Caleb Williams 2

[Jellybean]

Continued from here:

Caleb Williams, a family friend of the Duggars, was recently charged with two counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse of an underage child in Logan County, Illinois, where he is from. According to court documents, the attacks occurred between May 2015 - May 2018. 

Credit to @WhoompThereItIs for that summary - more info here if you want it:

Thankfully, the conversation seems to have moved on somewhat, drifting to more literary pursuits. Is Pa Ingalls a selfish, racist oaf? Was Susan excluded from heaven and cut off by Aslan forever for liking lipstick? What (TF) about Elsie Dinsmore?

[LilMissMetaphor]

Quote

And it's beyond creepy how Elsie married Mr. Travilla. Way beyond. In the early books he would kiss her and then say he wished she was ten years older. He waited until she was 21, if I remember right, to ask for her hand. He would have been about 38-40 at the time, and had his eye on her since she was 7 or 8. Ewwwww *brain bleach*. Not to mention all the deep, passionate mouth-kisses Elsie shared with her father. 

Book thread drift ?

Same thing with Dean and Emily in L.M. Montgomery.  So gross!

Dean: [after comparing Emily to a star] "I think I’ll wait for you.” 
Emily: “Oh, I’m ready to go now.” 
Dean: “H’m. That wasn’t what I meant. Never mind." 

[Carm_88]

4 hours ago, LilMissMetaphor said:

Book thread drift ?

Same thing with Dean and Emily in L.M. Montgomery.  So gross!

Dean: [after comparing Emily to a star] "I think I’ll wait for you.” 
Emily: “Oh, I’m ready to go now.” 
Dean: “H’m. That wasn’t what I meant. Never mind." 

The whole Emily of New Moon series was just dark and weird. 

[Rachel333]

@Lurky There's nothing in the book that says Susan is cast out forever, and Lewis said multiple times that he thought Susan could find her own way back to Aslan's Country after all.

What does happen with Susan is bad enough, though, so I'm not defending it! Susan's fate is something that has deeply bothered me for a long time.

Emily of New Moon:

I really liked the books when I read them. Something about them appealed to me more than the Anne books. I was pretty young when I read them, though, and since I didn't own them like I do the Anne books I didn't reread them as much. I didn't remember the stuff with Dean.

With Anne, I always thought the number of marriage proposals she received was a little much until I learned that LMM was proposed to about as many times herself!

[Lisafer]

I think CS Lewis pulled a George RR Martin stunt long before Game of Thrones ever happened. "All these characters you've loved through all these books? Hahaha they're all dead except one who is left behind while her entire family is mangled to death in a railway accident." The fact that none of the dead people were bothered by any of this, and that it was presented as a wonderful revelation of eternal joy, only made me more disturbed by the whole thing!

[Aine]

@QuiverFullofBooks, Amos Bronson Alcott reminds me a lot of John Shrader in many ways. Except for the fact I have some respect for some of Bronson Alcott's beliefs- he was definitely ahead of his time in many ways that made him an 'eccentric'. However, his dogmatism and arrogance made him few true longterm friends, served only to slow down the consideration of his beliefs as people were so put off by his "100% or 0%" attitude when it came to putting his ideas in practice, and he turned down many lucrative job opportunities that would have more than supported his family and likely funded more measured ways of sharing his ideas but he thought himself so important and so absolutely and utterly correct on everything that he couldn't possibly hold any job that didn't agree with all of his beliefs and let him loose on children with them ?

Considering much of the pedagogical philosophy that he so heartily endorsed, as well as other beliefs such as that of abolition, seemed to respect the worth of each individual, he really did not live that philosophy in how he acted when it came to anyone disagreeing with him over anything. Sure, there are straight up moral transgressions that you don't need to respect such as slavery if you were an abolitionist. But he would create rifts and ruin partnerships and friendships over issues that were trivial in comparison. It's always odd when the words of a narcissist seem to be about others but really they are all about seeing their ideas being carried out by others for their own glory.

