Seewalds 48: Homophobia Now Mixed With Hypocrisy

[Kiki03910]

8 hours ago, Cam said:

Agree with your comment about making an observation. And yep, trying to change another person’s mind is a waste of time and energy.

 

Imo, the term “pro-abortion” is intentionally used by the antiabortion crowd as a means to make it appear that pro-choice advocates are thrilled at the prospects of abortion. They say “pro-abortion” to inflame the situation. I don’t know if I’ve ever heard anti-abortion people refer to the other side as “pro-choice”. They simply won’t phrase it that way because it sounds too soft. They want to paint a picture of large crowds of people insisting women get abortions.

I remember when Hillary was running for president seeing memes of her dressed in doctor’s scrubs looking like she was performing abortions. Trumpers acted like Hillary was a type pf Hitler who was going to put an end to all pregnancies and she’d be leading the charge by doing the procedures herself!

To me, the terms “pro-aborts” or “pro-abortion” are used intentionally to inflame and mislead others on the matter. It is used divisively. Anti-abortioners are not interested in the many nuances surrounding the subject. They merely want to spew their hateful viewpoint and continue politicizing it. 

Kinda OT, but I met my bf's mom the first year we were dating. On maybe my 3rd visit with her, she asked me if I was pro-abortion. I said, "Yes! Everybody should have one!" Obvs she meant to say pro-choice (and she's pro-choice herself) but I'm lucky she wasn't horrified by my sense of humor!

 

[AprilQuilt]

3 hours ago, SisterCupcake said:

@AprilQuilt - same. My body started miscarrying at 11 weeks, but the little one had stopped growing at 9 weeks. I didn't realize anything was wrong, and only went to be checked out for a tiny bit of spotting. After everything was said and done though (including a D&C), they tested the tissue and found out that it was a freak and totally random and unpreventable genetic issue that caused the miscarriage, which made me feel better. I wasn't blaming myself, but it was still nice to have confirmation of what happened.

So sorry you went through that. I wish I'd been able to have the tissue tested. It was always my goal from the point of knowing that the foetus wasn't viable, but due to a string of mistakes and miscommunications hospital-side it didn't happen. I am certain that, like you, it had something genetic going on that wasn't compatible with life, and caused by something different than most of my other miscarriages which follow a different pattern. I'm still so sad it didn't make it but at peace with the fact that it never could have. Hope you're OK and have lots of joy in your world.

[Cam]

22 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I highly identify with the term prochoice because if someone was forced to have an abortion, I would be just as upset as if someone was forced to not have an abortion. They are equally horrible because the choice was taken away from both people. I know someone who was forced to have an abortion and that person was traumatized by it. Just like many women are traumatized because they are forced to carry to term. And then some of those women are further traumatized because they are then coerced into placing that baby for adoption. It’s all about choice for me and it always will be. 

Yes, 100% prochoice and the points you make are all very valid.

Antiabortioners don’t like the pro-choice term because they are incensed by the idea that a woman, a female, be allowed to make her own decisions. “How dare them damn females do that! A woman must do what God wants! That is, the white male God in flowing white robe floating out in the stratosphere on a white cloud! The sexy Jesus with blonde curls and blue eyes! What do the man-God want? You do what he say! No make up your own mind! You have ovaries and therefore cannot think clearly! We on earth tell you what God want and he want women to make the babies! Now don’t go on worrying yer purty lil head about what to do! We tell you what to do!” Control, control, control.

Edited March 3, 2023 by Cam

[Idlewild]

Jessa was back to shilling stuff on her instastory yesterday- the consolation for the ‘slanderous persecution’ being increased visits to her social media.

Whatever your view of the D&C and if it was hypocritical, the fact remains she made videos several weeks after the event, including a cliffhanger’ ending so they could monetise her experience.  Ben may be having a hissy fit about people calling them out, but he didn’t marry a Duggar so he couldn’t cash in on their fame/infamy. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Idlewild said:

Jessa was back to shilling stuff on her instastory yesterday- the consolation for the ‘slanderous persecution’ being increased visits to her social media.

Whatever your view of the D&C and if it was hypocritical, the fact remains she made videos several weeks after the event, including a cliffhanger’ ending so they could monetise her experience.  Ben may be having a hissy fit about people calling them out, but he didn’t marry a Duggar so he couldn’t cash in on their fame/infamy. 

I truly think that growing up with a camera filming your life for years on end messes with your sense of normalcy. Making her miscarriage into a cliffhanger is in poor taste and I would never do it. Most people would never do it. But I don’t think Jessa sees things normally. I think she sees things through the lens of a camera. She sees her life events as monetized. Her courtship was monetized. Her wedding was monetized. Her births were monetized. She sells pieces of her life like you or I would sell paintings. 

