Sci Fi and Religion

[Buzzard]

The Chrysalids

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chrysalids

There's a little boy in our church with six toes on each foot, and I always think about Sophie in this book.

Awesome book with some great warnings for our fundie friends!

[Guest Anonymous]

Heinlien's Stranger in a Strange Land

Enough said.

I loved this one too, and also Isaac Asimov's Foundation series 8-)

[Soldier of the One]

I think a lot of Mormons are into sci-fi. Hell, Orson Scott Card's a Mormon.

Which makes a lot of sense with their theology, no?

It does :) Also, the writer of the (original series of) Battlestar Galactica was a Mormon. The mythical planet of human/divine origin in the series is known as Kobol which is an anagram of Kolob, the planet closest to the 'throne' of God in Mormon cosmology.

[Swamptribe]

God my nerd is so showing.

DS9 is also my favorite STar Trek series. It and Babylon 5 are contemporaries. Actually, a lot of people argue that DS9 stole the 'story arch' type of style from B5.

I liked how they touched on religion on Firefly, and kind of summed up 'faith' in Serenity, the movie based on the series. Mal, despite his atheism, was a man of very deep faith.

Some would argue that Star Wars were films about religion. I disagree. Or maybe it's just that they lost my interest with the 'first three' films. The original three were great. There was nothing like them, or had never been anything like them, at the time.

Another interesting film about religion that is Sci Fi based is 2001 A Space Odyssey. I would highly recommend reading the book instead of watching the film, or as a supplement to the film. The foundation series is also great, though I haven't read much in it. Also, the Robots series, which ties into Foundation.

[nimerha]

Oh god, the Chrysalids is like... fundie handbook. Their ideal world. Well, until the little monsters gays perverts sinners get away, anyway.

Dune is a good one for the religious debates, too. Religion and it's artificial creation to control and use people are a major theme of the book. Card's Xenocide deals with religion in a very interesting way too but I don't want to spoil anyone who hasn't read them... I might think that Card is a crazy fundie, but those books are brilliant, and I'd recommend the Ender series to anyone. Well, anyone who can stomach the psychological child abuse of the first volumes.

Ah, Heinlein. That's one I have a love/hate relationship with. Stranger in a Strange Land was a while before he slipped into his perpetual masturbatory fantasy, though.

There is so, so many brilliant sci-fi books and novellas dealing with religion... the style seems custom made for it. My personal favourite, though, are and will always be the short stories by AC Clarke. The Star and Nine Billion Names of God, anyone?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nine_B ... mes_of_God

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Star_(short_story)

[Purple]

I never found Star Trek to be atheistic. There was no underlying religious theme (though each series had episodes that touched on religious topics), but there was also no anti-religious theme - I can't recall a plotline that concluded with "We've just proven that there is no God". There were aliens whose powers seemed godlike to humans, and civilizations to whom humans' futuristic technology seemed godlike, but there were also plenty of unexplained things that left the door open for the characters and viewers to believe in a higher power if they were so inclined. There were characters that were emphatically atheist, and others who were deeply religious. Some fundies may disagree, but the fact that something isn't religious in nature doesn't automatically make it atheistic or anti-religious.

[scifimommy]

I have loved this thread.

I have to agree with the pposter who said that ST was pretty much religious "free" (Well, I don't know how to navigate back to that post but it was something like that!). That is why I like it so much.

[Swamptribe]

Could we agree then, that Star Trek was more agnostic in it's view of religion?

[scifimommy]

Oh yes, agreed.

Great, now I need a recommended book list! Writing down titles now. But it always seems when I check out a book from the library, it sits on my nightstand the whole two weeks and I never, ever get past the first page!

Needless to say, I fall into bed most nights and don't even remember how I got there!

[thoughtful]

Card's Xenocide deals with religion in a very interesting way too but I don't want to spoil anyone who hasn't read them... I might think that Card is a crazy fundie, but those books are brilliant, and I'd recommend the Ender series to anyone. Well, anyone who can stomach the psychological child abuse of the first volumes.

I have just finished the first two, and am in the middle of Xenocide. I'd say he sets up the idea of who is human/worthy of living/one of us in the first book (Ender's Game), and the direct references to religion and ritual start in the second (Speaker for the Dead).

I really enjoyed the first two -- a bit bogged down with Xenocide, mostly because he seems to feel the need to fill the reader in on past stuff. Gotta trust sci-fi readers to have read the other books, Orson! :lol:

[Brainsample]

Star Trek TOS was very 'atheistic' in it's outlook. There was an occasional brief mention of religion, could cite episodes if I weren't being lazy right now. I think that was more a sign of the times than the series itself.

Later series of Star Trek did tackle the question of religion more, but always through alien cultures. Bajoran's are an excellent example of this. Klingon spirituality was also hit on many times. There is a Voyager episode in which the crew comes across a civilization that originated during the dinosaur age on earth. I never really liked the Voyager series, but this episode nicely tackles what happens when religious dogma takes precedent over fact.

Worf is the ultimate Fundie.

Spock is New Age, but a lot smarter than Carl Sagan.

[Brainsample]

Heinlien's Stranger in a Strange Land

Enough said.

Now I feel old! I read that more than half my life ago...

[Guest Anonymous]

I think a lot of Mormons are into sci-fi. Hell, Orson Scott Card's a Mormon.

Which makes a lot of sense with their theology, no?

