The Duggar Interview - With Megyn Kelly

[ljohnson2006]

If J'Chelle cares about her grandbabies as much as she says she does, how come she's doing nothing to protect them from their dangerous father?

[FundieFarmer]

If J'Chelle cares about her grandbabies as much as she says she does, how come she's doing nothing to protect them from their dangerous father?

Because their father is her baby.

[3BluBs]

I tried to get through the thread before commenting but holy cow, things are moving fast. My two cents after watching the clip with Jessa and Jill. The system didn't fail them. Their fucking parents did. You'd think that when something like this happens in a family, the ADULTS in charge would pull their heads out of their assess and re-examine what caused it in the first place and choose a different course. But NO, they just clamped down tighter on their children, shamed their girls, patted Josh on the head and then pretended nothing ever happened. Ass-idiots. They can't see it. They can't see any of it. It's all so wrapped in their (mistaken) beliefs about God and how things 'should' be that they've most likely caused long lasting, permanent damage. It's my hope and prayer that all of the now adult children who were involved get the real help and de-programming they need to see this for what it is. Their parents' failure.

Edited for typos

[Hera]

After ruminating in this overnight (fine, I was traveling and without Internet access to post my thoughts), I've come to the conclusion that the interview can be taken either one of two ways, and neither of them reflect well on Jimchelle.

No. 1 is that they're calculating, though ignorant, opportunists who chose to downplay this whole thing to save their money train. So, they minimize what happened, maximize forgiveness and blame the "liberal agenda" and care more about money and fame than their own children's happiness, health and safety.

No. 2 is that they live in a circle where child abuse and sexual abuse is so common and covering it up is so prevalent that they genuinely do not understand why their son touching their daughters inappropriately is a big deal ("it's not like he raped them or anything!") or why it should have been reported immediately and dealt with through proper channels. They don't understand why it happened, that it isn't a mistake, the impact it had on their daughters (or the other victim), the impact it had on Josh (who, according to them begged me for help and ended up having to pay for his own therapy!), how to prevent it or anything else about child sexual abuse that they would have learned had they gone through the proper channels. Essentially, they've shown themselves to be (perhaps willfully) ignorant and unable to stop this from happening again in or to their family.

I suspect that it is a combination of both: they're driven by the former and use the latter to justify their actions. In any event, what stood out to me is that by their own admission, sexual abuse of children is entrenched in their social circle, it's seen as really not that big of a deal, and that that same circle finds it acceptable to not seek legitimate treatment for offenders or victims and that they see nothing wrong with that approach and would do it that way again (we're not mandated reporters!). I wonder if that admitted level of disregard for the law and their children's safety might be enough to spark a DHS investigation into what else is going on in that house. I doubt it would result in removing the kids or anything, but it might do Jimchelle some good to focus on their actual children and not a TV show.

Also, I sincerely hope that Josh did get therapy. What he did sounds like a compulsion, not curiosity, since he repeatedly went crying to his parents and begged for help. If he still had those urges, even after being sent to get shamed and beaten, er, I mean Gothard counseling, then I do respect him for seeking out legitimate therapy on his own dime, assuming that happened. Based on his "apology," though, it doesn't sound like it did, since he's still referring to youthful mistakes and not ruining his life.

Bottom line is that the lack of empathy these people have for the victims of this is breathtaking, really. Those girls, and what happened to them, truly do not matter.

[paganhomeschooler]

"Little ones don't sit on big boys' laps." oh God... That's your safe guard?

Not sure if this has been posted yet because I'm still weeding through but.....ANOTHER FUCKING LIE!!!!!!!!

Whenever Josiah isn't at indoctrination camp, he's always constantly toting Josie around, and I know she's been sitting in his lap at different family bible times and announcements and crap. He's always carrying her.

(Not that I'm saying Josiah did or ever would do anything to Josie or any of the other kids. I personally think he seems to be one of the "better" Duggars now that he's gotten over his arrogance of trying to be Josh 2.0 from when he was younger. Just pointing out more LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE from these idiots.)

[Snarkle Motion]

I'm trying to remind myself that Jill and Jessa are the victims but their preview clip makes me irate. I get that no one wants this sort of info to come out to the world and they don't deserve that. But they are blind to who is really to blame for this!