[nickelodeon]

1 hour ago, Lisafer said:

I think CS Lewis pulled a George RR Martin stunt long before Game of Thrones ever happened. "All these characters you've loved through all these books? Hahaha they're all dead except one who is left behind while her entire family is mangled to death in a railway accident." The fact that none of the dead people were bothered by any of this, and that it was presented as a wonderful revelation of eternal joy, only made me more disturbed by the whole thing!

That's the part of Philip Pullman's reading that I think rings the most true - that a god whose will requires children to die horribly is a cruel and unjust one. It's rough stuff!

[Palimpsest]

@Aine, excellent take on Alcott, although I prefer him to John Shrader.  An autodidact, a visionary, a reformer, a moralist - and an irresponsible grifter and narcissist who must have been a horrible husband, father, and friend.  The only time I remember feeling sorry for Bronson was when he lost his first school in Boston (the Temple School) partly over daring to accept students of color.  Partly. The rest was over educational ideas that would not necessarily be seen as obscene or blasphemous today. 

Book recommendation on the friendships of Alcott, Emerson, Thoreau, and Hawthorne:  https://www.amazon.com/Concord-Quartet-Hawthorne-Friendship-American/dp/0471646636

And a funny story I remember hearing from a docent that may not be in the book.

Hawthorne was never a true Transcendentalist, but had the misfortune of living next door to Alcott in what is now The Wayside https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wayside when Alcott and family lived in Orchard house.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orchard_House

Hawthorne made significant renovations to the Wayside, including changing the name from "Hillside" to Alcott's extreme displeasure.  He also changed the orientation of the staircase to face the back of the house.  That was so, if he saw Alcott trotting down the road from his study window, he could race down the stairs, out the back door, and up the hill to avoid talking to him.  Bronson Alcott could apparently talk the ears off donkeys - and preferred chat to work any day.

[formergothardite]

Hinds' Feet on High Places. That is one weird book. I was made to read it and to hated every second of it, thought even then that the relationship seemed unhealthy and didn't really get what the message was supposed to me. 

[Pecansforeveryone]

@formergothardite, ah Hinds Feet On High Places. That and Pilgrims Progress were staples in our childhood Bible studies. I remember being more freaked out by Pilgrims Progress as a child. The various giants were pretty creepy. 

[Aine]

On 1/14/2019 at 12:14 PM, Palimpsest said:

although I prefer him to John Shrader

Oh yes, me too! Like I said, I can get behind many of Alcott's beliefs and most of what he was so dogmatic about at least seemed to be more in line with equality and valuing each individual. He could have influenced many more people and made some progress towards his ideal, at least in his immediate environments, had he not been such an arrogant asshole. 

[melon]

Ancestry,com used to have something that allowed you to see your famous relatives.This was always on my father's side.It would start with me then my Dad,one of my grandparents and take you all the way back.

Some of my famous ancestors are JFK thru his mother Rose.Louisa May Alcott thru her father Bronson Alcott.

[QuiverFullofBooks]

2 hours ago, melon said:

Ancestry,com used to have something that allowed you to see your famous relatives.This was always on my father's side.It would start with me then my Dad,one of my grandparents and take you all the way back.

Some of my famous ancestors are JFK thru his mother Rose.Louisa May Alcott thru her father Bronson Alcott.

Those are relatives, not ancestors, which means you’re a direct descendant. Did you see the recent thread drift on what a jerk Bronson Alcott was? I don’t remember which thread it was in.

[Queen]

I want to talk about Susan too! The Narnia books were the only fantasy books I was allowed to read as a child because Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings were - according to my mum -promoting witchcraft or non-Christian religious beliefs (ironically both Rowling and Tolkien are Christians, but my mum hardly knew that...) 

Susan was/is my favorite character of the four siblings. Lucy was always good, innocent and selfless, very unlike how I perceived myself at the time, and I couldn't identify with Peter or Edmund either. Susan was the smart, sceptical, big sister, I loved her. I was mad that Lewis decided to not let her into heaven, and for such idiotic reasons. Like her, I also ended up loosing my faith as an adult. I wished she has gotten a better ending, but on the other hand it's nice to have a character that strayed from the faith as I did, even if she is portrayed in a negative light. 

