetocall]

My thoughts exactly! :D

All of this. She sounds like the very model of a so-called good wife. She stuck it out in a marriage to a guy who was not the man she fell in love with, she raised her dead sister's five boys and she called her husband on stupidity in private.Except for the bit where her husband turned out to be a douchenozzle, I'm hoping I can do so well (no sarcasm).

ETA: I don't seek orphan babies. But should that happen, I hope I would be able to step up to the plate.

Why are all my posts ETA lately? I hit "submit" before the thought it done. I need to start hitting preview.

[galaxygirl]

so we changed it to Michael (only one letter different, and the traditional spelling). As she got older, we realized her name was often confused with the boy name of Michael, since that is more popular

Well I, for one, am shocked that people thought Michael is a boy name. Shocked I'm telling ya.

Is her middle name really "Christan" as Wikipedia says? Because wtf?

[Sister Mozz]

The Jeubs actually did that with all their children; all of their names end with the "ah" sound: Alicia, Cynthia, Lydia, Noah, etc.

I know another large family that did this. That's not quite so limiting as using the same first letter but still takes away from the individuality of each child.

What a strange story about Michal/Michael/Michaella's name. Like so many other things about the Bateses, it's very telling.

[BlackHawk]

Odd but whatever...

I've been wrong on pronouncing her name all along apparently. Michaella.. I pronounce Michael-ella cause that's the only way my brain could make sense of this spelling. I always thought Michal was the feminine spelling of Michael, no clue it was Mikhail. (which oddly to my Russian loving braining, Mikhail is a boy's name too!) No clue Michaella was supposed to be Mikayla. Odd really.

[linnea27]

Okay, now I'm confused. How is her name supposed to be pronounced? I've always said it in my head as Michelle-a, which is my son's preschool teacher's name (and spelled the same way).

Also? What a dumb ass story. I can't imagine.

[erunerune]

Please remember they've only had 20+ years to sort out this naming debacle. Quit being so hard on them ppl! :lol: I'm sure another decade or two will help to straighten this out. I wonder if they'd finally spring for the legal paperwork at this point if Michal/Michael/Michaela really cared about the issue.

My life experience has also taught me that if a kid is dressed in blue and named "Tyler," then she is probably mostly a girl.

[slickcat79]

Okay, now I'm confused. How is her name supposed to be pronounced? I've always said it in my head as Michelle-a, which is my son's preschool teacher's name (and spelled the same way).

Also? What a dumb ass story. I can't imagine.

They pronounce it as Michael-a. Kelly introduces the kids by name at about the 1:20 mark:

MN1RgyuLNq0

[FaeT]

it totally just screams all sorts of idiocy to me! Did they even give her or any of their kids middle names???

Yup. They all have middle names. Lawson actually goes by his middle name, as does Nathan. And their Jackson had the initials JEB, but which they just named their last child.

Zachary Gilvin Bates December 30, 1988

Michaella Christan Bates January 23, 1990

Erin Elise Bates May, 2 1991

William Lawson Bates July 27, 1992

Kenneth Nathaniel (Nathan) Bates August 29, 1993

Alyssa Joy Bates November 9, 1994

Tori Layne Bates December 20, 1995

Trace Whitfield Bates February 1, 1997

Carlin Brianne Bates April 11, 1998

Josie Kellyn Bates August 4, 1999

Katie Grace Bates October 5, 2000

Jackson Ezekiel Bates February 17 2002

Warden Justice Bates May 19, 2003,

saiah Courage Bates October 16, 2004

Addallee Hope Bates February 17 2006

Ellie Bridget Bates April 28, 2007

Callie-Anna Rose Bates August 2, 2009

Judson Wyatt Bates September 15, 2010

Jeb Colton Bates February 1, 2012

[Kitty]

Looking at all the kids' names on Wikipedia... Jesus.

The older boys' names are fine IMO, but a lot of them go by their middle names. The girls... Obviously Michaella got screwed, but you NEVER, EVER, EVER give a girl name Erin a middle name that begins with E. She's lucky her last name begins with B. I was not so lucky.

Alyssa Joy? Damn, the Duggars were ripping them off earlier than we thought.

Trace Whitfield? That's supposed to be a first and middle name? Sounds like a whole name to me, and the name of a country singer, at that. Run away, Trace! You're much better off as a country singer!

Josie Kellyn. Kelly basically named the kid after herself.

I didn't even know there was a Katie. :oops:

Warden Justice on down... :shock: looks like they've been borrowing from VF names. Seriously, those all seem like names VFers would come up with.

[marmalade]

The Lisa Ling special featured a Jewish girl named Michal, pronounced Mee ChALL. I can't phonetically write the "c" but think of challah bread. They should have just stuck with that.

It's a beautiful name if done right. For a couple who went to a Bible college, I can't believe the stupid (okay, I can). My knowledge of the story comes from reading 1 Samuel about 6 months ago for my Bible as Lit class. We didn't read much of 2 Samuel, so I didn't read the "disobedience." We weren't reading for "lessons," we were reading it as a piece (or pieces) of literature.

[Ali]

Actually, she criticized David for dancing when the ark was brought back to Jerusalem.

As the ark of the Lord was entering the City of David, Michal daughter of Saul watched from a window. And when she was King David leaping and dancing before the Lord, she despised him in her heart.

2 Samuel 6:16

Michal was his first wife. He took on many more wives and concubines after her. Michal remarried while David was exiled and David demanded that she be returned to him later. Paltiel, her second husband, was devastated. (2 Samuel 3:16)

I don't think she was mentioned in the Bible after this. She was a victim of the lack of control over her life.

The Bathsheba story comes later in chapter 11.