Their parents sold their privacy a decade ago! JB and Michelle paraded their kids to the world and happily embraced all that money and power from their celebrity. Their parents had to have known that this could possibly be brought to light but they said "we'll risk it!" and continued with their show. Yes, be mad at the system for exploiting the pain of children and splashing it across the world but really think about the fact that your parents knew what happened, knew this could get out, and still decided your feelings/privacy were worth the risk to them!

If these girls were not famous the truth is no one would have gone looking for that record or bothered making it known. It has nothing to do with an "agenda" and everything to do with the price of fame! This is why most normal people would never dream of airing their lives on a television show. Ug, I hate that this family wants to have it both ways about everything - you can't embrace the money and celebrity that comes with fame but also be outraged that you have no privacy and want people to stay out of your business. Honestly none of those girls chose this life to begin with and I feel a lot more sympathy for the girls still under JB's headship (and one still under 18!). Jill and Jessa both had the option to opt out of the show or at least minimize their participation but they have done just the opposite.

[violynn]

This is so true. I found out about repeated abuse that has gone on in my extended family. When I told my mother that her brother had been molesting his child (my cousin) her first response was anger at me.

When my close family members discussed it, we experienced direct attempts to shame and silence us - this was couched in "respect for the victim". But then there was also threats not to mention it to another family member who had been abused by the same uncle decades before because then this person might feel guilty for not speaking out or doing anything. I was like "Not telling people or talking about it is why this continued to happen! And the other victim should not feel guilty for not coming forward sooner - only the abuser should feel guilty!"

Everyone was so preoccupied with what they stated was "concern for the victims" but in reality the only one they were protecting was the abuser. And mentioning what had happened to my mother and she will still gets upset and says we are breaking "her" family apart. Mention anything about the situation and she is devastated that her family will never be all in the same room together and wishes we could get past this. The family was broken by a man who abused his family members and no one else! She has only recently made very gradual steps to acknowledge what has happened and distance herself from the perpetrator, but mostly she still sees and contacts him like nothing has happened.

My point being that I think its very common for family suffering from this to direct their anger at ANYTHING but the actual abuser. Its so hard to reconcile that someone part of your family- someone who may have done terrible things but you still love because of your familial bond - is the person you need to direct your anger at. Its much easier to direct it elsewhere or look for any reason to wash it away or forget about it because its very scary to think of your family being torn apart. The natural tendency is to protect the family and the status quo and survivors of abuse and others in the family may need years to process their feelings. Just my two-cents and hope sharing this experience was helpful in some way.

Thank you for sharing your story, Jee-Fringer, that couldn't have been easy for you. I have a situation a lot like yours too, even though my family's went a little deeper and more wide spread. The biggest problem hitting us was people trying to hide it and downplay the impact on our victims. So, thank you. I try to talk about what happened to me once in a while but then I chicken out. Those poor Duggar girls. And really, even poor Josh. That kid begged for help and never got it. :shifty-kitty: :shifty:

[Cleopatra7]

Not sure if this has been posted yet because I'm still weeding through but.....ANOTHER FUCKING LIE!!!!!!!!

Whenever Josiah isn't at indoctrination camp, he's always constantly toting Josie around, and I know she's been sitting in his lap at different family bible times and announcements and crap. He's always carrying her.

(Not that I'm saying Josiah did or ever would do anything to Josie or any of the other kids. I personally think he seems to be one of the "better" Duggars now that he's gotten over his arrogance of trying to be Josh 2.0 from when he was younger. Just pointing out more LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE from these idiots.)

I'm wondering what kind of conflicting messages the other Duggar boys must be getting in that house. They're told that they have no self-control and could possibly rape their sisters, but then they must also see Josh being treated like a golden boy, despite his past bad actions. Josiah must have been six or seven at the time of the abuse and could retain memories of that time. In retrospect, I wonder if his desire to be like Josh as a younger child wore off the older he got or if something else was going on?

[gustava]

How do I contact Lowe's to pull their sponsorship?

[Snarkle Motion]

Not sure if this has been posted yet because I'm still weeding through but.....ANOTHER FUCKING LIE!!!!!!!!

Whenever Josiah isn't at indoctrination camp, he's always constantly toting Josie around, and I know she's been sitting in his lap at different family bible times and announcements and crap. He's always carrying her.

