Texas ya'll. Texas will require aborted fetuses to be cremated or buried

[Toothfairy]

After months of fierce opposition from abortion rights advocates and the medical community, Texas will require fetal remains to be cremated or buried instead of disposed in sanitary landfills.

 

On Monday, health officials finalized the new rules prohibiting hospitals, abortion clinics and other health care facilities from disposing of fetal remains — regardless of the period of gestation. The rules will take effect Dec. 19, according to state health officials, the Texas Tribune reported.

 

Following criticism from medical providers, the state’s Health and Human Services Commission clarified that the requirement does not apply to miscarriages or abortions that take place at home. It also does not require birth or death certificates to be filed, to maintain confidentiality.https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/11/29/despite-months-of-outcry-texas-will-require-aborted-fetustes-to-be-cremated-or-buried/

So what happens at 5 weeks? What happens to a grieving mother who miscarry? 

[Lurky]

1 hour ago, Toothfairy said:

So what happens at 5 weeks? What happens to a grieving mother who miscarry? 

My heart breaks for Texas women.  What happens to people who miscarry on the toilet, or on the train, or pretty much anywhere?  It's fucking terrible.

[December]

Just another way to attempt to scare women off obtaining legal abortions from legitimate medical providers. It's not like there is something stopping women from having fetal remains cremated or buried without this law, if they choose to do so: 

Quote

Women who attended the hearing in August provided testimonials with mixed responses and personal details. One woman said she felt a great deal of closure burying a fetus after she had a miscarriage. Another said she had an abortion after she was raped, and that if she had been forced to bury the fetus it would have “essentially been the state of Texas rubbing my face in my own rape.”

To quote Tim Kaine on the topic of abortion, "why don't [people] trust women to make this choice for themselves?" 

[candygirl200413]

My heart aches for Texas Women, I can't even imagine. I'm confused though, how was this able to pass in Texas, but not Indiana? Unless from the last time I heard, they had to take it to court because they were like hey this is super ridiculous.

[Childless]

Wouldn't it be the abortion clinic who would be responsible for burying the remains?  A woman could have the abortion and then just walk out of the clinic.  You can't force her to be a part of the burial.  And how would they handle medical abortions?  That's what mine was.  I was only 5 weeks along, so there wasn't anything to bury.  I had what amounted to a heavy period after taking the meds.

[Chocolatedefrauded]

Texas lawmakers  have no sense. That is all.

[Bethella]

8 hours ago, Lurky said:

My heart breaks for Texas women.  What happens to people who miscarry on the toilet, or on the train, or pretty much anywhere?  It's fucking terrible.

This is only going to apply to women who have abortions in a medical facility because it's aimed at stopping abortions not at providing dignity for fetal remains. Women who miscarry or use the abortion pill at home will still be able to dispose of the remains however they wish.

3 hours ago, candygirl200413 said:

My heart aches for Texas Women, I can't even imagine. I'm confused though, how was this able to pass in Texas, but not Indiana? Unless from the last time I heard, they had to take it to court because they were like hey this is super ridiculous.

The courts in Indiana ruled that their version of the law was unconstitutional but those courts don't have jurisdiction in Texas. I highly suspect that this will go through the courts in Texas and be found unconstitutional there as well, although this case might get appealed as high as the Supreme Court. 

3 hours ago, Childless said:

Wouldn't it be the abortion clinic who would be responsible for burying the remains?  A woman could have the abortion and then just walk out of the clinic.  You can't force her to be a part of the burial.  And how would they handle medical abortions?  That's what mine was.  I was only 5 weeks along, so there wasn't anything to bury.  I had what amounted to a heavy period after taking the meds.

I think it's more about the money side of things. Needing to pay for the cremation or burial of the remains is going to add costs to a procedure that many women already have a hard time paying for, putting the abortion even further out of their reach.

[candygirl200413]

Thank you for answering @Bethella, very appreciative! I hope through Texas' courts that they have the same result as Indiana but I know that will be a very long time.

 

Also not trying to hijack this thread but just read how Texas' governor Greg Abott said he would take funding away from UT if they petition to become a sanctuary. But don't worry cause Jesus would want the fetuses as well as the Texas people to be protected! America is just going down fast greatly.

[Bethella]

6 hours ago, candygirl200413 said:

Thank you for answering @Bethella, very appreciative! I hope through Texas' courts that they have the same result as Indiana but I know that will be a very long time.

