WTF? Grownups playing war....

[Wolfie]

Um, this could get you killed if the wrong people wandered in on it....

paratusfamiliablog.com/2012/06/survival-net-101.html

(not to mention, I have a backpacking hammock and cords. It takes up a lot less room than the thing they are using there, and a lot less energy to put up. I don't have the one with a cover, but the company makes one.)

[Witsec7]

I think my backpacking hammock in the bag measures about 3"x4" and weighs a couple of ounces.

I really need to spend more time on their blog tomorrow. I'm a bit of a prepper, who just learned how to make rocket stoves from found objects. Now every time I take a walk or go down an alley to alley shop I see rocket stove materials.

Our hat is off to Joe Nobody. He couldn't be more correct - the survival net is an absolute must have item. Not only does it provide practically instant sleeping accommodations it also has innumerable other uses. The survival net can be used for:

Making a Ghillie Cloak/Hide

Fishing Net

Makeshift Litter/Stretcher

Looter's Bag

Climbing Tool

Trap

Emergency Shelter

Emergency Coat or Blanket

Door or Window Security

Cargo Net

The looters bag is such a nice touch.

[Esther]

So... is this a game or are these people for real? ... Are these people really learning survival skillz because civilization is somehow about to collapse? ... If so, how? Zombie apocalypse? Foreign invasion?

Does not compute. Reading more of the blog...

[Conuly]

Well, there's nothing wrong with knowing how to survive if society should collapse. I mean, you have to imagine that every time things fall apart in some place or another, it catches a lot of people by surprise, and by that time it's a little too late to learn. Plus, it can be a really fun hobby, and there's nothing wrong with that at all. And I can actually think of a few reasons that society might, if not exactly *collapse*, become a little harder, starting with an explosion of the caldera under Yellowstone and ending with another virulent flu pandemic. Put two of them together and you'll also have to contend with doomsday prophets making street corners extremely unpleasant places to hang out. :roll:

With that said, they are DEFINITELY doing it... well, not right, anyway. The emphasis on prepared and pre-ground spices? Not good value for your money, too full of sodium, and yes, they lose flavor faster.

The emphasis on guns as a weapon? I've long since thought that guns, in a survival situation, are totally overrated. They're noisy (scare away your game while attracting looters? No thanks!), they're hard to make and repair, you can't re-use your ammunition, and everybody wants them. It's easier to make a bow and arrow or atlatl (even if making a good one takes some skill) and any idiot can ultimately make a sling (even if they take practice to use effectively). And you can *reuse* arrows, and throwing spears, and rocks. You're never running out of rocks!

(Maybe I read My Side of the Mountain a little too often as a kid. At any rate, the point remains, prioritizing skill with guns and a supply of same is folly if you're taking this seriously. If you're not, do whatever the heck you like.)

The looters bag is such a nice touch.

Well, you're gonna have looters if you keep shooting off guns. Can't even practice with those things without making a lot of noise and wasting your ammo, I might add. Practice archery - do you waste the bullets? Can they hear you all over the damn place? No, they can NOT.

[MamaJunebug]

Conuly wrote,

The emphasis on guns as a weapon? I've long since thought that guns, in a survival situation, are totally overrated. They're noisy (scare away your game while attracting looters? No thanks!), they're hard to make and repair, you can't re-use your ammunition, and everybody wants them. It's easier to make a bow and arrow or atlatl (even if making a good one takes some skill) and any idiot can ultimately make a sling (even if they take practice to use effectively). And you can *reuse* arrows, and throwing spears, and rocks. You're never running out of rocks!

I'm in a really mellow mood today, and the bolded part made me think about a store called "Atlatls R Us" - it would be looted first in the event of societal breakdown, of course. :D :D :D

Forgive me, I'm an old lady with a weird "sensa humah." A nice thing about being old is, I'm looking at death a lot closer than I was 5 decades ago, any way, so the prospect of societal breakdown just makes me shrug and consider even more options for helping things along if it gets too bad. ;)

That said, now I need to go look at the link that Wolfie provided.

[debrand]

I looked up rocket stoves on youtube. That is amazing. I might build on just for the heck of it.

[Esther]

Is this an American thing? I've never even heard of people doing this. I mean, people where I'm from have like, vegetable gardens and keep chickens and stuff, but they certainly don't seem to think a collapse of civilization is imminent.