(Not that I'm saying Josiah did or ever would do anything to Josie or any of the other kids. I personally think he seems to be one of the "better" Duggars now that he's gotten over his arrogance of trying to be Josh 2.0 from when he was younger. Just pointing out more LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE from these idiots.)

God, I'm sure its the girls who are reprimanded when they violate the "no sitting on a boys lap" rule. Because a toddler wanting to sit on someones lap is the problem and not the teenage boy who might be so overcome with manly arousal at his toddler sibling. :roll:

Also, did anyone else think it was weird that they made a point of saying it was okay for the girls to sit on daddy's lap? I mean, yes, that should be okay but I don't understand how their system of logic makes it safe for JB and not any of the other boys. Because JB is married? So is it now okay for the girls to sit on Josh's lap? I dunno, the way they interjected that comment tweaked my creepiness radar.

[SassyPants]

You know, I could have accepted the "we did the best we knew how" reasoning (excuse)... IF they had added "but we were wrong. We didn't handle this the right way at all. We know that now." But it was not to be. They had every opportunity, especially when Kelly asked if they felt guilty/responsible as the girls' parents. The "kids are going to make their own" choices line was such crap. Yes, Josh made that choice to violate his sisters and the babysitter... but YOU made the choice to keep it "in house," allowing it to happen again. Josh deserved competent counseling after they FIRST found out, not after THREE times of literally crying out for help. *sigh*

That's it right there. They never spoke about getting any of it wrong: not the waiting for a year to get Josh help, not the kind of help given, not the continuing to procreate, not the basically ignoring the girls, not the selling of the wholesome family to the media, not how their political agenda hurts other people....they could never say that they were wrong, misguided, misinformed or undereducated.

[Clementine]

If anybody have the time, I would love to get a timeline of what happened according to JB and Michelle in the interview. I think it would be very telling to see exactly what they did and when.

[SassyPants]

What about when JB said that he did some research and found out that kids who end up in the juvi system don't receive effective treatment, so they decided to go with the construction job. I mean construction treatment.

Then AFTER this supposed treatment, he was willing to blindly walk Joshie into police station with just a "witness" no attorney or anything to just turn the kid over to the whim of the state?? That made no sense.

But he just happened to get a cop they knew, who gave Josh a stern lecture. What a lucky break, eh?

Then they went home wondering what would happen next?? Are they saying they walked out of the copshop without their friend saying, hey hope that talkin' to did the trick...

Construction job- maybe that's how Josh earned some of the money to pay for his licensed, accredited treatment-

[Eternalbluepearl]

That's it right there. They never spoke about getting any of it wrong: not the waiting for a year to get Josh help, not the kind of help given, not the continuing to procreate, not the basically ignoring the girls, not the selling of the wholesome family to the media, not how their political agenda hurts other people....they could never say that they were wrong, misguided, misinformed or undereducated.

I also expected a..."We were wrong. We know so much more now about sexual abuse and its impacts and we are so sorry we didn't get anyone the help they needed 12 years ago..." But...NOPE.

[Evenkeel]

Long time lurker, first time poster. Thank so much to Buzzard for the recap. My TV would have been in danger between Michelle's baby voice and JB's minimizing of the situation.

As far as the interview on Friday, I'm pretty sure it will be a bunch of "jesus forgave him and so did we and y'all need to just GTFO and liberal agenda." I was shaking mad after Jessa's little sound bite that was published. She can say that because she's a victim? Uh, no, honey, you've been marinated in the koolaid for so long that you no longer have any sense of self-awareness that what you say makes you sound as ignorant and narcissistic as the day is long.

On the agenda thing: of course there's an agenda! They placed themselves front and center as shining examples of the uber-religious hardcore fundie right! The fact that they walked right into the media bear trap baited with money while refusing to accept that maybe, just maybe, the fact that their son was/is a child molester might come to light and look bad on them all on its own (regardless of how they dealt with the situation) is another great example of how narcissistic the entire freaking family is. It's not personal, of course, because that's how any controversial individual or family is treated. The fact that they're trying to make it "oh, so and so just doesn't like us so they're out to get us" and, with the girls, "ebil librul media and haters made us victims! Halp!" instead of even just "mea culpa, let's all move on" is so far beyond the pale that it makes me want to puke.

[Buzzard]

The whole thing is just so messed up.