Edited March 3, 2023 by JermajestyDuggar

[SassyPants]

49 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I truly think that growing up with a camera filming your life for years on end messes with your sense of normalcy. Making her miscarriage into a cliffhanger is in poor taste and I would never do it. Most people would never do it. But I don’t think Jessa sees things normally. I think she sees things through the lens of a camera. She sees her life events as monetized. Her courtship was monetized. Her wedding was monetized. Her births were monetized. She sells pieces of her life like you or I would sell paintings. 

She hadn’t even posted that she was pregnant. How gross is that when you realize all of that was for a more clicks and money? She could have just never said anything, but then no extra clicks and no extra money. She is the female JB.

How about you get off your butt and go to school so you can secure a job that might command a modicum of respect. Neither she nor Ben have the personalities that mesh well with a public career. 

They are manipulative and opportunistic. What happened to Jesus?

Edited March 3, 2023 by SassyPants

[viii]

I don't like to typically judge how a woman handles a pregnancy loss but this... I side-eyed her for this. 

[Nothing if not critical]

19 minutes ago, viii said:

I don't like to typically judge how a woman handles a pregnancy loss but this... I side-eyed her for this. 

Because this is not about how she handles her loss or how she grieves - this is about instrumentalizing her loss and making money from it. And anyway, that video doesn't bother me half as much as her horrible views.

[Smee]

Has anyone seen “The Janes”? It’s a doco about a network of women who helped other women get abortions pre-Roe. Super interesting, some of these women ended up learning from how to do the abortions themselves, some of them had women coming to their family homes to have an abortion in the bedroom while they cooked dinner for their own kids. They would drive women around in winding routes to avoid being tailed by police. They talk about how women were seeking illegal backyard abortions from mobsters and people exploiting them for money, and then being left to bleed, and how when it was legalised in New York (the “Janes” were in Chicago) the demographic of people coming to them for help changed because white women could afford to fly interstate. It’s a very interesting picture of how much risk people would take but it did make me think how it would be even harder for something like that now with improved technology and surveillance.

[JDuggs]

16 minutes ago, Smee said:

Has anyone seen “The Janes”? It’s a doco about a network of women who helped other women get abortions pre-Roe. Super interesting, some of these women ended up learning from how to do the abortions themselves, some of them had women coming to their family homes to have an abortion in the bedroom while they cooked dinner for their own kids. They would drive women around in winding routes to avoid being tailed by police. They talk about how women were seeking illegal backyard abortions from mobsters and people exploiting them for money, and then being left to bleed, and how when it was legalised in New York (the “Janes” were in Chicago) the demographic of people coming to them for help changed because white women could afford to fly interstate. It’s a very interesting picture of how much risk people would take but it did make me think how it would be even harder for something like that now with improved technology and surveillance.

“The Janes” was fantastic. It’s on HBO Max. I’m from the Chicago area so it was so inspiring to see these women from Chicago taking charge and getting things done. Also so absolutely demoralizing to see where we’re at now. I’m young enough that abortion was always legal and easily accessible for women my age and now old enough where it won’t impact my generation directly. I feel that my generation absolutely fell asleep and took abortion rights for granted and didn’t do enough to protect the future generations. I voted for Republicans because I never thought they’d come after “social issues.” 2016 was a huge wake up call for me. My 25 year old daughter works remotely but refuses to live in any red state which makes total sense. It’s not how I saw this country’s future at all and it’s my and my generation’s fault.

[JermajestyDuggar]

2 hours ago, Smee said:

Has anyone seen “The Janes”? It’s a doco about a network of women who helped other women get abortions pre-Roe. Super interesting, some of these women ended up learning from how to do the abortions themselves, some of them had women coming to their family homes to have an abortion in the bedroom while they cooked dinner for their own kids. They would drive women around in winding routes to avoid being tailed by police. They talk about how women were seeking illegal backyard abortions from mobsters and people exploiting them for money, and then being left to bleed, and how when it was legalised in New York (the “Janes” were in Chicago) the demographic of people coming to them for help changed because white women could afford to fly interstate. It’s a very interesting picture of how much risk people would take but it did make me think how it would be even harder for something like that now with improved technology and surveillance.

I want to also add that there was a specific ward in a large Chicago hospital just for botched back alley abortions. Women came in all the time with excessive blood loss and sepsis from some random back alley abortion. After Roe V Wade, they closed that unit entirely. There was no need after that. 

[Chickenbutt]

When I was a kid, sometimes around 1964/5 ish (yes I am old), my mom took a friend of hers to Tijuana, Mexico for an abortion. She died of an infection 10 days to 2 weeks later. 