[closetcagebaby]

http://celebrityinsider.org/amp/counting-on-star-jana-duggars-once-rumored-bf-got-a-minor-pregnant-claims-court-docs-238620/

this case just gets worse and worse. Anyone still want to defend this scumfuck?

[Glasgowghirl]

6 hours ago, closetcagebaby said:

http://celebrityinsider.org/amp/counting-on-star-jana-duggars-once-rumored-bf-got-a-minor-pregnant-claims-court-docs-238620/

this case just gets worse and worse. Anyone still want to defend this scumfuck?

I wish the tabloids would stop linking Jana to the story, I has nothing to do with her and her name should be left out of it.

[HarleyQuinn]

No one would care about this kid if he wasn't linked to the Duggars so I can see why they do it. It's probably why Jana is working overtime on her new Instagram making sure she has a separate image.

Did this girl keep her baby? The article doesn't say. 

[Local Gorilla]

Sorry I am a little late to the thread drift, but oh how I laughed at mention of this book...

On 1/15/2019 at 9:39 AM, formergothardite said:

Hinds' Feet on High Places. That is one weird book. I was made to read it and to hated every second of it, thought even then that the relationship seemed unhealthy and didn't really get what the message was supposed to me. 

Back in High School I participated in a popular baptist youth group for the sole purpose of attending their coed bonfires and summer camps, despite the trade-off of having to fake a personal relationship with this Jesus Christ MF. There was one particularly curt youth leader, two grades my senior. I didn't like her. She was an overachiever at school. Popular at Church, Comfortable in her ivory tower, pushing principles of fundamentalism on children. She talked me into "borrowing" her copy of Hinds' Feet on High Places from her prized lady-christian book collection, after she caught me reading the nonsensical synopsis on it's book jacket. Oh I just had to read it, she said.  Of course, I never did read it. To this day, when I think about my never having returned it, I cant help but  :::evil laugh:::  to myself, as if it were sweet revenge! 

???

[Kittikatz]

I'm sorry but until now I somehow missed that Caleb's older brother Joshua was arrested for an assault on a minor that took place at Josh Duggar's home. I knew about the arrest, but not the direct tie into the Duggars. Wtf is going on with this family/groups? The predators seem especially thick on the ground.

[EmainMacha]

31 minutes ago, Kittikatz said:

I'm sorry but until now I somehow missed that Caleb's older brother Joshua was arrested for an assault on a minor that took place at Josh Duggar's home. I knew about the arrest, but not the direct tie into the Duggars. Wtf is going on with this family/groups? The predators seem especially thick on the ground.

I don't see where it says that in the article shared above. It says there that it was in Joshua Williams home. Is the info re it being Josh Duggar's house from another source?

[Don'tlikekoolaid]

Hi I can’t post a link with phone but here’s a screenshot. Need coffee now. Sorry for misjointed post. What a sleaze this meathead is!

Spoiler

 

 

[QuiverFullofBooks]

Here’s the Radar Online article on Joshua Williams’ arrest - https://radaronline.com/exclusives/2019/01/jana-duggar-rumord-ex-caleb-williams-brother-joshua-arrested-assault-battery-against-minor/. It’s (allegedly) child abuse in the name of punishment, not anything sexual. @Kittikatz, did you or some other site mix up Joshua Williams and Joshua Duggar, or is there another source?

[Carm_88]

What a piece of fucking shit! 

[Sky with diamonds]

8 hours ago, Carm_88 said:

What a piece of fucking shit! 

Scum of the earth.

[Local Gorilla]

8 hours ago, Carm_88 said:

What a piece of fucking shit! 

Recently Ive come to call most men by that moniker.

But I say it under my breath like, "piece of shit..."

"What did you say?"

"Oh, nothing..."