ALL the boys now have a skewed belief of what a relationship is like when even your OWN SISTER is a sex object. You cant learn to have interpersonal relationships when "safeguards" come into play in normal human interaction.

Can you imagine never being alone with a sibling because you might molest them? What does that do to a boy's psyche? What does that teach a young girl when they have to be afraid of everyone with a penis because they may jump on them? Living by fear is not living.

Boob kept saying the record was sealed. If thats true, show me the order. It wouldnt be hard to get... just hold up the piece of paper and I'll believe you. Show it to Megyn... you had time to go and have joy get it sealed, show me the one from a decade ago and then explain why you needed to do it again!

[Snarkle Motion]

Thank you for sharing your story, Jee-Fringer, that couldn't have been easy for you. I have a situation a lot like yours too, even though my family's went a little deeper and more wide spread. The biggest problem hitting us was people trying to hide it and downplay the impact on our victims. So, thank you. I try to talk about what happened to me once in a while but then I chicken out. Those poor Duggar girls. And really, even poor Josh. That kid begged for help and never got it. :shifty-kitty: :shifty:

Thank you for your support! I'm sorry that you have had to deal with a similar situation. I actually fear that the problem in my family IS more widespread and suspect others were also affected but their is so much shame that people continue to think the best course of action is to remain silent and act as if nothing happened. My feeling is that talking about the situation is the ONLY way to break the cycle of intergenerational abuse. I suspect that the abuser was likely also abused. And even if this makes people angry and the first response is to silence people I think that we HAVE to talk about it. Well, at least I feel like venting to the internet void is helping me to process it and I know going forward I will continue to discuss the issue with my immediate family, even if this makes things uncomfortable at times.

I do feel for Josh because he never got help and his parents reacted in a way that reinforced his behavior. They basically told him that you can't help yourself, man can't control themselves, ask for forgiveness from God instead of actually doing tough psychotherapy to at least try to address the problem and see what was going though his mind when he did what he did. But no, his parents essentially created a system where he was never truly held accountable or forced to deal with the pain he caused his victims. And I honestly suspect that Josh has been abused at some point because this family and their cult make statements like "we know worse things have gone on in other families we've talked to". I wonder if JB and Michelle were reluctant to put any of their children in real therapy because other abuse might come to light.

But again, thank you for your support. I hope you continue to find the courage to talk about your situation and can start to heal.

[VelociRapture]

Long time lurker, first time poster. Thank so much to Buzzard for the recap. My TV would have been in danger between Michelle's baby voice and JB's minimizing of the situation.

As far as the interview on Friday, I'm pretty sure it will be a bunch of "jesus forgave him and so did we and y'all need to just GTFO and liberal agenda." I was shaking mad after Jessa's little sound bite that was published. She can say that because she's a victim? Uh, no, honey, you've been marinated in the koolaid for so long that you no longer have any sense of self-awareness that what you say makes you sound as ignorant and narcissistic as the day is long.

I don't think its entirely fair to criticize either girls for what they may or may not say on Friday. Jessa is correct that they have a right to view things how they want to because they were the ones victimized - I do agree that she is incorrect in stating that no one else can view Josh differently though.

I think everyone should try to keep in mind that these girls are victims in multiple ways:

1. Victims of sexual assault at the hands of their brother.

2. Victims by being born into a patriarchal culture that teaches men can't control themselves and women are to blame.

3. Victims of shitty parents who failed to protect them and basically turned them into slaves.

I think that when it comes to this topic these young women deserve a bit of leniency.

(Please note, this wasn't directed just at you - the first paragraph was, but the rest was really for the general audience here) :)

[Alasselina]

I've been following this thread since last night, and I find most of my feelings about the interview echoed by many of you (the blatant lies, the minimizing, the blame, etc.).

But I haven't seen anyone touch on JB's use of that horrible Huckabee quote: "it was unexcusable but not unforgiveable". Maybe I'm overreacting, but that pissed me off to no end. It just felt, to me, like JB jhighlighting that he has powerful friends in high places. The way he said "someone" said it without naming Huckabee and with what looked to me like an arrogant little smirk... That made my blood boil.

[quiverempty]

To be fair, the police reports do indicate he was the instigator of the confession, as does Alice's early report.

even a police report doesn't mean that they were being completely truthful... nobody was under oath or anything like that. i know i remember reading that at least one of the victims said she went to their parents crying, upset that josh had violated her

[ljohnson2006]

The Duggars' suing the tabloid who leaked this, should be the last thing they think about.