My partner loves Ender's Game but I can't seem to get past what a homophobic jerkface Orson Scott Card is for long enough to read it. Maybe I'll eventually check it out of the library, but that dude won't get a cent of my money.

[Brainsample]

It does :) Also, the writer of the (original series of) Battlestar Galactica was a Mormon. The mythical planet of human/divine origin in the series is known as Kobol which is an anagram of Kolob, the planet closest to the 'throne' of God in Mormon cosmology.

Bingo, Baby!

God (whose name is Elohim) is really an extra-terrestrial, and Jesus and Satan were spirit brothers. God got it on physically with Mary so he could conceive Jesus himself. Satan isn't a created being, and we all have to birth lots of Mormon seed so that all of those souls out there that were once bodies of people on the planet that surrounds the star Kolob can have bodies again. Then their babies can grow up one day to be as enlightened as Elohim was, and they can get their own planet...

That almost beats Phillip Dick material.

But they don't tell that stuff to everyone... You have to be a high level freemason before they tell you the secrets, after you don the magic Mormon underpants and go dip in the tub at the temple where even the soles of your shoes have to be white. (That reminds me a bit of Clarke's 2001, actually, or at least Kubrick's interpretation.)

[Propagatrix]

Has anyone read Zenna Henderson's "People" stories, about an alien race that comes to Earth after their planet is destroyed? They're wonderful. Religion figures big, but in a positive "we're all kin" sort of way.

Henderson was raised Mormon, although she wasn't active in the church as an adult.

[Brainsample]

Just a thought, but isn't Nancy Campbell pretty much like a sci-fi character in real life? The alien in her only wants carrot juice and foods she can eat while it's still alive, and her orange teeth are a sign of piety. She doesn't so much care if you feed your kids rancid grains via cereal in the morning as much as she wants to prepare your host bodies for the patriarchal parasite.

Soon after Joyce's Quiverfull came out, NPR or someone did a short audio interview with Joyce, Campbell, and some QF family. Campbell's on there saying in the weirdest tone: "The Womb! The Womb is a weapon!" I wish I could pour something in my ear to get it out of my head -- just the way she said it made my skin crawl, though it sounded like it's own parody. She sounded like some kind of freakish sociopath that you might see on a Heaven's Gate Hale Bop video.

To which my friend responded -- "Yeah, my womb is a weapon! and my vagina has teeth." And I later learned that there is some indie film where some girl's vagina does have teeth...

You would not have to embellish much to turn Nancy into sci-fi. She could be a secondary story line on "V" or some alien show on the Sci-Fi Channel.

[Guest Anonymous]

To which my friend responded -- "Yeah, my womb is a weapon! and my vagina has teeth." And I later learned that there is some indie film where some girl's vagina does have teeth...

Vagina dentata is a common theme in folklore and myth. It's present in many different cultures.

[Brainsample]

Vagina dentata is a common theme in folklore and myth. It's present in many different cultures.

A friend of mine just called and her daughter said that there is a film -- called "Teeth"

I found it here: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0780622/

They should re-do it and work Nancy Campbell in it and give Lord Robotkin a walk on.

(aka undermuchgrace)

[Swamptribe]

Worf is the ultimate Fundie.

Worf was conservative, he wasn't fundie. The guy was willing to accept there were other views and beliefs. Also, Klingon women would kick your ass if you didn't show proper respect.

A vagina with teeth, straight mens ultimate nightmare. Husband insisted on picking up a book once, believe titled "Witch" that actually had this as a theme. It was a weird book.

[Brainsample]

Worf was conservative, he wasn't fundie. The guy was willing to accept there were other views and beliefs. Also, Klingon women would kick your ass if you didn't show proper respect.

When we watched STNG all the time because we were a little tired of the original, my husband used to say that he was Worf. I would agree with you, but I guess the problem there is the yet fluid definition of exactly what a fundie is. Worf was not a doin' hard things in the Amazon and dressing up for the ice cream social fundie. GAG! Sputter! (Do we have a puke emotocon?)

So if Worf is a conservative, who would be a ST fundie? STNG or otherwise? Patriarchy's collectivism is the Borg, but is there just an example of what you'd call a typical fundie?

[Brainsample]

Oooh! They have "Teeth" on Netflix! Fun for next weekend!

[Soldier of the One]

Can you imagine? Sci Fi fanfiction including our favorite fundie characters?

[Guest Anonymous]

Can you imagine? Sci Fi fanfiction including our favorite fundie characters?

Either Geoff Botkin or Dougie Phillips could play Baron Harkonnen ("Dune"). In fact, neither one would need actual lines as each could play himself. :twisted:

[anniebgood]

What about The Dark Matter Trilogy by Phillip Pullman? If that isn't anti church (magisterium) I don't know what is. I wish they could have expanded The Golden Compass movie to bring more of it out.

[kaetrin]

I'm late to this thread and have no real content to add, but just wanted to chime in that I read The Sparrow a few months ago and really liked it (although I like religious themes of that sort). I haven't read Children of God yet. I've never been much of a sci-fi reader so I haven't read much else that's been mentioned here.

It's not sci-fi exactly... more fantasy/magical realism/alternative history, but I also really liked Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell.

I'm interested to hear other thoughts about the Pullman trilogy -- which I also haven't read (not out of any abstract personal objection; just haven't gotten around to it) but of course heard all the fundie opposition.