[WatchingTheTireFireBurn]

I hate this is the US now. I can't understand it. Not really. I can read the events leading to it. I can read the quotes. But I just cannot understand.

[shesinsane]

12 hours ago, WatchingTheTireFireBurn said:

I hate this is the US now. I can't understand it. Not really. I can read the events leading to it. I can read the quotes. But I just cannot understand.

First you need to throw out facts and reality, and replace them with your own. When it comes to who gets an abortion, forget all those mothers who don't want more children and pretend every woman who seeks an abortion is having casual sex and using abortion as birth control. Ignore science and embrace the lie that an embryo is just a micro sized human baby, rather than cluster of cells that might eventually turn into a fetus (but has a 1 in 4 chance of ending as a miscarriage). Stick with the delusions and you realize that you can't allow anti-abortion laws to have exceptions for rape or the life of the mother because then all the condom-shunning sluts will claim they were raped (or will end their life) in order to secure an abortion. There's no problem with tax dollars paying for crisis pregnancy centers full of staff masquerading as trained medical personnel if the lies convince one woman to give birth to a child she doesn't want to bear.

Almost every word in the proceeding paragraph is absolute nonsense, but those steeped in pro-life propaganda believe everything that supports their cause and ignore all the evidence to the contrary. It's difficult to discuss why abortion is necessary health care with (usually) a man who is so misguided he believes women take birth controls with each sex act, rather than at the same time every day. And thanks to the internet, there's plenty of websites that will host the lies and delusions in big text right next to elected law makers that endorse every myth about human biology and sexuality. 

 

[gobucks]

Mama Doctor Jones put out a YouTube video today about Jessa. Very interesting. MDJ is a Ob/gyn formerly of Texas that now practices in New Zealand. If you watch, definitely watch it in its entirety. 

Edited March 4, 2023 by gobucks

[AprilQuilt]

On 3/3/2023 at 4:14 PM, JermajestyDuggar said:

I truly think that growing up with a camera filming your life for years on end messes with your sense of normalcy. Making her miscarriage into a cliffhanger is in poor taste and I would never do it. Most people would never do it. But I don’t think Jessa sees things normally. I think she sees things through the lens of a camera. She sees her life events as monetized. Her courtship was monetized. Her wedding was monetized. Her births were monetized. She sells pieces of her life like you or I would sell paintings. 

I think it's not just the legacy of her childhood, at this point if she's taking vlogging at all seriously she is immersed in a culture of treating your life as content to be monetised, including (especially!) your kids and your intimate tragedies. She must be in touch with so many vlogger/influencer families who all think this way and once you get into the loop of doing it and it's paying the bills, it's hard to climb down from that. And if everyone around you is doing it and you get attention and approval for doing it, you just don't stop. I feel for the children.

[Mostly Catholic]

I doubt that Jessa has enough education in biology or science to understand what is and what is not an abortion. Or even to read and understand the medical definition of a D&C, a D&E, an evacuation/suction abortion, etc., from a medical website or textbook. Even if she wanted to, which I'm sure she doesn't. And I'm sure she doesn't have the self-reflection or inclination to appreciate that she had a choice that is now denied to other women. And that no one has reported her to authorities as having a "suspicious miscarriage," as some other women who spontaneously miscarry have had to endure.

As someone who had an abortion at 9 weeks, I can tell you that my aspiration/suction procedure is the same as a D&C that is performed with a suction instrument versus a sharp instrument (usage varies among those two). 

On 3/2/2023 at 12:17 PM, AprilQuilt said:

This may be neither here nor there but I have seen a few people discussing their missed miscarriage experiences of going to the 12 week scan and finding that the baby had no heartbeat and had 'stopped growing at X weeks', and I wanted to share a personal experience of mine that might be helpful. Sharing below the jump, it's perfectly gentle and nothing explicit, but I understand some may not wish to read about pregnancy loss.

  Reveal hidden contents

My MMC pregnancy was heavily monitored due to my previous losses. I think I had 4 scans during my first trimester, it might have been 5. Over this time they initially confirmed that the foetus was present but not as large as it should have been; a week on from that we had hope because although it hadn't grown as much as it ought to, it had a strong heartbeat and the sonographer was pleased with it, saying that perhaps my dates were out (I knew they couldn't be by that much). Initially it measured a week behind, then two weeks, and finally by the time no heartbeat was found, it measured 8 weeks when it should have been about 12. Essentially my baby was alive for a while, and growing very slowly - I think it tried really hard - but it was never healthy.