[Buzzard]

I've been following this thread since last night, and I find most of my feelings about the interview echoed by many of you (the blatant lies, the minimizing, the blame, etc.).

But I haven't seen anyone touch on JB's use of that horrible Huckabee quote: "it was unexcusable but not unforgiveable". Maybe I'm overreacting, but that pissed me off to no end. It just felt, to me, like JB jhighlighting that he has powerful friends in high places. The way he said "someone" said it without naming Huckabee and with what looked to me like an arrogant little smirk... That made my blood boil.

I do give J'megyn props for calling that out and naming Huckabee.

Interesting also, boob said that ALL 5 victims were interviewed. We havent seen that report yet with the interview of the fifth child.

[SassyPants]

Because their father is her baby.

When your baby is struggling in school, you get him help. And perhaps pray

When your baby is injured, you seek medical help. And perhaps pray

When your baby admits to doing vile things to his sisters, you get them all help. And perhaps pray.

If praying is important, great, but you still seek outside help.

At least that's what REAL, DECENT parents who only birth 1-2-3-4 ,or whatever number that THEY can safely and financially raise and care for do.

You do things differently, but not necessarily the right or decent way.

[ljohnson2006]

Anna needs to take the blinders off, and realize that Smugs is a danger to their daughters.

[SassyPants]

After ruminating in this overnight (fine, I was traveling and without Internet access to post my thoughts), I've come to the conclusion that the interview can be taken either one of two ways, and neither of them reflect well on Jimchelle.

No. 1 is that they're calculating, though ignorant, opportunists who chose to downplay this whole thing to save their money train. So, they minimize what happened, maximize forgiveness and blame the "liberal agenda" and care more about money and fame than their own children's happiness, health and safety.

No. 2 is that they live in a circle where child abuse and sexual abuse is so common and covering it up is so prevalent that they genuinely do not understand why their son touching their daughters inappropriately is a big deal ("it's not like he raped them or anything!") or why it should have been reported immediately and dealt with through proper channels. They don't understand why it happened, that it isn't a mistake, the impact it had on their daughters (or the other victim), the impact it had on Josh (who, according to them begged me for help and ended up having to pay for his own therapy!), how to prevent it or anything else about child sexual abuse that they would have learned had they gone through the proper channels. Essentially, they've shown themselves to be (perhaps willfully) ignorant and unable to stop this from happening again in or to their family.

I suspect that it is a combination of both: they're driven by the former and use the latter to justify their actions. In any event, what stood out to me is that by their own admission, sexual abuse of children is entrenched in their social circle, it's seen as really not that big of a deal, and that that same circle finds it acceptable to not seek legitimate treatment for offenders or victims and that they see nothing wrong with that approach and would do it that way again (we're not mandated reporters!). I wonder if that admitted level of disregard for the law and their children's safety might be enough to spark a DHS investigation into what else is going on in that house. I doubt it would result in removing the kids or anything, but it might do Jimchelle some good to focus on their actual children and not a TV show.

Also, I sincerely hope that Josh did get therapy. What he did sounds like a compulsion, not curiosity, since he repeatedly went crying to his parents and begged for help. If he still had those urges, even after being sent to get shamed and beaten, er, I mean Gothard counseling, then I do respect him for seeking out legitimate therapy on his own dime, assuming that happened. Based on his "apology," though, it doesn't sound like it did, since he's still referring to youthful mistakes and not ruining his life.

Bottom line is that the lack of empathy these people have for the victims of this is breathtaking, really. Those girls, and what happened to them, truly do not matter.

You have just described the brainwashing that happens in a cult.

JB and M are seemingly of normal IQs...imagine belonging to a group where sexual abuse was rampant, can you imagine continuing to cleave to that group? Even after your son acted out, wouldn't you want better for your family? In addition, how does the purity obsession dovetail with a group where sexual abuse is seemingly approached from the perspective that almost everyone has this in their family? Fondling over the clothes is really not that bad but a private conversation while courting is giving away pieces of your heart? Um, few, if any, neurotypical people who are living outside of a cult are going to reason in that fashion. Josh saving his first kiss for marriage really does not mean all that much in the grand scheme of purity, JB and M.