I'm just worried that when it is overturned Texas will keep appealing it all the way to the Supreme Court. By the time it gets there Trump will be in office and will probably have Scalia's seat filled, so who knows how the case would go.

[Phoebe]

On 11/30/2016 at 10:38 PM, candygirl200413 said:

My heart aches for Texas Women, I can't even imagine. I'm confused though, how was this able to pass in Texas, but not Indiana? Unless from the last time I heard, they had to take it to court because they were like hey this is super ridiculous.

I think because the law in Indiana would have made the woman pay for the unwanted services of cremation or burial.

[Four is Enough]

Silly me. I thought it was incinerated (er, cremated) as medical waste anyway.

[iweartanktops]

http://huff.to/2gbI6qQ

Quote

"Aborted fetuses in Texas that would normally be treated as medical waste will have to be buried or cremated starting next month."

What the absolute fuck? Another RIDICULOUS way to shame women. I can't believe this is even real. 

Quote

In a fundraising email sent by Abbott in July, the governor argued that he wanted to pass the new measures to “reflect our respect for the sanctity of life” and “turn the tides against the soulless abortion industry in Texas.” Abbott’s fundraising letter came shortly after Texas suffered a bruising loss in a Supreme Court case that declared a different set of abortion-related regulations unconstitutional.

  

I'm in shock. Perhaps I'll have more words later. This is insane. 

[Fascinated]

Ok. I'm sure I can come up with something to say about this. I don't think this would pass. Would it?  Anyway, I guess the next step would be burying or cremating sanitary pads/tampons because no baby. I honestly, and obviously, don't know what to say. This guy, this world, is completely and utterly fucked up. 

[Kariina]

I've lived in both Pence's Indiana and Abbott's Texas. I reaaaaallly want to know what it's like in states that don't have this bullsh*t crop up every other week. Or countries that don't argue about women's bodily autonomy at all, for that matter.

[Chicken bones]

GD, I hate my state so often. but you know, this is the idiocracy that allows guns to be openly carried into mental health facilities.

[SolomonFundy]

Abortion is a complicated issue, and what I'm about to say admittedly grossly over-simplifies the objectives of "pro life" advocates. But... 

Why the hell does "respect for life" seem to extend exclusively to the rights of a fetus up until it is born? A live-born baby (particularly if its parents are immigrants) doesn't have the legal protections in Texas that a fetus does. And women? That smug "respect for life" party line doesn't seem to apply to women's lives at all. 

I participated in the 5.4 Million And Counting project earlier this year, and breathed a sigh of relief when the SC found the ludicrous abortion provider "admitting privileges" regulations to be unconstitutional.  And now, this. My home state isn't Texas, but ideologically, we aren't far behind. 

Since it makes no logical sense, and since it does literally nothing to further the quality of Texas citizens' health care (despite the fact this initiative was introduced under the auspices of the Texas Department of State Health Services), I can only assume that a significant number of the members of the Texas legislature own crematoriums or low-cost graveyards. 

[Childless]

5 hours ago, SolomonFundy said:

Abortion is a complicated issue, and what I'm about to say admittedly grossly over-simplifies the objectives of "pro life" advocates. But... 

Why the hell does "respect for life" seem to extend exclusively to the rights of a fetus up until it is born? A live-born baby (particularly if its parents are immigrants) doesn't have the legal protections in Texas that a fetus does. And women? That smug "respect for life" party line doesn't seem to apply to women's lives at all. 

I participated in the 5.4 Million And Counting project earlier this year, and breathed a sigh of relief when the SC found the ludicrous abortion provider "admitting privileges" regulations to be unconstitutional.  And now, this. My home state isn't Texas, but ideologically, we aren't far behind. 

Since it makes no logical sense, and since it does literally nothing to further the quality of Texas citizens' health care (despite the fact this initiative was introduced under the auspices of the Texas Department of State Health Services), I can only assume that a significant number of the members of the Texas legislature own crematoriums or low-cost graveyards. 