I say this because I know that people who only get a 12 week scan and experience the awful shock of a MMC, might look back to the point in time at which the baby supposedly 'stopped growing' and wonder if something they did caused it, or if at some point they missed a sign to seek medical care. If it gives anyone any comfort, I want to let you know that because I was privileged to witness my pregnancy in detail, I can accept that my MMC was not caused by anything I did. There was no point at which intervention could have made any difference, because lots of professionals were monitoring and caring for my baby and they did all they could, which really was simply to fill me with hormones and vitamins and let it try. I'm grateful to have that evidence. It gives me quite a bit of peace. If you need to hear something like this right now, I hope it helps you too.

 

I'm sorry for your loss.

[JermajestyDuggar]

2 hours ago, AprilQuilt said:

I think it's not just the legacy of her childhood, at this point if she's taking vlogging at all seriously she is immersed in a culture of treating your life as content to be monetised, including (especially!) your kids and your intimate tragedies. She must be in touch with so many vlogger/influencer families who all think this way and once you get into the loop of doing it and it's paying the bills, it's hard to climb down from that. And if everyone around you is doing it and you get attention and approval for doing it, you just don't stop. I feel for the children.

Yes, it doesn’t help that there are so many adult women doing the exact same thing as Jessa. Jinger and Jill try to keep their children’s faces off of social media. Yes Jessa seems happy to make money off of them. 

[AprilQuilt]

Actually, thinking about this it does make me respect Jill and Jinger's decision as more weighty than maybe it looks from the 'outside'. I mean I feel that giving my child privacy online is a really basic thing, but they are swimming against the tide to attempt to actively choose it when some of their own siblings don't. It's such easy money in that family to simply share a few snaps of their children's faces - I can see why you might not scruple too hard over it especially if you know no other way. And when you choose not to put your children on social media it can read as a criticism of those who do.

[allyisyourpally5]

I am sorry, and I think most of us are, for what Jessa went through, because it’s horrible and most people wouldn’t wish that on anybody.

Maybe though Ben, Jessa can have an apology when SHE apologises for her comments to Meghan Kelly in 2015 where she stated on TV that boys sexually molesting young girls is ok because they’re just a little curious. She was an adult when she said it and she’s an adult now. Maybe Jessa needs to think of any little girls who are being molested and are afraid to speak out, and heard that and now think it’s just normal.

[AussieKrissy]

10 hours ago, gobucks said:

Mama Doctor Jones put out a YouTube video today about Jessa. Very interesting. MDJ is a Ob/gyn formerly of Texas that now practices in New Zealand. If you watch, definitely watch it in its entirety. 

Oh I love her she pops up randomly on my Facebook clips and I watch I had no idea she was in New Zealand. I wonder why she is there? Is she married to a Kiwi?

[gobucks]

31 minutes ago, AussieKrissy said:

Oh I love her she pops up randomly on my Facebook clips and I watch I had no idea she was in New Zealand. I wonder why she is there? Is she married to a Kiwi?

They went there on a trip and loved it. They waited a while, then she was a traveling doctor in Hawaii for a few months, then got her documents to go to NZ. 

[Jackie3]

On 3/2/2023 at 8:11 AM, JermajestyDuggar said:

Just like everything else in the US, the rich have many choices while the poor have very few choices. And of the few choices they have, most of the choices suck. Which keeps them poor. 

The world is not so black and white.

I knew a girl from a very wealthy family who became pregnant at 17. Abortion was illegal at the time. Her wealthy parents could easily have helped her get an abortion, but they were so angry and wounded by this "betrayal" that they did not. They made her carry the baby to term, and then she and the baby were on their own. Basically, they kicked her out. 

Wealthy people don't all have the "dream life" you imagine!

Did you really think that, before Roe, the rich all had easy painless abortions? Life is so much more complex than that, especially when it comes to premarital sex, which is such a loaded issue.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Jackie3

[Satan'sFortress]

New York Times article about women in Texas in situations similar to Jessa. She is very fortunate that she was able to get the care she did. The article tells about women who didn't. You should be able to read for free.

NYT article

[SassyPants]

4 hours ago, Satan'sFortress said:

New York Times article about women in Texas in situations similar to Jessa. She is very fortunate that she was able to get the care she did. The article tells about women who didn't. You should be able to read for free.

NYT article

This is the crux of the entire matter. The Seewalds support this type of legislation. They do not have the ability to think about their recent experience within the context of the legislation that they support. They both lack critical thinking skills, common sense and logic. They lashed out publicly without logically thinking it through. They lack empathy, in the face of experiencing what they have experienced. Lastly, these folks have NO business thinking that they should have careers as influencers. Again, lack of self awareness and common sense.

Like I’ve said, JB Duggar clone to a T. Remember when Duggar verbally bashed education as a waste of money?

And we see the end product of an adult lacking education- it’s not pretty. It’s not functional.