[Wolfie]

I think my backpacking hammock in the bag measures about 3"x4" and weighs a couple of ounces.

I really need to spend more time on their blog tomorrow. I'm a bit of a prepper, who just learned how to make rocket stoves from found objects. Now every time I take a walk or go down an alley to alley shop I see rocket stove materials.

I was raised to be ready for an emergency, since my dad was stuck in SF in the 1989 quake, he pushed it. BUT not to the extent that these preppers are. I think I have a different judgement of people as a whole- glass is half full, not half empty.

ETA- I don't have a rocket stove, but I do have a coleman stove and lantern if my house becomes unsafe to use. Actually I use the lantern already.

[BlackHawk]

I do love this blog... they have SOME good ideas, not a lot, but some.

That said, I am pretty sure where they are is their private property. They own quite a bit of land and keep some of it forest for the upcoming end of the world.

They consider themselves serious survivalists who live in a shop/house they call a shouse, firmly believe that America was founded on Christians principles with our founding fathers wanting EVERYONE who steps foot here christian, and that they will be the most prepared when shtf. She, Enola Gay alias who writes the blog, also makes tea cozies and sells them for a weird price. As well as reusable female pads and other knick knacks. Their newest is an emergency birthing kit that their daughter put together (she's.. 22ish?) It's amusing really.

They are fundie however who firmly believe in SAHDs. paratusfamiliablog.com/2010/09/wanted.html is their blog about how you would word a wanted add for your adult daughter, and if gives their idea of a the perfect spouse for their 20 something daughter, including non-negotiable requirements (such as "God-fearing, Jesus-loving, Christian.") all the way down to random things I didn't think mattered to the parents of people (such as 7. A year's supply of food.)

I am also a huge fan of Rocket Stoves... juts wanted to throw this in there.

[debrand]

Here is a rocket stove. That is sort of cool

[Glass Cowcatcher]

The emphasis on guns as a weapon? I've long since thought that guns, in a survival situation, are totally overrated. They're noisy (scare away your game while attracting looters? No thanks!), they're hard to make and repair, you can't re-use your ammunition, and everybody wants them. It's easier to make a bow and arrow or atlatl (even if making a good one takes some skill) and any idiot can ultimately make a sling (even if they take practice to use effectively). And you can *reuse* arrows, and throwing spears, and rocks. You're never running out of rocks!

QFT. If the shit ever did hit the fan I think a lot of the gun-happy folks wouldn't know jack about what to do, other than protecting their piles of MREs.

I love the idea of survivalism, because I love the mental challenge of thinking through "How would we do this without electricity" kind of things, but so many of the survivalist blogs and outlets seem to devolve into "Any day now, MARTIAL LAW!" and other right-wing conspiracies.

[Conuly]

If the shit ever did hit the fan I think a lot of the gun-happy folks wouldn't know jack about what to do, other than protecting their piles of MREs.

MREs: Also overrated. How that could be when people claim that MRE stands for Meals Rejected by Everybody (and that's the nicest backronym you'll hear!) I don't understand, but - yes, highly overrated. If you're going to go with prepared meals that last forever, you might pick something with a longer shelf life.

I love the idea of survivalism, because I love the mental challenge of thinking through "How would we do this without electricity" kind of things, but so many of the survivalist blogs and outlets seem to devolve into "Any day now, MARTIAL LAW!" and other right-wing conspiracies.

I cut my teeth on dystopian fiction, starting with Outside and The Girl Who Owned a City. (The latter, hilariously, was apparently written to introduce Ayn Rand to kids. I was shocked to find that out, because the message *I* got from that book was that, in case of emergency, we all need to pull together like good little socialists.)

Planning for the end of society is definitely a fun mental challenge. You just have to ignore the crazies. And boy, are those everywhere.

[Soldevi]

Is this an American thing? I've never even heard of people doing this. I mean, people where I'm from have like, vegetable gardens and keep chickens and stuff, but they certainly don't seem to think a collapse of civilization is imminent.

In Finland it is recommended to have supplies for two weeks: fresh water and food which does not require cold to store, batteries, a radio, a torch, iodine tablets, enough lidded buckets (to fetch and store water) and such. National Defence Training Association of Finland, League of the National Defence Women and League for Women's preparedness offer different kind of courses like how to survive without electricity, street safety or how to survive in the woods.