[Ali]

I also think it is ridiculous for a Christian to give a child a Biblical name without researching it. There are many books about all the men in the Bible and all the women in the Bible. Why would you not consult one of them to find an usual Biblical name?

[Maude]

Honestly, I'm not surprised at any of this. Fundies aren't exactly known for their good sense - that's why they're fundies. In any case, I actually like the name Michaella (pronounced Michael-a). They should have just named her that to begin with.

[BlackHawk]

They pronounce it as Michael-a. Kelly introduces the kids by name at about the 1:20 mark:

MN1RgyuLNq0

Now I'm just all sorts of confused... That's alright.. understanding fundies is not something I plan to make a habit of... so I'll leave myself confused!

[marmalade]

Actually, she criticized David for dancing when the ark was brought back to Jerusalem.

And the we-don't-dance Bateses think this is bad because...

Kelly would certainly tell Gil to knock it off if she caught him getting his groove on, and it would be for a far lesser reason than bringing the ark back to Jerusalem in preparation for placement in the Temple that Solomon will build.

Don't these fools know that it was David's inability to stop making war that God decided that he would not be the one to get the glory for building the temple? Solomon made peace without violence. Yet David still has major cred amongst the fundies. Reading his cycle, I see a charismatic guy with a ginormous ego. Solomon's weakness was intellectual curiosity, but he didn't hurt anyone like David did.

[Ralar]

Well I, for one, am shocked that people thought Michael is a boy name. Shocked I'm telling ya.

Is her middle name really "Christan" as Wikipedia says? Because wtf?

On the plus side, if she ever discovers she's transgender and decides to live as a man, she doesn't have to change her name. Michael Christan Bates is a perfectly good male name. Well, aside from the middle name.

[pixydust]

What I want to know is how did they pronounce "Michal", I'm gonna bet they pronounced it "Michael". Morons.

[Arete]

And the we-don't-dance Bateses think this is bad because...

snip

Because she criticized her headship. If Gil got his groove on Kelly would never criticize him in public....or in private for that matter. She would march herself straight into the prayer closet and beseech the Lord to change Gil's heart. That's what a proper wife does. If Michaela had been allowed to stay Michal she would never be able to follow a headship.

[PennySycamore]

To be fair, that is some powerful stupid. I could see the teenage Duggar newlyweds, with minimal education or experience with evangelical Christianity making a mistake like that in the early 90 s; however, Gil and Kathy went to Bible college! WTF were they doing all those years? We know they don't offer real courses - they spent all that time reading the Bible and fundy interpretations of the Bible and they still made that "error"?

Gil and Kelly first went to Anderson Junior College and then the Carson-Newman College. They are affiliated with the Southern Baptist Church and are accredited. Anderson and Carson-Newman may be Christian schools, but they're not Bible colleges. I still don't know why they weren't familiar with the story of Michal, though, and why they were too damn cheap to legally change the kid's name

[Visionoyahweh]

Wasn't David getting it on with Jonathan? Michal was married to a gay guy, and told it like it is.

I like her.

ETA: M.C. Bates. Say it out loud. 'Masturbates'

[SeaSaltCaramel]

The Lisa Ling special featured a Jewish girl named Michal, pronounced Mee ChALL. I can't phonetically write the "c" but think of challah bread. They should have just stuck with that.

It's a beautiful name if done right. For a couple who went to a Bible college, I can't believe the stupid (okay, I can). My knowledge of the story comes from reading 1 Samuel about 6 months ago for my Bible as Lit class. We didn't read much of 2 Samuel, so I didn't read the "disobedience." We weren't reading for "lessons," we were reading it as a piece (or pieces) of literature.

This reminds me of a scene from the movie, "Arranged." (If you have Netflix, check it out. It's a really good movie about friendship between two women, one who is Jewish and one who is Muslim.) The one girl's name is Rochel, maybe Rachel (I can't remember the spelling), and she pronounced it Ra-chell with the same "challah" "Chanukah" sound. When no one can say it correctly, she says, "just call me Rachel" (as in the English pronunciation).

There was also a recent post in the "Zack Bates and Sarah Reith Courtship Kaput" thread by SisiL78 that reminded me of that movie:

Definately. I posted a comment saying that its difficult to expect only the males to find women and that women should have a say in who they'd like to court. I then explained how my Orthodox Jewish friends who don't touch or anything before marriage managed to remain pure but arranged dates themselves with or without intermediaries like matchmakers and friends. That they did not have chaperones ready to report back to family or that they could write emails and texts without having to be censored. Despite the lax oversight most managed to marry as virgins and are very happy in their choices. They have rules like dating only in public but they also didn't feel pressured to marry the first person who asked them out. I also said that its not very nice of people to badmouth either party without knowing the circumstances and Sarah shouldn't be required to marry a guy just because he asked her to court.... she should have the option of choosing her path too.

This sounds similar to experience the Jewish girl has. It's a funny and enlightening movie. I especially like the Muslim girl who has a sarcastic sense of humor ;)

[sippin0nsunshine]

What I don't get is why they changed her name to Michael instead of Michel? It's still only one letter difference and Michel obviously sounds more feminine than Michael.

[Still Standing]

Lurker.

Thought Michaella was pronounced "Mic-Kay-La". Micheal-la???? Wow

[erunerune]

In German "Michaela" is pronounced "Misha-ella", although clearly that wasn't what the Bateses meant to name her either. That extra "L" that they added throws me for a loop, too.

ETA: Woot! "Bought My House In Cash". I just leveled up! My husband actually did buy our house in cash, so I suppose the Maxwells & I would have a lot to talk about. that is, until I ran screaming from their midwestern Realm of Death.