I think the whole thing is a ruse.  Have you ever noticed that these politicians that are so pro-life never actually challenge Roe v. Wade?  They have never mounted an effort to get the decision overturned.  They've never mounted an effort to get an amendment added to the Constitution.  Most of us would say that it's pointless.  You'll never get enough states to ratify it, but these stupid laws they keep trying to pass are also pointless.  Everyone knows the courts will strike them down.  So why do they continue to try to pass them, but never try to outright make it illegal?  It's because they don't want to make it illegal.  Oh, there are certainly the outliers who try with a stray crazy bill here and there, bit there's no group effort on the Republicans' part.  If you think about it, of course they don't want to make it illegal.  Abortion is one of those social issues that gets them votes.  It's such a volatile issue, that people will vote based on that issue alone (I have super religious relatives that held their noses and voted for Trump based solely on abortion).  As long as the Republicans talk a good talk about getting rid of it, they pick up tons of votes.  As soon as they actually get rid of it though, what's their schtick to get those votes?  "We're going to raise taxes on the poor and middle class to compensate for tax cuts for the rich" just isn't going to get voters to the polls.  They need a volatile issue like abortion.  They can't afford to actually do what they say they want to do.  So, they play games and pass laws that make it look like they're doing something all the while knowing it won't fly in court.  They string people along without ever doing anything that might jeopardize their golden goose.

 

 

[HarryPotterFan]

Wow, @Childless I never thought of it that way. Brilliant point.

On December 2, 2016 at 9:08 PM, Fascinated said:

Ok. I'm sure I can come up with something to say about this. I don't think this would pass. Would it?  Anyway, I guess the next step would be burying or cremating sanitary pads/tampons because no baby. I honestly, and obviously, don't know what to say. This guy, this world, is completely and utterly fucked up. 

On that note, this popped up in my Facebook newsfeed:

 

[polecat]

On 12/2/2016 at 8:59 AM, Four is Enough said:

Silly me. I thought it was incinerated (er, cremated) as medical waste anyway.

I'm glad you said this because I've been puzzling about the same thing all day. 

[desertvixen]

On 12/6/2016 at 4:59 AM, Childless said:

I think the whole thing is a ruse.  Have you ever noticed that these politicians that are so pro-life never actually challenge Roe v. Wade?  They have never mounted an effort to get the decision overturned.

I've been thinking this for a long time myself.  It's pretty much a win-win for them - continue to pass laws that chip away at Roe and make it much harder for women to have access to abortion, but keep Roe out there as the abomination that must be destroyed (send us your money and vote for us).

[December]

On 12/6/2016 at 1:59 AM, Childless said:

I think the whole thing is a ruse.  Have you ever noticed that these politicians that are so pro-life never actually challenge Roe v. Wade?  They have never mounted an effort to get the decision overturned.

Even if they haven't been able to do much nationally, however, they have managed to enact policies at the state level in many places that create unnecessary obstacles for women who wish to obtain safe, legal abortions (as well as contraception, pap smears, STI testing, etc.). They don't need to overturn Roe v. Wade in order to impact women's healthcare access.

That said, I agree that some politicians seem to care deeply about keeping abortion as a hot button issue in order to steer the conversation away from many other critical topics that are affecting this country.

[Childless]

5 hours ago, December said:

Even if they haven't been able to do much nationally, however, they have managed to enact policies at the state level in many places that create unnecessary obstacles for women who wish to obtain safe, legal abortions (as well as contraception, pap smears, STI testing, etc.). They don't need to overturn Roe v. Wade in order to impact women's healthcare access.

That said, I agree that some politicians seem to care deeply about keeping abortion as a hot button issue in order to steer the conversation away from many other critical topics that are affecting this country.

They chip away at it, but never actually get rid of it.  They had a great opportunity when they had both houses and the presidency with GWB and did nothing.  Why?  Because it would effectively be shooting themselves in the foot.  You won't see them touch Roe v. Wade.  Especially now that they've lost marriage equality.  The only hot button issue working in their favor anymore is abortion.  They aren't about to let go of their biggest draw.  It's the issue that gets the Christian Right off their asses and to the polls.  So, you'll see politicians pass little laws here and there to make it look like they're doing something, but they won't make a concerted effort to take down Roe.  They aren't stupid.

Trump won't do anything more on that front than fill Scalia's empty seat with a conservative.  Donald himself doesn't give a rat's ass about abortion.  The man has been a life long Democrat.  He only switched parties when the black guy was elected.  I'm sure most of his political stances remain unchanged.  He's not a Republican.  He's simply a racist Democrat.  He's going to concentrate on passing laws that benefit Donald Trump and nothing more.  You can already see that in the disastrous tax plan he's floated.