Power cuts are not rare in Finland, not at all. In my parents' farm all sort of storms cut power and in some parts power cuts can last for weeks. 75 % of our power lines are overhead power lines and we are a scarcely inhabited country with the vast distances between any sort of habitation. So power cuts happen often.

But nope, not any sort of let's grab guns and play war BS.

[Boltingmadonna]

Conuly said

Maybe I read My Side of the Mountain a little too often as a kid.

Nooo!! You can't read My Side of the Mountain too often. I so much wanted to dig up cattails and make my own flour. Also, I was sad when the author wrote a sequel and made him set Frightful free. I realize that was the correct thing to do, as it is against the law to keep wild birds, but heck, I wanted my own falcon!

As an adult, I belonged to a cult that (fortunately) kicked me out just before they all started stockpiling beans and water in their basements. I've always wondered what happened to all those beans after the prophesied catastrophe failed to appear . . . .

I also went through a phase of reading stacks of Vietnam era war memoirs. One of the things I gleaned from them was that MREs were widely hated. The ham with lima beans, in particular, was known as "ham and motherfuckers."

[Wolfie]

In Finland it is recommended to have supplies for two weeks: fresh water and food which does not require cold to store, batteries, a radio, a torch, iodine tablets, enough lidded buckets (to fetch and store water) and such. National Defence Training Association of Finland, League of the National Defence Women and League for Women's preparedness offer different kind of courses like how to survive without electricity, street safety or how to survive in the woods.

Power cuts are not rare in Finland, not at all. In my parents' farm all sort of storms cut power and in some parts power cuts can last for weeks. 75 % of our power lines are overhead power lines and we are a scarcely inhabited country with the vast distances between any sort of habitation. So power cuts happen often.

But nope, not any sort of let's grab guns and play war BS.

The first paragraph is pretty much what is recommended in the US. I live in an area where the power goes out if we have a heavy snowstorm. (And my first winter here it was out often, one time for a whole week), but the 7 years supply, guns, ect is not a government recommendation. It is a small group of people called "preppers."

Here are the US governments suggestions http://www.ready.gov/build-a-kit 72 hours is what they suggest for food and water.

[gingernut]

I agree with the over-emphasis on guns these people always have. Who do these people think is going to come and "get them"? (edit for spelling mishaps...I need more coffee!)

[Witsec7]

I was raised to be ready for an emergency, since my dad was stuck in SF in the 1989 quake, he pushed it. BUT not to the extent that these preppers are. I think I have a different judgement of people as a whole- glass is half full, not half empty.

ETA- I don't have a rocket stove, but I do have a coleman stove and lantern if my house becomes unsafe to use. Actually I use the lantern already.

My prepper attitude is left over from living through the 'quakes down in cali. I have a couple of 5 gallon buckets in the shed with supplies. But our natural threats here are earthquakes (again) and I recognize that it may be hard to get to that crap if the hovel goes ass over tea kettle.

But the fact of the matter is if the shit really does hit the fan, do I actually want to survive it? My own attitude towards survival has changed substantially as I've aged.

[Esther]

In Finland it is recommended to have supplies for two weeks: fresh water and food which does not require cold to store, batteries, a radio, a torch, iodine tablets, enough lidded buckets (to fetch and store water) and such. National Defence Training Association of Finland, League of the National Defence Women and League for Women's preparedness offer different kind of courses like how to survive without electricity, street safety or how to survive in the woods.

Power cuts are not rare in Finland, not at all. In my parents' farm all sort of storms cut power and in some parts power cuts can last for weeks. 75 % of our power lines are overhead power lines and we are a scarcely inhabited country with the vast distances between any sort of habitation. So power cuts happen often.

But nope, not any sort of let's grab guns and play war BS.

Oh no, I completely understand having survival gear ready in case of a power cut, natural disaster, etc etc. I'm from Belgium, which is very densely populated, so there's less of a necessity for these things even on the countryside, but if I lived in a place such as Finland or the rural US, I'd want to be prepared too.

What I don't get is these people's deep desire to be Off The Grid because Society Is Collapsing, Can't You See The Signs? I mean, there's a difference between being prepared for a temporary situation and moving to the middle of nowhere to cut yourself off from civilization because God knows what is out to get you. One is sensible, the other reeks of crazy. Add some guns to the mix, and things really get interesting...

[mebeforee]

(Maybe I read My Side of the Mountain a little too often as a kid. At any rate, the point remains, prioritizing skill with guns and a supply of same is folly if you're taking this seriously. If you're not, do whatever the heck you like.)

My god, I read my copy of My Side of the Mountain until it fell apart and I had to tape the binding back together. A few years ago I bought a fresh copy of it xD Though upon rereading, I think Hatchet is a bit better... I loved those kind of books growing up.

I also have what I call my 'apocalypse kit', which is a waterproof camping bag that I have filled with survival necessities. Not that I actually think the apocalypse is coming, but I thought it'd be smart to have it after I thought I saw a UFO one night. (I swear I'm not crazy, regardless of how this particular story must make me sound...)

[debrand]

Let's imagine that society did collapse. One group of people is unprepared. They seek out other people, maybe raid some libraries and are forced to figure out how to survive. They will probably suffer big losses but the community that they build will probably be strong. Chances are that there might be medical personal and other knowledgable people in their community. Or at least, if I needed to survive, finding someone with medical knowledge would be tops on my list.

A family who has stockpiled food and weapons might at first be in a good position. However, if they don't share or seek out others, they won't have friends to depend upon. No one knows everything. Herbs won't cure everything and you can't stock pile enough medicine for all emergencies. What if the strongest person falls and breaks their bones? You need specialized individuals to assist in saving the person. That isn't going to happen in situation in which a few related members band together to protect their turf and food. And what do you do once that food supply runs out or if some disaster ruins your stores? Is the first community going to help your family if you haven't really shared with them?

Like it or not, humans need one another. Hiding away, won't in the long run save you. Besides, wouldn't you want to do more then survive but to flourish? How do you flourish with just one family all alone and no connections to other people? That isn't how our ancestors, for the most part, lived.

edited to add something

[Witsec7]

Let's imagine that society did collapse. One group of people is unprepared. They seek out other people, maybe raid some libraries and are forced to figure out how to survive. They will probably suffer big losses but the community that they build will probably be strong. Chances are that there might be medical personal and other knowledgable people in their community.

A family who has stockpiled food and weapons might at first be in a good position. However, if they don't share or seek out others, they won't have friends to depend upon. No one knows everything. Herbs won't cure everything and you can't stock pile enough medicine for all emergencies. What if the strongest person falls and breaks their bones? You need specialized individuals to assist in saving the person. That isn't going to happen in situation in which a few related members band together to protect their turf and food. And what do you do once that food supply runs out or if some disaster ruins your stores? Is the first community going to help your family if you haven't really shared with them?

Like it or not, humans need one another.

When I lived rurally prepping was just something that happened in the course of life. There was no political agenda behind it. Our first winter we lost power for 2 weeks, and were cut off from town. We learned having access to a safe water supply was a smart thing, so when we redesigned our water system the following year, that was taken into consideration. Living with two men who had been Eagle Scouts helped :lol: Having good neighbors also helped. But we did nothing on the scale of these folks.

I'm interested in their source of income, Danner boots and ammo don't come cheap. How do they pay for all their prepper toys?

[Sweetpea1]

Here is a rocket stove. That is sort of cool

I want a rocket stove. Yeah.

[Witsec7]

I want a rocket stove. Yeah.

I'm up to two rocket stoves so far :lol: One is the cinder block hillbilly version. The other is a clay cylinder (I had a few pieces of terra cotta lying about) with a stove pipe insert similar to the one on the you tube. I've done some test drives on these and am just loving it. My pal who is also crazy about rocket stoves did a dutch oven pot roast on his experimenting with different fuels. The hillbilly version can be used as a grill but be careful about fuel when grilling meat. I like the hillbilly one so far since it accepts my wok and I was able to do a stir fry dinner using just a couple of sticks.

[Sumeri]

Count me as another who feels preparedness is essential, as I live in a part of the country where it is more normal than not to be snowed in/lose power for days.

What I don't understand about these types of survivalists, though, is that they always seem to be talking about the end of the world in, well, a rapture kind of way. Isn't the whole point to fly away home and leave this sinful world to the rest of us? Why would one need survival skills at all if that's the kind of end of the world scenario they're talking about?

And those rocket stoves remind me of the coffee can ones we had to make in girl scouts, one of which I still carry in my car, with a roll of toilet paper for heating.

[JesusFightClub]

I lived through Lockerbie. It was a horror I don't want to tell you about.

Since then, I have been prepared to suffer.